National Assembly for Wales

In November, 43,800 people were relieved of pain and discomfort as a result of treatment in the Welsh NHS, contributing to the biggest monthly reduction in the waiting list on record. This Government has invested millions this year to reduce waiting lists, including the commissioning of a range of services, including endoscopy and dermatology. We're pleased that this is now paying off, but recognise that the NHS has further to go. 

Thank you. The reason I've raised this, First Minister, is, as you know, over the last two or three years, you've had a tendency to cancel contracts when you are insourcing. And this has been apparent in hernia treatment, endoscopy, dermatology and more. We heard recently about the PET scan—the contract for that has now been cancelled in north Wales. 

Now, the average waiting time for a first dermatology out-patient is stated as 15 weeks, with 10 per cent of patients waiting more than 50 weeks. I've got constituents who have been waiting well over 100 weeks, and they're just not well. And people are worried because, in a lot of cases, these people go to a dermatologist, and some people think they've got skin cancer, which, as you know, can sometimes have a secondary—. So, it's a really worrying aspect. In July 2025, nearly 7,000 were waiting for a diagnostic endoscopy. So, that was an increase from 4,985 the previous year. Now, behind these figures are real people. 

Can you come to your question, please, Janet Finch-Saunders?

Yes. This is just not acceptable. You stand there week after week stating that you're bringing waiting lists down. In those areas I've mentioned, they're increasing. [Interruption.] I'm not speaking to you; I'm speaking to the First Minister.

Ask the question. You're not speaking anymore; you're asking a question. 

So, will you, First Minister, please look at those areas I've mentioned and come back to me with a letter, just to tell me how those waiting lists are going down, because they're not?

Well, I can tell you they are. That is the truth. And, listen, I understand that it's very, very concerning. I was particularly concerned when I was health Minister about the situation in relation to dermatology in north Wales. The incidence of skin cancer is increasing. We need to catch it early. The north Wales health board has an insourcing dermatology contract for the provision of dermatology services, including for out-patients, cancer treatment and minor operations. 

Now, the additional capacity that this Government has funded has led to a 97 per cent reduction in two-year dermatology waits. [Interruption.] Yes, I think that deserves a clap. That is an incredible change from where it was—an 86 per cent reduction in those waiting over 52 weeks for a first out-patient appointment. That is progress. Of course there's more that can be done, but we recongise that, with endoscopy, for example, what's happening now is that a temporary endoscopy unit is being set up at Ysbyty Gwynedd, and that's going to start seeing patients in March. That's expected to enable over 1,500 people to receive medical care over the next few months.

The fact is, because we've had additional money—money that will be put again to you today in a budget—that can bring those waiting lists down, we will be voting for that. There'll be other parties here who'll be voting for that. You will not be voting for that, and that makes a difference to the people that you represent in those constituencies. 

We launched our new 'Healthy Weight: Healthy Wales' delivery plan in September, with full Cabinet and cross-Government support. The plan has a clear focus not just on food, but also on physical activity. Across Government, we’re improving active travel routes, establishing regional sport partnerships, through Sport Wales, developing the daily active offer for our schools, and providing significant funding for programmes, such as the 60-plus active leisure scheme, and Fit Fans, to support adults to be more active.

Thank you for that, First Minister. When it comes to health, we do need to be a lot more preventative for our population and to help relieve pressure on our health and social care services. This particularly applies in our more deprived areas, where ill health is greater. A more active population would help. I carried out an active Newport survey and the responses showed very strongly that there isn't enough access to facilities and infrastructure—whether that's 3G, indoor courts, fields, schools, changing rooms or storage facilities. I believe these issues are best addressed through prioritisation of our more deprived areas and providing those better facilities and support for them. So, First Minister, will the Welsh Government take a lead and work with key partners such as Sport Wales, the Football Association of Wales, the Welsh Rugby Union, local authorities, leisure trusts, our professional clubs and, of course, grass-roots organisations in our communities, to align policy and practice, to better deliver for our more deprived communities?

Diolch yn fawr, John. Thank you for your leadership in this. I know you're an active sportsman, and you lead the way for your community through example. What we know is that keeping fit decreases people's chances of developing health issues. The issue raised, whether it's access to facilities, competition for limited indoor spaces, shortage of pool lanes, 3G pitches, or indoor courts—. All of these are exactly the kinds of barriers that can limit participation and hold clubs back, particularly, I think, during the winter months. We recognise that it is important to focus on those areas perhaps where there is increased deprivation, to give those facilities and to focus those facilities in those areas, but also to work with organisations that can perhaps reach into those communities in a way that state structures can't. So, working with organisations like the FAW, I think, is really important, because they are able to get to these people to encourage them to participate. So, our focus is clear: we have given additional resources to Sport Wales to invest in modern, inclusive facilities to support local partners to make better use of existing spaces. An our focus is clear: improving facilities, widening access and creating more opportunities for sports organisations and communities in places like Newport.

We're already using genomics quite extensively in Wales. If you just look at what we're doing in relation to cancer treatments and screening, all of that is already being used. In fact, we're right at the front when it comes to liquid biopsies and analysing how those can be treated using specific targeted medicines. So, we are leading the way when it comes to genomics, I think, in Wales.

It's no secret, really, that we have a problem with obesity and idleness in both adults and children, with current trends of obesity in Wales worsening, affecting one in four children and three in five adults. Obesity also affects people in more deprived areas the most, as John Griffiths has mentioned. Promoting physical activity is vital to remedying this. Currently, one in three adults and 81 per cent of adolescents are not doing enough physical activity. According to Public Health Wales, there has been a shocking 44 per cent rise in obesity over the past 20 years, and this has happened on Labour's watch, with a titanic rise in the cost for the NHS services. Actif North Wales recognise that current provision for physical activities may be serving those already active but not, at least, active in society, following funding being secured from the previous UK Conservative Government to trial a place-based approach in four local authorities across north Wales. They've seen great success, working closely with residents and local organisations to really get to know each area, what was already working well, and what was already getting in the way of people being active. So, can the First Minister outline how the Welsh Government is working to reverse the vast rise in obesity over the past two decades, and how is the Welsh Government learning from the approach of Actif North Wales to target the most deprived areas where obesity is more common?

I do think that we need to encourage people to live healthier lifestyles, and that's why we've been very comprehensive with our 'Healthy Weight: Healthy Wales' strategy, which encourages people to eat healthily and to protect their health through physical activity. There's a whole range of things that the Government is already doing. Some of it is within our gift. I think we have to recognise that things like the increase in the amount of ultra-processed food that people are eating is something that is difficult and something that the UK Government needs to actually work on. We've done what we can in the Welsh Government, and we will continue to go further to make it easier for people to make the right choices—so, introducing things like making sure that you're not tempted, like I am every time I go to my local CKs shop, when I see the chocolates there just before the checkout. I'm tempted. I'm tempted by those Haribos that are just sitting there, looking at me. We've got to make it easier for people through removing that temptation. I do think that our 'Healthy Weight: Healthy Wales' strategy is going to be central to helping people to avoid those temptations in future.

First Minister, we all want to see progress towards achieving a healthier and more active population. However, are you aware of the growing concerns around the inappropriate use of weight-loss medication in Wales? I've been made aware of these drugs being supplied to people without proper clinical oversight. During a recent hospital visit, I was told of an increasing number of admissions of people with serious side effects, which is putting huge pressure on our hospital departments and A&E. Does the First Minister agree with me that the time has come for these medications to only be available via GP referral, and that, without people making sustainable lifestyle changes, including calorie deficit and increasing physical activity, there are no quick, long-term fixes to tackling obesity and losing weight?

I know a number of people who are using these weight-loss drugs, and a number of people are losing a significant amount of weight as a result, and they swear by them. But I think we have got to make sure that people understand that, when they come off them, there could be consequences, but also that doing it without adjusting your diet is also going to be difficult when you come off those drugs. I would recommend, to people in Wales who are tempted to go down this path, that they do get the right clinical advice before they undertake these weight-loss drugs.

Diolch, Llywydd. Yesterday, the Home Secretary outlined what she described as the biggest reform of policing in 200 years. That should surely be a big opportunity for Wales. Last week, the Cabinet Secretary for Social Justice stood in this Chamber and she said,

'it is, of course, our ambition...for Wales to secure the devolution of policing and justice in their entirety.'

Two days later, the First Minister herself delivered a speech reiterating her party's apparent commitment—[Inaudible.]—but yesterday, when my colleague Liz Saville-Roberts asked the Labour Home Secretary whether she agreed that now is exactly the right time for the devolution of policing in Wales, she got four dismissive words of reply.

'No, I do not.'

From one week to the next, I struggle to work out which is worse: the blatant disregard towards Wales shown by Labour MPs, or the Labour Welsh Government's sheer inability to influence their Westminster colleagues. I'll tell you exactly what I think: this is a Labour Home Secretary in a Labour UK Government that doesn't even try to hide its disdain towards Wales and the devolution process. Does the First Minister agree with my assessment, and will she echo and repeat those words, or will she again try to wriggle out of standing up for Wales?

Well, I made it absolutely clear, in a speech that I set out last week, where we stand on this issue, and I'm glad he was paying attention to that speech. I will always stand up for Wales. What is important for me is that we focus on issues. It's not about constitutional positioning, as far as I'm concerned. It's not about gesture politics; it's about results. That's what matters, and what are the best structures to deliver those results. Let me be clear that this is the biggest restructuring of policing in 200 years. The Cabinet Secretary has met with the UK Government to talk about future governance in relation to this. We are not interested in policing to be devolved as a journey to independence. We're interested in making sure that it's about responding to the needs of people within our communities. It's results for people in our communities that matter. I'm focused on jobs, on the NHS, on school support. I am interested in plans for progress, not on shouting from the sidelines.

You talked about the constitution when you were delivering that speech last week, only to find out four or five days later again how powerless you are to have any influence over UK Government Ministers. More wriggling, as I anticipated. I urge the First Minister to say it. It's so clear that Labour MPs and Keir Starmer have no interest in what's right for Wales. And as for her asking, it is always 'no', just like Andy Burnham got: 'no' on the Crown Estate, 'no' on fair funding, 'no' on HS2 money and now 'no' on policing, too. And do you know what, the more the people of Wales look, the more it sinks in that Labour is a party run from London with no regard for Wales. And they've quit pretending even. One Labour MP is quoted in the press today saying, 'We won't devolve policing, especially given that Labour's unlikely to be running Wales after May'. So, if it's not them in charge, they've got even less interest in Wales. It is shameful and it is transparent. Doesn't the First Minister believe that her office and her nation deserve more respect than this?

My focus is not on the UK Government. My focus is on delivering for the people of Wales. My focus is on making sure that what we do today is that we get a budget through—[Inaudible.]—public services to provide that stability and hope, and an extra £400 million since the draft budget was published. What I am focused on is making sure that we focus on the things that really matter to the people of Wales. To the record-breaking—[Inaudible.]—that were delivered last month. And thank you to all of the NHS staff who have worked tirelessly, and also for the record investment that has come as a result of the fact that what we have are two Governments committed to public services. We've seen the biggest ever fall in a month when it comes to waiting lists—over 23,000 people coming off the lists. For the sixth month in a row, waiting lists are shorter, and the average time for waiting lists in Wales is 19 weeks. 

You know what, people watching this will be remembering the question that I asked, and I'll tell you what, it's a masterclass in wriggling out of addressing her impotence in relation to the UK Government. And remember that we don't want devolution for the sake of some constitutional—[Inaudible.]—this is about improving policing. Wales has the highest rate of incarceration in Europe. Thousands are trapped in a cycle of reoffending, which helps no-one. Services that the police work within are devolved, yet policing itself isn't. It's a barrier to joined-up thinking. But, no, policy in Labour's eyes is best developed through a Whitehall lens, when surely it's best developed through a Welsh lens. 

One final question. I note the statement issued by the Welsh Government today calling for an assurance that no regional police force should operate on both sides of the England-Wales border. Cross-border co-operation, of course, is very, very important, but I agree that Wales's border must be respected now, or you're creating even more problems on what's devolved and what's not. But given how little influence the First Minister has been able to have on UK Labour colleagues to date, will she explain what's going to be different this time? What has she done since the announcement yesterday to take the case directly to the Home Office that she must at least allow a Wales-only force to emerge from this? It's a poor substitute for devolution, which Plaid Cymru will still press for, but it's the very least we need. 

I'm very pleased that, in the White Paper, when mentioning the merger of forces, there was recognition of the distinct circumstances of Wales, and of course we'll be clear that we keep on pushing for our long-stated view that policing should be devolved. But at some point, it would be good if the Plaid Cymru leader could ask me about areas for which I actually have responsibility. This week, for example, we have made a pledge to make sure that school support staff in Wales, if we are re-elected in May, will receive all-year-round pay. That is the kind of thing that the people of Wales are interested in: making sure that people within our schools are supported in a way that will make a difference to the lives of children in those schools.

Diolch, Llywydd. Today is Holocaust Memorial Day, of course, when we come together to commemorate the lives of the 6 million innocent men, women and children who were murdered simply because they were Jewish. At a time when the scourge of antisemitism, I'm afraid, is still once again on the rise, we must all be steadfast, saying that it must be challenged and tackled whenever and wherever it might arise.

First Minister, in your speech to the Institute for Government last week, you painted a terrifying picture of the threat to the United Kingdom posed by Plaid Cymru. Yet in recent years, your Welsh Government has been joined at the hip to those very same separatists, as you called them, through a co-operation agreement. You have spent literally years letting Plaid Cymru MSs into the inner sanctum of Government to help draft your budgets and to dictate your policies and legislation. That includes the unwanted and unpopular 20 mph default speed limits, the disastrous first draft of the sustainable farming scheme and the vanity projects that you continue to invest in in Uganda.

Isn't it, First Minister, the height of hypocrisy for you to now warn the public about the dangers of Plaid, when you have been working hand-in-glove with them, running Wales for years? Why should the people of Wales believe your warnings now, when you've been perfectly happy for Plaid to be your partner in crime?

I'm not going to apologise for the fact that we today, I hope, will get our budget through thanks to the support from Plaid Cymru. That's not something to be ashamed of. That is showing practical responsibility—something that you won't be showing this afternoon. Because we're going to be putting an extra £1.2 billion on the table to support our public services, and you're not going to be supporting that. You're not going to be supporting bringing those waiting lists down. You're not going to be supporting putting more money into our education system. You're not going to be supporting more money into housing and into transport. Those are the things that matter to the people of Wales. But no, you want to do your posture politicking, and that, frankly, is not where the people of Wales are at.

You didn't answer my question, but that's not surprising, because it's the same every single week. You have claimed that demanding more powers from the UK Government is a way to neutralise the threat of the break-up of the UK. But in reality, you're simply playing to Plaid Cymru's agenda, aren't you? Because by constantly demanding more powers and more control over issues such as policing and justice, you're actually building the scaffolding for the very break-up of the United Kingdom that you claim to want to defend. It seems to me, First Minister, and everybody else in Wales, that there isn't a cigarette paper, actually, between your constitutional ambitions and those of Plaid Cymru. So, instead of trying to out-nationalist the nationalists by clamouring for more powers, why don't you focus on the powers you already have to turn around the crisis in our NHS, to improve our education system, and to get Wales's economy working?

Labour is the party of devolution, Plaid is the party of independence. There's the difference. It's a fundamental difference. We want to make this place work—a strong Wales in a strong United Kingdom. I'm not apologising for that. What I set out in the IfG speech last week was what Wales needs next. It wasn't just rearguing the past. We've been very clear about the fact that we want to see Gordon Brown's suggestions implemented, that we want to see the independent commission on the constitution of Wales and the recommendations there delivered. Everything I said was not to do with constitutional positioning. It wasn't to do with gesture politics. It was about focusing and making sure we've got the right tools so we can deliver on the things that matter to the people of Wales. One of those is jobs.

People will have a choice in the next election. They will have to choose between whether they want chaos under Reform, which, frankly, we've seen here before—. We've had Nigel Farage’s party in here before. Seven of them were represented. By the end of the term, six of them had joined different parties. Who thinks that's going to happen again? I think a lot of us can predict what is likely to happen if they get elected. Or you can vote for that route towards independence. That is something that is on offer, and I think that is a difficult choice that the people of Wales will need to make. But we are unapologetically focused on the things that matter to the people of Wales. Today, that is about the budget. It's a about the budget and things that matter to the people of Wales when it comes to their daily lives.

You talk about the importance of jobs, and I agree with you, jobs are important, but you're failing on that front, aren't you? We've got the highest unemployment in the United Kingdom. It's gone up by almost 60 per cent since the UK Labour Government was elected, and it's not surprising, because you're heaping more and more taxes on the shoulders of the hard-working people who employ people across this country. The truth of the matter is this: Labour and Plaid Cymru are two cheeks of the same miserable face. That's what you are. You have worked together to pass budgets and legislation, and you have left Wales with the worst educational outcomes, the longest NHS waiting lists, and the lowest wages in Great Britain. So, rather than begging the UK Government for a new deal to save your political skin, why don't you apologise to the people of Wales for the old deals that you've made with Plaid Cymru, including a deal that prioritised creating 36 more politicians in Cardiff Bay, and spending £120 million on that project, instead of creating more doctors, nurses and teachers across Wales to support our public services?

You care about public services? Why won't you vote for the budget today? That's your opportunity to demonstrate that you care. The fact is that we've had a 40 per cent increase in the number of doctors and dentists since the pandemic. This is a huge increase in public services. The Welsh Labour Government has been working tirelessly to create more jobs across Wales: 12,000 supported since I became First Minister and 46,000 jobs in this Senedd term. We've been focused on getting young people into jobs. That youth guarantee has helped 62,000 young people, transforming their lives, giving them opportunities, and now we're focused, absolutely, on the economy. That's why we hosted the investment summit, with £16 billion-worth of investment announced. The key thing to remember is why we're doing this. The reason we're doing this is because we want to raise Wales out of poverty. We want to make sure the people of Wales are equipped with the resources and the skills that they need to land these jobs. We need to give them the powers to pay their bills. That's why we're focused on the economy.

Of course, during that decade, the Welsh Government was the only Government in UK history ever to cut an NHS budget in real terms. However, questioning the health Secretary here in November, I highlighted the frustration and anger expressed over the lack of progress by Betsi Cadwaladr University Health Board in developing a new purpose-built surgery in Waunfawr, Arfon, to replace the current cramped and unsuitable premises. I think that this is a region-wide issue replicated, for example, in Hanmer Surgery, south Wrexham, who continue to fight a similar battle more than 11 years after the existing building was declared unfit for purpose. The delays, excuses and errors behind this only add to the primary care shortage in north Wales, and the impact that this has on the region's accident and emergency departments.

Although creating a new surgery via progressive theoretical stages was proposed at a subsequent meeting between the health board and Hanmer Surgery, concern was expressed to me that this could once again fall victim to the health board's, quote, 'inflexible thinking and rigid administrative procedures'. When, if ever, in its few remaining weeks, will your Government ensure active engagement with primary care practitioners, patient groups and professional bodies to deliver on their evidenced calls for the development of community capacity in north Wales?

Mark, it was your Government that starved our Government of capital investment for over a decade. That meant that we couldn't invest in these things, and now we are able, for the first time, to do that. But that's no thanks to you, and today you won't be voting for a budget that is actually putting more money into capital expenditure. The fact is that we know Betsi is challenged, but it is important, I think, to note that 58 per cent fewer people are waiting for over two years for treatment, there's an 82 per cent reduction in those waiting over three years and a 41 per cent reduction in those waiting for four hours in emergency departments. This is because that extra funding has gone in from the Welsh Government—funding that you blocked.

Cancer mortality rates in Wales have improved by 17 per cent over the past 20 years. Five-year net survival rates for all cancers have improved by almost 10 percentage points over the last 15 years. Between December 2024 and November 2025, more than 170,000 people were informed they didn't have cancer. We recognise that there is a lot more to be done. I'm pleased that there have been advances in some health boards. Hywel Dda, for example, have made substantial strides and have seen over an 8 per cent improvement in performance over the past year.

