Y Cyfarfod Llawn
Plenary
26/04/2023Cynnwys
Contents
Yn y fersiwn ddwyieithog, mae’r golofn chwith yn cynnwys yr iaith a lefarwyd yn y cyfarfod. Mae’r golofn dde yn cynnwys cyfieithiad o’r areithiau hynny.
In the bilingual version, the left-hand column includes the language used during the meeting. The right-hand column includes a translation of those speeches.
Cyfarfu'r Senedd yn y Siambr a thrwy gynhadledd fideo am 13:30 gyda'r Llywydd (Elin Jones) yn y Gadair.
The Senedd met in the Chamber and by video-conference at 13:30 with the Llywydd (Elin Jones) in the Chair.
Prynhawn da a chroeso i'r Cyfarfod Llawn. Yr eitem gyntaf y prynhawn yma yw'r cwestiynau i Weinidog yr Economi. Mae'r cwestiwn cyntaf i'w ateb gan Ddirprwy Weinidog y Celfyddydau a Chwaraeon, ac i'w ofyn gan Altaf Hussain.
Good afternoon, and welcome to this Plenary meeting. The first item this afternoon is the questions to the Minister for Economy. The first question is to be answered by the Deputy Minister for Arts and Sport, and is to be asked by Altaf Hussain.
1. Pa gamau mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn eu cymryd i ddenu ymwelwyr i mewn i Orllewin De Cymru? OQ59396
1. What steps is the Welsh Government taking to attract inward visitors to South Wales West? OQ59396
Can I thank Altaf Hussain for that question? Visit Wales ensures that web, social media, public relations and travel trade activities provide opportunities for all parts of Wales to be promoted. Destinations and products in the South Wales West region are regularly highlighted to prospective visitors.
A gaf fi ddiolch i Altaf Hussain am ei gwestiwn? Mae Croeso Cymru yn sicrhau bod gweithgarwch rhyngrwyd, cyfryngau cymdeithasol, cysylltiadau cyhoeddus a'r diwydiant teithio yn darparu cyfleoedd i hyrwyddo pob rhan o Gymru. Amlygir cyrchfannau a chynnyrch yn rhanbarth Gorllewin De Cymru i ddenu ymwelwyr yn rheolaidd.
Thank you for that reply, Deputy Minister. Tourism is a vital sector of the economy in my region, and who would not want to visit? We have some of the best beaches in the world. However, all that is under threat due to policy decisions taken by your Government. Changes to the occupancy rule for holiday lets and the impending tourism tax are forcing many property owners to leave the market and sell up. Deputy Minister, how can we attract inward visitors if there is nowhere for them to stay? Will you now reconsider these policies given the weight of the evidence from the sector and the threat it poses to tourism in my region and across Wales? Thank you.
Diolch am eich ateb, Ddirprwy Weinidog. Mae twristiaeth yn sector hanfodol o’r economi yn fy rhanbarth, a phwy na fyddai eisiau ymweld? Mae gennym rai o'r traethau gorau yn y byd. Fodd bynnag, mae hynny oll o dan fygythiad o ganlyniad i benderfyniadau polisi a wnaed gan eich Llywodraeth chi. Mae newidiadau i’r rheol defnydd ar gyfer llety gwyliau a’r dreth dwristiaeth sydd ar y ffordd yn gorfodi llawer o berchnogion eiddo i adael y farchnad a gwerthu eu heiddo. Ddirprwy Weinidog, sut y gallwn ddenu ymwelwyr os nad oes unman iddynt aros? A wnewch chi ailystyried y polisïau hyn o ystyried pwysau'r dystiolaeth gan y sector a’r bygythiad y mae’n ei greu i dwristiaeth yn fy rhanbarth i a ledled Cymru? Diolch.
Thank you for that supplementary question. And I have to start by saying, Altaf, that I don't accept the premise of the comments or the question that you raise. This very question was actually asked to the First Minister yesterday, and you can all ask the question as many times as you like and you're going to get the same answers every single time. The regulations on second homes and self-catering changes were debated on the floor of the Senedd to annul those regulations, and the will of the Senedd was that we should continue with those regulations. And I would remind you that the charges on self-catering accommodation were actually part of the Labour manifesto. We won that election in 2021, and we are now implementing the manifesto pledges that we had.
But I think it's also worth saying and just repeating why it is we're making these changes. It is to ensure that self-catering properties are being used for business purposes for the majority of the year and are making a substantive contribution to the local economy. So, under the new criteria, properties are available to be let for at least 252 days of the year, but must be let for 182 days of the year. And we're very, very clear: the Welsh Government's view is that properties let out as self-catering accommodation on an infrequent basis should be liable for council tax. But if they are a genuine business, being let for 182 days or more, then they will be treated as a small business and will pay the relevant small business rates. What level the rates are set at in terms of any accommodation not meeting the 182 days, of course, is a matter for the local authority to determine.
Diolch am eich cwestiwn atodol. Ac mae'n rhaid imi ddechrau drwy ddweud, Altaf, nad wyf yn derbyn cynsail y sylwadau na'r cwestiwn a ofynnwch. Mewn gwirionedd, gofynnwyd yr union gwestiwn hwn i’r Prif Weinidog ddoe, a gallwch ofyn y cwestiwn gynifer o weithiau ag y dymunwch ac rydych yn mynd i gael yr un atebion bob tro. Cafodd y rheoliadau ar ail gartrefi a newidiadau i reolau llety hunanddarpar eu trafod ar lawr y Senedd i ddirymu’r rheoliadau hynny, ac ewyllys y Senedd oedd y dylem barhau â’r rheoliadau hynny. A hoffwn eich atgoffa bod y taliadau ar lety hunanddarpar yn rhan o faniffesto Llafur. Fe wnaethom ennill yr etholiad yn 2021, ac rydym bellach yn rhoi’r addewidion maniffesto a oedd gennym ar waith.
Ond credaf ei bod hefyd yn werth dweud ac ailadrodd pam ein bod yn gwneud y newidiadau hyn. Eu diben yw sicrhau bod llety hunanddarpar yn cael ei ddefnyddio at ddibenion busnes am y rhan fwyaf o’r flwyddyn ac yn gwneud cyfraniad o sylwedd i’r economi leol. Felly, o dan y meini prawf newydd, mae'n rhaid i eiddo fod ar gael i'w osod am o leiaf 252 diwrnod y flwyddyn, ond mae'n rhaid iddo fod wedi'i osod am 182 diwrnod o'r flwyddyn. Ac rydym yn glir iawn: barn Llywodraeth Cymru yw y dylai eiddo sy'n cael ei osod fel llety hunanddarpar ar sail anfynych yn unig orfod talu'r dreth gyngor. Ond os ydynt yn fusnes dilys, ac yn llety sy'n cael ei osod am 182 diwrnod neu fwy, byddant yn cael eu trin fel busnes bach a byddant yn talu’r ardrethi perthnasol i fusnesau bach. Mater i’r awdurdod lleol, wrth gwrs, yw pennu lefel yr ardrethi mewn perthynas ag unrhyw lety nad yw'n bodloni’r gofyniad 182 diwrnod.
South Wales West not only has the beaches that Altaf has talked about, but it's also got the beautiful valleys as well. So, in the South Wales West region, Minister, Bridgend council has recommitted to its leadership on the valleys park initiative, and we also have the Wildfox proposal for an adventure resort at the head of Dave Rees's valley and my valley—the top of the Llynfi and Afan valleys there, up next to Croeserw—looking to build on our natural advantage of those spectacular hills and valleys for walking, mountain biking, adventure as well. So, what additional support can Welsh Government give to those who want to develop the valleys as a destination for great adventure, outdoor fun and activity?
Nid yn unig fod gan Orllewin De Cymru y traethau y mae Altaf wedi sôn amdanynt, ond mae ganddo gymoedd hardd hefyd. Felly, Weinidog, yn rhanbarth Gorllewin De Cymru, mae cyngor Pen-y-bont ar Ogwr wedi ailymrwymo i’w arweinyddiaeth ar fenter parc y cymoedd, ac mae gennym gynnig Wildfox ar gyfer cyrchfan antur ar ben uchaf cwm Dave Rees a'm cwm innau—pen uchaf cwm Llynfi a chwm Afan, ger Croeserw—sy'n gobeithio adeiladu ar fantais naturiol y bryniau a’r dyffrynnoedd ysblennydd hynny ar gyfer cerdded, beicio mynydd ac antur hefyd. Felly, pa gymorth ychwanegol y gall Llywodraeth Cymru ei roi i'r rheini sydd am ddatblygu'r cymoedd fel cyrchfan ar gyfer antur, hwyl yn yr awyr agored a gweithgarwch gwych?
Well, can I say I absolutely agree with all the comments that the Member from Ogmore has made? And I spent many happy years living in Ogmore, of course, when the Member was my own MP and Member of the Senedd at the time. So, I absolutely agree that there are a number of areas in Wales, including your constituency, Huw, where we can all work alongside that wonderful natural environment, can't we, and we see many excellent examples in our valleys areas—BikePark Wales in my own constituency, of course, and Skyline that we're looking to develop in Swansea. And my team are always willing to discuss any good development or investment opportunities with local authorities or leads of prospective projects. We've got the Brilliant Basics fund, of course, and we have the strategic capital investment fund via the Wales tourism investment fund, which is available, and that we can support through our marketing and promotion activities.
You'll be pleased to know, of course, that the south-east Wales tourism forum has representatives from your local authority, from Bridgend, and it also has local operators such as Hugh Murray, who's the owner of the Porthcawl Surf School, and he's attended in the past, as have other tourism operators in the area. So, what I'm saying to you is that we have plenty of potential support for the right schemes, and look forward to continuing to support Bridgend, Ogmore as a whole, and many other varied tourism opportunities in your constituency.
Wel, a gaf fi ddweud fy mod yn cytuno’n llwyr â’r holl sylwadau a wnaed gan yr Aelod dros Ogwr? A threuliais lawer o flynyddoedd hapus yn byw yn Ogwr, wrth gwrs, pan oedd yr Aelod yn AS i mi ac yn Aelod o’r Senedd ar y pryd. Felly, rwy'n cytuno'n llwyr fod nifer o ardaloedd yng Nghymru, gan gynnwys eich etholaeth chi, Huw, lle gall pob un ohonom weithio ochr yn ochr â'r amgylchedd naturiol gwych hwnnw, oni allwn, ac rydym yn gweld llawer o enghreifftiau rhagorol yn ein cymoedd—BikePark Cymru yn fy etholaeth i, wrth gwrs, a Skyline, y gobeithiwn ei ddatblygu yn Abertawe. Ac mae fy nhîm bob amser yn barod i drafod unrhyw gyfleoedd datblygu neu fuddsoddi gwerth chweil gydag awdurdodau lleol neu arweinwyr prosiectau arfaethedig. Mae gennym gronfa'r Pethau Pwysig, wrth gwrs, ac mae gennym y gronfa buddsoddi cyfalaf strategol drwy gronfa buddsoddi mewn twristiaeth Cymru, sydd ar gael, ac y gallwn ei chefnogi drwy ein gweithgarwch marchnata a hyrwyddo.
Byddwch yn falch o glywed, wrth gwrs, fod gan fforwm twristiaeth de-ddwyrain Cymru gynrychiolwyr o’ch awdurdod lleol, o Ben-y-bont ar Ogwr, ac mae ganddo hefyd weithredwyr lleol fel Hugh Murray, perchennog Ysgol Syrffio Porthcawl, ac mae ef wedi mynychu'r fforwm yn y gorffennol, ynghyd â gweithredwyr twristiaeth eraill yn yr ardal. Felly, yr hyn rwy'n ei ddweud wrthych chi yw bod gennym ddigon o gefnogaeth bosibl i'r cynlluniau cywir, ac edrychwn ymlaen at barhau i gefnogi Pen-y-bont ar Ogwr, Ogwr yn gyffredinol, a chyfleoedd twristiaeth eraill amrywiol yn eich etholaeth.
2. Beth mae Llywodraeth Cymru'n ei wneud i dyfu sgiliau pobl ifanc? OQ59411
2. What is the Welsh Government doing to grow the skills of young people? OQ59411
We are making strong progress in delivering our young person's guarantee, with over 12,000 young people starting on employability and skills programmes alone since the launch of the young person's guarantee in November 2021.
Rydym yn gwneud cynnydd cadarn ar gyflawni ein gwarant i bobl ifanc, gyda dros 12,000 o bobl ifanc yn dechrau ar raglenni sgiliau a chyflogadwyedd ers lansio’r warant i bobl ifanc ym mis Tachwedd 2021.
I'd like to thank the Minister for that answer. Minister, the UK Government signed a new trade deal with New Zealand, and part of that was extending the working holiday visa up to 35. I firmly believe that growing the skills of young people is giving them the opportunities to go abroad to learn new skills and bring new experiences back home to improve their job opportunities back here in the UK. So, what is the Welsh Government doing to promote the opportunities that that trade deal has given to young people in Wales to go and work abroad so they can grow the skills base here in Wales?
Hoffwn ddiolch i’r Gweinidog am ei ateb. Weinidog, mae Llywodraeth y DU wedi llofnodi cytundeb masnach newydd â Seland Newydd, ac roedd rhan o hynny'n cynnwys ymestyn y fisa gwyliau gwaith i bobl hyd at 35 oed. Credaf yn gryf fod tyfu sgiliau pobl ifanc yn rhoi cyfleoedd iddynt fynd dramor i ddysgu sgiliau newydd a dod â phrofiadau newydd adref i wella eu cyfleoedd gwaith yn ôl yma yn y DU. Felly, beth mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei wneud i hyrwyddo’r cyfleoedd y mae’r cytundeb masnach hwnnw wedi’u rhoi i bobl ifanc yng Nghymru fynd i weithio dramor fel y gallant dyfu’r sylfaen sgiliau yma yng Nghymru?
Well, of course, the trade deal with New Zealand, as indeed the other trade deals, contains a range of areas. And we have always taken a balanced view on the fact that there is potential for more trade and economic activity. There is potential for people to go and work and learn in other countries, and we would like to see those people return and enhance the economy here in Wales. It's of course part of the reason why the Welsh Government has funded the Taith programme, to make sure that young people have the opportunity to study in other countries after the UK Government brought our participation in Erasmus to an end. But those trade deals are balanced, and there are challenges in other areas of them. It's an ongoing area of conversation between me, my officials and the UK Government, and I'll continue to report back transparently to both the relevant scrutiny committee and, indeed, to the Senedd.
Wel, wrth gwrs, roedd y cytundeb masnach â Seland Newydd, fel y cytundebau masnach eraill yn wir, yn cynnwys ystod o feysydd. Ac rydym bob amser wedi bod â safbwynt cytbwys ar y ffaith bod potensial ar gyfer mwy o fasnach a gweithgarwch economaidd. Mae potensial i bobl fynd i weithio a dysgu mewn gwledydd eraill, a hoffem weld pobl yn dychwelyd ac yn gwella’r economi yma yng Nghymru. Wrth gwrs, mae'n rhan o'r rheswm pam fod Llywodraeth Cymru wedi ariannu rhaglen Taith, i sicrhau bod pobl ifanc yn cael cyfle i astudio mewn gwledydd eraill ar ôl i Lywodraeth y DU ddod â'n cyfranogiad yn rhaglen Erasmus i ben. Ond mae’r cytundebau masnach hynny’n gytbwys, ac mae heriau mewn rhannau eraill ohonynt. Mae'n destun sgwrs barhaus rhyngof fi, fy swyddogion a Llywodraeth y DU, a byddaf yn parhau i adrodd yn ôl yn dryloyw i'r pwyllgor craffu perthnasol, ac yn wir, i'r Senedd.
Minister, yesterday I hosted an event with Airbus and colleagues from the trade union movement, as well as the French ambassador, who I was delighted to welcome to our Senedd. The event itself was entitled 'Flightpath to Decarbonising Aerospace', and speakers at the event updated Members and other guests on the work being done in developing carbon-neutral aviation fuels, and, of course, the state of the art Wing of Tomorrow project in Broughton. Minister, do you agree with me that Wales needs to continue to lead on this type of new technology, and that the more we invest in upskilling young people, like those future generations watching in the gallery today, the more we can seize the opportunity in front of us?
Weinidog, ddoe cynhaliais ddigwyddiad gydag Airbus a chydweithwyr o’r mudiad undebau llafur, yn ogystal â llysgennad Ffrainc, yr oeddwn yn falch iawn o’i chroesawu i’n Senedd. Teitl y digwyddiad ei hun oedd 'Y Llwybr i Ddatgarboneiddio Awyrofod', a rhoddodd siaradwyr yn y digwyddiad y wybodaeth ddiweddaraf i'r Aelodau a gwesteion eraill am y gwaith sy'n mynd rhagddo i ddatblygu tanwyddau hedfan carbon niwtral, ac wrth gwrs, prosiect blaenllaw Adain Yfory ym Mrychdyn. Weinidog, a ydych yn cytuno â mi fod angen i Gymru barhau i arwain ar dechnoleg newydd o'r fath, a pho fwyaf y byddwn yn buddsoddi mewn uwchsgilio pobl ifanc, fel y bobl ifanc o genedlaethau’r dyfodol sy’n gwylio yn yr oriel heddiw, y mwyaf y gallwn achub ar y cyfle sydd ger ein bron?
Yes, I do. And, in fact, we were talking much about the future of the economy in Wales when I was in Brussels yesterday, which was, unfortunately, why I wasn't at the event with Airbus. But I have good links with the company and, indeed, with the recognised trade union at Airbus, but more broadly across the wider manufacturing sector. And as we set out a renewed and refreshed plan for the manufacturing sector, alongside the action we're taking on our net-zero skills plan, we will continue to want to invest in the skills of young people, and the opportunity for them to grow and develop here in Wales.