When it comes to the PET scan situation, it is for Betsi as a health board to commission or deliver services, including PET scans, for its patients. We're aware of ongoing contractual issues related to the procurement of an outsourced mobile provider that means that the health board is unable to deliver PET scans in the short term. Whilst Betsi is resolving the contractual issue, it's moved quickly to ensure that patients are able to access alternative treatment.

First Minister, prostate cancer is the most common form of cancer in men in Wales, with one in eight men here being diagnosed with the disease during their lives. Now, as you know, First Minister, the key to surviving this dreadful disease is early detection. Wales has historically been the only UK nation without a dedicated Government-led cancer awareness campaign targeted at men, unlike England and Scotland, which have had campaigns to highlight risk factors and symptoms. With this in mind, First Minister, what steps will your Government take to raise awareness, and when will we see a move back to screening men over 50, as was taking place some 30 years ago, so that we can actually make strides to improve outcomes for men affected? Surely we should be pursuing the preventative agenda, as we were many years ago.

Look, I recognise that prostate cancer is, I think, the largest cancer when it comes to men suffering from cancer, so clearly we have to take it very seriously. And we do take it seriously. It is not clinically advised, as I understand, to screen for prostate cancer. Look, we're following advice, we're following evidence. That is the way we try and do things in the Welsh Government.

Yet again I'm standing here raising the issue of firefighters' health. Last month I accused the Welsh Government of dragging its feet on this issue, but I think it's becoming apparent now that there is a complete lack of urgency on the issue of firefighters dying at a young age because of the cancer linked to their service. It's been raised consistently by the Fire Brigades Union. The evidence is clear, yet months after we were told to expect advice from the Chief Medical Officer for Wales, we're still waiting. So, an honest answer today in FMQs will be really appreciated by the Fire Brigades Union and the fire service. When will that advice be published, and can we expect it before the election? The reality is very, very simple: the longer we delay, the more firefighters get diagnosed with cancer and the more firefighters die at a young age, when it could've been completely avoided.

Thanks, Luke, and thanks for your perseverance on this issue. It is something we need to take very seriously. We need to look at the evidence. People are looking at the evidence as we speak. We're waiting for that advice, and I will ask the Cabinet Secretary for Health and Social Care to make sure that we speed up that advice and get it as soon as we can.

The tourism sector is a major contributor to the Welsh economy and to jobs, in particular in Mid and West Wales. We're investing millions to strengthen the tourism sector, supporting businesses to grow and improve visitor experiences. Visit Wales promotes the region year-round, and I know that there's real excitement in Powys, knowing that their county will feature prominently in the 2027 Tour de France grand départ, with Welsh Labour Government support, demonstrating to a global audience what a wonderful place Powys and Wales are to visit.

Diolch, First Minister. I was pleased to see the recent completion of a new eco-tourism development in Cardigan. Fronteifi Nature Lodges reflect the beauty of the surrounding Teifi marshes, while being committed to sustainability and also social value. All major construction was self-funded with a loan from the Development Bank of Wales tourism fund. The project incorporates green technologies and carbon-reducing measures, with local tradespeople, contractors and suppliers supplying furnishing, artwork, tree planting, ecological consultancy and guest services. First Minister, do you agree with me that this demonstrates how valuable and essential support from the Development Bank of Wales is to many small and medium-sized businesses in Wales? 

Diolch, Joyce. As a Member for Mid and West Wales, I'm really pleased to see investments like Fronteifi Nature Lodges in Cardigan. This is exactly the kind of tourism development the Welsh Labour Government is backing—high quality, rooted in place, environmentally responsible and genuinely accessible. As you say, that contribution that's come via the Wales tourism investment fund, delivered through the Development Bank of Wales, has made a real difference here—a £180,000 loan, helping a strong local idea to become a reality. I think what stands out is the clear commitment to sustainability and inclusion, from low-carbon design and biodiversity improvements to accommodation that works for people with a range of needs. That matters because everybody should be able to enjoy what this part of Wales has to offer. It's a clear example of Welsh Labour supporting rural business, strengthening local economies and raising standards across tourism in Wales.

First Minister, one way to support tourism businesses and many other businesses in Mid and West Wales is by addressing the cumulative impact of rising business rates bills that many are now facing. Yesterday I hosted an online business rates advice forum with Samuel Kurtz with around 100 businesses in west Wales, and we heard just how serious the rate revaluations are for some of these businesses. One business explained that their rateable value has increased by a staggering 84 per cent, and there were others who made it clear that the changes would be devastating, not just for their business but for the wider sector.

First Minister, the sector needs stability and support. So, can you confirm whether the Welsh Government intends to follow the UK Government's recent u-turn on business rates? Can you also tell us what action the Welsh Government will take to support those businesses in Mid and West Wales affected by business rates changes, before it's too late for some of these businesses?

We'll be providing £116 million in transitional relief over the next two years, following the 2026 revaluation. That is on top of our fully funded permanent relief schemes, which are currently £250 million to businesses and other ratepayers every year. If you, in your manifesto, are going to be offering to cut this, then you have to explain where you're going to get £300 million or so from. Nobody supported small businesses more than the Welsh Labour Government during the pandemic. We stood by them in their hour of need, and they survived as a result of the Welsh Labour Government.

Good afternoon, Prif Weinidog. I just wanted to highlight one other tourist destination, which is actually a destination and also creates a destination in itself, which is the Heart of Wales railway line. It was featured in the National Geographic and was named the best on the planet, would you believe it, for slow travel in 2025. There are many ways that you could take that, of course—[Laughter.]—but I think the idea is that it gives you the opportunity to look as you're travelling along the Heart of Wales line. 

Very seriously, the Heart of Wales line is a tourist attraction as well as taking people to tourist attractions, but it is also used by commuters as they go into various towns and young people go for education. I was pleased that last year I secured £1.25 million in the budget deal, and I'm pleased to see that that's going to continue into this year. Five trains a day now, but we need more than that: we need eight trains a day. So, could I ask you: what is your Government doing in order to ensure that public transport, including the Heart of Wales line, across Mid and West Wales is increased? Diolch yn fawr iawn.

Well, you know that we have poured money into rail in Wales—£800 million invested, £1 billion on the core Valleys lines, brand-new trains across the whole of Wales. You can see them every day, and they’re lifting the hearts of commuters everywhere. But you’re right, there’s a real love and affection in particular for the Heart of Wales line, and your support for that £1.25 million has led to an increase in the number of trains per day, and I hope that is appreciated by people in the area.

The Cabinet Secretary for Health and Social Care and Welsh Government officials meet with the health board to hold them to account for the delivery and safe running of their services and sites. This includes the recent public accountability meeting and the regular reviews with the chair.

Thank you, First Minister, for that answer. Again, the quality journalism at Wales Online has brought forward a report that the health board has kept under wraps in the sterilisation and decontamination unit at that hospital, where a report was finalised in July 2024, when you were health Minister, and it highlighted unacceptable levels of bullying, toxicity, criminal activity, with damaging of surgical instruments, and a complete lack of confidence in the management at the university health board to deal with these issues. In fact, you keep talking about the social partnership model that the Labour Party are proud of here in Wales. The trade union reps describe the unit as 'savage' and 'unforgiving', with some staff unable to speak freely and openly. Are you proud that a health board is running a unit in the premier hospital of Wales in such a manner? And if you aren't proud of that, what is your Government doing to make sure that these issues are addressed? Will you commit to making sure that report is publicly published, so that constituents who use that hospital can get satisfaction that measures are being taken?

Well, I'll come on to your point, but I think it’s important to start with the good news in relation to Cardiff and Vale University Health Board. Over 231,000 people attended GP appointments, in a population of 520,000 people, in the last month. That accounts for over 44 per cent of the population. One-hundred-and-four week waits are down 72 per cent, 52-week out-patient waits are down 37 per cent, and we’ve seen a 60 per cent reduction in one-hour handovers in the last year. So, there are improvements within Cardiff, but—[Interruption.]—but there are also issues that need to be addressed. It’s not unusual for health boards to do internal reviews and for these not to be shared with the Welsh Government, or in public board meetings, especially in cases where it could prejudice any disciplinary action. Now, we understand that disciplinary action has concluded against the individuals related in this report, and we’ve asked the health board to provide us with a copy, and we are yet to receive that. But there is a new chair, a new approach, and we do expect to see improvements in that health board.

Jobs are training are important, of course. You referenced your investment summit; of course, the universities of South Wales West weren't invited, they told me, to that investment summit, so that was rather surprising. Deprivation in my region is deep-rooted, long-standing and spread across very different kinds of communities. Whether it's valley communities, coastal towns or urban neighbourhoods, challenges are distinct while outcomes can often be the same. And this reality was set out very clearly in a recent letter from the leader of Neath Port Talbot Council to the UK Government Secretary of State for Housing, Communities and Local Government. While he, of course, welcomed additional investment, he warned that programmes such Pride in Place, which restrict funding to a single contiguous neighbourhood, forces councils into making impossible choices between equally deprived communities. He also made the point that, in places like Neath Port Talbot, deprivation doesn't follow neat boundaries, and that our geography makes a one-size-fits-all approach like this particularly ill-suited. And I know similar concerns have been raised by Members across the Siambr about the way that funding frameworks as a whole are designed and delivered with limited flexibility. So, with that in mind, how is the Welsh Government working with local authorities and communities to ensure that efforts to alleviate deprivation are comprehensive rather than selective?

Well, first of all, let me make it clear that the vice-chancellor of Cardiff attended the investment summit and could not have commended it more highly. Let me be clear also that, unlike under the Tory Government, the Welsh Government now is able to allocate the over £500 million that previously was directed directly by the UK Government. We are working up proposals with the local authorities to make sure that we work in a co-ordinated and consistent manner in order to address those poverty issues in our communities.

In Wales we've always recognised the value of education. That’s why we spend a higher proportion of our budget on education than they do in England. It’s why we’ve provided free breakfast clubs for 21 years to ensure our pupils are ready to learn. It’s why we provide mental health support in schools, and why, in the budget we hope to pass today, we're providing more money to local government, so that they can pass it on to schools. Blaenau Gwent will see £165 million in that budget—an increase of £7.7 million on last year.

I'm very grateful to you, First Minister, for that. I tabled this question because I received correspondence from the children at Coed-y-Garn Primary School in Blaenau in my constituency. You'll see that they've written to me talking about the need for greater investment in both Coed-y-Garn school itself, but also in education. They make the point in their letter that we're not simply investing in bricks and mortar—although we are—we're also investing in their futures, and we are investing in some of the most deprived communities in the country. Schools like Coed-y-Garn work hard every day to give those pupils the best possible start in life. So, First Minister, I thought it would be useful for you to speak directly, perhaps, this afternoon, to the children of Coed-y-Garn school and say to them how important you regard education to be, and why passing the budget this afternoon matters to them and their school.

Well, thank you, Coed-y-Garn school, and thank you for approaching Alun Davies with this. I want to reassure you that the commitment of this Welsh Labour Government to education is absolute, and what we've done is increase the amount of money that is going into your school. And not just into your school, but also into supporting you, because, of course, we now have 3,569 children in Blaenau Gwent, including those in Coed-y-Garn, who now benefit from the offer of a free school meal in primary schools. That is an example of where we're making a difference. If we are re-elected in May, I want to assure those pupils that the chances of their support staff staying in those schools is going to be greater, because last weekend we made a commitment that, if Labour is re-elected in May, more money will go into education to support school support staff in Blaenau Gwent and the rest of Wales. These critical workers will receive year-round pay, not just in term time, and that will lead to a pay rise for the lowest-paid workers, including the 30,000 teaching assistants, the dinner ladies, who, I know, those children in Coed-y-Garn love, and the caretakers who make sure that they are there at all hours.

Diolch, Rhys ab Owen. The Homelessness and Social Housing Allocation (Wales) Bill introduces sufficient safeguards to ensure that prevention, support and accommodation plans are properly assessed, kept under review and given due consideration in decisions on the suitability of accommodation, including through enhanced internal review rights.

Diolch, Rhys. We have a slight difference of opinion there, I am afraid. The judgment in Norton confirms that a failure to carry out an updated housing assessment under the Housing Act 1996 does not automatically render a decision on the suitability of accommodation unlawful. The proper question is whether the decision maker had sufficient information and whether the decision was lawful and not prejudicial to the applicant.

In Wales, local housing authorities must assess whether the accommodation is suitable for each member of the household when discharging homelessness functions. The Homelessness and Social Housing Allocation (Wales) Bill strengthens existing requirements and seeks to embed a more trauma-informed, person-centred framework to respond to homelessness. For example, the Bill requires local authorities to prepare, maintain and keep under review a prevention, support and accommodation plan, which is a plan jointly developed with the applicant and based on the assessment of the applicant's housing need. The Bill introduces new rights of review in relation to prevention, support and accommodation plans. They can be reviewed at any time while the authority is required to maintain the plan. The Bill also extends the timescales for requesting a review of the suitability of accommodation, enhancing fairness and accessibility.

So, taken together, these provisions, we think, ensure that the Bill adequately addresses the issues arising from Norton against the London borough of Haringey, in particular the concern that deficiencies in housing assessments could be given insufficient weight in suitability of the decision making. The Bill strengthens safeguards around updating assessments, suitability decisions and increases access to internal review. So, I am of the view that no amendments to the Bill are required and, indeed, it strengthens the position in Wales quite considerably.

Torfaen County Borough Council are progressing their replacement local development plan in line with the agreed delivery agreement timetable. If the situation changes in the future, the Welsh Government will give due consideration to all appropriate options, which may require me to provide legal advice, but I have not yet done so.

Thanks, Counsel General. Torfaen's replacement local development plan has been pushed back significantly, with the authority indicating that adoption is now not expected until 2028. Now, this follows earlier revisions that aimed for adoption in 2026, but the timetable had slipped again after officers required an additional six months to assess land-use options and assemble the full evidence base. Now, all of these delays are bad news for the authority, economy and local residents. We also know that Torfaen council has been working through detailed feedback from the Welsh Government on sites in the south-east of the county, alongside studies into potential strategic projects in Cwmbran. A preferred strategy was expected in October 2025, with a deposit plan scheduled a year later, and only then can the plan be submitted for examination. Given this extended sequence of delays in Torfaen, can the Counsel General outline how the Welsh Government—[Inaudible.]—revised timetable remains achievable?

Diolch, Peter. The local development plans, as you know, are a vital part of the planning system in Wales. And the Welsh Government remains completely committed to their role in the planning system. They're a key tool in enabling local planning authorities to steer, guide and shape development in the future, meeting the local community's needs, increasing economic opportunities, and supporting change with local infrastructure. 

Without that clear vision for the future, as you rightly say, backed up by the statutory plan, LPAs can be vulnerable to speculative development, which may not meet the needs of their local community. So, I agree entirely with you that it's very important that they go ahead. 

I'm aware—I hope you're aware also—of the federation approach being followed by Torfaen and Blaenau Gwent councils, rationalising services where there is common ground, generating efficiency savings, and sharing skills and knowledge whilst delivering for their communities. We're of the view that if LPAs can come together to prepare a joint LDP, this can be a more effective and efficient mechanism, delivering more for less for the local community. But it is for the local planning authorities to determine that approach, and then it's for us to work with them to make sure that that comes forward.

Our understanding is that parallel reports are going to be taken to both councils very shortly now, in March, to pave the way for that federation approach. And then, through discussions, we understand that there's a date coming forward to make rapid progress on the development of that joint LDP. We would very much welcome a joint LDP coming forward, and, at this point in time, I have no reason to think that won't happen.

Diolch, Llywydd. Counsel General, the High Court, in its judgment on ATB v. Welsh Ministers, handed down on 25 November last year, after an initial hearing on 8 October, refused leave to judicially review secondary Senedd legislation in relation to the prescription of puberty-suppressing medication. However, the court did record that the Welsh Government misunderstood the effect of the second set of regulations, which we debated in the Senedd on 10 December 2024, and that they were specifically presented in the explanatory memorandum, and in other ministerial communication, as tightening restrictions, when the opposite is true. Welsh Ministers, according to the judgment, apologised to the court and to the claimant. Can the Counsel General confirm that I've given an accurate account of the court's findings?

This is a matter that's been discussed with the health Secretary, and not with me. I have a jurisdiction up until the point of the judgment, and then, once the judgment has happened, it would be passed over to the relevant Cabinet Secretary. I'm aware of the judgment, but I don't have that kind of detail at my fingertips, Adam. It would have been discussed with the Cabinet Secretary. 

But, Counsel General, you are responsible, aren't you, for litigation involving Welsh Ministers? Can you at least tell us when, given that the High Court has now recorded that the Senedd and the public were given an inaccurate, misleading description of these regulations—? Are you able to tell us on what date your office first became aware of the discrepancy, when the responsible Ministers were informed, or when the health Minister issued any formal correction to Members, since the judgment was handed down on 25 November 2025?

As you're aware, under the ministerial code, which governs Ministers and the Counsel General, there is a duty to correct the record where inadvertent errors have been made at the earliest available opportunity. It's been more than three months since the initial hearing, when the Welsh Government apologised in court. So, have we had a written statement? Has the explanatory memorandum been corrected? And if not, why not, and when will that happen?

I'm afraid I don't have the detail of the exact conversation. I'll have to write to the Member with the detail; I don't have it about my person. I don't recollect it just off the top of my head. 

Counsel General, would you accept—and this does go to your responsibilities—given everything that I've shared, that the legislative handling of this highly sensitive, complex matter, affecting children and young people, and a particularly vulnerable group within that cohort, has been badly mismanaged? This is a serious matter that should concern Members across the Chamber, whatever their views on the underlying policy. The Government confirmed in court that there was no child rights impact assessment. The explanatory memorandum also stated there was no consultation with those directly affected and their parents or guardians. The court proceedings, as we've now discovered, make clear that you didn't even understand your own legislation, which raises serious questions about internal legal assurance and sign-off.

So, will you now, as Counsel General, undertake a full review of how this developed, how the legislation was assessed, described and laid out and reported to the Senedd, and will you lay that review before the Senedd before the end of this session? Because no Government, no Counsel General, and no Minister should ever find themselves in this position.

Well, I think, Adam, you're rather overstating the remarks of the court and the effect on the overall judgment there, but I don't have the detail about my person, as I said, so I will write to you about that. Of course we take all of these things very seriously. We particularly take items of that sort very seriously, and I'm in discussion with the Cabinet Secretary about it. But I'm afraid I don't have the detail—the times, and so on—that you're asking for available to me right now, so I'll have to write to you.

Diolch, Llywydd. Counsel General, before the general election, we were told that two Labour Governments, working together on a shared agenda, would deliver for Wales. Prior to the general election, Welsh Labour called for the devolution of policing, youth justice, the Crown Estate, rail and so on. Can you tell us which of those has been devolved since the general election?

Well, I can, but I don't entirely understand what that's got to do with my portfolio at all, I'm afraid. So, I don't quite know where you're going with that.

Thank you very much. Well, you are responsible, obviously, for the legislative programme of the Welsh Government—

Which is nothing to do with what you just asked me. 

—it might be news to you, but it's certainly not news to us. Last week, we saw the First Minister call for a fairer funding model, a constitutional reform Act, and more powers for Wales, including on rail. But then, earlier this month, you said that you weren't sure that Wales actually wanted powers for rail devolved from Westminster at all. So, is it a surprise that the UK Government is unwilling to devolve power when the Welsh Government itself is inconsistent in the calls that it's making?

I did not say that. I said in a much longer interview that what we would want very much was the funding to be devolved at the same time, and that devolution is a journey and not an event. So, if you're going to quote me, at least read the whole speech. Again, I'm afraid this interaction between the UK Government and the Welsh Government is not within my portfolio. You need to address your questions to the Deputy First Minister or the First Minister.

I've got the quote here:

'"I'm not sure we're wanting the devolution of it," she said.'

So, always read to the end of the page.

Will you let me finish my question? It comes out of an article with the headline, 'Welsh Government accused of rail devolution—

Yes, and you haven't read the whole speech.

—U-turn'. I have read the whole speech—I've read it there. You mention—

You haven't; you've read the journalistic report.

Llywydd, is this a question and answer session, or is this—

This isn't a conversation between the two Members. Ask your question, Tom Giffard, and you'll have the right to reply.

Llywydd, I see very little point in asking this Counsel General very many questions, because she just fails to answer them—

Ask the question.

Ask me one in my portfolio.

—on a consistent basis.

If there's no point to it, then you can sit down.

I'm asking the Counsel General to justify the remarks that she has made, but she seems unwilling to do it, even when presented with the evidence.

So, on a consistent basis, there is an inconsistent approach, isn't there, at the heart of this Welsh Government, where you've got a First Minister calling for powers to be devolved, only to be undermined by the Counsel General, who is then saying that those powers are not needed in the first place. How can we have a situation where we have a Welsh Government that is inconsistent about what it wants within it? There's no wonder, is there, that a Welsh Labour MP, an unnamed Welsh Labour MP, said there's no way policing would be devolved, despite the First Minister's calls this week. So, how can it be that this Welsh Government, this Welsh Labour Party, expects the public to take it seriously and to listen to the things that it says, when its own party is not listening to it in Westminster?

And you're not listening to the answers I'm giving you, either. [Interruption.] It's very important not to carry on reading things out when somebody has already answered part of your question—

Your quotes. Your quotes.

Read the whole speech—

I have.

—don't read the journalistic outcome of it. I will be very clear for you: of course we want policing devolved. We want policing devolved with its budgets wholly intact and in a coherent fashion. I was asked the question, 'Do we want it right this second?' So, it's very important context, Tom Giffard. The other thing I would say is that it would be really nice, as a spokesperson for the CG, if you ever asked me anything in my own portfolio.

Question 3 [OQ63734] has been withdrawn by Laura Anne Jones, even though she is in the Chamber, but I'll consider it withdrawn.

Well, Delyth, state pensions are the responsibility of the Department for Work and Pensions in the UK Government, and Welsh Ministers do not have devolved powers in this subject area.

Thank you. I appreciate that point. Women born in the 1950s, though, are still waiting in limbo. Women born in the 1950s were denied their pensions, and many women have died without having the money that they are owed. Campaigners have fought long and hard for justice. It does seem that the memories of Ministers in Westminster are short. They have forgotten the promises they made before they came to power. Campaigners are calling for mediation. A petition calling for this has reached more than 30,000 signatures, and calls have been made too for an apology that acknowledges maladministration and discrimination. I realise that this is a Westminster issue, but time is running out in this Senedd. You, Counsel General, have been a strong voice on this matter and for justice, as was your predecessor. Could I ask if you could use your voice in these final weeks before the Welsh election to raise the matter with your colleagues again in Westminster? It is high time the women's voices were heard and justice attained.

Yes, absolutely, Delyth. I always have to say this: I'm a WASPI woman myself, so I obviously have an interest in it. So, I would just like to say that. Delyth, at this point, normally tells me I'm the same age as her mother, which always cheers me up. But, yes, of course we will do that.

There's been a decision taken by the Secretary of State to consider new evidence relating to how the change in the state pension age was communicated by the Department for Work and Pensions, and the action was agreed with the WASPI campaign group on 2 December. There's a 12-week time frame for that, which I know you're aware of, so we know that that's running. We've continued to raise concerns about this matter with the UK Government since 2016, and will continue to do so. My colleague Jane Hutt does it on every occasion she can, as do the rest of us. You're absolutely right, it's a long-standing issue that requires a just and satisfactory resolution at the earliest opportunity.

We provide a range of support to assist people with that. As always, here in Wales, we try to make sure that people are assisted. We provide a range of support, generally through my colleague Jane Hutt's portfolio. We have the single advice fund and the 'Claim what's yours' national benefit take-up campaign, just to name a few, just to try and make sure that people do have some support. Because there was a large number of women who suddenly couldn't retire when they thought they could, and certainly didn't have the amount of time it would have taken for them to build up enough of a pot. So, we continue to make those points, but we have no actual power because it's not devolved.

A question not designed to catch you out, I promise. [Laughter.]

Thank you very much, Lindsay. I'm delighted to answer it. As Minister for Delivery, I work alongside all our health Ministers to help drive momentum behind our health policies. So, my successes are their successes. Together, we are cutting long waiting times and delivering measurably better health outcomes for Wales. We have a process that sits behind that, and I continue to meet with my Cabinet colleagues on a monthly basis.

Thank you. The situation on targets, I believe, remains deeply concerning. The Welsh Government has, whether we like it or not, repeatedly failed to meet its key delivery targets in health. We've seen persistent failures in accident and emergency waiting times and cancer treatment pathways. For example, the target of 62 days, I think, is appalling, and we're not even meeting that target. And breast cancer screening areas, where timely action can be the difference between life and death, again, not met. Surgeons themselves have warned that a lack of theatre capacity and staff burn-out are actively undermining processes. As the Minister for Delivery, is there any more you can do, please, to try and improve this? And—wait for it—what can we do to help? You don't hear that often.

The Cabinet Secretary for Health and Social Care is responsible for improvements across the health portfolio. My role as Minister for Delivery is to provide targeted support that helps drive progress. The way it works is I meet on a monthly basis with the Cabinet Secretary and his Ministers to discuss health priority areas, and we have a data-led and very honest discussion about where we are, how we're performing, and what we're constantly trying to do to identify areas that will help us improve that delivery.

You've asked for a few things there. So, what we do is we pick particular things to have a focus on. So, the First Minister was very clear that my focus to assist my health colleagues was in three specific areas: women's health hubs, which we have opening right across Wales by March; the waiting-time figures, which we have been working consistently on, and I'm delighted to say are a testament to the hard work of NHS staff and the £120 million invested by this Welsh Labour Government. There's a 23,400 drop in the overall waiting list in November, the biggest ever monthly fall, and it's the sixth consecutive month the waiting list has been cut. The number of people waiting more than two years is now down to 6,900. Provisional figures for December, which are only provisional because they're not yet announced by Stats Wales, are down to 5,300. And all health boards, except Betsi, have either no-one or less than 1 per cent of pathways waiting for more than two years for treatment, and even in Betsi the falls are much higher than they've been before. The number of people waiting more than 36 weeks for treatment is at the lowest level since April 2021. The number of people waiting for more than a year for their first out-patient appointment is at its lowest level since October 2020. 

What I think you can say from that is that I in the middle have concentrated on a number of those metrics, but what you can see is a health service that's working incredibly well. I hate this 'broken' language. These are people dedicated and working really hard. The demand is extraordinary and it's rising really fast. It's something to celebrate. The boomer generation is going into the health and social care system at the moment. Those people are much younger at their age than the generation before them. They live longer, they have high expectations of what they want. We have to gear up for that. So, the system is working incredibly well and efficiently. We have to continue to invest. 

Lindsay, I know you share this concern as much as I do. We have been starved of funds by an austerity-driven political ideology for 14 long years here in Wales. Now at last we have a chance to invest in our public services, and what this shows is when you invest, my goodness, you get a response from the people who work in that service, because they want to give us the services we need. So, you outlined a number of areas where we have a way to go, but it's so much better than it was this time last year across the board. And just in my own health board, for example—touch wood, because we're not out of the winter yet—we don't have ambulances queued up outside A&E, because we've implemented the 10-point plan in A&E for flow in the hospital. So, it's an improving situation, but what we need to do is continue to invest. And if our colleagues who are muttering on the benches opposite got their way, of course, they would start to cut public services again and cut the jobs of public servants. Darren Millar said that on a Sharp End programme with me only very recently—that what they wanted to do was cut more public sector jobs. So, I very much hope that we will be able to continue to invest and have a real focus on what is most helpful to get all of these services to where we'd like them to be. 

My supplementary was about how you work at tackling the waiting list, but it feels that you may have answered that already. I don't know if you've got anything else to add. Thank you.  

Yes. What we do is we have a data-driven approach to waiting lists across the various health boards. I don't drive this; my cabinet colleague Jeremy Miles drives this with his team. What I do is I assist in the interrogation of the data, and I have staff and analytical services staff who are able to get underneath that data and show us where targeted intervention is necessary and targeted assistance is necessary. So, it's a methodology for focusing on what makes a real difference in which area, and we can see that it works, because we can really see the benefits.

I wait a long time for a question and, like buses, two come along at once. [Laughter.]  

Whilst rail infrastructure is not devolved to Wales, we do continue to make the case for a fair share of funding for rail infrastructure projects at every opportunity.

Counsel General, I'm sure you'll agree with me that, once again, Wales is short-changed to the tune of an extra £1 billion of rail investment. And, as the UK Labour Government refuses to change the situation with Northern Powerhouse, HS2, Oxford to Cambridge, all of this money is spent in England for the sole benefit of England, yet regarded as England and Wales projects. Legally, what are the barriers to the Westminster Government changing this system? Or do you think this is about saving money by short-changing Wales?

Well, to answer your question directly, there aren't any barriers, of course. What we're concentrating on is making sure that when we get devolution of rail, we get the funding to go with it, and that's the case across all devolution journeys. I would like very much to see rail investment in Wales go up. We've had a welcome boost recently, but nothing like what we'd like. We'd absolutely like to see that investment go up. What I would say to you is that, when we take control of the railways, like with the core Valleys lines, you can see the difference that can be made. Transport for Wales is the most improved rail operator across Britain. We have really seriously pleasing rises in passenger numbers. I hope that all of the people in the Chamber have had the chance to go on some of the new and refurbished trains. They are absolutely splendid. I had the chance to travel on one of the lines very recently. I do recommend that you read the whole of the interview I gave after I'd travelled on the train, because one of the things I was able to say was that, in Wales, we have a tri-mode train, and that is the only train in Europe—and, I believe, in the world, though I'd have to check that, but certainly in Europe—that can change mode at speed. So, it can change from electric to battery to a back-up diesel, back to battery, back to electric at speed on the line. And we've developed that in Wales. We should be so proud of it. It's extraordinary. I was on the train when it swapped modes, and there's no diminution of speed. They're lovely trains and people were, without any prompting, telling me how great they were, and you can see from passenger numbers—they're going up. We have huge increases in reliability, and so on. So, there's a very good case for giving us better rail investment because, when we have it, we do really great things with it.

Statutory duties to strengthen judicial independence are a central part of our tribunal reform proposals. As part of this, we've consulted on introducing judicial oaths and affirmations for all Welsh tribunal members as a clear public expression of their respective commitment to justice and fairness and to uphold judicial independence.

Diolch yn fawr, Rhys. I said, and you know how much I regret this, that we haven't been able to bring forward the tribunals Bill to get it into law this Senedd term, but we continue to work on it, and I really hope that it will be an early year 1 Bill in whatever government we have after the elections. But it's not because we didn't want to; it's because it's actually quite a complicated thing to do and there are lots of interactions with other things, and a number of things keep popping up—'Events, dear boy', as they say. So, the mental health tribunal team were the same team working on the tribunals Bill, you won't be at all surprised to find. So, we have to be able to be agile. And I just want to take this opportunity to thank them once more, because most of them gave up their Christmas and had hardly any time to themselves over that period, and we did a very good job—27 days between understanding and sealing. So, that's really great. 

The crux of the matter, judicial independence, is absolutely the principle that guides the way in which judicial institutions are currently supported in Wales, and it's the principle that I hope will continue to guide the way for the Wales of the future. We set out in the White Paper on tribunal reform, as you mentioned, that statutory protections for judicial independence and for the independent administration of justice should be the cornerstone of the modern tribunal system in Wales because, exactly as you say, such protections reinforce public confidence in the judiciary, ensure impartial and transparent decision making, and safeguard the integrity of Wales's emerging justice system. Responses to the White Paper showed broad and consistent support for the proposals for strengthening judicial independence. Many stakeholders welcomed the proposal for statutory duties to uphold judicial independence for a form of judicial oath or affirmation for tribunal members, and for the creation of a structurally independent statutory body to administer the new tribunal system. So, work continues to prepare the tribunals Bill and to translate those proposals into a legislative framework that will govern how our tribunals are made. I very much hope to get to the point where it would easily be a year 1 Bill for the next Senedd.

Diolch yn fawr, Sioned Williams. This is a difficult time for the higher education sector, not only in Wales, but in the whole of the UK, and we fully appreciate the tough decisions universities are having to make. I understand that Swansea continues to engage with trade and student unions, but we do expect universities and colleges to work closely with their staff. The Minister for Further and Higher Education has made this very clear.

Working closely with staff and student unions in social partnership and also the concerns about the mental health and well-being of staff and learners are prioritised. Medr engages closely with all universities to understand their individual positions and the plans that they're putting in place to ensure their long-term financial sustainability. 'The future of tertiary education in Wales: five challenges and calls for submission' does invite stakeholders to have their say on the challenges facing the sector, which will contribute to a robust evidence base for the development of future policy.

Just finally, in recognition of the financial challenges facing higher education, of course, the Welsh Government provided an additional £28.5 million in 2024-25, bringing that total grant support for the sector to over £200 million. This comes in addition to increasing tuition fees in two consecutive years, which we expect to generate up to £21.9 million in income for 2025-26, and an additional £5 million for further education in this the final budget—extra funding at the draft budget, extra funding via Medr for 2026-27. Importantly for higher education, this is to support priorities in further and higher education.

Trefnydd, I'd like to request a statement from the Cabinet Secretary for Health and Social Care on the delivery of health services in west Wales. In a few weeks' time, Hywel Dda university health board will hold an extraordinary board meeting to consider the future model of delivery for nine of its clinical services. Any changes to those services would, of course, have a huge impact on local patients. The nine service areas affected are critical care, dermatology, emergency general surgery, endoscopy, ophthalmology, orthopaedics, stroke, radiology and urology. Trefnydd, before the health board makes any decisions, the Welsh Government has the opportunity to make it clear to the people of west Wales that it will not rubber-stamp any proposals that force patients to have to travel even further for essential services. I'd be grateful if we could have a statement from the Cabinet Secretary for Health and Social Care on the delivery of services in west Wales so we can hear directly from the Welsh Government about its views on the delivery of healthcare in the area, and so Members can question them on the health board's management of services in west Wales.

Thank you very much for your question, Paul Davies. It is very important that the health board is having that special meeting to look at these services, which of course are important for all your constituents in your constituency and across the health board area. Of course, the health board is very clear on the Welsh Government's priorities in terms of delivery, and, indeed, their planning responsibilities for the delivery of those services in terms of all the strategic guidelines and pathways that the Welsh Government and the Cabinet Secretary for Health and Social Care have clearly laid out. They are well aware of this, and so are the people and patients of your health board area. However, I think it's also, at this point, really useful to mention the role of Llais in terms of the patient voice, and I'm sure that they will be engaging. This is the first step, with transparent and open health board discussions. 

Today is Holocaust Memorial Day, as Darren Millar has already mentioned. The industrial extermination of 6 million innocent people was based on their ethnicity, race, disability, sexuality and political opposition to the Nazis. Babies and young children, along with elderly people, were sent straight to the gas chambers, along with anybody who wasn't able to be used as slave labour.

Amidst that horror, it's extraordinary that Peter Lantos, aged five, survived deportation and a year in Bergen-Belsen, dodging starvation, rampant disease and aerial bombardment. We were able, as a result of his survival, to hear his powerful testimony yesterday in the Temple of Peace. This must inspire us all to double down on the hatred of others that was the foundation stone for the Holocaust and all the other genocides that have occurred both before and since.

The far right is active in my constituency, trying to sow hatred amongst my community. I would like to ask you, Cabinet Secretary, for a statement on how we can double down on this, using the anti-racism action plan to counter the hatred being promoted in our schools, workplaces, pubs and sporting events, so that we can truly ensure that the nation of sanctuary is something we all respect.

Secondly, I wondered if you could have a—

Jenny, no, you've used up well over your time on your first request.

Thank you very much, Jenny Rathbone, and thank you for drawing to our attention, as has already been done today, Holocaust Memorial Day 2026. There was representation across this Chamber at that very powerful event yesterday at the Temple of Peace.

The theme for this year is 'Bridging the Generations—Pontio'r Cenedlaethau'—such an important theme. We heard not only that testimony from Peter Lantos, a Holocaust survivor, but I also would praise and thank the young people from Haverfordwest high school who spoke so powerfully about their experience of the Holocaust Educational Trust, which we fund and support, and their experiences in terms of visiting Poland and Auschwitz, and then coming back. I think what was really strong was the way that the young people said that that had strengthened their determination to fight discrimination and prejudice, and indeed the way in which we tackle hate crime.

I've issued a statement today. I say that Holocaust Memorial Day is an important reminder that genocide is an extreme end point for behaviour and attitudes that start life as hate and dehumanisation. If groups in our society are blamed, treated as inferior and then targeted, we will lay the foundations for such atrocities. In the last year, we've seen horrific attacks on our religious communities and vocal hate towards those from ethnic minorities or born outside the UK.

I think this absolutely strengthens the backing and endorsement of our 'Anti-racist Wales Action Plan'. I thank the Equality and Social Justice Committee, a cross-party committee, for not only supporting the 'Anti-racist Wales Action Plan', which is crucial in terms of tackling hate, but also to recognise the community cohesion work that the committee is undertaking. Also, we're about to report on the work that's been chaired by Gaynor Legall in terms of tackling this. I think we have to recognise that this is a real responsibility. We have our hate support centre—we fund it—and our hate and community tensions board, bringing everyone together, all backing the 'Anti-racist Wales Action Plan'.

Diolch yn fawr, Mabon ap Gwynfor. It is important that we do hear of these situations, which are concerning, in terms of patients and access to the particular, often specialised, services that they need to be able to access. In terms of mental health services, we know that waiting times for mental health services—. I know we're shortly going on to the oral statement on NHS waiting times. I think the reduction in waiting lists for mental health services is very positive, and of course, that can also include access to beds, as well as all-important out-patient and primary care, which is so crucial for mental health services.

Yet again, we had some heavy rain last night, and yet again Gumfreston Road flooded—the B4318—from the Ritec. There's a petition live at the moment. It has had over 2,500 signatures. The local hard-working county councillor Rhys Jordan has pushed Pembrokeshire County Council for action, but has come up against a brick wall. It's becoming such an issue that a local resident, Tom Morgan, has even designed his own web app called 'Is Gumfreston flooded?' That's becoming an issue, because this is one of the main routes into Tenby, stopping people coming in. When it does flood, people get their cars caught. That takes away the fire service from doing their jobs rescuing people from this area. What Rhys Jordan is calling for is a multi-agency approach to tackle this once and for all. It's becoming a real problem and is only getting worse. So, can I call for an oral statement from the Cabinet Secretary for climate change on how he can help lead this multi-agency approach to tackle the flooding of the Ritec on Gumfreston Road once and for all?

Thank you for that question, Sam Kurtz. We are in the position where we're receiving hourly reports on the likely impact of storm Chandra. Of course, that requires multi-agency working. Particularly, you referenced that all-important route into Tenby and the historical situation in terms of that situation. I think it is very important to recognise that we activated level 1 response arrangements yesterday. We anticipated, of course, those strong winds and heavy rainfall. That level 1 response means multi-agency response to co-ordinate departmental input, where needed. I have to assure you that Natural Resources Wales held a flood advisory service meeting today with south Wales, Dyfed-Powys, and Gwent local resilience and flood authorities to plan for multi-agency response, so I'm sure that road also was included in that multi-agency discussion today.

I would like to ask for two statements. The first is on the Welsh Rugby Union. There are serious problems in Welsh rugby. Amongst them is the national team only beating Japan in the last two years, and the WRU unable to sell six nations tickets. Despite the WRU denial, there's a serious drop-off in players participating between the ages of 14 and 18. We know this from the failure of senior teams to have second and third teams. There are now proposals to reduce the number of top-level senior teams, with the owners of Ospreys buying Cardiff placing the Ospreys at risk. We also know, despite attendance not being officially released, there's a lack of spectators at regional games. Economically, the Ospreys are important to the Swansea economy. Can we have a Welsh Government statement regarding recent discussions between the Welsh Government and the WRU on the future of Welsh rugby, including the Ospreys?

I would also like to ask for a Government statement on exempting certifiable compostable bio-based carrier bags from the ban on single-use carrier bags. I would like an explanation on why biodegradable bags are not as environmentally friendly as reusable bags.

Thank you very much, Mike Hedges. Two very important questions this afternoon. We've strongly encouraged the WRU to make sure it listens carefully to the views of clubs, players and all those with an interest in proposals to change the professional game in Wales. And although the future of the game is a matter for the WRU, we all want to see Wales thrive again as a successful rugby nation.