On the one hand, there are opportunities to work in other parts of the world. We want people, though, to be really confident about having a successful and fulfilling future here in Wales. It's why we're looking for clarity, not competition, when it comes to skills policy. We've seen different policy initiatives from the UK Government. We would like to see continued investment in real terms to increase the skills of young people for the future—that's exactly what we're committed to—and in the areas you mentioned specifically, the Wing of Tomorrow, in not just the materials used, but the manufacturing process itself. And when it comes to the new fuels that will allow us to carry on flying in a more sustainable way in the future, there are an awful lot of research, development and innovation opportunities. So, you can see the advanced manufacturing plan, the green skills plan and our innovation strategy all gearing up together with the young person's guarantee and a range of other programmes. And we've got to have a coherent plan, where we'll have partners to do that with—both the trade union movement and businesses—and I would like to see a more coherent partnership with the UK Government than the one we have at present.
Ydw, rwy'n cytuno. Ac mewn gwirionedd, buom yn siarad llawer am ddyfodol yr economi yng Nghymru pan oeddwn ym Mrwsel ddoe, sef y rheswm pam nad oeddwn yn y digwyddiad gydag Airbus, yn anffodus. Ond mae gennyf gysylltiadau da â’r cwmni, ac yn wir, â’r undeb llafur cydnabyddedig yn Airbus, ond yn fwy cyffredinol hefyd ar draws y sector gweithgynhyrchu ehangach. Ac wrth inni greu cynllun newydd ar gyfer y sector gweithgynhyrchu, ochr yn ochr â’r camau rydym yn eu cymryd gyda'n cynllun sgiliau sero net, byddwn yn parhau i fod yn awyddus i fuddsoddi yn sgiliau pobl ifanc, a’r cyfle iddynt dyfu a datblygu yma yng Nghymru.
Ar y naill law, ceir cyfleoedd i weithio mewn rhannau eraill o'r byd. Serch hynny, rydym am i bobl fod yn wirioneddol hyderus ynglŷn â chael dyfodol llwyddiannus a boddhaus yma yng Nghymru. Dyna pam ein bod yn edrych am eglurder, nid cystadleuaeth, yn ein polisi sgiliau. Rydym wedi gweld mentrau polisi gwahanol gan Lywodraeth y DU. Hoffem weld buddsoddiad parhaus mewn termau real i gynyddu sgiliau pobl ifanc ar gyfer y dyfodol—dyna'n union rydym wedi ymrwymo iddo—ac yn y meysydd a grybwyllwyd yn benodol gennych, Adain Yfory, nid yn unig o ran y deunyddiau a ddefnyddir, ond y broses weithgynhyrchu ei hun. Ac o ran y tanwyddau newydd a fydd yn ein galluogi i barhau i hedfan mewn ffordd fwy cynaliadwy yn y dyfodol, ceir cryn dipyn o gyfleoedd ymchwil a datblygu ac arloesi. Felly gallwch weld y cynllun gweithgynhyrchu uwch, y cynllun sgiliau gwyrdd a'n strategaeth arloesi oll yn gweithio gyda'r warant i bobl ifanc ac ystod o raglenni eraill. Ac mae'n rhaid inni gael cynllun cydlynol, lle mae gennym bartneriaid i wneud hynny gyda hwy—y mudiad undebau llafur a busnesau hefyd—a hoffwn weld partneriaeth fwy cydlynol gyda Llywodraeth y DU na'r un sydd gennym ar hyn o bryd.
Cwestiynau nawr gan lefarwyr y pleidiau. Llefarydd y Ceidwadwyr, Paul Davies.
Questions now from the party spokespeople. The Conservative spokesperson, Paul Davies.
Diolch, Llywydd. Minister, you will be aware of Cardiff Council's meeting tomorrow to discuss the possibility of introducing a congestion charge to tackle traffic levels in Cardiff. Whilst this is primarily a matter for the local authority, there could be important economic consequences should these plans go ahead, and so, as the Minister for Economy, can you tell us what your assessment is of the economic impact of these plans on our capital city and can you confirm the Welsh Government's position on this matter?
Diolch, Lywydd. Weinidog, fe fyddwch yn ymwybodol o gyfarfod Cyngor Caerdydd yfory i drafod y posibilrwydd o gyflwyno tâl atal tagfeydd er mwyn mynd i’r afael â lefelau traffig yng Nghaerdydd. Er mai mater i’r awdurdod lleol yw hwn yn bennaf, gallai fod canlyniadau economaidd pwysig pe bai’r cynlluniau hyn yn cael eu rhoi ar waith, ac felly, fel Gweinidog yr Economi, a wnewch chi ddweud wrthym beth yw eich asesiad chi o effaith economaidd y cynlluniau hyn ar ein prifddinas? Ac a wnewch chi gadarnhau safbwynt Llywodraeth Cymru ar y mater hwn?
Well, it isn't possible to deliver an economic assessment of the plans because there isn't a fully formed proposal to assess, and, as well as the impact on the economy, you need to consider the environmental, the societal and, indeed, the public health benefits. When Cardiff Council announced they were considering a range of proposals, it wasn't just about the potential for road user charging; it was also about their plan to invest in the future of public transport, and the council were very clear that they want to deliver public transport improvements before any element of charging may be introduced. And I am sure you will also have heard the public health director from Cardiff and Vale University Health Board talking about the potential public health benefits. Now, that's big news for me as a constituency Member. Obviously, I represent part of the city of Cardiff, and there are significant air pollution challenges. And I want to see my constituents and other constituents across Wales have opportunities to live in an environment where the way that we move around does not compromise their health and opportunity to succeed economically. I look forward to seeing a fully formed proposal. And I welcome the fact that the council are actually having this conversation, and I want to be gauging the evidence rather than misleading or less than truthful slogans that some people have indulged in.
Wel, nid yw'n bosibl cynnal asesiad economaidd o'r cynlluniau am nad oes cynnig llawn i'w asesu, ac yn ogystal â'r effaith ar yr economi, mae angen ichi ystyried y manteision i'r amgylchedd, y manteision cymdeithasol, ac yn wir, y manteision i iechyd y cyhoedd. Pan gyhoeddodd Cyngor Caerdydd eu bod yn ystyried ystod o gynigion, roedd hynny'n ymwneud â mwy na’r potensial o godi tâl ar ddefnyddwyr ffyrdd yn unig; roedd hefyd yn ymwneud â’u cynllun i fuddsoddi yn nyfodol trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus, ac roedd y cyngor yn glir iawn eu bod am gyflawni gwelliannau trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus cyn codi unrhyw fath o dâl. Ac rwy’n siŵr y byddwch hefyd wedi clywed cyfarwyddwr iechyd y cyhoedd Bwrdd Iechyd Prifysgol Caerdydd a’r Fro yn sôn am y manteision posibl i iechyd y cyhoedd. Nawr, mae hynny'n newyddion mawr i mi fel Aelod etholaethol. Yn amlwg, rwy’n cynrychioli rhan o ddinas Caerdydd, a cheir heriau sylweddol o ran llygredd aer. Ac rwyf am weld fy etholwyr ac etholwyr eraill ledled Cymru yn cael cyfleoedd i fyw mewn amgylchedd lle nad yw’r ffordd rydym yn symud o gwmpas yn peryglu eu hiechyd a’u cyfle i lwyddo’n economaidd, ac edrychaf ymlaen at weld cynnig llawn. Ac rwy'n croesawu'r ffaith bod y cyngor yn cael y sgwrs hon, ac rwyf am ystyried y dystiolaeth yn hytrach na sloganau camarweiniol neu anghywir y mae rhai pobl wedi’u rhannu.
Well, clearly, Minister, you don't know what the economic consequences of these plans are going to be, and I'm sure the people of Cardiff will have heard what you have to say on the matter and will draw their own conclusions.
Now, it was recently reported that the number of firms collapsing into insolvency across England and Wales jumped last month to 16 per cent, as companies continue to struggle with soaring costs and weak consumer spending. So, it's vital that governments at all levels are working to support our town and city centres and help our businesses during this time. Now, you'll be aware of the 2021 Audit Wales report, which made six recommendations to help the Welsh Government and local authorities better manage and support town and city centres across Wales, and so can you tell us how many of the recommendations have been delivered and what further work will be done in this financial year to nurture and develop town and city centres in Wales?
Wel, yn amlwg, Weinidog, nid ydych yn gwybod beth fydd canlyniadau economaidd y cynlluniau hyn, ac rwy’n siŵr y bydd pobl Caerdydd wedi clywed yr hyn sydd gennych i’w ddweud ar y mater ac yn dod i’w casgliadau eu hunain.
Nawr, adroddwyd yn ddiweddar fod nifer y cwmnïau sy'n cofnodi ansolfedd ledled Cymru a Lloegr wedi neidio fis diwethaf i 16 y cant, wrth i gwmnïau barhau i'w chael hi'n anodd gyda chostau cynyddol a gwariant isel gan ddefnyddwyr. Felly, mae'n hanfodol fod llywodraethau ar bob lefel yn gweithio i gefnogi canol ein trefi a'n dinasoedd a helpu ein busnesau yn ystod y cyfnod hwn. Nawr, fe fyddwch yn ymwybodol o adroddiad Archwilio Cymru 2021, a wnaeth chwe argymhelliad i helpu Llywodraeth Cymru ac awdurdodau lleol i reoli a chefnogi canol trefi a dinasoedd ledled Cymru yn well, ac felly a wnewch chi ddweud wrthym faint o’r argymhellion a gyflawnwyd a pha waith pellach fydd yn mynd rhagddo yn y flwyddyn ariannol hon i feithrin a datblygu canol trefi a dinasoedd yng Nghymru?
Okay. So, I can't give you a direct response to all six of those areas. I'd be more than happy to write to the Member to set that out in more detail—the detail I think he'll want to see. We continue with our investing in towns programme—our Transforming Towns programme. That's working alongside local authorities' programmes that they themselves are developing and leading and managing, and we'll continue to have a properly grown-up partnership on that.
I should just make the point, when it comes to his first question and the comments he then made, when road user charging has been introduced in other cities in the UK and around the world, we have not seen the economy come to a halt. We have seen changes in people's behaviour and, actually, I think there is a really vibrant future for Cardiff city centre, and you can see that in the way that a number of professional services companies look at their future in and around the city. I'm expecting positive news over the next year or so on more growth and development in that area, and these policies don't put off those people from wanting to invest in the future of jobs and really good-quality jobs. I think, as I say, a dose of reality and evidence would be helpful when it comes to the future of thriving cities and, indeed, towns right across the country.
Iawn. Felly, ni allaf roi ymateb uniongyrchol i bob un o'r chwe maes hynny i chi. Rwy'n fwy na pharod i ysgrifennu at yr Aelod i nodi hynny mewn mwy o fanylder—y manylder y credaf y bydd am ei weld. Rydym yn parhau â’n rhaglen buddsoddi mewn trefi—ein rhaglen Trawsnewid Trefi. Mae'r rhaglen honno’n gweithio ochr yn ochr â rhaglenni y mae'r awdurdodau lleol eu hunain yn eu datblygu, eu harwain a’u rheoli, a byddwn yn parhau i gael partneriaeth aeddfed ar hynny.
Ar ei gwestiwn cyntaf a’r sylwadau a wnaeth wedyn, dylwn wneud y pwynt pan fydd taliadau'n cael eu codi ar ddefnyddwyr ffyrdd mewn dinasoedd eraill yn y DU a ledled y byd, nid ydym wedi gweld yr economi’n dod i stop. Rydym wedi gweld newidiadau yn ymddygiad pobl, ac mewn gwirionedd, credaf fod dyfodol bywiog iawn i ganol dinas Caerdydd, a gallwch weld hynny yn y ffordd y mae nifer o gwmnïau gwasanaethau proffesiynol yn edrych ar eu dyfodol yn y ddinas ac o’i chwmpas. Rwy'n disgwyl newyddion cadarnhaol dros y flwyddyn neu ddwy nesaf ar fwy o dwf a datblygiad, ac nid yw'r polisïau hyn yn atal y bobl hynny rhag dymuno buddsoddi yn nyfodol swyddi a swyddi o ansawdd da iawn. Fel y dywedaf, rwy'n credu y byddai dos o realiti a thystiolaeth yn ddefnyddiol wrth drafod dyfodol dinasoedd ffyniannus, a threfi yn wir, ledled y wlad.
Well, I look forward to your letter regarding the Audit Wales report recommendations, which will tell us whether these recommendations have actually been delivered or not by your Government.
Now, 12 months ago, the Federation of Small Businesses published its vision for Welsh towns, which looked at some of the challenges that our town centres have faced in recent years, and set out what they believe is needed to build a successful future for Welsh town centres and high streets. That report told us that only 3 per cent of people believe their town centre to be thriving, and that really should be a wake-up call for the Government to prioritise building resilient town centres, helping businesses to grow and recycling the Welsh pound in our communities. The scale is huge and the challenges include everything from changing consumer habits to cost pressures for businesses, to public transport, which you've just been talking about. Therefore, can you tell us what additional funding is being allocated to support businesses in town centres across Wales in light of some of the challenges that they are continuing to face? And can you also provide an update on the discussions you've had with local authorities about the measures they are taking in order to ensure that local interventions do not harm the ambition to create sustainable town centres for the future?
Wel, edrychaf ymlaen at eich llythyr ynghylch argymhellion adroddiad Archwilio Cymru, a fydd yn dweud wrthym a yw’r argymhellion hyn wedi’u cyflawni ai peidio gan eich Llywodraeth.
Nawr, 12 mis yn ôl, cyhoeddodd y Ffederasiwn Busnesau Bach eu gweledigaeth ar gyfer trefi Cymru, a oedd yn edrych ar rai o’r heriau y mae canol ein trefi wedi’u hwynebu dros y blynyddoedd diwethaf, ac yn nodi’r hyn sydd ei angen yn eu barn hwy i adeiladu dyfodol llwyddiannus i ganol trefi a'r stryd fawr yng Nghymru. Dywedodd yr adroddiad hwnnw wrthym mai 3 y cant yn unig o bobl sy’n credu bod canol eu tref yn ffynnu, a dylai hynny fod yn rhybudd gwirioneddol i’r Llywodraeth y dylid blaenoriaethu adeiladu canol trefi gwydn, gan helpu busnesau i dyfu ac ailgylchu’r bunt Gymreig yn ein cymunedau. Mae’r raddfa’n enfawr, ac mae’r heriau’n cynnwys popeth o newid arferion defnyddwyr, i bwysau costau ar fusnesau, i drafnidiaeth gyhoeddus, fel rydych newydd fod yn ei drafod. Felly, a wnewch chi ddweud wrthym pa gyllid ychwanegol sy’n cael ei ddyrannu i gefnogi busnesau yng nghanol trefi ledled Cymru o gofio rhai o’r heriau y maent yn parhau i’w hwynebu? Ac a wnewch chi hefyd roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf am y trafodaethau rydych wedi'u cael gydag awdurdodau lleol am y mesurau y maent hwy'n eu rhoi ar waith er mwyn sicrhau nad yw ymyriadau lleol yn niweidio'r uchelgais i greu canol trefi cynaliadwy ar gyfer y dyfodol?
Yes. Look, as ever, we work alongside local authorities and other partners when it comes to the future for town centres. But it's also a range of policy areas across the Government—so, taking a 'town centre first' approach to the way that we develop. So, that includes when we're making choices around investing in housing and in the health service; when we're thinking about regeneration approaches as well. You can see that we are working directly alongside local authorities to do just that. I've visited Rhyl and Prestatyn in the past, for example, to see some of that work directly and that is all about how you do create a vibrant high street. A number of the challenges they face come from a number of different factors. The cost-of-living crisis is also a cost-of-doing business crisis—the challenges of inflation when you look at some of the challenges around retail, and you mentioned that there are trends in the way that people are now behaving as consumers.
So, when we developed our retail action plan, when we were going into the delivery phase, that was working alongside trade unions led by the Union of Shop, Distributive and Allied Workers; that was working alongside businesses led by the Wales Retail Consortia. And it is understanding all the different things we can do to have a positive future for retail, and it's part of what makes a vibrant and effective high street.
I look back on other choices we've already made. For example, I know that other Members will have been today at events with pharmacy colleagues and Marie Curie and, actually, the choice that we have made consistently to invest in community pharmacy is hugely important for generating footfall on a range of our high streets in towns of all shapes and sizes. It goes into the everyday economy as well that Hefin David has regularly talked about, to make sure that procurement policy and the way that we work alongside small and medium-sized businesses actually have a direct impact, so that it isn't simply about where the budget lines are, it's also about the coherence of policy and understanding what we can all do to support our local town centres, not just on small business weekend, but through the year, and the policy choices we make in Government.
Iawn. Edrychwch, fel bob amser, rydym yn gweithio ochr yn ochr ag awdurdodau lleol a phartneriaid eraill ar ddyfodol canol trefi. Ond mae'n ymwneud hefyd ag amrywiaeth o feysydd polisi ar draws y Llywodraeth—felly, mabwysiadu agwedd 'canol y dref yn gyntaf' o ran y ffordd rydym yn datblygu. Felly, mae hynny'n cynnwys pan fyddwn yn gwneud dewisiadau ynghylch buddsoddi mewn tai ac yn y gwasanaeth iechyd; pan fyddwn yn meddwl am ddulliau adfywio hefyd. Gallwch weld ein bod yn gweithio ochr yn ochr ag awdurdodau lleol i wneud yn union hynny. Rwyf wedi ymweld â’r Rhyl a Phrestatyn yn y gorffennol, er enghraifft, i weld rhywfaint o’r gwaith hwnnw fy hun ac mae hynny'n ymwneud â sut rydych yn creu stryd fawr fywiog. Daw nifer o'r heriau a wynebant o nifer o ffactorau gwahanol. Mae’r argyfwng costau byw hefyd yn argyfwng cost gwneud busnes—heriau chwyddiant pan edrychwch ar rai o’r heriau mewn perthynas â manwerthu, ac fe sonioch chi fod tueddiadau yn y ffordd y mae pobl bellach yn ymddwyn fel defnyddwyr.