On your second question, in relation to carrier bags, of course, we all know, across this Chamber, that our vision is for a sustainable Wales that’s free of litter, plastic pollution and unnecessary waste. Our policies are designed to encourage reuse, to help shift consumers and businesses towards that more circular economy where products are kept in use for as long as possible.

In response to concerns about consumer behaviour related to reusable carrier bags, we're formulating policies aimed at promoting their sustainable reuse. I think there's a great deal more I could say, Dirprwy Llywydd, but I will just leave it at the fact that we believe any bag that is manufactured to be used only once before being disposed of undermines our aims in relation to circular economy. Studies show that plastic shopping bags used at least five times have less environmental impact than those designed for just one use. Of course, this is about how we can learn from our pioneering work that we've done since we were the first nation, of course, in turn, to ban plastic bags. Diolch yn fawr, Mike Hedges.

Good afternoon, Trefnydd. May I just ask for two statements, please? One is with regard to dentistry in Llandrindod. Llandrindod Wells is a town of 6,000 people and currently has no NHS dentist at all. Little Owl was the town's only dental practice and lost their dentist just before Christmas. So, there are around 6,000 people with no NHS dentist in a rural area with very poor public transport.

The second question is in regard to climate change and rural affairs, particularly on landfills. Bryn Posteg is just 2 miles outside Llanidloes. It's a long-established landfill and waste management site that NRW has previously described as the worst performing landfill site in Wales. For over 15 years, local residents have repeatedly raised concerns about persistent smells, dangerous gas levels and the discharge. So, I'd like to know as well what action we can take on that. Diolch yn fawr iawn.

Diolch yn fawr, Jane Dodds. It is always disappointing, and it must be very disappointing for the people of Llandrindod Wells, when a dentist decides to reduce or end their NHS commitment. When this happens, it's important to put on the record again that the funding for the lost provision remains with the health board for it to replace the level of NHS dental services, and it is important to note and understand that, in Powys, returned funding has been used to establish salaried general dental services, so there is a contingency in place if contracts are handed back. They've also employed a dental therapist to help ensure no children are waiting for access to dental care for an extended period. So, it's important—. The fact is that that funding for lost provision is—. The health board must now move to ensure reprocurement. I think that example for Powys, the GDS service, I'm sure, would be welcome.

On your second point—very discouraging to hear of the impact of this site, the Tylwch tip. NRW is responsible for regulating waste activities relating to landfills and for ensuring site operators fully comply with strict environmental and legal requirements. But I understand NRW is aware of an increase in odour complaints and pollution concerns from the public relating to the Bryn Posteg landfill in Llanidloes. Waste isn't being accepted anymore on the site, but unfortunately the activity on the site is as a result of the operator undertaking capping works, and that can release pockets of odour. So, NRW are conducting site visits and are in regular contact with the operator, and NRW encourages anyone with odour or pollution concerns to report to them using our online reporting form or by calling—and I will give this number—0300 065 3000. So, it is important for the Member, Jane Dodds, but others too to hear that point and that contact detail with these issues rising.

I would like to call for a statement, please, from the Cabinet Secretary for Health and Social Care this afternoon on the use of private facilities in order to repatriate mental health patients referred for in-patient treatment in England. Due to a lack of in-patient mental health beds in north Wales, patients are often referred to out-of-area in-patient treatment, which in my experience can be distressing for the patients. I wrote to Betsi Cadwaladr University Health Board in late 2023, and they acknowledged, and I quote,

'the additional distress that patients can experience while they are further away from local support network or their friends or family'.

Unquote. The largest mental health hospital in Wales opened in Rhyl last year. Seren Gobaith is an independent mental health hospital that has an established referred pathway with the health board, allowing many patients to be repatriated to north Wales for treatment, and they deliver excellent results. However, the pathway has been paused by the health board, completely halting patient referrals. This means the costs are being driven up, patients' stays are longer, beds are more overstretched and patients are being sent further away from their families.

So, can we have a statement from the Cabinet Secretary for Health and Social Care on what discussions he's had with Betsi regarding the suspensions of referrals to Seren Gobaith, whether he could provide a timetable as to whether the referral pathway will be restored and how the Welsh Government is prioritising mental health patients receiving treatment as close to home as possible?

Thank you for that question, Gareth Davies. We've already aired this point; it's been aired earlier on this afternoon by Mabon ap Gwynfor in terms of mental health provision in north Wales. I'm sure that the Minister for Mental Health and Well-being will want to respond to these points in terms of pathways using Seren Gobaith. I mean, there may be different and similar issues here that have been raised, so thank you again for raising that this afternoon.

Trefnydd, could I ask for a statement from the Welsh Government on the agricultural advisory panel, and in particular an update on the setting of the agricultural wages Order for 2026? In the interest of full transparency, I'm a member of Unite, as per my register of interests, and Unite is one of the organisations involved with the panel, and I was part of some of the campaigns to establish it in the first place. So, I'm familiar with the role that it plays and the importance of its work. I very much welcome—and I raised this previously in the Chamber—the Deputy First Minister's commitment to the panel and its purpose. I think now, really, is the time to have that further update, not just on the work of the panel, but the wages Order for 2026, as it's really important to rural workers across Wales. Diolch.

Diolch, Hannah Blythyn, and thank you for raising this again, as you did with the Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Climate Change and Rural Affairs. The importance of the agricultural panel cannot be understated, and the Welsh Government's commitment to the panel and its purpose. I will ask the Deputy First Minister if he can update the Senedd on its purpose and also its progress as well. Thank you for raising it, because it came about as a result of that commitment to social partnership with agricultural workers' workforce, and it also shows our Welsh Government commitment to our rural workforce and our agricultural workforce. So, I think that's a very welcome request for an update and statement.

Trefnydd, the Welsh Government boasts about artificial intelligence growth zones in north and south Wales, promising more than £10 billion of investment and thousands of jobs—fantastic—but AI does not run on good intentions. It needs to be run on vast amounts of reliable, continuous power, and the most reliable power comes from gas. So, I'd like a statement, please, from this Welsh Government, on how it plans to expand gas production in Wales to support their AI dreams, as they will remain only dreams unless you match them with a hard dose of reality that large AI companies need gas power to succeed. I mean, what is clear is that Labour needs to drop this ridiculous net-zero obsession if Wales is to succeed in the future. Diolch.

Well, I do like it so much—[Interruption.]—I like it so much, Laura Anne Jones, when you expose dreadful Reform policy. We haven't got your manifesto yet, but we know you are in complete climate denial and against all of the important policy moves that we are taking to net zero. It is quite extraordinary, but I think we welcome these questions, because it does expose what Reform is all about. It's not about securing the well-being of future generations, which is about economic and social justice, and environmental commitments underpin that.

Trefnydd, can I request a statement from the Cabinet Secretary for Transport and North Wales? The A4042 is a major trunk road running through my constituency, in both Torfaen and Monmouthshire. It has recently been announced the road will see both its northbound and southbound sections closed for around six months due to major roadworks, although the traffic order will be in place for some 18 months. The affected stretch runs between Mamhilad roundabout and the Hardwick interchange at Abergavenny, a stretch of over 7.5 miles. Now, motorists are being warned to expect significant disruption and traffic restrictions throughout the duration of the works. This closure seems to coincide with other major roadworks being undertaken by Monmouthshire County Council in the area, which is going to make certain journeys throughout the county at best difficult and at some times impossible. Can I therefore ask the Cabinet Secretary for Transport and North Wales for a statement on these works, and to ask what prior discussions were had with the local authority to avoid unnecessary disruption?

Well, thank you, Peter Fox. I mean, clearly, major roadworks have to take place. When they are needed, they have to take place. I know that the local authorities, with those responsible for those roadworks, and, of course, that will include Welsh Government on trunk roads—. Clearly, these are planned over a period of time, unless it's an unexpected issue affecting a road, but we need to ensure that those roadworks do take place for the benefit of the economy and the local community, and I am sure that will emerge out of this planned project.

I very much welcome the statement you've made, Trefnydd, this morning on the devolution of policing. I think many of us across this Chamber were profoundly disappointed by the statement made in the House of Commons yesterday by the Home Secretary, where she dismissed and ignored the words that you have put on the record, and the speech made by the First Minister last week. Every time any serious work has been done on this, every commission that has looked at the structure of devolution in Wales has recommended the devolution of policing. The Thomas report is still not being implemented by the United Kingdom Government. This is a matter of social justice and fairness for Wales. Wales is the only country in the United Kingdom that is unable to control its own police force. It's time that Wales had equality with England, Scotland and Northern Ireland. The cities of England have more authority than the people of Wales. Is it not time now for the Government to table a resolution in this place in Government time on a motion to demand the devolution of policing to this place immediately? 

Thank you very much, Alun Davies, for that question. I'm glad that you have noted the written statement that I released earlier on today on our response to the UK Government police reform White Paper, and it's important that it was also raised earlier on in First Minister's questions. What's interesting about this is that we have seen an opportunity emerging in terms of looking at the governance and accountability of policing services in Wales as a result of the announcement to abolish police and crime commissioners in Wales. Of course, I'm very grateful, as I say in my statement, for the work that they've undertaken, and they certainly have represented the voices of our communities. I'm now working with our police and crime commissioners to look at a way forward. And I've had very positive conversations, indeed, with Sarah Jones MP, at a meeting with her at the weekend. She also came to our recent policing partnership board, which I chair.

And so what we have been looking to is a Welsh Government influencing a form of governance with the Home Office during this Senedd term. So, I'm grateful to you for raising this with me, because it shows the urgency of this. This is urgent. We need that clarity before the end of the term. And I will just say, Dirprwy Lywydd, what I've said, and it's in my statement, is we need to build on what currently works. You've been hearing from chief constables, I think, over the last 24 hours, and they do recognise it's about what works and that what delivers for local people in Wales is important. But we want to strengthen the devolution settlement. I've made that absolutely clear. Our longer term goal is to devolve policing to Wales, as you say, recommended by the Thomas commission and the Independent Commission on the Constitutional Future of Wales and, indeed, by the former Silk commission, Silk 2, which was a cross-party group. In fact, the Conservatives supported that at the time. So, thank you for that.

We're proud of the partnerships we've built with our policing partners in Wales, and we want to work forward constructively with them and to strengthen, as I said, the devolution settlement, leading to the devolution of policing to Wales. But it is important that we do look at this in terms of what the needs are of our local people, local communities, in terms of community safety and the opportunities that this—. Let's see this as an opportunity, not a threat, and it's certainly timely that we're discussing this today.

Two constituents have recently raised with me issues they're having with their civil service pension. Firstly, an NHS worker with 22 years of service has been trying to get a pension statement since September to try and get a mortgage. He's still waiting. And this morning, he received an e-mail that there is no timescale for him to receive a statement. A second is someone who was a Welsh Government speechwriter for a number of years. Maybe he's written a few of your speeches, Trefnydd. Last summer, as he was approaching 60 in the autumn, he contacted the civil service pension scheme. He was told the pension was approved and they would receive payment in mid November. To date, no payment has been received. Messages and telephone calls are going unanswered. And it's understood that there are 86,000 civil service pensioners in the UK waiting for their pensions. And I understand that the blame is laid on the fact that they have been moved from MyCSP to Capita. A pension is one of the benefits of working in the civil service, and I'm sure Members who'll be retiring shortly would not want to be waiting that long for their pensions.

So, Minister, can we have a Welsh Government statement to see what action the Welsh Government is taking to support civil service pensioners to receive what is rightfully theirs in a timely fashion? Diolch yn fawr. 

Diolch yn fawr, Rhys ab Owen, and thank you for raising this. I will draw it to the attention of the Permanent Secretary.

Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. Trefnydd, I would like to request an oral statement from the Cabinet Secretary for Education about the dire state of finances in higher and further education. I have been contacted by two institutions from my region—one further education college, and one university lecturer, both concerned about the impact budgets are having on their students. 

In the case of Bridgend College, their concern centres around the enrolment freeze. The college currently has 285 students more than their funding allocation, as well as seeing increasing numbers of students in need of financial support. Yet cuts to funding for an employment bureau service, as well as the removal of post-16 learner travel, are placing additional strain on the students and the college. 

Separately, but related, I also received correspondence about cuts to the computer science faculty at Swansea University, which will see a large number of staff redundancies. At a time when both the Welsh and UK Governments are placing great emphasis on artificial intelligence, we are seeing short-term financial decisions impacting our ability to provide further generations with the skills necessary to maximise the economic benefits of new technologies. 

Therefore, Trefnydd, could the Cabinet Secretary for Education bring forward an oral statement on how these issues are being addressed in the next financial year? Diolch yn fawr. 

Thank you very much, Altaf Hussain. We're giving an extra £5 million for further education in this final budget. Are you going to support it, Altaf Hussain—an extra £5 million for further education in this final budget? Taken with the extra funding at the draft budget, it means that we're allocating an extra £26.5 million via Medr in 2026 to support priorities in further and higher education. Are you going to support our final budget this afternoon? Because this is the investment that we're making to address the very real challenges that have also been raised this afternoon in terms of further and higher education. But, finally, and I put this to you again, in terms of our final budget—you have a chance to vote for it this afternoon—Medr's overall budget is increasing by almost 4 per cent in 2026-27, and I think that gives you the reason for backing this budget this afternoon. 

Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. As the First Minister and I have said many times in the Siambr, cutting long waiting times is the public’s and our No.1 priority, and this has not changed. Thanks to the hard work of the NHS all over Wales, we've made considerable progress towards that ambition over the last seven months. Long waits are falling, and the overall waiting list is coming down.

In some health board areas, in Swansea and in Powys, no-one is waiting more than two years for treatment, or more than a year for an out-patient appointment. In the other south Wales health boards, fewer than 1 per cent of people are waiting more than two years for treatment, or a year for an out-patient appointment.

In north Wales, Betsi Cadwaladr University Health Board still has more to do to meet its plan to cut long waiting times. But here too there has been progress.

Dirprwy Lywydd, last week, the latest referral-to-treatment times data was published for November 2025. This shows the impact of our focus on improving performance, the hard work of NHS staff, and of the £120 million the Welsh Government has made available this financial year. They are a record-breaking set of figures.

The overall waiting lists fell by 23,400 in November—the single biggest monthly fall ever recorded. This was the sixth consecutive monthly fall in the overall waiting list. Long waits of more than two years are down to 6,883—a 90 per cent reduction from April 2022. The provisional figures for December suggest this will fall further, to around 5,300. Waits of more than 52 weeks for a first appointment have fallen by 46 per cent since March 2025, and are now at their lowest level since October 2020.

By the end of December, almost 100,000 more first out-patient appointments, over and above normal NHS activity, had been provided in the five months since August, and a further 28,000 additional out-patient appointments had been booked for January, all as a result of this Government's laser-like focus on performance, the dedication of the workforce and the additional investment this Government has made. The NHS is on target to deliver an extra 20,000 cataract operations this year, over and above its normal activity. By the end of December, management information indicates the NHS had already delivered more than 26,400 cataract procedures. That's already 9,400 more than it provided in 2023-24.

Dirprwy Lywydd, this is a huge scale of activity: more appointments, more tests, more treatments. We're helping people to be seen faster, cutting long waiting times and reducing the size of the overall waiting list—just as we said we would. And there's more to come as we move into the final quarter of the financial year. Dirprwy Lywydd, it has been a long journey to recover performance and to reform planned care services since the end of the pandemic. The progress of the last year has been achieved against big increases in demand for secondary care. The total number of referrals into secondary care for the year to November was 1.67 million. The referral rate over the last year was 7.1 per cent higher than the previous year.

When I committed to cutting long waiting times, I also committed to working with the NHS to reset the system, to create a more sustainable service to improve access to treatment in the long term. At the moment, about 30 per cent to 40 per cent of pathways are closed after the first out-patient appointment. That tells us that large numbers of people probably didn't need to be referred to hospital and could have been cared for in a better way. So, we're extending national funding to strengthen the all-Wales integrated referral process, and we're moving even more care and resources into the community, so there are more alternatives to a hospital referral. Secondary care should only be for those people who absolutely need specialist expertise. This is a key principle of our community by design policy.

We've seen what can be achieved by the successful reforms we've made to eye care. Enhanced optometry services are now widely and easily available in the community, and we're doing the same for hearing services. But we are going further, and providing even more services in local communities. We're also empowering people to manage their own health. Instead of routinely scheduling post-treatment appointments, we'll help people to have a say in whether they need follow-up care, and give them the option to initiate appointments if and when they're needed. We already have two models—see on symptom and patient-initiated follow-up—to support this. This will help free up out-patient clinics for even more new patients to be seen.

There is progress in the system. We now need every health board to match the best performances. In this year's national planning guidance, for the second year, I set mandatory actions for the NHS to ensure they deliver improved productivity, building on the ministerial advisory group recommendations. I've been clear with the NHS that we need to ensure, in the interests of patients and the public, that we maximise the efficiency of our services and make every £1 count. This is a core responsibility for the NHS, not an add-on. We're backing this up with an extra £120 million this year to cut waiting times, on top of the £170 million we still provide every year to help the NHS recover from the pandemic.

Dirprwy Lywydd, twenty-first century services cannot, of course, be provided with twentieth-century models of care. But there are some great examples of transformation in many parts of our country. Cardiff and the Vale health board is delivering seven cataract procedures on an operating list as a minimum. This is one of our key enablers and it makes a huge difference. Cwm Taf Morgannwg has reorganised its planned orthopaedic services onto one site. It has protected services, improved efficiency, doubled the number of patients it is able to see, and reduced the length of stay for those patients. But, again, there is variation across Wales, and, where progress is not yet where we need it to be, the Welsh Government is acting.

Dirprwy Lywydd, the last quarterly special measures report for Betsi Cadwaladr University Health Board showed it had made progress in some areas, but it also highlighted concerns about the length of time people are waiting for planned care. The chair and chief executive asked the Welsh Government for additional support to help improve planned care performance, and we've stepped in with a team of experts to work alongside the board to drive improvements. I now expect to see the health board meeting its plans for improvement.

In closing, Dirprwy Lywydd, can I thank all those working so hard delivering those extra appointments and treatments, including on weekends and in the evenings, so we can make sure more people are cared for more quickly? Diolch yn fawr.

Well, in response to Mabon ap Gwynfor's questions, my message to NHS staff right across Wales is that I don't share the grudging acknowledgement that he gave to the progress that we've seen. I want to say that we are warmly welcoming the step-change that we are seeing and the work that people are putting in at all hours of the day, including on weekends, to make the progress that we are seeing in the system.

I'll take a number of the points that the Member made directly, if I may. He made a point to say that the system is still not operating at the level of pre-COVID performance, that we haven't caught up, as I think he put it, with where we were. The truth is that out-patient activity is now 22 per cent up on pre-COVID levels. Treatment capacity is 8 per cent above pre-COVID levels. So, what we are seeing is a system that is working really hard, against incredible levels of demand, in order to put itself back into balance, so that patients can be treated routinely much more quickly. 

He made a point about the position for the Government in the next Senedd, and I couldn't resist hearing in his voice that he's measuring the curtains in the health department as we speak, but the truth is that whoever forms the Government in the new Senedd will be—I think he used the word 'inheriting'—inheriting a health service that is getting back into balance because of the work that we have put in over recent years, getting to grips with that backlog, making sure that out-patient activity is available in a much wider range of settings and opportunities, and putting in place, implementing, those changes that we know will make the service sustainable in the long term. That's in fact the work that we are seeing the health service delivering at the moment. 

He asked important questions about the operation of outsourcing to the independent sector. This Government has been very clear that, where we ask the NHS to make use of outsourcing of that sort, it is in order to support the sustainability of the public NHS and to provide extra capacity in accordance with the strategy of the NHS to get it back into balance. I'm absolutely satisfied that those arrangements deliver the care that people in Wales are entitled to expect. He made a particular point about arrangements to manage those contracts, and I'm happy that those arrangements are appropriately in place. 

He asked me what we are doing to make sure that our targets are met. I think that the statement that I made today sets out fairly fully the work that's already under way. The targets that we have set for health boards are very clear. We have capacity in the system to meet them, and I expect them to be met in accordance with the time frames that I've been setting out. 