Felly, pan wnaethom ddatblygu ein cynllun gweithredu ar gyfer y sector manwerthu, pan oeddem yn mynd i mewn i’r cyfnod cyflwyno, roedd hynny’n golygu gweithio ochr yn ochr ag undebau llafur dan arweiniad yr Undeb Gweithwyr Siopau, Dosbarthu a Gwaith Perthynol; roedd yn golygu gweithio ochr yn ochr â busnesau dan arweiniad Consortia Manwerthu Cymru. Ac mae'n golygu deall yr holl bethau gwahanol y gallwn eu gwneud i sicrhau dyfodol cadarnhaol i'r sector manwerthu, ac mae'n rhan o'r hyn sy'n gwneud stryd fawr fywiog ac effeithiol.
Rwy'n edrych yn ôl ar ddewisiadau eraill rydym wedi'u gwneud eisoes. Er enghraifft, gwn y bydd Aelodau eraill wedi bod mewn digwyddiadau heddiw gyda chydweithwyr ym maes fferylliaeth a Marie Curie, ac mewn gwirionedd, mae'r dewis rydym wedi’i wneud yn gyson i fuddsoddi mewn fferylliaeth gymunedol yn hynod bwysig i sicrhau ymwelwyr ar y stryd fawr mewn trefi o bob lliw a llun. Mae’n ymwneud hefyd â’r economi bob dydd y mae Hefin David wedi siarad amdani’n rheolaidd, i sicrhau bod polisi caffael a’r ffordd y gweithiwn ochr yn ochr â busnesau bach a chanolig yn cael effaith uniongyrchol, fel nad yw hyn yn ymwneud â ble mae llinellau'r gyllideb yn unig, ond hefyd â chydlynu polisi a deall yr hyn y gall pob un ohonom ei wneud i gefnogi canol ein trefi lleol, nid yn unig ar benwythnosau busnesau bach, ond drwy gydol y flwyddyn, a'r dewisiadau polisi a wnawn yn y Llywodraeth.
Llefarydd Plaid Cymru, Luke Fletcher.
Plaid Cymru spokesperson, Luke Fletcher.
Diolch, Llywydd. An approach to apprenticeships should be focused on end outcomes rather than just simply overall numbers. Now, it's great that the Welsh Government has committed to creating 125,000 additional apprenticeships over this Senedd term, but that means little if they're not completed. There's a worrying trend of late showing a 14.6 per cent dip in the success rates of apprenticeships since 2019. Over a third of apprenticeships in Wales are not completed.
Now, we know that upskilling our workforce is critical in addressing the underlying weaknesses of the Welsh economy particularly in relation to the productivity gap. And on top of this, the latest data also shows a widening gap in the success rate between learners living in the most deprived areas and the least deprived areas. Therefore, what measures are the Welsh Government undertaking to reverse the recent slide in apprenticeship success rates, particularly amongst individuals from deprived areas?
Diolch, Lywydd. Dylai ymagwedd at brentisiaethau ganolbwyntio ar ganlyniadau terfynol yn hytrach na niferoedd cyffredinol yn unig. Nawr, mae'n wych fod Llywodraeth Cymru wedi ymrwymo i greu 125,000 o brentisiaethau ychwanegol yn nhymor y Senedd hon, ond nid yw hynny'n golygu fawr ddim os na chânt eu cwblhau. Mae tueddiad diweddar, sy'n dangos gostyngiad o 14.6 y cant yng nghyfraddau llwyddiant prentisiaethau ers 2019, yn peri cryn bryder. Nid yw dros draean o brentisiaethau yng Nghymru yn cael eu cwblhau.
Nawr, gwyddom fod uwchsgilio ein gweithlu'n hollbwysig er mwyn mynd i'r afael â gwendidau sylfaenol yn economi Cymru, yn enwedig mewn perthynas â'r bwlch cynhyrchiant. Ac yn ychwanegol at hyn, mae’r data diweddaraf hefyd yn dangos bwlch cynyddol yn y gyfradd lwyddiant rhwng dysgwyr sy’n byw yn yr ardaloedd mwyaf difreintiedig a’r ardaloedd lleiaf difreintiedig. Felly, pa fesurau y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn eu rhoi ar waith i wrthdroi’r llithro diweddar yng nghyfraddau llwyddiant prentisiaethau, yn enwedig ymhlith unigolion o ardaloedd difreintiedig?
We've actually been looking at working with a number of people who haven't completed those outcomes, as well as the providers themselves, to understand the different reasons for that. Now, people's financial means are part of that, but it's also then a conversation, not just for those individuals, but for the businesses they're working in as well. And it's about the range of different routes to achieving an apprenticeship. Some of the challenges actually come from people making different choices and from some of the challenges that we still see feeding through from apprentices when it comes to post-pandemic mental health and well-being. It's a really significant challenge, which is why I previously announced more money for mental health support for our apprentices—I made that announcement last month—when it comes to what we're doing alongside the broader work we're doing in the youth guarantee work.
What I'm focused on is not just increasing the number of apprentices—and you are right to focus on completion rates; we still have a better completion rate than over the border and it's about making sure that we continue to improve that—but it is also about the quality of the apprenticeships. We could have made a choice to downgrade the level of apprenticeships to try to put on more numbers; we chose not to do that. That's why we've maintained the different levels and why we still have a commitment to increase the degree apprenticeship programme as well. But there is a recognition, I think, within large parts of the business community that they need to keep on investing in their apprenticeships too. The legal amount they have to pay and what they actually pay may well differ, and lots of our employees—. If you were at the Airbus event, you would have found that Airbus employees are really well looked after; they're a big company and you'd expect them to be so. That goes across the broader supply chain as well, and there's a need to do that, because all of those businesses recognise it's in their interests for those people to complete their apprenticeships, because there is a challenge about having enough labour, with the right skills, to meet the opportunities for those businesses. So, again, it's not a one-shot intervention, but I'd be more than happy, when I come back to not just you, but the committee as well, on what we're doing not just across the young person's guarantee, but what we're doing specifically on completion rates, to give you, if you like, a more granular understanding of why we believe completion rates have fallen back and what we'll then do about it.
Rydym wedi bod yn edrych ar weithio gyda nifer o bobl nad ydynt wedi cwblhau'r canlyniadau hynny, yn ogystal â'r darparwyr eu hunain, i ddeall y gwahanol resymau am hynny. Nawr, mae sefyllfaoedd ariannol pobl yn rhan o hynny, ond mae hefyd yn sgwrs, nid yn unig i'r unigolion hynny, ond i'r busnesau y maent yn gweithio ynddynt hefyd. Ac mae'n ymwneud â'r ystod o wahanol lwybrau tuag at gwblhau prentisiaeth. Daw rhai o’r heriau o fod pobl yn gwneud dewisiadau gwahanol ac o rai o’r heriau rydym yn dal i’w gweld yn cael effaith ar brentisiaid o ran iechyd meddwl a lles ar ôl y pandemig. Mae'n her sylweddol iawn, a dyna pam fy mod wedi cyhoeddi mwy o arian ar gyfer cymorth iechyd meddwl i'n prentisiaid—gwneuthum y cyhoeddiad hwnnw fis diwethaf—a'r hyn a wnawn ochr yn ochr â'r gwaith ehangach rydym yn ei wneud gyda'r warant i bobl ifanc.
Yr hyn rwy'n canolbwyntio arno yw nid yn unig cynyddu nifer y prentisiaid—ac rydych yn iawn i ganolbwyntio ar gyfraddau cwblhau; mae gennym gyfradd gwblhau well na thros y ffin o hyd, ac mae'n ymwneud â sicrhau ein bod yn parhau i wella hynny—ond mae a wnelo hefyd ag ansawdd y prentisiaethau. Gallem fod wedi dewis israddio lefel y prentisiaethau i geisio sicrhau niferoedd mwy; fe wnaethom ddewis peidio â gwneud hynny. Dyna pam ein bod wedi cynnal y lefelau gwahanol a pham fod gennym ymrwymiad o hyd i gynyddu'r rhaglen gradd-brentisiaethau hefyd. Ond credaf fod cydnabyddiaeth mewn rhannau helaeth o’r gymuned fusnes fod angen iddynt barhau i fuddsoddi yn eu prentisiaethau hefyd. Mae’n ddigon posibl y bydd gwahaniaeth rhwng y swm cyfreithiol y mae’n rhaid iddynt ei dalu a’r hyn y maent yn ei dalu mewn gwirionedd, ac mae llawer o’n cyflogeion—. Pe baech yn nigwyddiad Airbus, byddech wedi gweld bod gweithwyr Airbus yn cael gofal da iawn; maent yn gwmni mawr a byddech yn disgwyl hynny. Mae hynny’n wir ar draws y gadwyn gyflenwi ehangach hefyd, ac mae angen gwneud hynny, gan fod pob un o’r busnesau hynny’n cydnabod ei bod o fudd iddynt hwy i’r bobl hynny gwblhau eu prentisiaethau, gan fod her ynglŷn â chael digon o lafur, gyda’r sgiliau cywir, i'r busnesau hynny allu manteisio ar yr holl gyfleoedd. Felly, unwaith eto, nid ymyrraeth un ergyd yw hi, ond rwy'n fwy na pharod, pan ddof yn ôl nid yn unig atoch chi, ond at y pwyllgor hefyd, ar yr hyn rydym yn ei wneud nid yn unig ar draws y warant i bobl ifanc, ond yr hyn a wnawn yn benodol ar gyfraddau cwblhau, i roi dealltwriaeth fwy manwl i chi, os mynnwch, o pam y credwn fod cyfraddau cwblhau wedi gostwng a beth a wnawn ynglŷn â hynny wedyn.
We would welcome that clarity at committee. Of course, completion rates have dipped below Scotland's completion rates. The stats also show pretty clearly an increase in uncompleted apprenticeships as a result of apprentices seeking employment before the end of their course. You only have to sit around a table with students in colleges across Wales to know that they've either considered leaving education themselves or know somebody who has taken this step, and this accounts for approximately 15 per cent of all uncompleted apprenticeships in the latest stats. This is, surely, a clear indication of the impact of cost-of-living pressures on people undertaking apprenticeships, and it's not right that individuals seeking to improve their employment prospects through training are ultimately unable to do so due to financial constraints and subsequently are pushed into low-skill and low-wage work to make ends meet.
When we spoke to the National Society of Apprentices on this, they confirmed that the affordability, of course, is a key concern of its members at present. So, if we want to create a Welsh economy that is supported by a high-skill and high-wage workforce, then it is vital that all barriers to education are removed. So, to this end, what measures are the Welsh Government undertaking right now to support people in training to manage cost-of-living pressures, and will the Minister consider a living wage for apprenticeships as a means to an end?
Byddem yn croesawu’r eglurder hwnnw yn y pwyllgor. Wrth gwrs, mae cyfraddau cwblhau wedi gostwng yn is na chyfraddau cwblhau'r Alban. Mae'r ystadegau hefyd yn dangos cynnydd eithaf clir mewn prentisiaethau heb eu cwblhau o ganlyniad i brentisiaid yn chwilio am waith cyn diwedd eu cwrs. Nid oes ond angen ichi eistedd o gwmpas y bwrdd gyda myfyrwyr mewn colegau ledled Cymru i wybod eu bod naill ai wedi ystyried gadael addysg eu hunain neu’n adnabod rhywun sydd wedi gwneud hynny, ac mae hyn yn wir am oddeutu 15 y cant o’r holl brentisiaethau heb eu cwblhau yn yr ystadegau diweddaraf. Mae'n sicr yn arwydd clir o effaith pwysau costau byw ar bobl sy’n ymgymryd â phrentisiaethau, ac nid yw’n iawn fod unigolion sy’n ceisio gwella eu rhagolygon cyflogaeth drwy hyfforddiant yn methu gwneud hynny yn y pen draw oherwydd cyfyngiadau ariannol ac yn cael eu gwthio wedyn i mewn i waith sgiliau isel a chyflog isel i gael deupen llinyn ynghyd.
Pan siaradom â Chymdeithas Genedlaethol y Prentisiaid ynglŷn â hyn, gwnaethant gadarnhau bod fforddiadwyedd, wrth gwrs, yn bryder allweddol i’w haelodau ar hyn o bryd. Felly, os ydym am greu economi Gymreig wedi'i chynnal gan weithlu sgiliau uchel a chyflogau uchel, mae’n hollbwysig cael gwared ar bob rhwystr i addysg. Felly, i'r perwyl hwn, pa fesurau y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn eu rhoi ar waith ar hyn o bryd i gefnogi pobl dan hyfforddiant i ymdopi â phwysau costau byw, ac a wnaiff y Gweinidog ystyried cyflog byw ar gyfer prentisiaethau fel ffordd o gyrraedd y nod?
Well, we've invested £36 million of additional money to try to maintain the progress that we can make at the maximum level through this time, and that's a direct result of budget challenges. We have also taken some action to try to help to support people through a range of our training programmes. We've increased some of the allowances, for example, in parts of our young person's guarantee. The challenge in saying whether you can deliver a real living wage for apprenticeships as a required standard is actually not just about our competence, but about the budgets we have to do that, as well. You'll know, from going through what was a very difficult budget exercise, that I couldn't give you a guarantee that we could find the money to do that. It's why there has got to be a conversation with those businesses that are seeing apprenticeships come through their businesses. It's why we're looking more and more at the range of skills that people need through shared apprenticeships and what that means in terms of the routes to get that apprenticeship, how much time they can spend in work and the balance between that and being with a provider. So, I can't tell you in the here and now that there is a definitive answer and a definitive budget that can do what you would want to do and, indeed, what I think lots of Members in this place would want to do. I'm more than happy not just to write to the committee, but more than happy to sit down with him to go through some of those challenges and what we are actually doing to try to make that work.
Wel, rydym wedi buddsoddi £36 miliwn o arian ychwanegol i geisio cynnal y cynnydd y gallwn ei wneud ar y lefel uchaf bosibl drwy'r cyfnod hwn, ac mae hynny o ganlyniad uniongyrchol i heriau cyllidebol. Rydym hefyd wedi cymryd rhai camau i geisio helpu i gefnogi pobl drwy ystod o'n rhaglenni hyfforddi. Rydym wedi cynyddu rhai o'r lwfansau, er enghraifft, mewn rhannau o'n gwarant i bobl ifanc. Mae’r her o ddweud a allwch sicrhau cyflog byw gwirioneddol ar gyfer prentisiaethau fel safon ofynnol yn ymwneud nid yn unig â’n cymhwysedd, ond â’r cyllidebau sydd gennym i wneud hynny hefyd. Fe fyddwch yn gwybod, o fynd drwy’r hyn a oedd yn ymarfer cyllidebol anodd iawn, na allwn roi sicrwydd i chi y gallem ddod o hyd i’r arian i wneud hynny. Dyna pam fod yn rhaid cael sgwrs gyda'r busnesau hynny sy'n gweld prentisiaethau'n dod drwy eu busnesau. Dyna pam ein bod yn edrych fwyfwy ar yr ystod o sgiliau sydd eu hangen ar bobl drwy brentisiaethau a rennir a beth mae hynny'n ei olygu o ran y llwybrau i gael y brentisiaeth honno, faint o amser y gallant ei dreulio yn y gwaith a'r cydbwysedd rhwng hynny a bod gyda darparwr. Felly, ni allaf ddweud wrthych ar hyn o bryd fod yna ateb pendant a chyllideb derfynol a all wneud yr hyn y byddech am ei wneud, ac yn wir, yr hyn y credaf y byddai llawer o Aelodau yn y lle hwn am ei wneud. Rwy’n fwy na pharod nid yn unig i ysgrifennu at y pwyllgor, ond i fynd drwy rai o’r heriau hynny gydag ef a’r hyn rydym yn ei wneud i geisio gwneud i hynny weithio.
3. Pa gefnogaeth fydd Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei darparu ar gyfer gardd goffa mwyngloddio cenedlaethol Cymru a Glofa Universal yn Senghennydd? OQ59408
3. What support will the Welsh Government provide for the Welsh National and Universal Mining Memorial Garden in Senghenydd? OQ59408
Thank you, Hefin David, for that question. We recognise, of course, the significance of the Senghenydd memorial to families and communities affected by mining disasters throughout Wales. The Welsh Government is keen to work with others, including volunteers who run the site, to explore options for how it can be cared for in the future.
Diolch am eich cwestiwn, Hefin David. Wrth gwrs, rydym yn cydnabod arwyddocâd cofeb Senghennydd i deuluoedd a chymunedau yr effeithiwyd arnynt gan drychinebau glofaol ledled Cymru. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn awyddus i weithio gydag eraill, gan gynnwys gwirfoddolwyr sy'n rhedeg y safle, i archwilio opsiynau ar gyfer gofalu amdano yn y dyfodol.
We were very grateful for the First Minister's visit back in, I think, January time, when he came to see the garden and the need to upkeep it. He saw at first hand the local volunteers and the Aber Valley Heritage Group, and the work that they do in maintaining the garden. It's a community space that's run by volunteers, and the volunteers are not getting younger and it's an incredible challenge. We were really delighted that Cadw and Caerphilly County Borough Council agreed to consider ways to maintain the garden and to help. Caerphilly council have agreed—Councillor Jamie Pritchard, the deputy leader, has agreed—to provide immediate support for grounds maintenance, partly funded by the shared prosperity fund. Cadw have advised that their in-house masonry team, based at Caerphilly castle, can maintain the memorial garden stone walls but, due to a full works programme, cannot start until next year. I've had committee members expressing disappointment about that. I think Cadw can do more. So, would the Deputy Minister put pressure on Cadw to provide extra support with landscaping, in addition to stone masonry, and for it to begin this year, please?
Roeddem yn ddiolchgar iawn am ymweliad y Prif Weinidog yn ôl ym mis Ionawr, rwy'n credu, pan ddaeth i weld yr ardd a’r angen i’w chynnal. Gwelodd â'i lygaid ei hun y gwirfoddolwyr lleol a Grŵp Treftadaeth Cwm Aber, a'r gwaith a wnânt i gynnal a chadw'r ardd. Mae'n fan cymunedol sy'n cael ei redeg gan wirfoddolwyr, ac nid yw'r gwirfoddolwyr yn mynd yn iau ac mae'n her anferth. Roeddem wrth ein boddau fod Cadw a Chyngor Bwrdeistref Sirol Caerffili wedi cytuno i ystyried ffyrdd o gynnal yr ardd ac i helpu. Mae cyngor Caerffili wedi cytuno—mae’r Cynghorydd Jamie Pritchard, y dirprwy arweinydd, wedi cytuno—i ddarparu cymorth ar unwaith er mwyn cynnal a chadw'r tir, a ariennir yn rhannol gan y gronfa ffyniant gyffredin. Mae Cadw wedi dweud y gall eu tîm gwaith maen mewnol, sydd wedi’u lleoli yng nghastell Caerffili, gynnal a chadw waliau cerrig yr ardd goffa, ond oherwydd rhaglen waith lawn, ni allant ddechrau tan y flwyddyn nesaf. Mae rhai o aelodau’r pwyllgor wedi mynegi siom wrthyf ynglŷn â hynny. Credaf y gall Cadw wneud mwy. Felly, a wnaiff y Dirprwy Weinidog roi pwysau ar Cadw i ddarparu cymorth ychwanegol gyda thirlunio, yn ogystal â gwaith maen, ac i'r gwaith hwnnw ddechrau eleni, os gwelwch yn dda?
Thank you for that supplementary question. I think it would be remiss of me not to say, before I come to addressing that question, the significance of the Senghenydd memorial as a site of a memorial representing the worst mining disaster, not only in Wales but in the UK, and what that means to constituencies, like yours and mine, that are basically mining constituencies, and the communities that that industry shaped in those areas.
So, what I would say, in response to the points that you've raised today is I'd really welcome the opportunity to meet with yourself and others, along with officials from Cadw, at the memorial, to discuss these issues further, because, as you've already highlighted, Cadw have suggested that they've got in-house expertise that could certainly help with the maintenance. There are funding pressures—of course there are. The local authority's got funding pressures, we've got funding pressures, and we would like to make a commitment to be able to do more in the area, but I think the starting point would be for us to have that meeting with yourself, with the local authority, with volunteers, and see what the art of the possible actually is.
Diolch am eich cwestiwn atodol. Credaf y byddai’n esgeulus ohonof i beidio â sôn, cyn imi fynd i’r afael â’r cwestiwn hwnnw, am arwyddocâd cofeb Senghennydd fel safle cofeb sy’n cynrychioli’r trychineb mwyngloddio gwaethaf, nid yn unig yng Nghymru, ond yn y DU, a'r hyn y mae hynny'n ei olygu i etholaethau fel eich un chi a fy un i, sy'n etholaethau glofaol yn y bôn, a’r cymunedau a luniwyd gan y diwydiant hwnnw yn yr ardaloedd hynny.
Felly, yr hyn y byddwn yn ei ddweud mewn ymateb i'r pwyntiau rydych wedi'u codi heddiw, yw y byddwn yn sicr yn croesawu'r cyfle i gyfarfod â chi ac eraill, ynghyd â swyddogion Cadw, ger y gofeb, i drafod y materion hyn ymhellach, oherwydd, fel rydych eisoes wedi nodi, mae Cadw wedi awgrymu bod ganddynt arbenigedd mewnol a allai helpu gyda'r gwaith cynnal a chadw. Mae pwysau cyllidol—wrth gwrs. Mae pwysau cyllidol ar yr awdurdod lleol, mae pwysau cyllidol arnom ninnau, a hoffem wneud ymrwymiad i allu gwneud mwy yn hyn o beth, ond credaf mai’r man cychwyn fyddai inni gael y cyfarfod hwnnw gyda chi, gyda'r awdurdod lleol, gyda gwirfoddolwyr, a gweld beth yw celfyddyd yr hyn sy'n bosibl mewn gwirionedd.
Diolch i Hefin am godi'r cwestiwn yma.
Thank you to Hefin for bringing this question to the Chamber.
I'm pleased to hear that there is a commitment to supporting and that it's finally been provided to the volunteers at long last. Led by the chair of the Aber Valley Heritage Group, Lindsay Whittle, a councillor and former Member in this place for Plaid Cymru, this group has been asking for help with maintenance for the garden for some time now, and they're mostly made up, as Hefin said, of pensioners. This garden is a reminder of our industrial heritage and the immense sorrow and tragedy that is intertwined with that chapter in history as a nation. It is one of a number of historic sites that we could and should make the most of. It's a real shame that more is not made of places like the Chartists' cave in Blaenau Gwent or the Guardian of the Valleys in Six Bells that many people living in the region are not aware of, let alone potential international visitors. Has any thought gone into the creation of a heritage trail for south-east Wales in order to boost tourism and perhaps provide an opportunity for schoolteachers looking to bring history to life and celebrate our rich and fascinating history?
Rwy'n falch o glywed bod ymrwymiad i gefnogi a'i fod wedi'i roi i'r gwirfoddolwyr o'r diwedd. Dan arweiniad cadeirydd Grŵp Treftadaeth Cwm Aber, Lindsay Whittle, cynghorydd a chyn-Aelod Plaid Cymru yn y lle hwn, mae’r grŵp wedi bod yn gofyn am gymorth gyda'r gwaith o gynnal a chadw’r ardd ers peth amser bellach, ac mae'r rhan fwyaf ohonynt, fel y dywedodd Hefin, yn bensiynwyr. Mae’r ardd hon yn ein hatgoffa o’n treftadaeth ddiwydiannol a’r tristwch a’r drasiedi enfawr sydd ynghlwm wrth y bennod honno yn ein hanes fel cenedl. Mae’n un o nifer o safleoedd hanesyddol y gallem ac y dylem wneud y gorau ohonynt. Mae’n drueni mawr na wneir mwy o lefydd fel ogof y Siartwyr ym Mlaenau Gwent neu Warcheidwad y Cymoedd yn Six Bells, nad yw llawer o bobl sy’n byw yn y rhanbarth yn ymwybodol ohonynt, heb sôn am ddenu ymwelwyr rhyngwladol. A roddwyd unrhyw ystyriaeth i greu llwybr treftadaeth ar gyfer de-ddwyrain Cymru er mwyn hybu twristiaeth ac efallai i roi cyfle i athrawon ysgol sydd am ddod â hanes yn fyw a dathlu ein hanes cyfoethog a hynod ddiddorol?
I thank Peredur Owen Griffiths for that supplementary question. I think that's a very important point, and I have actually discussed this with Caerphilly council in relation to other trails. And it's not just Caerphilly council, but we have such a rich history and heritage across the whole of Wales that local authorities absolutely could be developing and doing more with in terms of their tourism offer and what they can sell, not only to their local residents, but to visitors coming in to the area. In fact, I've had a conversation with Wayne David, the MP, about how we could do more about attracting people to Caerphilly castle and whether we should be doing more about having language interpretation at Caerphilly castle that goes beyond English and Welsh. Because, of course, we see visitors from all over the world, and if you go to visitor sites and national sites of importance, like Caerphilly castle, in other parts of the world, you will see multilingual interpretation. So, those are the kinds of things that I think local authorities and Welsh Government, with Cadw and our heritage teams, can work on. And I'd certainly be happy to have further conversations with Caerphilly council about how they could work to develop that.
Diolch i Peredur Owen Griffiths am ei gwestiwn atodol. Credaf fod hwnnw'n bwynt pwysig iawn, ac mewn gwirionedd, rwyf wedi trafod hyn gyda chyngor Caerffili mewn perthynas â llwybrau eraill. Ac mae'n ymwneud â mwy na chyngor Caerffili yn unig, mae gennym hanes a threftadaeth mor gyfoethog ledled Cymru gyfan y gallai awdurdodau lleol fod yn ei ddatblygu ac yn gwneud mwy ag ef, yn sicr, o ran eu cynnig twristiaeth a'r hyn y gallant ei werthu, nid yn unig i'w trigolion lleol, ond i ymwelwyr a ddaw i'r ardal. A dweud y gwir, rwyf wedi cael sgwrs gyda Wayne David, yr AS, ynglŷn â sut y gallem wneud mwy i ddenu pobl i gastell Caerffili ac a ddylem fod yn gwneud mwy i ddarparu gwasanaethau dehongli yng nghastell Caerffili mewn ieithoedd heblaw'r Saesneg a’r Gymraeg. Oherwydd rydym yn cael ymwelwyr o bob rhan o'r byd, wrth gwrs, ac os ewch i safleoedd ymwelwyr a safleoedd o bwysigrwydd cenedlaethol, fel castell Caerffili, mewn rhannau eraill o'r byd, fe welwch wasanaethau dehongli amlieithog. Felly, dyna'r mathau o bethau y credaf y gall awdurdodau lleol a Llywodraeth Cymru, gyda Cadw a'n timau treftadaeth, weithio arnynt. A byddwn yn sicr yn fwy na pharod i gael sgyrsiau pellach gyda chyngor Caerffili ynglŷn â sut y gallent weithio i ddatblygu hynny.
4. Sut mae Llywodraeth Cymru'n hyrwyddo'r sector twristiaeth yng Ngorllewin Caerfyrddin a De Sir Benfro? OQ59383
4. How is the Welsh Government promoting the tourism sector in Carmarthen West and South Pembrokeshire? OQ59383
I thank Sam Kurtz for that question. The region features prominently throughout the year in Visit Wales marketing activities, and also benefits from financial support for high-profile events, such as Ironman Pembrokeshire. And major capital investment schemes have also supported developments at Pendine and Saundersfoot.
Diolch i Sam Kurtz am ei gwestiwn. Mae’r rhanbarth yn cael sylw amlwg drwy gydol y flwyddyn yng ngweithgarwch marchnata Croeso Cymru, ac mae hefyd yn elwa o gymorth ariannol ar gyfer digwyddiadau proffil uchel, fel Ironman Sir Benfro. Ac mae cynlluniau buddsoddi cyfalaf sylweddol hefyd wedi cefnogi datblygiadau ym Mhentywyn a Saundersfoot.
Thank you very much, Deputy Minister. The county of Pembrokeshire gets its name, of course, from the town of Pembroke in my constituency, and it has its fantastic Pembroke castle there, birthplace of Henry Tudor, the Welshman who would be King, and the Pembroke wars. And I was delighted to join councillors Jonathan Grimes and Aaron Carey in visiting the South Quay development, just a couple of doors down from Pembroke castle. And while there is investment in this, which is welcomed by the community of Pembroke and the wider south Pembrokeshire community, there's a little concern as to what that end product may well be. But they are delighted that these derelict historic buildings are coming back into life. But Pembroke is a fantastic example of a traditional medieval town. So, how is the Welsh Government using its powers, through Visit Wales and through every other means it has, to promote the fantastic historical assets that we have that are unique to Wales and unique to my part of the world in Carmarthen West and South Pembrokeshire?
Diolch yn fawr iawn, Ddirprwy Weinidog. Mae sir Benfro yn cael ei henw, wrth gwrs, o dref Penfro yn fy etholaeth, lle mae castell gwych Penfro, man geni Harri Tudur, y Cymro a fyddai’n Frenin, a rhyfeloedd Penfro. Ac roeddwn yn falch iawn o ymuno â’r cynghorwyr Jonathan Grimes ac Aaron Carey i ymweld â datblygiad Cei’r De, ychydig ddrysau i lawr o gastell Penfro. Ac er bod buddsoddiad ynddo, sy'n cael ei groesawu gan gymuned Penfro a chymuned ehangach de sir Benfro, ceir rhywfaint o bryder ynglŷn â beth y gallai'r cynnyrch terfynol hwnnw fod. Ond maent wrth eu boddau fod yr adeiladau hanesyddol adfeiliedig hyn yn cael eu hatgyfodi. Ond mae Penfro yn enghraifft wych o dref ganoloesol draddodiadol. Felly, sut mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn defnyddio ei phwerau, drwy Croeso Cymru a thrwy bob dull arall sydd ar gael iddi, i hyrwyddo’r asedau hanesyddol gwych sydd gennym sy’n unigryw i Gymru ac yn unigryw i fy rhan i o’r byd yng Ngorllewin Caerfyrddin a De Sir Benfro?
And I spent many a happy hour, Sam, in Pembrokeshire when I was a young, fresh-faced Unison officer at the time, and the whole county of Dyfed was my patch, and I used to go round with the nickname of 'the officer for seaside resorts' because I spent so much time in places like Pembrokeshire. It is absolutely a beautiful part of the world, and I'm very proud to see the investment that we have put in to a number of capital projects in the area. One of the things we're trying to do in our tourism strategy is to look at the three 'S's, so that we don't just see people piling into an area in the six weeks of summer. So, we look at seasonality, we look at spend, we look at spread. We look at having campaigns to bring people into Wales at any time of the year, and there are different offers at any time of the year. You've mentioned Pembroke castle and Henry Tudor; as a child growing up, the Tudor era was an absolute fascination for me, an absolute fascination, and that fascination was brought to me by the museum coming into my school with Tudor outfits, and they let us put Tudor outfits on. I've had this lifelong love of history ever since, and when we've got such significant monuments, castles, whatever it might be, that tell the history of our nation—some of it contested, I accept, but nevertheless history that we can be proud of, and that we can sell, and we can make part of our tourist offer and our tourist destination—. You will find all of that in our Visit Wales strategy around how we draw people in.
If there are particular projects within your area that you'd like me to have a look at I'd be happy to meet with you, Sam, and with the local authority to discuss that. But, absolutely, I think we probably are on the same page around what we want to do in areas like Pembrokeshire.
Ac fe dreuliais sawl awr hapus, Sam, yn sir Benfro pan oeddwn yn swyddog Unsain ifanc, diniwed ar y pryd, a sir Dyfed oedd fy ardal i, ac roeddwn yn arfer mynd o gwmpas gyda'r llysenw 'y swyddog dros gyrchfannau glan môr' am fy mod yn treulio cymaint o amser mewn llefydd fel sir Benfro. Mae'n rhan hynod brydferth o'r byd, ac rwy'n falch iawn o weld y buddsoddiad rydym wedi'i wneud mewn nifer o brosiectau cyfalaf yn yr ardal. Un o'r pethau rydym yn ceisio'i wneud yn ein strategaeth dwristiaeth yw edrych ar dair elfen, fel nad ydym yn gweld pobl yn pentyrru i ardal yn ystod chwe wythnos yr haf yn unig. Felly, rydym yn edrych ar natur dymhorol twristiaeth, rydym yn edrych ar wariant, rydym yn edrych ar ledaeniad. Rydym yn edrych ar gynnal ymgyrchoedd i ddenu pobl i Gymru ar unrhyw adeg o'r flwyddyn, ac mae cynigion gwahanol ar unrhyw adeg o'r flwyddyn. Rydych chi wedi sôn am gastell Penfro a Harri Tudur; fel plentyn yn tyfu i fyny, roedd oes y Tuduriaid yn hynod ddiddorol i mi, yn hynod ddiddorol, a thaniwyd y diddordeb hwnnw ynof pan ddaeth yr amgueddfa i fy ysgol gyda gwisgoedd Tuduraidd, ac fe wnaethant adael i ni wisgo'r gwisgoedd Tuduraidd. Rwyf wedi bod wrth fy modd gyda hanes byth ers hynny, a phan fo gennym henebion mor arwyddocaol, cestyll, beth bynnag, sy'n adrodd hanes ein cenedl—ac rwy'n derbyn bod dadlau ynghylch rhai agweddau arno, ond er hynny mae'n hanes y gallwn fod yn falch ohono, ac y gallwn ei werthu, a gallwn ei ymgorffori yn ein cynnig i dwristiaid a'n cyrchfannau i dwristiaid—. Fe welwch chi hynny i gyd yn ein strategaeth Croeso Cymru o ran sut rydym yn denu pobl i Gymru.
Os oes yna brosiectau penodol yn eich ardal chi y byddech yn hoffi i mi gael golwg arnynt, fe fyddwn yn hapus i gyfarfod â chi, Sam, a chyda'r awdurdod lleol i drafod hynny. Ond yn bendant, rwy'n credu ein bod yn cytuno ynglŷn â'r hyn rydym eisiau ei wneud mewn ardaloedd fel sir Benfro.