Thank you for your statement, Cabinet Secretary. It would be remiss of me not to focus on the situation in Betsi Cadwaladr, which has been unacceptable for too long. I know that you acknowledge that more needs to be done there, however, the latest data scandal is just another mistake in a long line of disasters at the health board, and the people of north Wales deserve better. Betsi Cadwaladr has spent longer in special measures than any NHS body in the UK's history. What assurances can the Cabinet Secretary give that this latest mistake will not happen again? And will he and the Welsh Government finally listen and launch an independent inquiry into the health board, committing to a date before the election? 

Now, despite some improvement in some waiting lists, which is a welcome change, it remains the fact that, under Labour, our NHS is clearly in crisis. And this is no fault of the staff. This is due to a failure of leadership, which has led to systemic failure. Just look at the data. Your Government set a target of no patient waiting over 12 hours in A&E, yet in December there were 10,193 patients waiting 12 hours or more. When one in nine patients wait for more than half a day in A&E, you cannot claim that this is progress. You owe patients answers.

This is not a winter blip. It's structural failure, which keeps ambulances queuing, A&E departments crowded, and planned care postponed. December's A&E performance was the worst in three years. Cabinet Secretary, what immediate capacity is being looked into to lift the four-hour performance above 70 per cent and cut the amount of 12-hour breaches? The equivalent of one in four Welsh people are still stuck on an NHS waiting list, and the disparity between England and Wales is quite frankly remarkable when it comes to the two-year waits. We've heard this several times, but in Wales it's 6,883 compared with just 177 in England. That means you are 375 times more likely to wait over two years on the Welsh NHS list than an English one.

As an example, the busiest out-patient speciality in NHS Wales, ophthalmology, alone accounts for one in eight patients on the national waiting list, and still one in 20 people in Wales are waiting for an ophthalmology appointment. The First Minister, when she was Cabinet Secretary, promised to eliminate two-year waits by March 2023, and again by March 2024, and you've rebadged the target to around 8,000 by spring 2025, and we still missed it. What is the next hard deadline, and what happens if you miss it again, Cabinet Secretary, or is this pretty much academic at this moment?

The Welsh Government's failure to get to grips with the situation isn't simply a minor inconvenience for people as they wait; it is costing lives. If you dive behind these headline statistics, the picture is even more bleak. The Welsh Government's target of 75 per cent of patients starting cancer treatment within 62 days has not been met once. In fact, the latest data shows that little over half of the patients began their treatment on time. Cancer does not wait, yet, under Labour, the 62-day target is missed month after month. Surgeons warn burn-out is the highest in the UK, and theatre access is blocked with a systemic failure. Cabinet Secretary, where is the plan for surgery and oncology, and when will protected theatre performance be in place? And Cabinet Secretary, what is the Welsh Government doing to strengthen capacity and bolster our NHS workforce? Because ultimately, if we want to see results, we need to see much more investment into our workforce and our resilience, not only for the benefits of the patients across Wales, but also our hard-working NHS staff. Diolch.

Well, from a party that plans to vote against more money for the NHS next year, that's quite the litany of points that the Member has put to me. If he believed that those issues were genuine, he would be voting for the budget this afternoon to provide further money for the NHS in Wales, so I think that speaks for itself, I’m afraid. But I will take some of the points that he has made to me head-on.

He is right to say that the situation in north Wales is not remotely acceptable. He will not have heard me defend that position at any point that I’ve been here, but it is important to recognise that where there is progress, that should be acknowledged. There have been, even in north Wales, where there are still challenges—we would all accept that—considerable reductions in the longest waits over the course of the last year, and as he himself says, that's not about data, that's about individual patients getting seen more quickly. There is much, much further to go, but I do think it's important to acknowledge that progress as well.

He made an important point about data. He would have seen the statement that was made a few weeks ago in relation to that. The matter has been resolved, the figures have been published, they’re updated, they’re now available. There are lessons to be learned, certainly, from that, and I will be publishing a report, I hope imminently, which will set out the conclusions from the process. But the issue itself, which was always about data, not about patient care, has been resolved.

In relation to A&E, I don’t think I would accept the characterisation that the Member put on that. There are people waiting far too long in some of our A&E departments, that’s absolutely the case, but the median time for people waiting in A&E is under three hours—two hours and 56 minutes. Now, most of us would want that to be shorter, but that is the median time. People shouldn't have to wait for 12 hours or more, but that is not most people's experience by any means, and I think it really is important, when we talk about the pressures on A&E, that we have those facts as the underpinning for the discussion.

He mentioned ambulances queuing outside hospitals. This year, the number of hours lost in the back of an ambulance is half what it was the year before. Ambulance crews were able to hand over patients safely to emergency departments twice as quickly as they were the year before, because the NHS has been planning in a very proactive way to hit that target. Obviously, there’s further to go there as well, but I think his characterisation of that doesn’t do justice to the work  of both the ambulance service and staff in A&E departments right across Wales.

The targets that he challenged me on are the still the Government's targets, and I responded to Mabon ap Gwynfor about the capacity in the system, the plans in the system and the timescales over which I expect those to be met.

He asked me about investment into cancer services to support an improvement in those services. We have a new Velindre cancer centre being delivered in the spring, a satellite radiotherapy unit opened at Nevill Hall Hospital, funding set aside for a fixed PET scanner for Singleton Hospital, a third fixed scanner at Glan Clwyd, and over £5 million invested in new state-of-the-art radiopharmaceutical production facilities in Newport. So, a range of investments in the system, together with the reforms that he'll be aware of to leadership in the cancer space and the reforms to the cancer pathway, and improvements in terms of cancer data.

I think we need to share hope for people waiting on waiting lists. Residents in north Wales have told me about knee operations, eye surgery and orthodontic appointments that have been brought forward. ESCAPE-pain programmes and the national exercise referral schemes have been really beneficial, as has targeting physiotherapy to help their recovery. They have been told also—. One patient told me he was told it's because of the extra funding that's gone into the system that's making a difference. But could you set out what targeted interventions are being put in place in Betsi Cadwaladr University Health Board to bring down waiting lists there, so that they are in line with other areas? Thank you.

Yes, certainly. There's additional funding, which we've provided, to support improvements in planned care. We've provided support through NHS Wales Performance and Improvement, which is the newly reformed NHS executive, focused on helping health boards to improve performance in just this way. We've supported the health board with procurement activity, so they can make sure that the external capacity they need is available in order to support their reduction in the waiting lists. They said to us, at the end of last year, that they would appreciate additional support on some of the areas that are particularly challenged, so we agreed, as a Government, to put in a team to work with the board, with the senior executive team, to focus on areas that have been particularly challenging—planned care, in some parts, is one of those areas; some aspects of urgent and emergency care is another. That team has gone in in the last few weeks and will be working with the senior executive team. 

I think the Member made an important point about acknowledging where people have a good experience. I have a range of patient stories, which I like to draw on occasionally, because it does show what people's experiences are. A number of these here are in the Betsi Cadwaladr area, talking about the support they had whilst waiting for surgery to lose weight and therefore be able to be fit for surgery when that time came. So, supporting patients as they wait for surgery is as important as speeding up those waiting times.

Good afternoon, Cabinet Secretary. I'd just like to talk on behalf of the people of Powys. You'll know the issues in relation to cross-border care. Previously, we were able to access the provision of services that had shorter waiting times in the English hospitals. We're used to going over to Hereford, Shrewsbury and Telford, across Powys, in order to get our treatment. It's pretty brutal that people are hearing that the waits that they were previously told that they had are now being extended to match the waiting lists in Wales.

I've heard from one lady, assessed as urgent by her surgeon, who's still waiting after more than two years now. I'll happily write to you on that, and the health board. We've written to you, Russell George and I, to ask you about the moneys that are needed by Powys Teaching Health Board to reinstate that arrangement. I'm also writing to the health boards where the hospitals are, because there is some information that patients are telling me that those hospitals are still going to continue with the waiting lists that they had. I just wonder, Cabinet Secretary, if you could comment on those issues, please, as you have done, I know, previously, but particularly the £10 million that we know Powys Teaching Health Board have told us that they need, they say, to reinstate those waiting lists. Diolch yn fawr iawn.

The Member makes two separate points, I think. There are certainly patients waiting longer than the Welsh target of the two-year wait in hospitals in England. We have patients who are in that position, as we've discussed previously here. I don't want to see anybody waiting that long, wherever they're being treated.

The second point the Member makes I think is more challenging for all of us. The argument that she makes—I know that this isn't the intention—has the effect of this: patients in Wales are entitled to be treated within the timescales that the Government sets out; she's asking, essentially, for additional funding to be provided to one health board that provides a different level of service to every other patient in Wales. The challenge I face as health Secretary is a challenge of equity. My role, I think, is to make sure that every patient in Wales can look to have the treatment within the same standard. I think the challenge in the argument that she puts to me is that I would need to take the money from another health board to provide it to Powys health board to provide a different level of service for Powys. I know that isn't the intention in her argument, but that is the effect of it. What I want to see is a service that is there that provides equity to people in all parts of Wales, so that everybody in Wales can be seen within the same target time. That's what we're working towards, and I hope that she can see from the statement today that the service is making real strides in that direction.

In your statement, you said that in north Wales, Betsi Cadwaladr University Health Board still has more to do to meet its plan to cut long waiting times, but that here too there's been progress. A senior clinician at Betsi Cadwaladr University Health Board told me just two weeks ago that, in accordance with the Welsh Government's expectations, the health board is once again commissioning clinicians privately from elsewhere in the UK to provide evening and weekend clinics and temporarily massage down politically embarrassing waiting list figures. I've actually previously attended one of those clinics myself on a Saturday morning. Instead of reactively responding to crises, wouldn't it be better to do this openly and proactively in order to stop the crises happening in the first place?

I'm sorry, I don't understand the question. The focus that the Government has, as with the health board in north Wales, is making sure that patients get seen as quickly as possible. I make absolutely no apology for supporting the health board to do that and challenging the health board where that isn't happening. I'm sure that your constituents want to make sure that they get seen as quickly as possible for the treatments that they need. That is what we expect as a Government and that's what the health board is working to deliver.

Whilst of course we welcome any improvement, I think many are still waiting up to and very close to that two years. I think we're far from being at a point where we can pat ourselves on the back for the improvements made when lots of people are still waiting just under that two-year bracket. Why do you think that waiting lists are coming down so significantly better in other parts of the UK? What lessons can we learn from that, whilst, of course, keeping everything free at the point of use? Also, expanding on Jane's point on the cross-border situation, how can we really get to grips with and address that and make the most of it for the people of Wales? Yes, you say that that would improve the treatment just for those on the border, but surely that would be something that we should look into and would be helpful. Also, why aren't we using community hospitals more? Diolch.

The Member makes comparisons with other parts of the UK; she'll remember that the NHS in England were celebrating a fall of, I think, 86,000 in their waiting lists in November last year, which I think was also a record. With a very much smaller population in Wales, we are able to say that over 24,000 people are coming off the list. So, I think, on a proportionate basis, that shows a system that is accomplishing even more here in Wales. What I will say to the Member is that although I heard the pro forma reference in her question to the health service being free at the point of use, no-one actually believes that that is Reform's policy. What I know is that every person waiting for treatment in Wales at least knows that they won't have to pay for it when their time comes.

Congratulations to you and everybody who has been involved in this amazing turnaround. To have fewer than 1 per cent of people waiting for over two years in Cardiff and Vale is really fantastic.

I want to look at your laser-like focus on performance. One of the areas where my constituents are still having to wait more than two years is to see a urologist, which is very poor compared with Swansea Bay, for example. One of them in particular, the treatment of kidney stones, is still having to go to the consultant urologist, even though we know that the treatment for kidney stones—and they are expert patients, because they've been experiencing this for many, many years—is something called lithotripsy, which is basically done by a radiologist. Yet the machine doesn't exist in Cardiff and Vale, our tertiary hospital. It's quite extraordinary, and I just want to understand that.

Secondly, when I attended the fantastic Bevan exemplars on Thursday, I learnt that 30 per cent of all people who have a stroke will experience another within five years, and if we could do targeted primary intervention, we could save ourselves £46,000, just by preventing two strokes a year. That's a lot of nurse time that could be saved. So, I wondered how much attention the Welsh Government pays to the fantastic work going on in these Bevan exemplars to ensure that they are mainstreamed.

I thank the Member for those questions. I would hope that her constituent will not be waiting for two years for the treatment that she referred to, but if she wants to write to me separately on that, I'd be very happy to look into that. That is not my understanding of where the performance is in the health board overall, but I'm happy to look into the detail of the point that she makes to me.

She makes a very important point about how the NHS is able to deliver services in more innovative ways or to construct pathways that deliver the sorts of benefits early on that her question refers to in the context of stroke specifically. The work of the Bevan Commission and the exemplar projects is really good evidence that, sometimes, the challenges aren't challenges of resources, they're challenges of a different approach and a more creative approach for how the existing resources in the system can be deployed more effectively and in a more preventative way. I think we are seeing, as a consequence of the focus that the Government has put for a number of years now on that importance of innovation—the funding that we've provided for many years to the Bevan Commission is one example of that—services improving. I listed some of them in my statement.

I think there is much further to go in making sure that the good practice we see in services in all health boards is identified more rapidly, built upon, disseminated and distributed in other parts of the health service more quickly. I think the challenge in doing that can be a challenge of pressure on the system sometimes, but the fundamental point, as I made in my statement, is that this can't be an add-on. It's got to be part of the core activity, the core business, the core responsibility of the NHS, and it's in getting to that that we'll see the sustainability that we need to see in the service into the future.

Thank you very much, Deputy Presiding Officer. Cabinet Secretary, we've had this problem before about data validation. I know from my own casework that I've got a veteran in my constituency who's been waiting over two years for a hip operation. So I'd just like to ask you if you could double-check some of the figures that you have been given by the health boards to make sure they are correct. Also, Cabinet Secretary, can you outline today—? Yes, it's good that waiting lists have come down, but can you just outline how many people have left that waiting list voluntarily, either because they've gone private or for some other reason, and how many people have passed away while waiting for treatment for up to two years?

The Member makes a point about two-year waits. I hadn't said at any point that nobody in Wales today is waiting for more than two years, so there isn't a data question. I've set out the numbers, and they are accurate, they are validated, and they're tested by statisticians who are independent of the Government. There is a process, which he'll appreciate, that is there to make sure that we can all rely on those figures. But those—[Interruption.] He's challenging from a sedentary position. I'm responding to the question he asked when he was on his feet. The point is that patients in Powys will be treated in a number of different health board areas. I've said to the Member that the system is on the path to eliminating two-year waits. If he has an issue that he thinks I could help with specifically, then I'm happy, if he writes to me, to deal with that.

On the question of people leaving voluntarily, people will still be waiting for too long even if they're not waiting for two years, of course. What I want to see is that nobody feels that they have to go to the private sector for treatment. They should be able to wait on the waiting list and get care in a timely way. What I think we're seeing, as I've tried to outline in my statement, is a system working very hard to do that. We are seeing real progress in meeting those targets, and I know he'll want to welcome that.

Diolch yn fawr, Dirprwy Lywydd. Welsh rates of income tax were introduced in April 2019 and they apply to the non-savings and non-dividend element of income earned by Welsh residents. Welsh rates of income tax are forecast to raise nearly £4 billion in the next financial year, and they are therefore a vital element of the resourcing of the Welsh Government budget, supporting the delivery of public services in Wales.

The proposed Welsh rates for the next financial year were announced in the draft budget in October. This rate resolution, if agreed, will mean that Welsh taxpayers will continue to pay the same income tax as their counterparts in England and Northern Ireland. As Members here know, income tax devolution has resulted in significant increases in resources available to this Senedd. Welsh rates of income tax are expected to make a positive net contribution to the Welsh Government's budget of £2.7 billion in the first decade of devolution.

In 2026-27 alone, the Welsh Government's budget is £484 million higher than it would have been without income tax devolution. Moreover, the administrative foundations through which these responsibilities are discharged are secure. We work closely with His Majesty's Revenue and Customs on the administration of these responsibilities and, as highlighted in the National Audit Office's most recent report, the robust processes and governance arrangements with HMRC provide a strong basis for the effective and efficient collection and administration of Welsh rates of income tax, now and in the future.

But fiscal devolution does not stand still. Following the UK Government's budget on 26 November, further fiscal devolution is proposed, transferring to the Senedd the ability to set Welsh rates of income tax for property income. There will be a legislative consent motion on 3 February for the Senedd to debate the relevant clauses in the Finance (No. 2) Bill.

Dirprwy Lywydd, Welsh rates of income tax provide contributions that are vital to the budget that will be debated later this afternoon. Just for me to be clear, a vote against this motion is a vote to reduce next year's budget by £3.8 billion. That is why the Senedd is asked today to agree the Welsh rate resolution, which will set the Welsh rates of income tax for the next financial year, and I ask Members for their support this afternoon.

Thank you to the Cabinet Secretary. I think it is important that we reflect, nearly a decade since we were first granted tax-raising powers, on why it's important that we see the devolution of these powers and the benefits that come to Wales. As you outlined, Cabinet Secretary, £484 million is significant, and the amount raised has made a difference. When some people oppose devolution and constantly talk Wales down, it is important that we realise why we're calling for these powers and the difference they can make to our public services and to the money available for the Welsh Government.

But it is important to distinguish between the success of WRIT in terms of raising revenue and their application as a fiscal policy lever of Government. Because on the latter point, it's clear that WRIT remain for all intents and purposes purely ornamental rather than practical, having never been used since their introduction. And it is likely that this will continue to be the case as long as the Senedd is beholden to tax bands that are wholly determined by Westminster, without our say, and totally unsuited to the nature of our tax base.

Sometimes we are criticised when we compare the powers that we have here with those of the Scottish Parliament, but when you compare, in this instance, with Scotland, whose ability to create their own income tax bands has allowed them to introduce a far more progressive framework so that over 50 per cent of the entire population pay less income tax compared with the rest of the UK, then it's a discussion that we have to have. We're being held back, and it's time to end this completely arbitrary constitutional asymmetry.

I would ask the Cabinet Secretary if there has been any progress, because obviously the UK Labour Party in the general election manifesto promised reforming Wales's fiscal architecture, but we need that full parity with the Scottish Parliament on taxation powers without delay. The Cabinet Secretary referenced the upcoming LCM debate. We are looking forward to further scrutinising the relevant details there. So, whilst not going anywhere near as far as we'd like, we do note the transfer of some of the additional powers to mirror the UK Government's reforms to property income tax. This will at least expand the potential of the WRIT as a fiscal tool for the next Welsh Government and is one step forward, but we need many more.

The Cabinet Secretary may not be surprised to hear that we will not be supporting the Government's proposal on income tax, because we believe and we think it's right to put more money into people's pockets by cutting the basic rate of income tax by 1p, saving the average Welsh family nearly £500 a year, giving them the choice of where to spend more of their hard-earned money. An income tax cut such as this would cost just over 1 per cent of the Welsh Government's £36 billion budget, and this investment into family budgets could be funded via efficiency savings in Welsh Government departments, whilst also still protecting funding for health, schools and for farming as well.

I hear from many of my constituents that the Welsh Labour Government is wasting taxpayers' money left, right and centre. From defunct green schemes to substantial settlement payments, they've squandered hundreds of millions of pounds on vanity projects, ranging from the default 20 mph speed limit to bloated Senedd reform. It's clear that Labour and Plaid Cymru's direction of travel is to drive up taxes, putting pressure on families, workers and businesses, and in turn, at times, delivering worse services. The Welsh Conservatives' position is in contrast to that, and we urge all Members to not support the proposal in front of us today.