5. Pa asesiad mae'r Gweinidog wedi ei wneud o effaith Ystâd y Goron ar economi Cymru? OQ59409
5. What assessment has the Minister made of the impact of the Crown Estate on the Welsh economy? OQ59409
We believe the benefits from the Crown Estate would be greater for Wales if the Crown Estate were devolved. Whilst we seek devolution, we continue to work with the Crown Estate to ensure that we maximise the current opportunities for the Welsh economy.
Rydym yn credu y byddai'r buddion o Ystad y Goron yn fwy i Gymru pe bai Ystad y Goron wedi'i datganoli. Er ein bod am ei gweld wedi'i datganoli, rydym yn parhau i weithio gydag Ystâd y Goron i sicrhau ein bod yn manteisio i'r eithaf ar y cyfleoedd presennol i economi Cymru.
Diolch i'r Gweinidog am yr ateb.
I thank the Minister for that response.
With significant generation opportunities along the Welsh coastline in both marine renewables and offshore wind, Wales has real potential to gain first-mover advantage and become a world leader both in the manufacture of components and in exporting skills and expertise into a growing global market. To ensure that the benefits are retained in Wales, we will need to develop robust local supply chains that allow for the manufacture and assembly of floating offshore wind components here in Wales. So, what steps are the Welsh Government taking to ensure that the Crown Estate mandates strict supply chain requirements for developers? And will they work with the Crown Estate to develop a mechanism to hold developers to account on these commitments?
Gyda chyfleoedd ar gyfer cynhyrchiant sylweddol ar hyd arfordir Cymru mewn ynni adnewyddadwy morol ac ynni gwynt ar y môr, mae gan Gymru botensial gwirioneddol i sicrhau mantais o'r cychwyn cyntaf a dod yn arweinydd byd-eang mewn perthynas â gweithgynhyrchu cydrannau ac allforio sgiliau ac arbenigedd i farchnad fyd-eang sy'n tyfu. Er mwyn sicrhau bod y buddion yn cael eu cadw yng Nghymru, bydd angen inni ddatblygu cadwyni cyflenwi lleol cadarn sy'n caniatáu cynhyrchu a chydosod cydrannau gwynt arnofiol ar y môr yma yng Nghymru. Felly, pa gamau y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn eu cymryd i sicrhau bod Ystad y Goron yn mandadu gofynion cadwyni cyflenwi llym ar gyfer datblygwyr? Ac a fyddant yn gweithio gydag Ystad y Goron i ddatblygu mecanwaith i ddwyn datblygwyr i gyfrif mewn perthynas â'r ymrwymiadau hyn?
It's exactly what—. What the Member is calling for is exactly what myself and the Minister for Climate Change have called for, not just publicly on repeated occasions, but also in our direct engagement with the Crown Estate. Because all those opportunities, right across our sea bed—. In north Wales there are significant opportunities, as well as south-west Wales, before competing free-port bid supporters start jumping up and down over their particular part of the country; it's a genuine national opportunity. And I have always said this isn't just about the opportunity to deliver and develop power on a renewable basis—it is the jobs that come from that. Not just the maintenance work and the end construction work, but actually the major construction work, the manufacturing side work that takes place much earlier and higher up in the value chain. That is exactly what we are keen to capture, as well as, then, the potential opportunities that do come from having a predictable power supply that comes in. It's why we have continued, on a different point, to talk about the requirement to reform the way that the National Grid works, so those opportunities really can be taken advantage of. But we will continue to call, in our meetings and in public, for exactly that: a proper supply chain requirement for bids when the bids are provided, and then to make sure that people live up to those bids—so, the contract management of those bids, in live action, and not just writing a good bid that may then not bear any relationship to what has happened. So, on that point, there is no disagreement and we will continue to make that case as robustly as possible.
Dyna'n union—. Yr hyn y mae'r Aelod yn galw amdano yw'r union beth rwyf fi a'r Gweinidog Newid Hinsawdd wedi galw amdano, nid yn unig yn gyhoeddus ar sawl achlysur, ond hefyd yn ein hymgysylltiad uniongyrchol ag Ystad y Goron. Oherwydd mae'r holl gyfleoedd hynny, ar draws gwely'r môr—. Yng ngogledd Cymru, mae yna gyfleoedd sylweddol, yn ogystal â'r de-orllewin, cyn i'r rhai sy'n cefnogi ceisiadau sy'n cystadlu am borthladd rhydd ddechrau neidio i fyny ac i lawr dros eu rhan benodol hwy o'r wlad; mae'n gyfle cenedlaethol go iawn. Ac rwyf bob amser wedi dweud nad yw hyn yn ymwneud yn unig â'r cyfle i gyflawni a datblygu pŵer ar sail adnewyddadwy—mae'n ymwneud hefyd â'r swyddi sy'n deillio o hynny. Nid yn unig y gwaith cynnal a chadw a'r gwaith adeiladu terfynol, ond yr holl waith adeiladu mawr, y gwaith gweithgynhyrchu sy'n digwydd ochr yn ochr yn llawer cynt ac yn uwch i fyny yn y gadwyn werth. Dyna'n union rydym yn awyddus i'w sicrhau, yn ogystal â'r cyfleoedd posibl sydd wedyn yn deillio o gael cyflenwad pŵer rhagweladwy. Dyna pam ein bod wedi parhau, ar bwynt gwahanol, i siarad am y gofyniad i ddiwygio'r ffordd y mae'r Grid Cenedlaethol yn gweithio, fel y gellir manteisio o ddifrif ar y cyfleoedd hynny. Ond byddwn yn parhau i alw, yn ein cyfarfodydd ac yn gyhoeddus, am yn union hynny: gofyniad cadwyn gyflenwi priodol ar gyfer ceisiadau pan ddarperir y ceisiadau hynny, a sicrhau bod pobl yn cyflawni'r hyn a nodwyd yn y ceisiadau hynny—felly, rheoli cytundebau'r ceisiadau hynny, yn fyw, yn hytrach na dim ond ysgrifennu cais da na fydd yn debyg o gwbl i'r hyn a fydd yn digwydd. Felly, ar y pwynt hwnnw, nid oes unrhyw anghytundeb a byddwn yn parhau i hyrwyddo hynny mor gadarn â phosibl.
In January, the Crown Estate sealed landmark agreements for offshore wind energy to power 7 million homes. One of the six offshore wind projects is in north Wales. The agreement saw the culmination of the Crown Estate's offshore wind leasing round 4, adding further strength to the offshore wind sector's track record in leading the UK's net-zero energy transition. Now, having met with an official, I know that their focus is on delivery, and they have a track record of successfully leasing sea bed, to the point that the UK is now the second most successful market in the world. Thanks in part, of course, to the Crown Estate, Wales is now on the cusp of being global leaders in the sector. Surely, rather than put that at risk by causing uncertainty through devolution, do you agree with the Minister for Climate Change that we should continue to work with the Crown Estate, including to maximise the employment opportunities across this very important supply chain?
Ym mis Ionawr, seliodd Ystad y Goron gytundebau nodedig ar gyfer ynni gwynt ar y môr i bweru 7 miliwn o gartrefi. Mae un o'r chwe phrosiect gwynt ar y môr wedi'i leoli yng ngogledd Cymru. Yn sgil y cytundeb daeth rownd 4 o brydles gwynt ar y môr Ystad y Goron i ben, gan ychwanegu cryfder pellach i gyflawniad y sector gwynt ar y môr yn arwain trawsnewidiad y DU i ynni sero net. Nawr, ar ôl cyfarfod â swyddog, gwn fod eu ffocws ar gyflawni, ac mae ganddynt hanes o lesio gwely'r môr yn llwyddiannus, i'r graddau fod y DU bellach yn ail farchnad fwyaf llwyddiannus y byd erbyn hyn. Diolch yn rhannol, wrth gwrs, i Ystad y Goron, mae Cymru bellach ar fin dod yn arweinydd byd-eang yn y sector. Yn hytrach na pheryglu hynny drwy achosi ansicrwydd drwy ddatganoli, onid ydych yn cytuno gyda'r Gweinidog Newid Hinsawdd y dylem barhau i weithio gydag Ystad y Goron, gan gynnwys manteisio i'r eithaf ar y cyfleoedd cyflogaeth ar draws y gadwyn gyflenwi bwysig iawn hon?
I don't think calling for devolution of the Crown Estate takes away from the economic opportunities or puts them in any way at risk at all. Of course, the Crown Estate is devolved in Scotland. I think we can learn from what Scotland has done, and I'm optimistic that we can do an even better job on delivering greater economic benefit. That's certainly my ambition: to do the best possible to deliver the maximum economic benefit.
It is, of course, good news that the Crown Estate have given a greater indication of future supply, including the really significant 1.5 GW Mona project off the north Wales coast. But the climate change Minister and what I am saying today, they're absolutely consistent. We will, of course, continue to work with the Crown Estate to maximise the economic benefit and value to Wales from development in the Crown Estate off our sea bed, and we will continue at the same time to call for greater devolution. I don't see that there's any conflict in that at all, and I can tell you, in the industry's point of view, they don't have any problem with it either.
Nid wyf yn credu bod galw am ddatganoli Ystad y Goron yn tynnu oddi ar y cyfleoedd economaidd hynny nac yn eu rhoi mewn unrhyw berygl o gwbl. Wrth gwrs, mae Ystad y Goron wedi'i datganoli yn yr Alban. Rwy'n credu y gallwn ddysgu o'r hyn y mae'r Alban wedi'i wneud, ac rwy'n obeithiol y gallwn wneud gwaith gwell fyth ar ddarparu mwy o fudd economaidd. Yn sicr, dyna yw fy uchelgais: gwneud y gorau sy'n bosibl er mwyn cyflawni'r budd economaidd mwyaf.
Mae'n newyddion da wrth gwrs fod Ystad y Goron wedi rhoi mwy o arwydd o'r cyflenwad yn y dyfodol, gan gynnwys y prosiect 1.5 GW Mona hynod arwyddocaol oddi ar arfordir gogledd Cymru. Ond mae'r hyn rwyf fi a'r Gweinidog newid hinsawdd yn ei ddweud heddiw yn gwbl gyson. Wrth gwrs y byddwn yn parhau i weithio gydag Ystad y Goron i fanteisio i'r eithaf ar y budd economaidd a'r gwerth i Gymru o ddatblygiadau Ystad y Goron i wely'r môr yng Nghymru, a byddwn yn parhau ar yr un pryd i alw am fwy o ddatganoli. Nid wyf yn gweld bod unrhyw anghysondeb o gwbl yn hynny, a gallaf ddweud wrthych, o safbwynt y diwydiant, nad oes ganddynt hwy unrhyw broblem gyda hynny chwaith.
6. Pa asesiad mae'r Gweinidog wedi'i wneud o'r effaith y bydd taliadau defnyddwyr ffyrdd yn ei chael ar yr economi? OQ59394
6. What assessment has the Minister made of the impact that road-user charges will have on the economy? OQ59394
Thank you for the question, which I note is similar to the ones asked by Paul Davies. In line with 'Llwybr Newydd: The Wales Transport Strategy' and our transport delivery plan, we will consider supporting fair and equitable road-user charging systems that deliver benefits for our society, environment and economy.
Diolch am y cwestiwn, a nodaf ei fod yn debyg i'r cwestiynau a ofynnwyd gan Paul Davies. Yn unol â 'Llwybr Newydd: Strategaeth Drafnidiaeth Cymru' a'n cynllun cyflawni ar gyfer trafnidiaeth, byddwn yn ystyried cefnogi systemau taliadau teg a chytbwys ar gyfer defnyddwyr ffyrdd sy'n sicrhau manteision i'n cymdeithas, ein hamgylchedd a'n heconomi.
Great, thank you so much, Minister. Last week, your Labour colleagues in Cardiff Council unveiled plans to impose a congestion charge in the city. This comes just weeks after your Government's anti-driver brainwave to start charging people for driving along the M4 and A470 was revealed. Needless to say, plans for road-user charges have gone down like a lead balloon with many residents for a range of reasons, and one in particular is the extra cost that it will inflict on residents who are already under immense pressure with the cost of living.
Squeezing more cash out of people will mean they have less money in their back pockets to spend in shops, cafes and restaurants, all of which play a pivotal role in the economy. One resident expressed their serious concerns to me that they fear that road charges will completely kill off our city centres and push people to out-of-town retail parks. Public transport is so bad in Wales that, often, driving is, in fact, the only option. So, Minister do you share my concerns, and the concerns of countless others, that these proposals, especially in the current climate, could have a seriously damaging impact not just on residents' finances, but also on our hard-working businesses? Will you call on your colleagues in the Welsh Government and Cardiff Council to have a serious rethink about these plans?
Gwych, diolch yn fawr, Weinidog. Yr wythnos diwethaf, fe wnaeth eich cyd-aelodau Llafur yng Nghyngor Caerdydd ddatgelu cynlluniau i osod tâl atal tagfeydd yn y ddinas. Daw hyn wythnosau'n unig ar ôl datgelu syniad gwrth-yrwyr eich Llywodraeth i ddechrau codi tâl ar bobl am yrru ar hyd yr M4 a'r A470. Afraid dweud, mae llawer o drigolion yn anhapus iawn ynglŷn â'r cynlluniau ar gyfer taliadau defnyddwyr ffyrdd am nifer o resymau, ac un rheswm yn benodol yw'r gost ychwanegol y bydd yn ei gosod ar drigolion sydd eisoes dan bwysau aruthrol gyda chostau byw.
Bydd gwasgu mwy o arian allan o bobl yn golygu bod ganddynt lai o arian yn eu pocedi i'w wario mewn siopau, caffis a bwytai, ac mae pob un o'r rheini'n chwarae rhan ganolog yn yr economi. Mynegodd un preswylydd wrthyf eu bod yn ofni'n fawr y bydd taliadau ffyrdd yn lladd canol ein trefi ac yn gwthio pobl i barciau manwerthu y tu allan i'r dref. Mae trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus mor wael yng Nghymru, a gyrru, yn aml, yw'r unig opsiwn mewn gwirionedd. Felly, Weinidog, a ydych yn rhannu fy mhryderon, a phryderon nifer fawr o bobl eraill, y gallai'r cynigion hyn, yn enwedig yn yr hinsawdd bresennol, gael effaith niweidiol ddifrifol, nid yn unig ar gyllid trigolion, ond hefyd ar ein busnesau gweithgar? A wnewch chi alw ar eich cyd-aelodau yn Llywodraeth Cymru a Chyngor Caerdydd i ailfeddwl o ddifrif am y cynlluniau hyn?
Well, of course, the Member will have heard about the public health cost from congestion. It's an issue in my constituency; it's an issue in other parts of Wales as well. I think it's odd to say on the one hand you're in favour of a clean air Act, but then to demand that congestion continues with no effective response to it.
As well as the public health cost, there's an economic cost to congestion. You will no doubt have noted—I'm sure you haven't just read the headlines—that, in the report provided by Cardiff Council, in the external evidence there was a cost of £109 million in 2019—the economic cost of congestion within the city. There's a need to do something about congestion within a range of the towns and cities that we live in. Cardiff Council is looking at proposals and they're looking to consult on proposals that may include road-user charging, and that's right thing to do. We'll then have a properly defined proposal that the council may want to take forward. There'll then be a further conversation with the Welsh Government.
I also think it's worth reminding ourselves that the economy in other parts of the world and other parts of Britain has not ended when there has been an element of road-user charging. As you may have heard, someone called Boris Johnson was the Mayor of London and he didn’t end road-user charging when he was the mayor. It didn’t end the economy in London and there are now definable and understood public health benefits, and public transport works even more effectively. So, there’s a challenge in understanding the sorts of steps we’re prepared to take, in understanding what the impact on the economy will be, understanding what the impact on wider society will be, and public health, and that’s a conversation we look forward to having with Cardiff Council. They’re doing the right thing in having a consultation, being very clear that what they are looking to do is to improve public transport first, to make a real difference for citizens in the city and those who commute in and out of the city for societal and indeed economic purposes.
Wel, wrth gwrs, bydd yr Aelod wedi clywed am y gost i iechyd y cyhoedd o ganlyniad i dagfeydd. Mae'n broblem yn fy etholaeth i; mae'n broblem mewn rhannau eraill o Gymru hefyd. Rwy'n credu ei bod yn od dweud ar y naill law eich bod o blaid Deddf aer glân, ac ar y llaw arall eich bod yn mynnu bod tagfeydd yn parhau heb unrhyw ymateb effeithiol iddynt.
Yn ogystal â'r gost i iechyd y cyhoedd, mae yna gost economaidd i dagfeydd. Diau eich bod wedi nodi—rwy'n siŵr nad y penawdau'n unig a ddarllenoch chi—yn yr adroddiad a ddarparwyd gan Gyngor Caerdydd, yn y dystiolaeth allanol, fod yna gost o £109 miliwn yn 2019—cost economaidd tagfeydd yn y ddinas. Mae angen gwneud rhywbeth am dagfeydd yn nifer o'r trefi a'r dinasoedd rydym yn byw ynddynt. Mae Cyngor Caerdydd yn edrych ar gynigion ac maent yn ystyried ymgynghori ar gynigion a allai gynnwys codi tâl ar ddefnyddwyr ffyrdd, ac mae hynny'n beth iawn i'w wneud. Yna bydd gennym gynnig wedi'i ddiffinio'n iawn y gallai'r cyngor fod eisiau ei ddatblygu. Yna, bydd yna sgwrs bellach gyda Llywodraeth Cymru.
Rwyf hefyd yn credu ei bod hi'n werth atgoffa ein hunain nad yw'r economi mewn rhannau eraill o'r byd a rhannau eraill o Brydain wedi dod i ben ar ôl cyflwyno elfen o godi tâl ar ddefnyddwyr ffyrdd. Fel y clywsoch chi, efallai, roedd rhywun o'r enw Boris Johnson yn Faer Llundain ac ni ddaeth â thaliadau defnyddwyr ffyrdd i ben pan oedd yn faer. Ni ddaeth economi Llundain i ben o'i herwydd ac erbyn hyn mae manteision diffiniadwy a dealledig i iechyd y cyhoedd, ac mae trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus yn gweithio'n fwy effeithiol byth. Felly, mae yna her o ran deall y math o gamau rydym yn barod i'w cymryd, deall beth fydd yr effaith ar yr economi, deall beth fydd yr effaith ar y gymdeithas ehangach, ac iechyd y cyhoedd, ac mae honno'n sgwrs rydym yn edrych ymlaen at ei chael gyda Chyngor Caerdydd. Maent yn gwneud y peth cywir drwy gael ymgynghoriad, a thrwy fod yn glir iawn mai'r hyn y maent yn ceisio ei wneud yw gwella trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus yn gyntaf, i wneud gwahaniaeth gwirioneddol i ddinasyddion yn y ddinas a'r rhai sy'n cymudo i mewn ac allan o'r ddinas at ddibenion cymdeithasol, ac economaidd yn wir.
7. Pa asesiad mae'r Gweinidog wedi ei wneud o briodoldeb hysbysebu a noddi gamblo ym myd chwaraeon Cymru? OQ59387
7. What assessment has the Minister made of the appropriateness of gambling advertising and sponsorship in Welsh sport? OQ59387
I thank Huw Irranca-Davies for that question. Gambling industry sponsorship in sport, of course, is a matter for the UK Government. During the UK Government’s review of the Gambling Act 2005, we had strongly advocated for a strengthening of the legislative framework, robust restrictions on gambling advertising as well as greater protections for those vulnerable people to gambling-related harm.
Diolch i Huw Irranca-Davies am y cwestiwn hwnnw. Mater i Lywodraeth y DU yw nawdd y diwydiant gamblo ym myd chwaraeon wrth gwrs. Yn ystod adolygiad Llywodraeth y DU o Ddeddf Gamblo 2005, roeddem wedi dadlau'n gryf dros gryfhau'r fframwaith deddfwriaethol, sicrhau cyfyngiadau cadarn ar hysbysebion gamblo yn ogystal â sicrhau mwy o amddiffyniadau rhag niwed sy'n gysylltiedig â gamblo ar gyfer pobl fregus.
That’s good to hear. Look, I’m not a puritan. I’ve had a flutter occasionally myself, most recently 10 quid on Wales to beat France in the six nations in March. It didn’t end well. [Laughter.]
But, increasingly, gambling nowadays is much easier to access, it’s more attractive, it’s more addictive to play—especially online—and reports have shown a lack of diligence by operators, affordability checks being bypassed, and the already too-high limits on bets being circumvented or even ignored, as we’ve seen in recent reports and even fines.
And we know that gambling is not victimless: Citizens Advice has warned the Digital, Culture, Media and Sport Committee in Westminster of a toxic cycle between online gambling and growing financial vulnerability, and more than a third of Citizens Advice advisers say they’re aware of people gambling to improve their financial situation. And we know from public health figures across the UK that several hundreds of people take their lives each year due to gambling debts, and the repercussions are felt right across their families and communities too.
So, can I ask: in terms of football in particular, because football players are icons of sport in Wales, Premier League have said—and you’re right, this falls to the UK Government—that the shirt sponsorship will end by the end of 2025-26, but banner advertising may continue; what can we do here in Wales in your engagement not just with football clubs at all levels, but all sport, to try and work with them to end this unhealthy relationship, this addiction to gambling sponsorship within Wales and across the UK?
Mae hynny'n dda i'w glywed. Edrychwch, nid wyf yn biwritan. Rwyf wedi cael ambell fet fach fy hun, yn fwyaf diweddar 10 punt ar Gymru i guro Ffrainc yn y chwe gwlad ym mis Mawrth. Ni ddaeth unrhyw ddaioni ohoni. [Chwerthin.]
Ond mae'n mynd yn fwyfwy hawdd gamblo y dyddiau hyn, mae'n fwy deniadol, mae'n fwy caethiwus i'w chwarae—yn enwedig ar-lein—ac mae adroddiadau wedi dangos diffyg diwydrwydd gan weithredwyr, gwiriadau fforddiadwyedd yn cael eu hosgoi, a bod y terfynau ar fetiau, sydd eisoes yn rhy uchel, yn cael eu hosgoi neu eu hanwybyddu hyd yn oed, fel y gwelsom mewn adroddiadau diweddar, a dirwyon hyd yn oed.
Ac rydym yn gwybod fod pobl yn dioddef yn sgil gamblo: mae Cyngor ar Bopeth wedi rhybuddio'r Pwyllgor Technoleg Ddigidol, Diwylliant, y Cyfryngau a Chwaraeon yn San Steffan am gylch gwenwynig rhwng gamblo ar-lein a bregusrwydd ariannol cynyddol, ac mae mwy na thraean o gynghorwyr Cyngor ar Bopeth yn dweud eu bod yn ymwybodol o bobl yn gamblo i wella eu sefyllfa ariannol. Ac fe wyddom o ffigurau iechyd cyhoeddus ledled y DU fod cannoedd o bobl yn cyflawni hunanladdiad bob blwyddyn oherwydd dyledion gamblo, ac mae eu teuluoedd a'u cymunedau hefyd yn dioddef y sgil-effeithiau.
Felly, a gaf fi ofyn: ynghylch pêl-droed yn enwedig, oherwydd mae chwaraewyr pêl-droed yn eiconau chwaraeon yng Nghymru, mae'r Uwch Gynghrair wedi dweud—ac rydych yn iawn, mater i Lywodraeth y DU yw hwn—y bydd y noddi crysau'n dod i ben erbyn diwedd 2025-26, ond gall yr hysbysebion baner barhau; beth allwn ni ei wneud yma yng Nghymru o ran eich ymgysylltiad, nid yn unig â chlybiau pêl-droed ar bob lefel, ond pob camp, i geisio gweithio gyda hwy i roi diwedd ar y berthynas afiach hon, y caethiwed hwn i nawdd gamblo yng Nghymru ac ar draws y DU?
I think Huw Irranca-Davies makes some very important points there, and of course gambling and the impact of gambling goes across many ministerial portfolios. My colleague here, the Deputy Minister, will be looking at it within her portfolio as well. The impact on society of sports gambling advertising and sponsorship is an area that we are strongly encouraging the UK Government to address and strengthen as a matter of urgency as part of their review of the Gambling Act 2005, which I think we’re going to see probably by the end of this week. It will be published by the end of this week.
And as you quite rightly pointed out, we know that children and younger adults are more likely to gamble online and therefore they’re most likely to be exposed to the online advertising to gamble. So, exposure to advertising is therefore key in determining the sort of relationship that our future generations have with gambling. But, as colleagues will know, I’m a huge football fan, and I’ve seen myself first-hand how football in particular has become inextricably linked with gambling sponsorship, because gambling operators can offer huge amounts of money to football clubs in sponsorship compared to any other companies that offer sponsorship, and I’m aware that campaigners for gambling reform are advocating for a ban on all sports advertising sponsorship, and, like you, I’m aware that the Premier League clubs have collectively agreed to withdraw gambling sponsorship from the front of their match-day shirts by the end of the 2026 season, and, although that is of course a welcome step, from my point of view, I would be urging all football clubs to do this, not just Premier League clubs, but all the league in Wales clubs as well, and do it more rapidly, and particularly for their child, junior and youth football kits. There's no reason for those advertisements to be on their clothing as well. So, I would encourage also the removal of gambling sponsorship from all other parts of sports kits, from banner advertising, and suggest that sports clubs do look closely at the wider impact that gambling advertising has on their sport.
Rwy'n credu bod Huw Irranca-Davies yn gwneud pwyntiau pwysig iawn, ac wrth gwrs mae gamblo ac effaith gamblo yn cyffwrdd â llawer o bortffolios gweinidogol. Bydd fy nghyd-Aelod yma, y Dirprwy Weinidog, yn edrych arno o fewn ei phortffolio hithau hefyd. Mae effaith nawdd a hysbysebu gamblo chwaraeon ar gymdeithas yn faes rydym yn annog Llywodraeth y DU yn gryf i fynd i'r afael ag ef a'i gryfhau ar frys fel rhan o'u hadolygiad o Ddeddf Gamblo 2005 yr ydym yn debygol o'i weld, rwy'n credu, erbyn diwedd yr wythnos hon. Bydd yn cael ei gyhoeddi erbyn diwedd yr wythnos hon.
Ac fel y nodoch chi'n gwbl briodol, rydym yn gwybod bod plant ac oedolion iau yn fwy tebygol o gamblo ar-lein ac felly hwy sydd fwyaf tebygol o fod yn agored i hysbysebion gamblo a welir ar-lein. Mae amlygrwydd hysbysebion yn allweddol felly i bennu'r math o berthynas sydd gan genedlaethau'r dyfodol gyda gamblo. Ond fel y bydd cyd-Aelodau'n gwybod, rwy'n gefnogwr pêl-droed enfawr, ac rwyf wedi gweld fy hun sut mae pêl-droed yn enwedig wedi'i gysylltu'n agos iawn â nawdd gamblo, oherwydd gall gweithredwyr gamblo gynnig symiau enfawr o arian i glybiau pêl-droed mewn nawdd o gymharu ag unrhyw gwmnïau eraill sy'n cynnig nawdd, ac rwy'n ymwybodol fod ymgyrchwyr dros ddiwygio gamblo yn dadlau dros wahardd pob nawdd hysbysebu chwaraeon, ac fel chi, rwy'n ymwybodol fod clybiau'r Uwch Gynghrair wedi cytuno gyda'i gilydd i dynnu nawdd gamblo o flaen eu crysau ar ddiwrnod gêm erbyn diwedd tymor 2026, ac er bod hynny wrth gwrs yn gam i'w groesawu, o'm safbwynt i, byddwn yn annog pob clwb pêl droed i wneud hyn, nid clybiau'r Uwch Gynghrair yn unig, ond holl glybiau cynghrair Cymru hefyd, a gwneud hynny'n gynt, yn enwedig ar gitiau pêl-droed plant, pobl iau a ieuenctid. Nid oes unrhyw reswm i'r hysbysebion hynny fod ar eu dillad hwy hefyd. Felly, byddwn yn annog sefydliadau i gael gwared ar nawdd gamblo o bob rhan arall o gitiau chwaraeon hefyd, o hysbysebion baner, ac awgrymu bod clybiau chwaraeon yn edrych yn fanwl ar yr effaith ehangach y mae hysbysebu gamblo yn ei chael ar eu camp.
Can I wholeheartedly agree with your comments, Minister? We do need to get to grips with this public health menace. We know that problem gambling has been on the rise in recent years, and too many vulnerable people are falling prey to the gambling industry and the harm that it can do. Obviously, I appreciate that many of the levers to deal with gambling advertising are, of course, held at Westminster, but there are issues that can be addressed here in Wales, and I know that, working with your colleagues, I would like to see some action, for example, on the planning system, which allows a proliferation of gambling centres on our high streets, with bookmakers on our high streets; we need some action in our education system to make sure that young people are warned about the harms, not just of gambling on sports but gaming gambling, which is becoming a big issue; and of course we need some more investment in our addiction services, particularly around this. So, can I ask what collaborative work is going on within the Welsh Government, given that this is such a disparate responsibility between many portfolios, to make sure that those things in particular are addressed with the powers that you already do have?
A gaf fi gytuno'n llwyr â'ch sylwadau, Weinidog? Mae angen inni fynd i'r afael â'r bygythiad hwn i iechyd y cyhoedd. Rydym yn gwybod bod problemau gamblo wedi bod ar gynnydd yn y blynyddoedd diwethaf, ac mae gormod o bobl agored i niwed yn syrthio'n ysglyfaeth i'r diwydiant gamblo a'r niwed y gall ei wneud. Yn amlwg, rwy'n derbyn mai San Steffan sydd â nifer o'r ysgogiadau i ymdrin â hysbysebu gamblo, ond mae yna faterion y gellir mynd i'r afael â hwy yma yng Nghymru, ac rwy'n gwybod, drwy weithio gyda'ch cyd-Aelodau, y byddwn yn hoffi gweld camau gweithredu, er enghraifft, ar y system gynllunio, sy'n caniatáu canolfannau gamblo lluosog ar ein stryd fawr, gyda siopau betio ar ein strydoedd mawr; mae angen camau gweithredu yn ein system addysg i wneud yn siŵr fod pobl ifanc yn cael eu rhybuddio am y niwed, nid yn unig o gamblo ar chwaraeon ond o hapchwarae, sy'n dod yn broblem fawr; ac wrth gwrs mae angen mwy o fuddsoddiad yn ein gwasanaethau dibyniaeth, ar hyn yn enwedig. Felly, a gaf fi ofyn pa waith cydweithredol sy'n mynd rhagddo yn Llywodraeth Cymru, o gofio bod hwn yn gyfrifoldeb mor wahanol rhwng sawl portffolio, i wneud yn siŵr fod y pethau hynny yn enwedig yn cael sylw gyda'r pwerau sydd gennych eisoes?
Can I thank Darren Millar for that question and the very valid points that he makes in his comments? I think it's probably worth reminding ourselves that we did have a Welsh Government taskforce, a task and finish group, which was set up to look at gambling related harm, and that work will feed in to develop the proposals in terms of how we respond to people affected by gambling related harm. The task and finish group concluded its work in 2022, and one of the four key recommendations that it made was that it would continue to advocate for the reform of the Gambling Act 2005 for all the reasons that you have highlighted. Most of the issues that we are facing with gambling related harm are not within our areas of competence, and we have to look at supporting a future system that takes a population-level public health approach, and that's the conversation that I will certainly be having with my colleague Lynne Neagle, and we need to look at it across other ministerial portfolios as well, where we have that cross-interest.
A gaf fi ddiolch i Darren Millar am y cwestiwn hwnnw a'r pwyntiau dilys iawn y mae'n eu gwneud yn ei sylwadau? Rwy'n credu ei bod yn werth atgoffa ein hunain, mae'n debyg, fod gennym dasglu Llywodraeth Cymru, grŵp gorchwyl a gorffen, a sefydlwyd i edrych ar niwed sy'n gysylltiedig â gamblo, ac y bydd y gwaith hwnnw'n bwydo i mewn i ddatblygu'r cynigion ynglŷn â sut rydym yn ymateb i bobl sydd wedi cael eu heffeithio gan niwed sy'n gysylltiedig â gamblo. Daeth gwaith y grŵp gorchwyl a gorffen i ben yn 2022, ac un o'r pedwar argymhelliad allweddol a wnaeth oedd y byddai'n parhau i ddadlau dros ddiwygio Deddf Gamblo 2005 am yr holl resymau rydych wedi'u hamlinellu. Nid yw'r rhan fwyaf o'r problemau a wynebwn gyda niwed sy'n gysylltiedig â gamblo o fewn ein meysydd cymhwysedd, ac mae'n rhaid inni edrych ar gefnogi system yn y dyfodol sy'n mabwysiadu dull iechyd cyhoeddus ar lefel poblogaeth, a byddaf yn sicr yn cael y sgwrs honno gyda fy nghyd-Aelod Lynne Neagle, ac mae angen inni edrych arno ar draws portffolios gweinidogol eraill hefyd, lle mae gennym y diddordeb trawsbynciol hwnnw.
Yn olaf, cwestiwn 8, Peter Fox.
Finally, question 8, Peter Fox.
8. Beth mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei wneud i gryfhau'r diwydiant twristiaeth yn etholaeth Mynwy o safbwynt economaidd? OQ59399
8. What is the Welsh Government doing to economically strengthen the tourism industry in the Monmouth constituency? OQ59399
I thank Peter Fox for that question. Visit Wales has invested in regional assets, such as Tintern abbey, and the region benefits from our year-round marketing, which highlights the unique and quality offering of Monmouthshire to visitors.
Diolch i Peter Fox am y cwestiwn hwnnw. Mae Croeso Cymru wedi buddsoddi mewn asedau rhanbarthol, fel abaty Tyndyrn, ac mae'r rhanbarth yn elwa o'n marchnata drwy gydol y flwyddyn, sy'n amlygu cynnig unigryw a safonol sir Fynwy i ymwelwyr.
Thank you, Minister. Wales possesses many strengths, as you know, economically, especially the tourism industry. It employs over 10 per cent of our working population. But, last week, research revealed that Wales was in the top-two UK areas to experience the largest decrease in employment as well as the lowest employment rate after only Northern Ireland. This concerning revelation reminds us that businesses need more support rather than being held back by barriers. And I know I'm going to talk about an area that you're keen not to. One potential barrier they continue to voice concerns about is your proposed tourism tax, which they have warned will hit those jobs and businesses, and particularly in my constituency of Monmouth and other border constituencies, because people will be deterred from overnight stays and will choose to be day visitors instead. Minister, what advice would you give to businesses who feel so threatened by what your Government is proposing?