I would say exactly the opposite of Sam Rowlands: I urge all Members to support this today. I support keeping the Welsh rate for the purpose of calculating the basic rate of income tax at 10p in the pound, the Welsh rate for the purpose of calculating the higher rate of income tax at 10p in the pound, and the Welsh rate for the purpose of calculating the additional rate of income tax at 10p in the pound. This means that in Wales, when the rate of income tax is added to the Westminster rate, we end up with a basic rate of 20 per cent, the same as England and Northern Ireland; a higher rate of 40 per cent, the same as England and Northern Ireland; and an additional rate of 45 per cent, the same as England and Northern Ireland. The Welsh rates are payable if you live in Wales for longer than anywhere else in the UK during a tax year. When the rates are the same, there is no incentive to register in England or Wales. When the Scottish Parliament was set up in 1999 following a devolution referendum, the Scottish Parliament had the power to vary the rate of income tax by 3 per cent in either direction from the rates applied to the rest of the UK. This power was specifically authorised by the second question of the 1997 referendum. No Scottish Government—SNP or Labour—ever chose to use the variable rate and left tax rates the same as they were in the rest of the UK.

Increasing the rate raises additional money. It has been estimated that every 1p added to the basic rate brings in £220 million; every 1p to the higher rate, £33 million; and every 1p to the additional rate, £5 million. This would raise around £300 million a year. While it would be difficult for basic taxpayers to avoid paying it, additional rate taxpayers could move to being paid via dividend income or organise their lives so they are in Wales less than half the time. This would reduce the expected income. As Scotland found out, if all you can do is change the rate, it's not worth doing. If income tax was reduced, the opposite would occur, and the Welsh budget would be £300 million less. What would make a difference is devolving part or all of dividend income, or, better, treating dividend income as income tax, taxed at income tax rates. I've argued that continually, I'll keep on arguing it, and I hope eventually to get there.

Thank you very much for this statement. I will be supporting this motion in the vote, but I just really wanted to make a few points, really. For six years, this Senedd has held the power to vary income tax by up to 10p in the pound, but for six years that power has gone unused, even during some of the most difficult budget settlements Wales has faced since devolution. So, I wish to ask the Welsh Government, not confrontationally but sincerely and with respect: if these powers are not used when times are hardest, when would they be used? We all recognise—and we've heard this—that the current fiscal framework is deeply flawed. Even you, Cabinet Secretary for finance, have acknowledged that these powers are severely constrained and that they limit our ability to design a tax system that genuinely reflects Wales’s needs. But while we hear this, we still have the option to put up taxes here in Wales.

We, the Welsh Liberal Democrats, want to vary the income tax level. As opposed to the Welsh Conservatives, we want to put it up, by a penny in the pound, in order to fund social care. We actually believe that if people know where their money is going to, then they will understand that we all need to support public services, and the way we support public services is in order to pay that tax. Our plan would invest £234 million to expand care in the community and create new or improved care places. We have been upfront and honest, as I've said. A small, temporary increase of just a penny on income tax is a modest contribution from those who can afford it, yet it would raise £353 million—still not enough, but it would help. To put that in perspective, that's £2.86 a week for a nurse to give. A small investment for individuals, but a huge difference for those who rely on care. I believe that the people of Wales are capable of understanding and supporting fair solutions when we lay them out clearly.

My final point relates to what Heledd has also said. Just last month, Welsh Labour expressed frustration at the lack of progress from Westminster on further devolution. We've seen no progress on devolving justice and policing, no progress on devolving the Crown Estate, no progress on reforming the Barnett formula and no progress on devolving rail infrastructure. This is another issue where we see no progress on—that is, further devolution in order to give us the powers that we need to vary income tax and to get a fair fiscal settlement for Wales. So, I'd like to hear from you, Cabinet Secretary, with respect, how we will secure those additional powers that make sure that Wales gets the fair funding it needs. Diolch yn fawr iawn.

Thank you to Mike Hedges for confirming his support for the Welsh rates of income tax motion, and for the powerful points he makes in relation to dividend income. I was grateful for Jane Dodds's support for the motion as well. She puts forward her party's policy for an increase in income tax in Wales. My party went to the Welsh electorate in 2021 with a promise not to raise Welsh rates of income tax while the COVID crisis continued and the cost-of-living pressures continued to bear down on Welsh households, and that's exactly what we have delivered in every year of this Senedd term. And while we have ambitions that go beyond the devolution of property-derived income, I hope she will agree that it was a positive sign that the UK Government, having decided on this course of action, decided that it would also wish to offer that power to the Senedd itself. That is what the LCM debate will be about—whether the Senedd wishes to take on new responsibilities in the fiscal field—and I hope that, when we have that discussion, we will have Jane Dodds's support for that as well.

I heard Sam Rowlands. Let me make it clear to colleagues that he cannot achieve his ambitions by voting against the motion this afternoon. Voting against the motion this afternoon moves the system not one inch towards the policy that he set out. The only thing that voting against this motion achieves is to ensure that there will be £3.8 billion less in the budget that Members here will be asked to vote upon later this afternoon. And I sit here, as others do, and hear time after time, from Conservative Members, demands for more expenditure on this and more investment in that, and criticising the Welsh Government for not having funded other things that they say need to be funded. And yet, this afternoon, apparently, they are going to vote to take £3.8 billion out of the resources available for the services on which they say—and I agree with them here—so many Welsh citizens depend. It is an irresponsible choice that the Conservative Party will be making this afternoon.

Can I then finally thank Heledd Fychan, Dirprwy Lywydd, for her contribution? I remember very well the debates around the Silk commission and the 2017 Wales Act. The motivation for many in the Conservative Government in Westminster at that time was that devolving fiscal powers to the Senedd would be a disciplinary measure. It would ensure that those dreadful spenders down there in Wales in future would have to watch what they did, because if our economic policies failed to match the outstanding success that theirs managed in England, we would lose money, and therefore we would have to take greater care in our ambitions. In fact, the discharge of those fiscal responsibilities in this Senedd results in nearly £0.5 billion extra in this year's budget, not less. We have out-performed our comparators in England and Northern Ireland, and that's why devolution is a success story, not the carping story that Heledd Fychan criticised.

Now, I outlined the additional powers that could come our way in relation to property-derived income, but colleagues will remember that at last year's motion on Welsh rates of income tax, I said that I would commission an external review of our current income tax powers. Researchers from the Fraser of Allander Institute in Scotland, chosen because they would bring all that Scottish knowledge and experience, and Bangor University, the experts in our own fiscal responsibilities, are currently finalising their research. I hope to be able to publish that report before the end of this term, and then that will be raw material for the next Senedd to decide how we would wish to take this success story—because devolution of income tax in Wales has been a success story—how we take that further into the future.

Dirprwy Lywydd, we have more money to allocate in this final budget as a result of both additional funding arising from the UK budget in November and from increases in forecast devolved tax revenues. Along with the unallocated funding set aside at the draft budget, this means that we have secured a more ambitious final budget that addresses some of the issues raised during scrutiny and the pressures facing our public services.

Through the budget agreement the Welsh Government reached with Plaid Cymru, an extra £180 million goes to the health and social care budget to support front-line NHS services. This means an increase of 3.6 per cent in 2026-27. The agreement also provides an extra £112.8 million for local government, a 4.5 per cent increase in the local government settlement, with all councils seeing increases of more than 4 per cent. The challenging financial climate for both the NHS and local government were amongst the main issues raised during the scrutiny process. They were also a key focus of my discussions with colleagues across this Chamber and with our partners in the public sector.

The extra funding for health and social care directly addresses the Senedd Health and Social Care Committee's first recommendation: to secure additional funding to maintain core NHS services. The extra funding for the local government settlement responds to the Children, Young People and Education Committee's recommendation that sufficient resources are directed to local authorities to ensure additional funding to schools.

Now, beyond those budget agreements, the largest new investment in the final budget is the £65 million to support a business rates transitional relief scheme in the next financial year. Over the next two years, we will provide a total of £116 million in additional support to help businesses with the extra costs of the non-domestic rates revaluation in April. This is in addition to the existing permanent rates relief schemes of £250 million every year. As a result, two thirds of businesses will either pay no rates bills at all or receive some form of relief. Beyond that, from April, a lower multiplier will also take effect, reducing rates bills for small and medium-sized bricks-and-mortar retailers.

Dirprwy Lywydd, I know there will be interest in the new relief scheme to support pubs, as announced earlier this afternoon by the Chancellor in Westminster. The details have come too late for consideration as part of the final budget, and the level of any consequential funding will not be confirmed this afternoon. In the meantime, however, almost half of all pubs in Wales will benefit from the small business rates relief next year, and more than a quarter will already not pay any rates at all here in Wales.

Dirprwy Lywydd, after making these larger allocations, there was a modest amount of money still available to recognise the areas of pressure and priorities across the Government. Extra funds have been provided to reflect the Office for Budget Responsibility's updated pay and inflation forecasts: 2.2 per cent for general inflation, and 3.2 per cent wage growth for all departments not already reflected in the budget agreement. That amounts to an additional £21.5 million in this final budget. The Finance Committee highlighted the rising inflation forecast as a key concern, and I'm pleased we have been able to address this pressure consistently across all departments.

Other new allocations of revenue and capital in this final budget include an extra £5 million for apprenticeships, directly addressing the Economy, Trade and Rural Affairs Committee's recommendation that we should consider using unallocated funds to support the apprenticeship sector. The final budget also takes new investment in support for children and young people with additional learning needs to a total of £14 million, with a further £5 million beyond that to support the rise in learners in education. The education main expenditure also sees an additional £20 million in this final budget of capital funding for maintenance of schools and colleges.

Dirprwy Lywydd, the Local Government and Housing Committee recommended additional investment in services that prevent homelessness, and I'm very glad to have been able to agree with the Cabinet Secretary an extra £2.6 million for those purposes, also reflected in this final budget.

The passage of the Bus Services (Wales) Bill has been a major achievement of this final year of this Senedd term. This final budget also contains an additional £6 million in revenue and £10 million in capital for transport, which will help to prepare for franchising.

It's also part of our commitment to make cultural buildings more efficient and supports better productivity, another focus of the Finance Committee's scrutiny of the final budget.

Dirprwy Lywydd, let me end by putting all these details in their wider context. All budgets are choices. There never has been, and there never will be, enough money to answer all its potential uses. Last week, I was in this Chamber and heard two passionate discussions. Across all parties, Members spoke about the importance of pubs in local communities. The Welsh Conservatives asked the First Minister to give a guarantee that any money coming to Wales—any money—as a consequence of that policy will be used for that purpose in Wales. Then, on Wednesday, I heard an excellent debate about the importance of hospices, those remarkable organisations that do so much good in all parts of Wales—compelling contributions, again from all sides, sometimes from the same Members, making the case for further funding.

Dirprwy Lywydd, if that was the Senedd at its best, then it seems to me that our debates are less admirable when choices have to be faced. Too often, those dilemmas disappear simply into that fantasy world where choices are always a matter of both/and, rather than the harsh reality of either/or. The real challenge of budget making is that there are always two good causes, or multiples of good causes, for every one sum of money available, and where to spend more money in one area can only mean to spend less in another.

How then are those choices to be made? My colleagues and I work to a set of guiding principles: a determination that the public interest should always be the lens through which choices are resolved; a dedication to collective efforts to solve common problems; and an unwavering commitment that access to those services should be determined by the urgency of your need, not the depth of your pocket.

Dirprwy Lywydd, because those of us on this side of the Chamber are united in these core beliefs, we find a way to resolve even the most difficult of choices. That is both the burden and the privilege of being in Government. The ability to make choices, rather than speeches about them, is exactly why even the hardest day in Government is always preferable to even the best day in opposition. And that, Dirprwy Lywydd, is because every choice, in the end, is a chance to contribute to a Wales that stands tall in the world, a Wales of genuine equality, where prosperity is a shared endeavour, where the test of our humanity is how we treat those who we do not find attractive and deserving, not simply those we do, and a Wales where the open hand of friendship, not the closed fist of suspicion, is how we reach out to the rest of the world.

Dirprwy Lywydd, these are the motivating beliefs of this budget, which completes the financial cycle of this Senedd term. It delivers again on the priorities of a progressive Welsh Labour Government. It secures the success of our programme for government. It provides security and stability for our public services, those who work in them, and even more so for those who rely upon them. All my Labour colleagues this afternoon will shoulder the responsibility of passing a budget for Wales. I urge all Members here to do likewise.

First of all, I welcome that the Cabinet Secretary accepted our recommendation to appear before the committee to discuss issues relating to the final budget, which took place at our meeting last week. In a year when there are significant changes between the draft and final budgets, this approach was beneficial and allowed us to understand and scrutinise these changes in greater detail. We’re also pleased to see that the Cabinet Secretary agreed with our recommendation to extend the length of today's debate to allow a greater number of Members to take part. This debate forms a crucial stage in the Senedd’s budget process, and I look forward to hearing what others have to say.

Turning to the changes between the draft and final budgets, we are grateful for the information shared about the new allocations made in the final budget and the reasons for doing so. In particular, we note that all parts of the Welsh Government will see their funding allocations increase in line with the updated OBR forecasts. Whilst this is to be welcomed, some further clarification from the Cabinet Secretary, specifically on pay inflation, would be helpful. We ask for confirmation that the additional allocations made to the NHS and local government, combined with the £21.5 million outlined in the final budget for other departments, will fully account for the additional projected costs due to increases to OBR pay and inflation forecasts since the draft budget was published. Inflationary pressure was a key area of interest in our report, and we would welcome further information on how this figure was reached.

As mentioned in my opening remarks, we are thankful to the Cabinet Secretary for responding to our report prior to today's debate, and his general positive and constructive responses to our recommendations. It was particularly encouraging to hear about plans to reform the Barnett formula, which will be considered at the next Finance: Interministerial Standing Committee meeting, as well as details of the Cabinet Secretary's meeting with the Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury about the introduction of the property income tax in Wales, a matter we will return to next week during the debate on the Finance Bill legislative consent motion.

Dirprwy Lywydd, I would also like to reflect on the Cabinet Secretary's general approach to setting next year's budget. As a committee, we value the steps taken by the Cabinet Secretary in presenting a budget that has not tied the hands of the next Senedd and the Government, and agree that it would not have been appropriate for this Senedd to predetermine the budgetary priorities of the next Senedd.

So, it will come as no surprise to fellow Members today, I'm sure, that Plaid Cymru will be abstaining on the budget today, so that it passes. This is not an endorsement of the budget, but rather Plaid Cymru providing much-needed stability for public services and ensuring that we avoid a catastrophic situation had the budget not passed. I hope all of us here today recognise that a solution had to be found, and that it was the responsibility of the Senedd as a whole to ensure the successful passage of a budget given that the Government has no majority. 

Let me be clear—and I'm happy to repeat this time and time again—we do not support the budget in its totality. As you would expect, a Plaid Cymru Government would have different priorities. And if we have the privilege of forming and leading the next Government, we will put forward our own budget within the first 100 days of the next Senedd term, charting an ambitious future for our nation. We will also be clear with the UK Government about our expectations and ambitions for Wales, and the need for fair funding, including the billions of pounds owed to Wales. This is not as good as it gets for Wales, and we recognise that many of our public services remain under huge pressure and that child poverty rates continue to rise.

Labour can spin as much as they want about the partnership in power, and the Conservatives can conveniently try and forget the damage their UK counterparts inflicted on Wales when in Government, but the people of Wales, who use our public services, who work in our public services, who run businesses in Wales, all know that whoever is in power in Westminster, Wales is never prioritised. The First Minister can’t even persuade her own Welsh Labour MPs, let alone the UK Government, to back what she says she wants to see delivered for Wales, and it’s people living in Wales that suffer the consequences.

So, the Conservatives chose irrelevance with their approach to the budget. Rather than bring forward credible proposals, they indulged in fantasy economics—uncosted cuts straight out of the Liz Truss playbook. Wales deserves better from what was then the largest opposition party in this Senedd. We did what needed to be done to provide stability. 

We've made clear our criticism of Labour's approach and we don't agree with the approach taken in terms of quick fixes with no long-term strategy, a failure to shift spending towards prevention, and no radicalism to address the deep-rooted challenges facing our NHS, our economy, and our schools, to get to grips with child poverty. And I’d like to say this to every union, organisation and business that’s reached out to us to express concerns about this budget: we are listening and we understand that many of you are facing huge challenges still. We want to work with you to see how they can be overcome, and to grow our economy here in Wales.

Plaid Cymru acted with the seriousness that the situation demanded. We prevented a crisis in local government—

You need to conclude now, Heledd, please.

—strengthened our health services, and delivered greater certainty for our vital public services. That's what we can deliver in opposition; imagine what we can deliver in Government.

I thank the Welsh Government today for bringing forward today's budget debate and also for the Cabinet Secretary's engagement through this budget-setting process. I'm sure that he will be not surprised at all to hear that the Conservatives will not be supporting what is essentially a roll-over budget in front of us here today; a budget that acknowledges a real risk of Labour not being in Government after the next Senedd election. Unlike Plaid Cymru, we are not willing to support a budget that does not offer the ambition that Wales deserves, and that's exactly what Plaid Cymru are doing here today. They are supporting a budget that will not fix the problems that we see up and down Wales; it does not deliver on tackling waste or put money in people's pockets, which hard-working people in Wales need.

This budget fails to address the most pressing issue of the day, which is our economy. Even the First Minister has said that her own finance Secretary's interest has never been in the economy. It's something, perhaps, we've always known on these benches, but to hear the First Minister's refreshing honesty does feel quite stark. It seems like a clear theme through the Welsh Government that the economy here in Wales is not a priority. I think that's down to the fact that Labour and Plaid Cymru simply do not understand the needs of business and fail to realise that sustainable, long-term prosperity comes from businesses—businesses that invest, expand and employ people.

Just very, very simply—and thank you for taking an intervention—will you explain to the people of Wales why you were happy to have council tax increases of up to 20 per cent or even more, based on your negotiation that wanted to favour those with the largest houses and the deepest pockets?

Clearly, Rhun ap Iorwerth forgets that we want to see a cap on council tax at 5 per cent.

You can't afford it, can you?

And when it comes to the economy, we must not forget that it was the Conservative Party—[Interruption.]—it was the Conservative Party that put 4,000 people a day into work when it was in Government. Now we're seeing a Labour Party, which you're supporting, putting 400 people a day on welfare benefits. We want to see an economy that works and prospers for people up and down Wales.

This budget does not acknowledge the importance of businesses here in Wales, and does not support our belief that a strong society is built on a strong economy. Until prosperity, in all its forms, becomes the desire of any Government here in Wales, I worry that any well-meaning efforts will merely become a sticking plaster on the problems that we are seeing.

The Cabinet Secretary, in his opening address, talked about choices, and he's absolutely right, of course, that a budget is all about choices. And we made the choice, perhaps unexpectedly, to reach out to the First Minister this time around to see if a budget deal that works for the people of Wales could be agreed upon. But the Welsh Government, of course, chose to do a deal with their friends in Plaid Cymru instead. We wanted to deliver on our Conservative aims to support our economy and the priorities of the people of Wales, because when we started those conversations there was around £600 million of unallocated money left for next year's budget and that's why, for a start, we wanted to see if some of that could be used to scrap stamp duty here in Wales, the land transaction tax on primary residences. Scrapping this tax would get our economy moving and deliver positive change for people in Wales, supporting them with a place that they can call their own.

Thank you for giving way. You've run a local authority and you know that if you're going to spend more in one area, you have to spend less in another. You've called for cuts in various things, but you haven't been able to identify an equivalent amount of money that can be saved in another and that's just not credible.

I just said at the start of that contribution that when these conversations were taking place, there was £600 million of unallocated money. The Cabinet Secretary said it's all about choices, and that was a choice that we would have made to spend that money in that way to support families up and down Wales.

But there are other areas that we think are really important. This budget does not seriously tackle the cost-of-living pressures that families are facing in Wales, and that's why I spoke a few moments ago about how a cut in the basic rate of income tax by 1p would save nearly £500 a year for Welsh families up and down Wales. The truth is that on these benches we trust people to have money in their pockets, and we hear from the benches opposite that they want to take more money off people to spend it as they think better, rather than trusting people to spend the money they know best.

We want to see a budget that has tax cuts for family firms and family farms to give them a fighting chance to carry on, a budget that supports our farmers, who work tirelessly to feed the nation while facing mounting costs and growing uncertainty and pressures. I'm really disappointed, actually, that Plaid Cymru did not negotiate specifically for farmers in their budget agreement this time around, letting down farmers up and down Wales.

Will you take an intervention?

Another intervention? Certainly.