Diolch. Mae gan Gymru nifer o gryfderau economaidd, fel y gwyddoch, yn enwedig y diwydiant twristiaeth. Mae'n cyflogi dros 10 y cant o'r boblogaeth sy'n gweithio. Ond yr wythnos diwethaf, dangosodd ymchwil fod Cymru yn un o'r ddau ranbarth uchaf yn y DU i brofi'r gostyngiad mwyaf mewn cyflogaeth yn ogystal â'r gyfradd gyflogaeth isaf, ar ôl Gogledd Iwerddon yn unig. Mae'r canfyddiad pryderus hwn yn ein hatgoffa bod busnesau angen mwy o gefnogaeth yn hytrach na chael eu dal yn ôl gan rwystrau. Ac rwy'n gwybod fy mod am siarad am faes rydych yn awyddus i beidio â sôn amdano. Un rhwystr posibl y maent yn parhau i leisio pryderon yn ei gylch yw eich treth dwristiaeth arfaethedig, ac maent wedi rhybuddio y bydd yn taro'r swyddi a'r busnesau hynny, yn enwedig yn fy etholaeth i ym Mynwy ac etholaethau eraill ar y ffin, oherwydd bydd pobl yn dewis peidio ag aros dros nos ac yn dewis ymweld am y dydd yn lle hynny. Weinidog, pa gyngor fyddech chi'n ei roi i fusnesau sy'n teimlo dan gymaint o fygythiad yn sgil yr hyn y mae eich Llywodraeth yn ei argymell?
Well, can I thank Peter Fox for that supplementary question? And, again, as I said in my answer to Altaf, I don't come from the same premise that you come from in terms of the impact that a visitor levy would have on tourism. There was a significant consultation around the visitor levy. The sector itself is helping to inform and design that levy and make sure that it works for Wales. It's a levy that will enable local authorities to raise revenue, it's about visitors supporting destinations, they enjoy making a small contribution to the community, and so on. Again, as I said in my response to Altaf, this was a key element of the Labour manifesto in the 2021 election. It is a key element of the co-operation agreement that we have with Plaid Cymru. We are progressing with the implementation of that manifesto commitment, as it is the right thing to do.
We are not convinced by the arguments that it is something that is likely to impact adversely on the tourism economy. There is no evidence from any other country in the world that has a visitor levy that that has a significant impact. I was abroad on holiday myself over Easter—I had a wonderful time—and I paid a tourism levy in the cities that I visited, and it would not put me off visiting that area again. If there is somewhere you want to go, then you will go. And I think what is important about all of this is that the visitor levy will be designed with the sector to develop a levy that will be appropriate for the type of accommodation that people stay in and the value of that accommodation, and so on. So, we will continue to work with the sector. We will continue to develop the levy, and I am convinced that it will be of benefit to those local authority areas where tourism is a significant factor in the economy to help them to develop their tourism offer in those areas.
Wel, a gaf fi ddiolch i Peter Fox am y cwestiwn atodol hwnnw? Ac eto, fel y dywedais yn fy ateb i Altaf, nid wyf yn rhannu eich safbwynt ynghylch yr effaith y byddai ardoll ymwelwyr yn ei chael ar dwristiaeth. Roedd yna ymgynghoriad sylweddol ar yr ardoll ymwelwyr. Mae'r sector ei hun yn helpu i lywio a chynllunio'r ardoll honno a sicrhau ei bod yn gweithio i Gymru. Mae'n ardoll a fydd yn galluogi awdurdodau lleol i godi refeniw, mae'n ymwneud ag ymwelwyr yn cefnogi cyrchfannau, maent yn mwynhau gwneud cyfraniad bach i'r gymuned, ac yn y blaen. Eto, fel y dywedais yn fy ymateb i Altaf, roedd hyn yn elfen allweddol o'r maniffesto Llafur yn etholiad 2021. Mae'n elfen allweddol o'r cytundeb cydweithio sydd gennym gyda Phlaid Cymru. Rydym yn bwrw ymlaen â'r gwaith o weithredu ymrwymiad y maniffesto, gan mai dyna'r peth iawn i'w wneud.
Nid ydym wedi cael ein hargyhoeddi gan y dadleuon ei fod yn rhywbeth sy'n debygol o effeithio'n andwyol ar yr economi dwristiaeth. Nid oes unrhyw dystiolaeth o unrhyw wlad arall yn y byd sydd ag ardoll ymwelwyr i ddangos bod hynny'n cael effaith sylweddol. Roeddwn i dramor ar wyliau fy hun dros y Pasg—cefais amser bendigedig—ac fe delais ardoll dwristiaeth yn y dinasoedd yr ymwelais â hwy, ac ni fyddai'n fy rhwystro rhag ymweld â'r ardal honno eto. Os oes rhywle rydych chi eisiau ymweld ag ef, fe wnewch chi fynd. Ac rwy'n credu mai'r hyn sy'n bwysig am hyn i gyd yw y bydd yr ardoll ymwelwyr yn cael ei chynllunio gyda'r sector i ddatblygu ardoll a fydd yn briodol ar gyfer y math o lety y mae pobl yn aros ynddo a gwerth y llety hwnnw, ac yn y blaen. Felly, byddwn yn parhau i weithio gyda'r sector. Byddwn yn parhau i ddatblygu'r ardoll, ac rwy'n argyhoeddedig y bydd o fudd i ardaloedd awdurdodau lleol lle mae twristiaeth yn ffactor sylweddol yn yr economi i'w helpu i ddatblygu eu cynnig twristiaeth yn yr ardaloedd hynny.
Diolch i'r Dirprwy Weinidog a'r Gweinidog.
I thank the Minister and Deputy Minister.
Yr eitem nesaf, felly, yw'r cwestiynau i'r Gweinidog Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol. Mae'r cwestiwn cyntaf i'w ateb gan y Dirprwy Weinidog Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol ac i'w ofyn gan Hefin David.
The next item is questions to the Minister for Health and Social Services. The first question is to be answered by the Deputy Minister for Social Services and to be asked by Hefin David.
1. A wnaiff y Gweinidog roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf am strategaeth Llywodraeth Cymru ar gyfer mynd i'r afael ag unigrwydd ac ynysigrwydd cymdeithasol? OQ59406
1. Will the Minister provide an update on the Welsh Government's strategy for tackling loneliness and social isolation? OQ59406
Diolch, Hefin. Publication of our strategy was an important step in building stronger social connections in Wales. We continue to make good progress with implementing the strategy and have worked with members of our loneliness and isolation advisory group to quality assure delivery and consider what more can be done.
Diolch, Hefin. Roedd cyhoeddi ein strategaeth yn gam pwysig tuag at adeiladu cysylltiadau cymdeithasol cryfach yng Nghymru. Rydym yn parhau i wneud cynnydd da gyda'r gwaith o weithredu'r strategaeth ac rydym wedi gweithio gydag aelodau o'n grŵp cynghori ar unigrwydd ac ynysigrwydd i sicrhau darpariaeth o ansawdd ac i ystyried beth arall y gellir ei wneud.
Diolch am eich ateb.
Thank you for that.
On Friday, 31 March, I visited Caerphilly Miners Centre for the Community, which, of course, is the former miners' hospital that has been converted into a community centre through the work of Katherine Hughes and her team, and it's now a local community facility. At that meeting, Katherine mentioned 'Connected communities', the Welsh Government's strategy for tackling loneliness and social isolation and building stronger social connections. The centre provides classes and activities for people who require those activities and does huge work in tackling social isolation, but the funding that she receives is very short term, and she finds it difficult, then, to maintain staffing, and she's uncertain as to whether that provision can be provided in the year ahead. In order to ensure that the funding is not too little, too late, the centre feels that support needs to be more sustainable and funded on a longer term basis. So, would the Deputy Minister discuss with her colleagues, the Minister for Social Justice and the Minister for finance how this can be facilitated, so that these cherished voluntary services can be maintained?
Ddydd Gwener, 31 Mawrth, ymwelais â Chanolfan Glowyr Caerffili ar gyfer y Gymuned, sef hen ysbyty'r glowyr, wrth gwrs, sydd wedi ei droi'n ganolfan gymunedol drwy waith Katherine Hughes a'i thîm, ac mae bellach yn gyfleuster cymunedol lleol. Yn y cyfarfod hwnnw, soniodd Katherine am 'Cysylltu cymunedau', strategaeth Llywodraeth Cymru ar gyfer mynd i'r afael ag unigrwydd ac ynysigrwydd cymdeithasol a meithrin cysylltiadau cymdeithasol cryfach. Mae'r ganolfan yn darparu dosbarthiadau a gweithgareddau i bobl sydd angen y gweithgareddau hynny ac yn gwneud gwaith enfawr ar fynd i'r afael ag unigrwydd cymdeithasol, ond cyllid yn y tymor byr iawn yn unig yw'r cyllid y mae'n ei gael, ac felly mae'n ei gweld hi'n anodd cynnal staff, ac mae'n ansicr a oes modd darparu'r ddarpariaeth honno yn y flwyddyn sydd i ddod. Er mwyn sicrhau bod cyllid digonol ar gael mewn pryd, mae'r ganolfan yn teimlo bod angen i'r gefnogaeth fod yn fwy cynaliadwy a bod angen ei hariannu ar sail fwy hirdymor. Felly, a wnaiff y Dirprwy Weinidog drafod gyda'i chyd-Aelodau, y Gweinidog Cyfiawnder Cymdeithasol a'r Gweinidog cyllid, i weld sut y gellir hwyluso hyn, fel bod modd cynnal y gwasanaethau gwirfoddol gwerthfawr hyn?
Thank you, Hefin, for that supplementary question. I will certainly follow it up, as you suggest. I'm very pleased that the centre has received money from the loneliness and isolation fund. And, in fact, I believe it's had help for a Ukrainian children's reading club and the Ukrainian Hope project, which is excellent, and also has received funding for a warm hub and a household support fund. So, I really would like to thank them for what they're doing. They're obviously a huge strength in the community.
The £1.5 million loneliness and isolation fund is to build the capability and the sustainability of front-line grass-roots voluntary and community organisations like the Caerphilly Miners Centre for the Community. This is a three-year fund, so it's not short term in the sense that it's just one—it's a three-year fund. Funding was allocated to local authority and community voluntary councils working in partnership to distribute to community-based organisations within their areas. And I know that there has been a real increased demand for voluntary services since the pandemic and in the cost-of-living crisis, so I really do appreciate what they are doing. We also know how important the warm hubs are, which they also provide. So, I do recognise the call for the voluntary sector funding to be on a more sustainable and longer term basis, and when we can, we do provide three-year funding, but I will follow up the particular issues that you raise.
Diolch am y cwestiwn atodol, Hefin. Byddaf yn sicr yn mynd ar drywydd hynny, fel yr awgrymwch. Rwy'n falch iawn fod y ganolfan wedi cael arian o'r gronfa unigrwydd ac ynysigrwydd. Ac yn wir, rwy'n credu ei bod wedi cael cymorth tuag at glwb darllen i blant Wcrainaidd a phrosiect Gobaith Wcráin, sy'n ardderchog, ac mae hefyd wedi derbyn cyllid canolfannau clyd a'r gronfa cymorth i aelwydydd. Felly, hoffwn ddiolch iddynt am yr hyn y maent yn ei wneud. Mae'n amlwg eu bod yn gryfder enfawr yn y gymuned.
Diben y gronfa unigrwydd ac ynysigrwydd gwerth £1.5 miliwn yw adeiladu gallu a chynaliadwyedd sefydliadau gwirfoddol a chymunedol rheng flaen ar lawr gwlad fel Canolfan Glowyr Caerffili ar gyfer y Gymuned. Cronfa dair blynedd yw hon, felly nid yw'n arian tymor byr yn yr ystyr nad am flwyddyn yn unig y caiff ei ddarparu—mae'n gronfa dair blynedd. Rhoddwyd arian i awdurdodau lleol a chynghorau gwirfoddol cymunedol sy'n gweithio mewn partneriaeth i'w ddosbarthu i sefydliadau cymunedol yn eu hardaloedd. Ac rwy'n gwybod bod galw cynyddol go iawn wedi bod am wasanaethau gwirfoddol ers y pandemig ac yn ystod yr argyfwng costau byw, felly rwy'n gwerthfawrogi'r hyn y maent yn ei wneud yn fawr. Yn ogystal, rydym yn gwybod pa mor bwysig yw'r canolfannau clyd y maent hefyd yn eu darparu. Felly, rwy'n cydnabod yr alwad i sicrhau bod cyllid y sector gwirfoddol ar sail fwy cynaliadwy a hirdymor, a phan allwn wneud hynny, rydym yn darparu cyllid tair blynedd, ond fe af ar drywydd y pethau penodol a nodwyd gennych.
Minister, one of the biggest contributors to loneliness and isolation for older people, apart from the pandemic, is the increased digitalisation of society. As more and more services move online, and physical services become automated, human interaction for many older people has dramatically reduced. Obviously, Welsh Government cannot put the genie back into the bottle and return us to the face-to-face world. However, we do need to look at the health and well-being impact upon older people. Minister, what discussions have you had with local authorities and the third sector about improving socialisation opportunities for those suffering loneliness and isolation? I know you have spoken about some of these; maybe if there is something more, you might let us know.
Weinidog, un o'r pethau sy'n cyfrannu fwyaf at unigrwydd ac ynysigrwydd i bobl hŷn, ar wahân i'r pandemig, yw'r cynnydd a welwyd gyda digidoleiddio cymdeithas. Wrth i fwyfwy o wasanaethau symud ar-lein, ac wrth i wasanaethau ffisegol gael eu hawtomeiddio, mae i lawer o bobl hŷn mae rhyngweithio rhwng pobl wedi lleihau'n sylweddol. Yn amlwg, ni all Llywodraeth Cymru droi'r cloc yn ôl i fyd wyneb yn wyneb. Fodd bynnag, mae angen inni edrych ar yr effaith ar iechyd a llesiant pobl hŷn. Weinidog, pa drafodaethau a gawsoch gydag awdurdodau lleol a'r trydydd sector am wella cyfleoedd cymdeithasu i'r rhai sy'n dioddef unigrwydd ac ynysigrwydd? Gwn eich bod wedi siarad am rai o'r rhain; os oes rhywbeth arall, efallai y gallech roi gwybod i ni.
Thank you very much for that question. Yes, we have had discussions with local authorities. One of the distressing results of the pandemic was that many local activities, for example, where you do have face-to-face contact, did cease temporarily, and some of them have not reopened since, so we have had a lot of discussion and encouragement to local authorities to try to open those facilities. I've often had a lot of involvement with the Commissioner for Older People in Wales, who is very concerned about the development of digitalisation, where it will mean that there won't be anything left in terms of the face-to-face communication, which is so important for people, and particularly for some elderly people. So, we are certainly trying to ensure that as well as digitalisation there is a means of communicating that is face to face or is on the telephone or is more personal. I absolutely take the point that the Member makes, and this is something that we are very aware of.
Diolch yn fawr iawn am y cwestiwn hwnnw. Rydym wedi trafod gydag awdurdodau lleol. Un o ganlyniadau gofidus y pandemig oedd bod llawer o weithgareddau lleol, er enghraifft lle mae gennych gyswllt wyneb yn wyneb, wedi dod i ben dros dro, ac nid yw rhai ohonynt wedi ailagor ers hynny, felly rydym wedi cael llawer o drafod ac wedi annog awdurdodau lleol i geisio agor y cyfleusterau hynny. Rwyf wedi ymwneud yn fynych â Chomisiynydd Pobl Hŷn Cymru, sy'n pryderu'n fawr am ddatblygiad digidoleiddio, lle bydd yn golygu na fydd unrhyw gyfathrebu wyneb yn wyneb, sydd mor bwysig i bobl, ac yn enwedig i rai pobl oedrannus. Felly, rydym yn bendant yn ceisio sicrhau, yn ogystal â digidoleiddio, fod yna fodd o gyfathrebu wyneb yn wyneb neu dros y ffôn neu'n fwy personol. Rwy'n derbyn y pwynt y mae'r Aelod yn ei wneud yn llwyr, ac mae hyn yn rhywbeth yr ydym yn ymwybodol iawn ohono.
2. A wnaiff y Gweinidog roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf am amseroedd aros yn adran damweiniau ac achosion brys Ysbyty Athrofaol y Faenor? OQ59405
2. Will the Minister provide an update on accident and emergency waiting times in the Grange University Hospital? OQ59405
Emergency department performance at the Grange hospital is not where I, the health board, nor the public want it to be. The health board has an urgent and emergency care improvement plan, supported by additional Welsh Government funding, and is working closely with partners to secure better outcomes and experiences at the Grange site.
Nid wyf fi, y bwrdd iechyd, na'r cyhoedd yn fodlon gyda perfformiad adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys Ysbyty Athrofaol y Faenor. Mae gan y bwrdd iechyd gynllun brys ar gyfer gwella gofal brys, cynllun sydd wedi'i gefnogi gan gyllid ychwanegol gan Lywodraeth Cymru, ac mae'n gweithio'n agos gyda phartneriaid i sicrhau canlyniadau a phrofiadau gwell ar safle'r Faenor.
Thank you, Minister. I'm glad to hear that. Unfortunately, I was in the position where I had to go to A&E twice last week, at the Grange University Hospital in my region. Seventeen and three quarter hours I waited, and others waited, to see just a doctor—17 and three quarter hours. All staff, let me just put on record now, were absolutely excellent, professional and lovely when you saw them, but that A&E at the Grange is not fit for purpose in any shape or form. The management wasn't right. There was no flow. I spoke to a paramedic outside. The 21 ambulances for the majority of the time that I was there were outside. I spoke to one of the paramedics who said that in Cardiff university hospital there was a one-hour turnaround. In the Grange, they were experiencing eight to 10-hour turnarounds. Something is not right there. Something has to give. That's a marked difference. Is it because the A&E at the Grange was never meant to be an A&E? It was deemed for critical care. As it happens, in A&E with me at the time, there were two former cabinet members for social care from Monmouthshire County Council, both baffled and appalled by the scenes that they saw. Right up to the end of the development stage for the Grange, that area was meant to be for critical care only. It is not fit for purpose for an A&E. The size of it was far too small. There was no food and drink. The positioning in the hospital wasn't right. None of it was right for an A&E. There were patients having to stand up who were passing out. Other patients had to bang doors for help. There was no care during that whole time in the A&E. There was an 82-year-old next to me who had waited 14 hours with a hernia poking out of him who decided to go home after 14 hours.