Farmers pay council tax. You would have charged council tax to the hilt, because, clearly, you cannot say that you will put a cap on council tax and, at the same time, say that you wouldn't give them additional support as Plaid Cymru secured in this budget. How the hell are people going to pay for public services?

Plaid Cymru certainly aren't listening, Deputy Presiding Officer. I've already explained that, under our proposals, income tax will be cut, saving those same families nearly £500 every single year, as well as a cap on that council tax.

What we're not seen in this budget is our high streets boosted, jobs protected, and there are far too many barriers to growth for our businesses in Wales. I've noted the time—

I've noted the time, as well, don't worry.

—Deputy Presiding Officer. So, let me conclude, if I may, Deputy Presiding Officer. We're not going to see the improvements that we need to see desperately here in Wales if we continue to see Plaid Cymru and Labour working together as they have done for the last 27 years. Twenty-seven years of socialist policies under Welsh Labour and Plaid Cymru have resulted in Wales having the highest unemployment—you can't shy away from this—the longest NHS waiting lists in the UK, and the worst education outcomes in the UK, as well as the lowest pay packets. It hasn't been working, it's not working today, and it's not going to work tomorrow. Labour's failures are Plaid Cymru's failures. Support for Labour is support for Plaid Cymru, support for Plaid Cymru is support for Labour. We recognise this budget fails to deliver those tax cuts, fails to deliver to cut waste and fails to deliver for Wales.

It's important the budget is passed to avoid a catastrophic reduction in budgets across the public sector. I urge Members to support the budget. Failure to do so would mean services ending and large-scale public sector redundancies.

Apart from the local government settlement, money can be moved around in the first supplementary budget. The Conservatives, Plaid Cymru and Reform believe they will, either combined or individually, be the next Government. Why would you want to take over a Welsh public sector in chaos and crisis? Why would you want to help create that chaos?

As I said in the debate on the draft budget, I had serious concerns about the failure to fully fund health, social care and local government. This has been rectified in the final budget. It was risible to consider CPI as a means of calculating increased costs in health, social care and local government. CPI went up last month due to increased prices for tobacco and the cost of plane tickets, items not affecting local government or health.

Overall, there's a 4.5 per cent increase to the local government settlement. All 22 councils will receive increases of 4 per cent or above, with individual increases ranging from 4 per cent to 6.5 per cent. The funding supports schools, social care and everyday council services.

One hundred and eighty million pounds of additional funding for health and social care brings the total revenue budget to more than £12.6 billion. This is a 3.6 per cent increase in 2026-27. It supports the front-line NHS services that we all depend on and we all claim in here to support. That £12.6 billion is an interesting number, because it approximately equals the shortfall in funding for Wales from independence.

The challenges facing the NHS are substantial, but they will not be resolved by funding alone. Some of the issues are about the way services are organised and about inefficient ways of working. A plan to use artificial intelligence, especially for examining scans, is urgently required. Offer patients a choice of texts instead of letters for hospital appointments. Ask them to confirm the appointment. It's more efficient, a better service, it saves money, and they'll actually get it before the appointment.

The work to reduce long waiting times this year, combined with the NHS planning framework enabling action, will help health boards to make sustainable changes to the way services are provided. All departments outside health and local government receive additional funding to maintain real-term spending levels and to reflect the increased forecasts for inflation and wage costs.

The final budget also includes additional revenue and capital allocations to support spending priorities, including the bus service, further education, apprenticeships, continuing to improve the condition of schools across Wales, and water quality. Plaid Cymru and the Tories, which of those do you not wish to fund? Taking into account all spending in Wales, 10 per cent more is spent in Wales than England. You can ask for money, 'We should have this and we should have that', but we actually get 10 per cent more. 

If Plaid Cymru's view is, 'Let's have exactly the same as England and every time it is increased, have a 5 per cent’, that would take 10 per cent off the total income of the Welsh Government. We have had the spending part of Plaid Cymru's budget; now is the time to get the budget to balance. The initial spending was laid out on the floor of the Senedd recently. What is going to be cut in order for the budget to balance? We have not had either the spending proposals or the reductions to proposed budgets to balance the budget from the Conservatives, but they continually say, 'We want to cut this, we want to cut that, we want less money coming in. Oh, by the way, we want more money for hospices'—that was last week. They’ll want more money for something else next week.

On the Crown Estate, the Welsh Government agreed a fiscal framework with the UK Government that sets out the Welsh Government's funding arrangements to support its devolved fiscal powers. This includes block grant adjustment models that determine how the Welsh block grant is adjusted taking account for the devolution of Welsh taxes. This, despite frequent Plaid Cymru assertions to the contrary, means that the net financial benefit of devolving any taxation to Wales is removed from the block grant, meaning Wales does not get any extra money. When income tax was partially devolved and when stamp duty was fully devolved, the block grant was adjusted accordingly. Why will Plaid Cymru and the Conservatives not produce their budgets? Plaid Cymru say it's going to happen after the election; they've got it ready. Well, can we see it now? Can the public see it now? They expect that things will be fine, that they can tell people they can have everything they want, until the reality hits home to them if they ever reach the position of Government on their own or with the Conservatives.

On pubs, can I just say to the Cabinet Secretary, and I've said to him previously, that if we're going to give money back on rates, can we only do it to pubs who haven't had a rent increase? Because from what I know about the way pubs are run, the pubcos especially increase rents dramatically, and if you actually give a rate rebate, all they'll say to the publicans is, 'Can you hand the money over to us?'

Thank you, Cabinet Secretary, for presenting the final budget to the Welsh Parliament. Extra funding, no doubt, will be welcomed by many schools across Wales. That's my praise out of the way.

For me, it's quite funny; we are being told in the run-up to the election to believe that Plaid Cymru offers meaningful change for Wales particularly—an alternative to the stale Welsh Labour Government—yet here we are again with the nationalists in bed with Labour, this time with a budget cooked up in a back-room deal. Nothing, clearly, has changed in the past 27 years. And, for the record, this final budget has not gone down well with many in the education sector, and I would argue it's those sorts of people we should be listening to when making important decisions such as these. After all, they're the ones on the ground.

While we see the final budget allocate an extra £4.2 million to resources for schools, other educational settings and local authorities for additional learning needs, on top of the £9 million in the draft budget, unions, including NAHT Cymru, are saying that more money does not necessarily mean equal or better results. Rather, they and I believe that extra funding should be sent to the right places so that it has some form of lasting impact. With schools and teachers buckling under the weight of having to deliver a new curriculum and ALN reforms at the same time, I wonder whether it was wise of the Welsh Government to place both onto schools, and if the ALN legislation actually struck the right balance by placing many of the duties onto schools and local authorities, rather than sharing many of them with the NHS. I would like to know if the Cabinet Secretary is confident that piecemeal funding through this budget will deliver the changes so desperately needed in our education system, because I, and clearly many others, are still yet to be convinced.

I would like to know how this budget will improve the lives of teachers, Cabinet Secretary. It's nice to see you're announcing extra capital funding towards schools and college buildings, but what about those working and learning in them? For example, the Welsh Education Workforce Council has outlined that since 2015, the overall number of school teachers registered fell by 5.6 per cent. The workforce council also noted that the data suggested that the inflow of teachers into the profession had not been sufficient to replace those that are leaving. Education Support's teacher well-being index 2025 also highlights that teachers' overall well-being score is the lowest since they began recording it in 2019. They found that 75 per cent of teachers in Wales reported stress at work, and 15 per cent of teaching staff working in Wales feel low levels of job purpose and meaning. That’s the highest in the United Kingdom.

How will this budget improve deteriorating behaviour in schools, Cabinet Secretary? Last March, the NASUWT explained that teachers reported that pupil violence had a negative impact on their health, highlighting that Welsh local authorities received 6,446 violent incident reports from schools in 2023-24, a 37 per cent rise from the previous year. In the same report, NASUWT also found poor behaviour means poor teacher well-being, 35 per cent of the teacher workforce experienced physical abuse, and 92 per cent experienced verbal abuse. Less than half of teachers said they would intervene in a pupil fight for fear of being involved in a child protection issue that may threaten their employment, and more than half, 55 per cent, said poor behaviour made them consider leaving the profession entirely. I quote from your Government's own statistical release in November for 2023-24: every type of exclusion has increased since 2022-23 and reached the highest since 2011-12. Cabinet Secretary, that's just not good enough, is it?

I would also be interested to know, Cabinet Secretary, how much Wales has benefited from the 20 per cent VAT imposed on private schools since January last year, because I don't see it resulting in more teachers in Wales. So, how much did your colleagues in Westminster increase the block grant by in Wales? And are we going to see any of this £1.5 billion tax raised here in Wales?

Turning to further education, I'm sure colleges will be welcoming the small amounts of extra funding to support the increase and participation of learners, but ColegauCymru has said that this budget presents an unprecedented challenge for our further education colleges. Its chief executive warned:

'It risks shutting young people out of education, and it will shatter the government's own flagship Young Person’s Guarantee.'

'undermining the commitment that every young person should be offered a place in education, training or work.'

The body also warned that thousands of young people in Wales could find themselves without a college course in Wales this September, as they say they face a £25 million plus funding crisis. And it's not just further education that's at risk in Wales, is it Cabinet Secretary? Universities Wales has warned that the budget does not reflect the continued financial pressures facing universities in Wales, stating:

'We are disappointed not to see further support for universities, and in particular that the critical in-year funding received last year has not been consolidated.'

Last year we were faced with a university, Cardiff, potentially cutting nursing degrees due to its dire financial situation. The same university is still keeping its staff under the threat of redundancy until December this year, and yet it's still pressing ahead with a campus in Kazakhstan. Cabinet Secretary, would you wish to see one of our flagship educational institutions, or indeed any, fail because of this budget? Because our higher education institutions are not out of the woods yet.

For example, combined pressures of higher energy costs, which your friends in Westminster have not helped with, and higher national insurance contributions, which again were a cost entirely of the UK Labour Government's own making, really are the cherry on top for already struggling institutions. So I'd like to know what exactly the Cabinet Secretary for Education's top three asks were when it was coming to put this budget together. Universities in Wales are faced with growing pressures at a time when the sector faces participation challenges and the demand for graduate skills is indeed increasing.

Many of the pressures I've spoken about have indeed covered education, but I want to talk about women now. The Wales Women’s Budget Group and Women’s Equality Network Wales have also said that they restated funding for childcare, and they've stated it's wholly insufficient to address the structural issues in Wales—

You need to conclude now, Natasha, please.

—a childcare system that remains unaffordable, inaccessible and disjointed. So I'd like to know, Cabinet Secretary, when will your Government match the child care offer in England? And I'm proud that the Conservative Government introduced it at the time—

Natasha, you need to conclude, please.

I will. I'm just concerned with the budget as a whole. A lack of basic budgeting by failing to cut waste, while spending more on pet projects and a lack of basic decency by hardly mentioning women within your spending plan, shows a lack of vision, and what Wales lacks now is a Welsh Conservative Government. Thank you very much, Deputy Presiding Officer.

First of all, I want to thank Mark Drakeford for his skilled husbanding of the Welsh budget throughout this period, because this is the last Welsh budget that he's going to be presenting, as he's retiring in April, like several of us. Particularly, I think we should all be grateful for his negotiating skills to create the coalition of the willing to enable us to use the extra money coming from the UK Government, rather than simply having a roll-over budget with an uplift for inflation. That would have caused a huge budget crisis in our local authorities, including quite considerable potential redundancies. So, I'm very glad that we appear to have an arrangement whereby we will be able to pass this budget, which I obviously will be voting for. 

I just want to turn to some of the issues that have come up in the Equality and Social Justice Committee, because we had a very good discourse with the Cabinet Secretary for Social Justice, who accepted two of our recommendations and a couple of them in principle. One of the issues is how much money is spent on equality-related action plans. That is quite difficult for the committee to track, simply because a lot of the money that is delivering on these action plans is not in the Cabinet Secretary's budget lines. So, for example, we know that making sure signage on public transport is accessible to people with disabilities is going to come out of the transport budget; making sure that bike lanes pass behind bus stops, rather than in front of them, where they become a fantastic hazard for anyone stepping off a bus, particularly those with a disability, also will have to come out of the local government budget in the areas where that is an issue.

So, I think these sorts of issues are a major concern for us. We know that, in making decisions about where to spend our capital, we would never have had the very welcome decision to locate the women's health hub for Cardiff and the Vale in the Maelfa—that  could never have happened were it not for the capital investment that Mark Drakeford identified as health Minister to replace a deplorably decrepit doctor's surgery that had the fascia falling off the walls, as I know the Cabinet Secretary is familiar with. That is an incredibly important way in which we ensure that those with the greatest need are getting better access to the services, which is obviously trying to reverse the perverse inverse care law. So, I very much welcome that, and we will clearly need to do a great deal more of that if we're going to ensure that everybody has equitable access to health services.

I just wanted to pick up on what Natasha was saying, because you say that people in education are unhappy about the allocations of funding, but I know that pupils are absolutely delighted to have the twenty-first century schools, which have been transformational for so many secondary schools. Pupils at Fitzalan High School, for example, in Cardiff, were incredulous that this new building was for them, and I'm sure we will have a similar response once the Willows High School build is completed.

Additional learning needs, Natasha, is not an illness, it is a disability that requires education to make reasonable adjustments to meet the needs of the individual. That often, but not always, includes additional staffing levels to meet those additional needs, but I don't see that that should be coming out of the health budget, unless of course you want to argue for preventative action to ensure that more postnatal support is given to prevent additional problems, which, of course, in another debate, I would certainly be arguing myself.

I finally just want to make a plea for the need to tackle the shortage of BSL interpreters. The BSL Bill completed its second Stage yesterday, and Stage 3 will be debated and voted on in the next few weeks. I think I speak on behalf of all Equality and Social Justice Committee members that the biggest obstacle to delivery is the shortage of BSL interpreters. There is no allocation in the costs of the BSL Bill delivery, if it becomes law, to start rectifying that skills shortage, and that needs, in my view, to be done immediately. It takes up to six years to train someone to become an interpreter, and we only have 54 registered interpreters in Wales. We know that it will increase demand if the Act is passed. So, with the residual amount that has not yet been allocated in the final budget, I hope that the Cabinet Secretary might find what is pocket money, in terms of the amount of money that you are dealing with, to ensure that we can make a racing start immediately, rather than wait for the next Government to get its feet under the table.

Being a mature politician is being able to be clear and realistic. I'm almost starting the speech this year on the budget as the one I did last year, which is that passing this budget is essential for the people of Wales. It is our responsibility, as all of the parties here in this Senedd, to make sure that the people of Wales get the money that they deserve. Actually, not passing this budget would mean that we would have the budget cuts to essential services. So, I'm pleased and relieved that there has been an agreement that has been brought to us today. Like Plaid Cymru, I will be abstaining. There is much to go, but I'm pleased to see this happen, so thank you very much. I'm also grateful to the Cabinet Secretary for the constructive way we have worked together over the past two years. I'm pleased to see that there are elements from last year's budget in this year's budget as well.

I just want to touch on some of those. Social care first. I'm pleased to see the £30 million to help people leave hospital sooner and receive help at home, either before they go into hospital or after; the £30 million to extend the Flying Start programme to all two-year-olds; and £5 million to strengthen enforcement against water pollution. We've also seen improvements in road repairs, the £1 bus fare for young people, support for the Heart of Wales line, decarbonising leisure centres and improving playgrounds.

So, let me start with social care. There is real progress here, and it is right to recognise that the additional £180 million negotiated in this budget for health and social care reflects the seriousness of this crisis. It's not going to fill the gap, but it is a step. And I'm pleased to hear that that funding will also go to local authorities as well. The Welsh Local Government Association's own projections show that social care alone faces budget pressures of over £200 million in 2026-27. Even if a significant share of this funding reaches social care—and we know that health will rightly claim its share too—it will not fully close the gap. Across Wales, we know that around 1,400 people are in hospital beds awaiting discharge. In Powys, over the past three months, 50 per cent of the patients in our hospitals are waiting to leave hospital. Half of people in Powys should leave those hospitals but can't—can't because they can't get an assessment, and if they do, they can't get a package of care that means they get home. So, every hour, every day that they spend in hospital that's longer than needed means that, sadly, they deteriorate. This is an absolute scandal. We need ambition to take that action, but it is also about being honest and fair with the public. As you heard in the previous debate on Welsh rates of income tax, we want to see a penny increase in income tax to fund social care. We need to be clear that you can't fix the NHS without fixing social care.

I want to move on to childcare. I'm pleased to see the continuation of the Flying Start funding. We know that the option for having good, accessible funding for childcare is vital to tackling one of the biggest scourges we have here in Wales, and that is child poverty. Child poverty still stands at a shameful 31 per cent. It's really hard for me to contemplate that, in 2026, we live in a country where we think it's okay for 31 per cent of our children to live in poverty. Childcare will help to tackle that. It's fundamental also to ensuring that we treat women better and more equal, and allow them the option to return to work. Our vision is for 30 hours of free childcare every week for children aged nine months to four. We produced a research paper two years ago; I sent it to the Cabinet Secretary. It's called 'Closing the Gap: Childcare in Wales'. It's fully costed, and therefore it is achievable. I am calling on you, if I may, to commit to delivering universal, affordable childcare.

I want to turn finally to some other issues, such as the state of our rivers. I welcome the real-term uplift for Natural Resources Wales and the progress made in respect of that, with a Green Paper expected next month. But Natural Resources Wales have found that nearly 80 per cent of Welsh habitats are now classed as 'unfavourable' or 'bad', with species like Atlantic salmon in serious decline. Against that backdrop, it is absolutely outrageous that a £1.35 million fine issued to Dŵr Cymru for over 800 breaches was cut to a paltry £120,000. To many families, that doesn't look like accountability, it looks like a complete failure. So, I'd like to hear, if I may, what we can do around that.

Finally, can I mention the £1 bus fare? Two million journeys were made two weeks ago, and I'm really pleased and proud that we got that into the budget. Diolch yn fawr iawn.

Over the last financial year, yet again the picture across Wales has been pretty dire. We have gone backwards again—local authorities cutting back services, tourism businesses struggling under rising costs, shops disappearing from our high streets. These are real pressures faced by real people in real communities. And yet, while families and businesses tighten their belts, the Welsh Labour Government, propped up again by Plaid Cymru, has chosen to prioritise their pet products.

They have rejected the Welsh Conservatives' sensible plan to scrap land transaction tax, calling it unaffordable, all while continuing with wasteful spending elsewhere: £154 million you've spent previously on the M4 relief road—wasted, just never built; £120 million on Senedd reform; £47 million on active travel grants—[Interruption.] And £216 million—hang on, I'm coming to you—£216 million on an active travel scheme that has seen 0 per cent increase in people and cyclists using these travel schemes; £20 million every year subsidising Cardiff Airport; a 20 mph speed limit costing around £32 million. You would hope that in the face of the pressures—[Interruption.] Hang on, who wants to intervene? Anyone? Yes, go for it.

On 20 mph, I remember you supporting it. I remember you voting for it.

Absolutely wrong, and on a point of order, Llywydd, when it came to the scrutiny in principle, we were sold a very different policy.

[Inaudible.]—David Melding, one of your own Members. 

Ten million pounds on non-devolved international relations, Ugandan tree planting, which really does incense the majority of people—. This budget set out by the Welsh Labour Government, and again supported by Plaid Cymru, is a classic smoke-and-mirrors exercise: departmental uplifts that barely keep pace with inflation; funding settlements, certainly for my local authority, that fall short of meeting rising demand; and workforce pressures that remain unanswered.

Even where there are increases, such as within the climate change and rural affairs MEG, serious concerns remain. During scrutiny of the draft budget, the Climate Change, Environment and Infrastructure Committee was clear—the lack of funding, and, in some cases, further reductions, put the Welsh Government's ability to meet its own targets in doubt. We see this in the energy portfolio, which has only received a slight uplift. We see it again in waste policy, with a second consecutive reduction in capital spending. When those decisions are set against recent recycling and consumption trends, the Welsh Government is likely to miss at least some of its own waste targets. This is not long-term planning, this is short-term thinking, and it defines, again, this Labour-Plaid budget.

During budget talks, the Welsh Conservatives offered a different approach. We want to cut tax, we want to cut waste, we want to get the Welsh economy moving again, and we want to get people into jobs. But, once more, Welsh Labour has chosen the same path as almost every year before, backed by Plaid Cymru, delivering more of the same. So the message is clear: Welsh Labour and Plaid Cymru offer no real change in this budget.

Now, Wales needs a stronger alternative. We simply cannot afford another four years of Plaid Cymru or Labour. We need an alternative that backs businesses, an alternative that strengthens our economy, an alternative that gets Wales working, and an alternative that supports our education and health services to recover and thrive, an alternative that sees the Welsh Conservatives elected to Government here in Cardiff Bay—bring it on—on 7 May.

How do I follow that, Llywydd? I’ve seen some things in this place in my time, but my God. All Governments need oppositions, and I think we need an opposition, because it isn’t good enough, bluntly, to come here to read a speech for the first time, listing all the things you don’t like and then telling us the things that you don’t know. What we’ve seen this afternoon from all the Conservative speakers, and we’ve seen it before, is a list of spending commitments, as we saw last week, and the finance Secretary was very clear that, last week, Conservatives stood up and made a whole series of spending commitments. The lead Conservative spokesperson this week spent the whole of the budget and all of the additional funds in his first two sentences. And I have to say to the Conservatives that this is not serious politics. If you want to be the Government of this country, the people deserve far better. They deserve a party that understands its budget and is able to argue for not just different choices and different priorities, but able to understand—[Inaudible.]—and what we've seen this afternoon is an opposition unable to do that.

So, in that spirit, if you like, I do welcome the budget from the finance Secretary and I welcome as well the maturity of the Liberal Democrats and of Plaid Cymru in recognising that, whilst we will not and do not agree on everything, the one thing we do agree on is that failure to agree a budget would be a disaster for our services in Wales, and a disaster for the communities that we all seek to represent in different ways. The mature decision today isn’t simply to make the speeches we have just, unfortunately, heard, but to actually vote for a budget that will deliver perhaps not everything that you want, but will at least ensure that we have the services delivered following the next financial year.

Also, we had an interesting conversation here earlier this afternoon on waiting lists, and the health Secretary analysed and reported how waiting lists are falling. Now, I’ve taken some inspiration from Mark Isherwood, in fact, and I looked at some of my previous speeches on this matter, and I noticed that at the time—he isn’t here this afternoon, unfortunately, but—back about 16 years ago, we were celebrating the fact that waiting lists had reached the lowest levels ever, in about 2010. Since then, we’ve seen the impact of austerity on our budgets, and we have seen the impact of austerity on our ability to deliver public services. Then we have seen the impact of austerity and the failure to deliver public services on the people we represent, on the communities we represent. The waiting lists issue is an example of a failed economic policy, a failed approach to delivery of public services and then a failure to recognise the damage that has caused to human beings. So, what we’ve seen in recent years—what we've seen in recent years—is Conservative failure to argue the case on a budget, Conservative failure to deliver on economic policy, and then Conservative failure to recognise the human impact of all of those different things.

Now, I recognise that there are things in this budget that are important and that we need to, I think, collectively recognise. The finance Secretary—. And I pay tribute to the finance Secretary. We have occasionally not agreed on everything, but I have to say the way that the finance Secretary has taken custody of the budgets year on year over recent years has been exemplary. Whilst individual Members and parties here may disagree with the conclusions that he reaches, I hope the whole of this Chamber will recognise the work that he's put into doing so and the diligence with which he's carried out that work, and so I want to say 'thank you', Mark, for that. Perhaps emblematic of that is the management of Welsh taxes. The fact that we have hundreds of millions of pounds more to spend on public services today is testament to the management of Welsh taxes. It outperforms England and Scotland, but it also demonstrates that this is a mature democracy, able to take on additional responsibilities. But also the investment on health and education, the additional resources for local government, mean that we're able to do more for the very poorest people in this country, and I recognise the point that Jane Dodds made on child poverty earlier. But also, of course, we need then to go further, and this will then be the subject of the election.

I'm very proud of the work that we're doing at the moment delivering on bus services reform and the money that's going to go into that, but we will then—and this is where we will cross swords over the coming weeks and months—need to look at how we further deliver reform of public services. How do we reform the finances and invest in the future of our economy?

Over the last few years, we've seen some real strong challenges facing this Parliament and this Government, and what this Government and this Parliament have done has been to debate the choices available to us, debate the challenges we face and the Government has then delivered on the basis of that. The challenge at the next election for this Government is to win a mandate for further change, to deliver further reform, to strengthen our economy and to deliver the country that we can all be proud of.

I would also like to acknowledge the work of the Cabinet Secretary. Whilst we might not agree on choices, I recognise the challenge of that role, and I thank Mark for the way he's delivered that over the years. I will focus my budget contribution today on the health service, because I think there are some things we need to say, because every year we come to this Chamber and we hear the same message from Welsh Labour. They shout from the rooftops that they have put more money into the NHS, they have protected health and have done everything they can, but this couldn't be, really, further from reality. This year, Labour and their close allies, Plaid Cymru, are proudly waving around an extra £180 million for health, secured through their latest deal. But let's be clear: this £180 million, whilst it's very important, is not a moment of triumph. It is the price of 26 years of mismanagement and is the cost of failure. If Labour had funded health properly in the first place many years ago, this emergency top-up wouldn't be needed. Basically, they are repairing the hole in the bucket that they created. We know Wales gets £1.20 for every £1 spent on health in England, yet this Labour Government chooses—and 'choices' is an important word today—to spend only £1.12 of that on the NHS, and, prior to COVID, it was about £1.05. That is Welsh Labour knowingly, repeatedly and deliberately underfunding our NHS. Let's be clear: to short-change our NHS is a political choice.

Whilst Labour and Plaid congratulate themselves on their budget arithmetic, here is what patients in Wales experience under their so-called management. [Interruption.] Sorry, yes, please do.

Your finance spokesperson started the debate by saying that he'd have put all the money that was unallocated into cutting stamp duty—[Interruption.] A substantial amount of money paying stamp duty. That would not have left money to pay pay uplift or the things that you're now saying should be done. So, how do you square that circle?

I'm pointing out how your choices have deprived an important service of very important money over many years. Now, to unpick your choices, which took 27 years to create and create the problem we've got, will take some while to do, and that's how—. We would eventually find ways to do that. [Interruption.] Sorry, do you want an intervention?

Why don't you make an intervention?

Are you accepting Jenny Rathbone's intervention?

I think I am, yes. Yes.

I'm very interested to understand whether you're arguing that we need to put even more money into health when we already spend half of our budget on it.

I'm pointing out your failures. It's important for an opposition to point out your failures, so that we can learn from your mistakes of many years past and we can start improving things for the future. 

So, what are patients experiencing under the so-called management that's been created over many years from Plaid and Labour? Well, we heard earlier: 10,000 patients waiting 12 or more hours in A&E, more than one in four people in Wales stuck on a waiting list, 7,000 people waiting over two years, and barely half of cancer patients starting their treatment on time. Now, these are not just statistics, they are people's stories—patients who are scared, suffering and feeling let down. Now, increasing a budget does not always increase competence and delivery. There is systemic failure in our Welsh NHS, and that comes from the top, and that's including Government. Adding £180 million does not add leadership, and altering the number on a spreadsheet does not change the reality that patients in Wales are seeing every single day.

Let's look at the opportunity cost of that £180 million. If the NHS was not in permanent crisis, requiring that extra money, that amount could have gone into supporting schools, more to local government or transport. Instead, it's being used as a sticking plaster. If only the full £1.20 had been spent, then just think of the resilience we would have created and would have been built into our NHS. Indeed, if you were to go back just 10 years and added 5p to the £1.12 and funded at £1.17 per head for the health service, over 10 years that would have amounted to some £3.5 billion into the health service, which would have created a resilience—[Interruption.] Yes, please do.

We can all—[Inaudible.]—on what should have been, but the fact is that this is the here and the now. So, do you oppose the extra money going into the NHS?

No, I'm pointing out the problems that you've created and why we—. It's going to take some while to put some of these things right.

As I was saying, £3.5 billion into the health service over the last 10 years would have created a resilience, and wouldn't have required you to have to bail it out in such a way. You may have had to disinvest in certain areas that you've chosen to invest in, but you could have created a resilient health service. 

I'm conscious that my time is running out. Plaid Cymru have been part of this, and you—. Plaid Cymru have been part of this over many years, but why didn't you do more, why didn't you do more to secure a resilient health service over the years of deals that you have had? Only the Welsh—[Interruption.] I don't know if I can have another one.

You've got five seconds left. Do you want Heledd Fychan to use it, or do you want to use it yourself?

I've only got five seconds left. Look, from a health perspective, we would declare a health emergency so that we could actually focus all of our resources to put things right, as we did in COVID. It's not until you recognise the problem you've created that you can start putting it right. That's the denial that we've found from Plaid and Labour in Wales that has left us in this situation. I'll leave it there. Diolch.

It's a huge relief to see a change of UK Government to a Labour administration that believes in investing in our public services. Of course, 14 years of ideologically driven Tory austerity cannot be undone in a single year, but we are already seeing progress. We would have been billions of pounds worse off if we'd continued on that same trajectory. Now, if our health service had been properly funded since 2010, instead of being cut and not risen in line with need and inflation, our health service would be fine. It's because of the Conservatives not funding it properly in line with need.

Waiting lists are coming down and capital funding is now being made available for long overdue investment. That includes our roads and our major assets renewal, such as the deteriorated A494 River Dee crossing, and our hospitals, including the Royal Alexandra in Rhyl and our hospitals, such as the orthopaedic centre in Llandudno, and funding for public transport, for bus services. At its heart, this is a £27.5 billion Labour budget protecting front-line public services and safeguarding jobs. There is £400 million of new spending commitments and extra funding to meet inflation and pay pressures.

Cutting land transaction tax on properties over £225,000 I am told would cost £140 million, but where would this come from if we're still to expect decent public services? Cutting the Mbale Size of Wales project, which does great, great things—what's that, £4 million? Well, that won't go very far, especially if you want to spend money reversing Senedd reform. We've just spent a lot of money making the Senedd or the Chamber ready to go. What are you going to do, change all that again, or reform 20 mph? It just doesn't add up. You want to increase farming payments, which is great, but where's that coming from? Many of you voted to leave the EU, which gave specific ring-fenced funding grants to farmers. It was generous and based on Wales's need, and you got that wrong too.

Reform, or should I say Reform a Tory, promise the earth, but also want to make cuts and savings. They cannot be trusted. Look at the disaster under Liz Truss, when inflation and mortgages rocketed. Her disastrous team have now joined Reform.

I am glad that the extra funding has gone to councils and health. As well as delivering important services and keeping us housed, educated, transported and healthy, our public services are one of our biggest employers, employing people in our communities: carers, cleaners, waste collectors, public protection officers, nurses, cooks, teachers. The jobs in our foundational economy are wide and varied. If we want to grow childcare, we need to make sure we've got people employed in childcare and we can pay them a decent wage. We cannot grow our economy without them. Without planners, we can't build houses. We can't have people employed in businesses without educating them first.

So, as well as investing in people and our foundational economy, our budget also invests in animal welfare and in the natural environment, which is really important. We cannot take these for granted. Thank goodness we've been able to make these important investments. Now we need to make sure at the next election that Reform and the Tories do not get their hands on it, or the money. Thank you.

Cabinet Secretary, Wales deserves better than this budget. However much the Conservatives that are left remain in complete denial in their little bubble, the reality is clear—although if you speak out, you might be chucked out—Britain is broken, and Wales is broken. This zombie retirement budget from a dead-in-the-water Government does nothing to fix the deep problems facing our country.

This final budget dressed up as a £27.5 billion plan simply does not deliver for the people who get up and pay their taxes. Much of the headline figure is swallowed up by inflation, pay pressures and recycled funding, meaning the real impact on services and communities is far smaller than the Ministers suggest. Instead it's been stitched together by this tired, Labour-Plaid deal designed to limp on until May. It fails farmers, it punishes rural communities and it forces councils to make an impossible choice: raise council tax on working families or cut the services people rely on.

While areas like the NHS have received funding increases, which, of course, are welcome, throwing money at the system will not fix the problem when the underlying problems run so deep. Demand continues to rise, workforce shortages persist and waiting lists still outpace any improvements promised by this Government—[Interruption.] I won't. Patients are treated in corridors, and others are waiting months, even years, for care.

Reform would tackle the root causes Labour refuses to face, and we would ensure the NHS remains free at the point of delivery. We would cut layers of management and wasteful bureaucracy, focusing on recruiting and retaining front-line staff, and delivering the care that people actually need, working with the people who know what they're talking about—the clinicians, not the civil servants—to fix those problems. Reform would deliver what this Government has failed to do for the last 26 years: an NHS that is free, that works and delivers.

Will you take an intervention?

No, I won't. Across rural Wales councils are being squeezed and farmers are ignored once again. Year after year, Labour and Plaid have signed off budgets that steadily erode the support for the sector that puts food—high-quality first-class food—on our tables. Support remains well below the levels called for by the NFU, and farming accounts for merely 2 per cent of the Welsh budget. The final budget does nothing to close that gap or restore confidence in the future of Welsh farming.

On top of this, farmers now face yet another Westminster policy shambles, with u-turn after u-turn on family farm tax. Farmers do not need mixed messages or last-minute climb-downs, and they deserve certainty and stability. Reform will deliver a scheme that works for farmers, listens to farmers and delivers with farmers.

Another result of this botched budget is that councils are being pushed into impossible decisions: raise council tax on families already struggling or slash essential services. Across Wales, local authorities are proposing inflation-busting rises as they face multimillion-pound shortfalls. In Labour Monmouthshire alone, a 5.95 per cent—[Interruption.]—no, sorry—is being proposed, the highest yet, and above the 5 per cent limit usually allowed in England. This budget passes responsibilities to councils without providing them the money needed to meet rising costs and new duties. The result will be fewer buses, longer waits for care, reduced school transport and neglected roads. Small businesses are being squeezed from every direction, yet this Welsh Government has chosen to sit on its hands.

You're certainly not the party of business. [Interruption.] No, I won't. There is no meaningful Wales-wide response to this budget to help small and medium-sized businesses absorb costs and taxes. Business rates, rising energy costs, they are asking for breathing space, but this budget delivers nothing for them.

Plaid Cymru are also to blame. They're a huge part of the problem. Time after time, Plaid talks up opposition, protests on the steps, then walks straight back in here and props up this Government. This is not just Labour's mess; this is a Labour-Plaid budget, agreed, signed off and defended by both parties. We do not need to guess where this Government's priorities lie with their bedfellows, Plaid Cymru. Millions are being wasted on overseas projects whilst roads crumble. Councils cut services, farmers are ignored and families are hammered with higher bills. This is not progressive Government. It is a complete failure of the people's priorities. Let us be absolutely clear: if Plaid Cymru wins in May, which will be a disaster for the people of Wales, nothing will change. Labour have failed Wales; Plaid have enabled that failure. The old parties are out of ideas.

And Plaid are worse than Labour: when Reform takes the reins in May, we'll end this madness. We will reform the system top to bottom and deliver the budget and put Wales first, working with the people that know what they're talking about, not left-wing ideological nonsense. There will be no ideological madness, no vanity projects, no stitch-up back-room deals with people who want to destroy the United Kingdom. Wales deserves better than this budget. Wales needs Reform, and we will not be supporting this budget today.

I'll be voting against this proposed budget today because it's a bad budget for Powys, and it's a bad budget for my constituents. Well, the Minister did like a comment on my Facebook when I was criticising the First Minister the other week—accidentally, I think; but I did note that.

There are many reasons why I would not support this budget today and I'll focus on just one of those. There is an ongoing and deeply unfair situation affecting Powys patients who are waiting for treatment in English hospitals. Many of my constituents are forced to wait longer than their English counterparts. That is because Powys Teaching Health Board have instructed providers in England to deliberately slow down treatment. They say that they've taken that action to respond to the financial expectations set out by the Welsh Government. Therefore, it is straightforward: the Welsh Government, if they provided funding to Powys health board to buy healthcare capacity in England based on the English waiting-time targets, then that would end the two-tier system that my constituents face. [Interruption.] I'll take an intervention.

I mean, Powys health board shouldn't be spending money it hasn't got. But I want to understand how Powys managed to get away with instructing English authorities not to take your patient.

Oh, that's an excellent question, Jenny. Please ask the health Minister to explain to you. I've been asking him to explain for months how the Welsh Government is allowing the Powys health board to do just that. Please do pursue the issue, Jenny. Thank you.

And we're not in the middle of a pandemic. We haven't got a shortage of surgeons. This is purely about financial decisions. There is capacity in those English hospitals, but those hospitals are not taking those patients because they're being instructed not to see them any quicker, and this is due to the Welsh Government not providing that funding to Powys health board.

Russell, will you take an intervention?

Yes, I will, yes.

Do you agree with me it is very disappointing? We've asked this question of the finance Secretary, I think the Cabinet Secretary, and members of Plaid Cymru who do represent this area on a regional basis: are they going to put any additional money in the budget into Powys? We've had no commitment from Plaid Cymru or Labour, so it does show the point that you can't trust Labour and Plaid Cymru to stand up for their constituents in mid Wales.

Thank you, James Evans, for your intervention. Your constituents, of course, will have the same situation as mine. And you're right, because of course, last month, we had the budget deal between Labour and Plaid with a big fanfare for the additional £180 million for the health and social care budget. But guess how much of that is going to be spent on addressing this issue? Not a penny. Not a penny. Well, I assume that that is the case. I have asked in written questions, I have asked in letters, I've asked in this Chamber, and I continually get a non-answer from various Ministers. In fact, the Minister said that this isn't a matter for him, that I should ask the health Secretary. I asked the health Secretary. All he does is answer a question that I've not asked, and continue to deflect away from the question I'm putting to him. And when I ask the First Minister, the First Minister agrees that this position is completely unacceptable, but doesn't confirm that the Welsh Government are going to act and resolve this situation that I and Jenny and James feel is wrong. 

This Labour and Plaid Cymru budget deal is not a good deal for the people of Powys. Had I been negotiating with the Government, I can tell you that this would have been at the top of my negotiation list. [Interruption.] I could have. I could have, and it would have been at the top of my negotiation list, and it would have been a red line for me. [Interruption.] I'm sorry, do you want me to go into the details of private conversations I've had, Lee? No, I thought you wouldn't. No. [Interruption.] Well, as this is being said, I will confirm that I had an informal conversation, and in that informal conversation, I set out what I'm setting out now to the Government. This is a red line that I was not prepared to cross in terms of supporting any budget deal with the Government.

Powys health board, of course, has unique circumstances. It has no district general hospital of its own, and therefore I would have negotiated, for example, a commissioning grant fund of some sort in order to resolve this situation. This is one of the most significant issues facing the people of Powys, and this Government has failed Powys patients. I would urge this Chamber to vote against this appalling, unfair and unfit budget. 

Llywydd, diolch yn fawr. Good politics requires both collaboration and contestation, and we've seen all of that on the floor of the Senedd this afternoon. But it is remarkable, Llywydd, it seems to me, how over the whole of the period of devolution, for more than a quarter of a century, the essential fault line in the Senedd remains unchanged. On one side of that fault line, you have progressive parties, where we disagree on many things but we know that we have a responsibility, a shared responsibility, to pass a budget that supports people in Wales and the public services on which they rely. And on the other side of that fault line you have those parties who are not prepared to play their part in that great project, who will vote against the budget this afternoon despite the many, many speeches we have heard from them all demanding for more be spent on this and more to be spent on that.

I heard Janet Finch-Saunders wanting more money on energy, more money on waste. I heard Natasha Asghar ask for more money on teachers, more money for childcare, more money for further education, more money for higher education. I heard Peter Fox saying that it had been a mistake not to spend more money on health every single year. He was too honest to say that his party would spend more on health, despite the many times that he was invited to do so. What we know for sure is that every single one of them will vote this afternoon to reduce the amount of money available for public services in Wales by £3.8 billion. That's what their spokesperson told us earlier this afternoon: they will vote against the Welsh rates of income tax resolution, and that means that there will be that huge hole in the middle of this budget. So, with the actions of the Welsh Conservatives this afternoon, no wonder they have never been