My second trip: 13 hours. I'm sorry I'm overrunning. Thirteen hours at A&E to see a doctor. Then I was moved to SDEC, the same-day emergency care, which was fantastic, but there were three people in it at the other side of the hospital—
Diolch. Rwy'n falch o glywed hynny. Yn anffodus, bu'n rhaid imi fynd i'r adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys ddwywaith yr wythnos diwethaf, yn Ysbyty Athrofaol y Faenor yn fy rhanbarth. Bu'n rhaid i mi ac eraill aros am 17¾ awr, i ddim ond gweld meddyg—17¾ awr. Gadewch imi nodi nawr fod yr holl staff, yn gwbl ardderchog, yn broffesiynol ac yn hyfryd pan fyddech yn eu gweld, ond nid yw'r adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys yn ysbyty'r Faenor yn addas i'r diben mewn unrhyw fodd. Nid oedd y rheolaeth yn iawn. Nid oedd pethau'n llifo. Siaradais â pharafeddyg y tu allan. Roedd y 21 ambiwlans y tu allan am y rhan fwyaf o'r amser yr oeddwn i yno. Siaradais ag un o'r parafeddygon a ddywedodd fod pobl yn cael eu gweld o fewn awr yn ysbyty athrofaol Caerdydd. Yn ysbyty'r Faenor, roedd cleifion yn aros am wyth i 10 awr. Mae rhywbeth o'i le yno. Mae'n rhaid gwneud rhywbeth ynglŷn â hyn. Mae hwnnw'n wahaniaeth amlwg. Ai'r rheswm am hyn yw nad oedd yr adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys yn ysbyty'r Faenor i fod yn adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys? Fe'i pennwyd ar gyfer gofal critigol. Fel mae'n digwydd, yn yr adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys gyda fi ar y pryd, roedd yna ddau gyn aelod cabinet dros ofal cymdeithasol ar Gyngor Sir Fynwy, y ddau wedi'u syfrdanu a'u brawychu gan y golygfeydd a welsant. Hyd at ddiwedd y cam datblygu ar gyfer ysbyty'r Faenor, roedd yr ardal honno i fod ar gyfer gofal critigol yn unig. Nid yw'n addas i'r diben ar gyfer adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys. Mae'n llawer rhy fach. Nid oedd unrhyw fwyd a diod. Nid oedd ei lleoliad yn yr ysbyty'n iawn. Nid oedd dim ohono'n addas ar gyfer adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys. Roedd yno gleifion a oedd yn gorfod sefyll ar eu traed yn llewygu. Roedd yn rhaid i gleifion eraill guro ar ddrysau i gael cymorth. Nid oedd unrhyw ofal yn ystod yr holl amser yn yr adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys. Fe benderfynodd gŵr 82 oed wrth fy ymyl â thorgest yn gwthio allan ohono fynd adref ar ôl aros am 14 awr.
Fy ail drip: 13 awr. Mae'n ddrwg gennyf, mae fy amser ar ben. Tair awr ar ddeg yn yr adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys i weld meddyg. Yna cefais fy symud i ofal argyfwng yr un diwrnod, a oedd yn wych, ond roedd tri o bobl yno ar yr ochr arall i'r ysbyty—
You're going to have to ask your question now.
Bydd yn rhaid i chi ofyn eich cwestiwn nawr.
Why wasn't that being used to relieve A&E, Minister? And the Government needs to get a grip of this situation. What urgent action is your Government and Aneurin Bevan health board taking to ensure that scenes like I witnessed and were witnessed yesterday in A&E in the Grange aren't repeated?
Pam nad oedd hwnnw'n cael ei ddefnyddio i leddfu'r baich ar yr adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys, Weinidog? Ac mae angen i'r Llywodraeth fynd i'r afael â'r sefyllfa hon. Pa gamau brys y mae eich Llywodraeth a bwrdd iechyd Aneurin Bevan yn eu cymryd i sicrhau nad yw golygfeydd fel y rhai a welais i ac eraill yn yr adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys yn ysbyty'r Faenor ddoe yn cael eu hailadrodd?
Well, thanks very much. Obviously, the responsibility for making this work is with Aneurin Bevan and the health board. Since the emergency department was configured, obviously what we've seen—the difference in terms of when the planning happened and what is happening—across the whole of Wales is a massive increase in demand. We have made efforts to try and support changes in the Grange hospital, including £3.5 million capital, which has enabled that SDEC service to be established. I think they're still having teething problems with that. Clearly, they need to work out how to use that better. What I can tell you is that nearly three quarters of patients attending A&E in the Grange are spending less than four hours in departments. That is—[Interruption.] Well, this is what was true in March. These are facts. [Interruption.] There are—[Interruption.] These are facts, so you can't really dispute the facts. What I can also tell you is that Aneurin Bevan, I think, is planning to submit a case for capital funding to enable further building works to extend the emergency department, and we're expecting that request to us to come in the autumn.
Wel, diolch yn fawr. Yn amlwg, cyfrifoldeb bwrdd iechyd Aneurin Bevan yw gwneud i hyn weithio. Ers i'r adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys gael ei chreu, yn amlwg, yr hyn a welsom—y gwahaniaeth rhwng pan ddigwyddodd y cynllunio a'r hyn sy'n digwydd nawr—yw cynnydd enfawr yn y galw ar hyd a lled Cymru. Rydym wedi ceisio cefnogi newidiadau yn ysbyty'r Faenor, gan gynnwys £3.5 miliwn o gyfalaf, sydd wedi eu galluogi i sefydlu gwasanaeth gofal argyfwng yr un diwrnod. Rwy'n credu eu bod yn dal i gael problemau cychwynnol gyda hynny. Yn amlwg, mae angen iddynt ddatrys sut i ddefnyddio hwnnw'n well. Yr hyn y gallaf ei ddweud wrthych yw bod bron i dri chwarter y cleifion sy'n mynychu'r adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys yn ysbyty'r Faenor yn treulio llai na phedair awr mewn adrannau. Mae hynny—[Torri ar draws.] Wel, roedd hynny'n wir ym mis Mawrth. Ffeithiau yw'r rhain. [Torri ar draws.] Mae—[Torri ar draws.] Ffeithiau yw'r rhain, felly ni allwch anghytuno â'r ffeithiau. Gallaf ddweud wrthych hefyd fod Aneurin Bevan, rwy'n credu, yn bwriadu cyflwyno achos dros gyllid cyfalaf er mwyn galluogi rhagor o waith adeiladu i ymestyn yr adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys, ac rydym yn disgwyl i'r cais hwnnw ein cyrraedd yn yr hydref.
Llefarwyr y pleidiau nawr. Llefarydd y Ceidwadwyr, Russell George.
The party spokespeople now. Conservative spokesperson, Russell George.
Thank you, Presiding Officer. If the Labour-run Welsh NHS is functional, as the First Minister said yesterday, why did the chair of the British Medical Association say it was not?
Diolch, Lywydd. Os yw GIG Cymru sy'n cael ei redeg gan Lafur yn weithredol, fel y dywedodd Prif Weinidog Cymru ddoe, pam y dywedodd cadeirydd Cymdeithas Feddygol Prydain nad oedd yn weithredol?
To be quite honest with you, I don't know why she made those comments. I am absolutely stunned that the Chair of the BMA could say such a thing when she is aware that there are 2 million contacts a month, in a population of 3.1 million people. We have committed to spend over £1 billion extra this Senedd term to help get the NHS back on its feet after one of the most traumatic and difficult times during the COVID pandemic. We are seeing a significant improvement in waiting times; they're not as fast we'd like, but our waiting lists are coming down, while they're going up in England. So, I am baffled by the Chair of the BMA's comments. I am frankly very disappointed in them, and, obviously, it is a sensitive time for everybody involved.
I fod yn hollol onest gyda chi, nid wyf yn gwybod pam y gwnaeth hi'r sylwadau hynny. Mae'n fy synnu'n fawr y gallai cadeirydd y BMA ddweud y fath beth a hithau'n ymwybodol fod 2 filiwn o gysylltiadau'r mis yn digwydd mewn poblogaeth o 3.1 miliwn o bobl. Rydym wedi ymrwymo i wario dros £1 biliwn ychwanegol yn ystod tymor y Senedd hon i helpu i gael y GIG yn ôl ar ei draed ar ôl un o'r cyfnodau mwyaf trawmatig ac anodd yn ystod y pandemig COVID. Rydym yn gweld gwelliant sylweddol mewn amseroedd aros; nid ydynt mor gyflym ag y byddem yn ei ddymuno, ond mae ein rhestrau aros yn lleihau, er eu bod yn tyfu yn Lloegr. Felly, mae sylwadau cadeirydd y BMA yn peri penbleth i mi. Rwy'n siomedig iawn yn eu cylch a dweud y gwir, ac yn amlwg, mae'n amser sensitif i bawb.
Thank you for your answer, Minister. I suppose that my analysis would be that health professionals, such as the chair of the BMA, have got a very different view to you in terms of how the running of the Welsh NHS is performing. If you want to resolve an issue, the first thing you've got to do is accept that there's an issue in the first place. The statistics for February show us that we've got nearly 40,000 people that are waiting for over two years for treatment. When the March figures come out, I very much doubt they'll be zero, which will mean that the Welsh Government has of course missed its own target. We know that, in Scotland and in England, those two-year waits were virtually wiped out last summer. People, often in pain or unable to live the life that they want, shouldn't be waiting for over two years for treatment. They would rightfully ask, 'Why is it, if I lived in Scotland or England, I wouldn't be in this position?' Could I ask, Minister, when will you be announcing your new target? Tell us when you believe the two-year waits will be eliminated in Wales. What confidence can the tens of thousands of people who are waiting have in the commitments that you make?
Diolch am eich ateb, Weinidog. Rwy'n tybio mai fy nadansoddiad i fyddai fod gan weithwyr iechyd proffesiynol, fel cadeirydd y BMA, farn wahanol iawn i chi ynglŷn â sut mae GIG Cymru yn perfformio. Os ydych chi eisiau datrys problem, y peth cyntaf y mae'n rhaid ichi ei wneud yw derbyn bod yna broblem yn y lle cyntaf. Mae'r ystadegau ar gyfer mis Chwefror yn dangos i ni fod gennym bron i 40,000 o bobl yn aros dros ddwy flynedd am driniaeth. Pan gyhoeddir ffigyrau mis Mawrth, rwy'n amau'n fawr y byddant i lawr i sero, a fydd yn golygu fod Llywodraeth Cymru wedi methu cyrraedd ei tharged ei hun wrth gwrs. Yn yr Alban ac yn Lloegr, gwyddom fod arosiadau dwy flynedd wedi cael eu dileu fwy neu lai yr haf diwethaf. Ni ddylai pobl sy'n aml mewn poen neu'n methu byw'r bywyd y maent eisiau ei fyw, fod yn aros dros ddwy flynedd am driniaeth. Byddent yn gofyn, yn briodol, 'Pam ei bod yn wir na fyddwn yn y sefyllfa hon pe bawn i'n byw yn yr Alban neu Loegr?' A gaf fi ofyn, Weinidog, pryd fyddwch chi'n cyhoeddi eich targed newydd? Dywedwch wrthym pryd y credwch y bydd yr arosiadau dwy flynedd yn cael eu dileu yng Nghymru. Pa hyder y gall y degau o filoedd o bobl sy'n aros ei gael yn yr ymrwymiadau a wnewch?
As I say, the numbers waiting for treatment have fallen in Wales for the fifth consecutive month, whilst the numbers waiting in England are going up, and have been going up for the past five months. I think it's also important to note that, in Wales, we count diagnostics and therapy, whereas in England they don't do that. What I can tell you is that, actually, by the target date, most specialities will be at zero, but there are seven specialist areas where we are seeing real issues in trying to bring those waiting lists down, which is why I have regular summit meetings focusing on some of those areas, including, for example, orthopaedics, where we know it's very challenging. I'm sure you heard somebody from a health think tank saying on the weekend that, actually, part of the reason for this is because different choices are being made—they're not necessarily always the choices I want them to make, to be honest—with the health boards. Because I've asked them to prioritise the longest waits, but, obviously, clinicians have to take a judgment on urgent cases, and those go to the front of the queue. That's why, if you look at the number of people, ours are going down, theirs are going up, but we're seeing more of the urgent cases.
Fel rwy'n dweud, mae'r niferoedd sy'n aros am driniaeth wedi gostwng yng Nghymru am y pumed mis yn olynol, tra bod y niferoedd sy'n aros yn Lloegr yn codi, ac wedi bod yn codi am y pum mis diwethaf. Rwy'n meddwl ei bod hi'n bwysig nodi hefyd, yng Nghymru, ein bod ni'n cyfri diagnosteg a therapi, ac nad ydynt yn gwneud hynny yn Lloegr. Yr hyn y gallaf ei ddweud wrthych mewn gwirionedd yw y bydd y rhan fwyaf o arbenigeddau ar sero erbyn y dyddiad targed, ond ceir saith maes arbenigol lle rydym yn gweld problemau go iawn wrth geisio lleihau'r rhestrau aros, a dyna pam fy mod yn cael uwchgyfarfodydd rheolaidd sy'n canolbwyntio ar rai o'r meysydd hynny, gan gynnwys orthopaedeg er enghraifft, y gwyddom ei fod yn heriol iawn. Rwy'n siŵr eich bod wedi clywed rhywun o felin drafod iechyd yn dweud dros y penwythnos mai rhan o'r rheswm am hyn yw oherwydd bod dewisiadau gwahanol yn cael eu gwneud—i fod yn onest, nid y dewisiadau rwyf eisiau iddynt eu gwneud o reidrwydd bob amser—gyda'r byrddau iechyd. Oherwydd gofynnais iddynt flaenoriaethu'r arosiadau hiraf, ond yn amlwg, mae'n rhaid i glinigwyr wneud penderfyniadau am achosion brys, ac mae'r rheini'n mynd i flaen y ciw. Dyna pam, os edrychwch chi ar nifer y bobl, mae ein niferoedd ni'n gostwng, mae eu rhai hwy'n cynyddu, ond rydym yn gweld mwy o'r achosion brys.
I appreciate the difficult job that you've got, Minister, I do. Of course, the gap is still significant on those two-year waits between Wales and the rest of the UK, and that can't be denied. It may well be right and correct—I'm glad those waits are coming down—but they are still significant. Here's an idea for getting those waits down—and I'm not going to mention surgical hubs this time either: doing more operations and treatments on the weekend. Patients are two and a half times less likely to be discharged on a Saturday or a Sunday than a weekday. This is only contributing, I would also add, to the bed blocking situation we have, which, of course, causes so many other issues within the Welsh NHS. It just highlights that in Wales we haven't truly got a seven-day service within the Welsh NHS, to the extent that we need it to be. To clear the backlog of treatments, specifically those long waits, can I ask the Minister whether she'll ensure that more is done on the weekend so patients do get the treatment they need, when they need it? Of course, that will ultimately help to bring those waiting lists down.
Rwy'n sicr yn derbyn bod gennych chi swydd anodd, Weinidog. Wrth gwrs, mae'r bwlch rhwng Cymru a gweddill y DU yn dal yn sylweddol gyda'r arosiadau dwy flynedd, ac nid oes modd gwadu hynny. Efallai'n wir ei bod yn iawn ac yn gywir—rwy'n falch fod yr arosiadau hynny'n lleihau—ond maent yn dal i fod yn sylweddol. Dyma syniad ar gyfer lleihau'r rhestrau aros—ac nid wyf yn mynd i sôn am hybiau llawfeddygol y tro hwn chwaith: gwneud mwy o lawdriniaethau a thriniaethau ar y penwythnos. Mae cleifion ddwywaith a hanner yn llai tebygol o gael eu rhyddhau ar ddydd Sadwrn neu ddydd Sul nag ar ddiwrnod o'r wythnos. Os caf ychwanegu, nid yw hyn ond yn cyfrannu at y sefyllfa sydd gennym gyda blocio gwelyau sy'n achosi cymaint o broblemau eraill o fewn GIG Cymru wrth gwrs. Mae'n dangos yn glir nad oes gennym wasanaeth saith diwrnod go iawn yn GIG Cymru, i'r graddau rydym ei angen. I glirio'r ôl-groniad o driniaethau, a'r arosiadau hir hynny'n arbennig, a gaf fi ofyn i'r Gweinidog sicrhau bod mwy yn cael ei wneud ar y penwythnos fel bod cleifion yn cael y driniaeth sydd ei hangen arnynt pan fydd ei hangen arnynt? Wrth gwrs, bydd hynny yn y pen draw yn helpu i leihau'r rhestrau aros.
Thanks very much. I know the Member was here yesterday for the announcement of our new diagnostic strategy, and in there it was very clearly stated that we are intending to expand the time frame when diagnostic treatment can happen, to include longer hours during the day and to include weekends. Obviously, if we do that, we have to find additional money to pay people to do that work, and you will know that what we've had is a real terms cut in terms of our budget this year. So, finding that additional money is not easy. I would love to be able to pay people to work more on the weekends, but, frankly, the financial situation is incredibly challenging at the moment. I'm sure the Member will be very pleased to note the announcement of those surgical hubs in relation to diagnostics, and it's important to emphasise how crucial that is to the waiting list pathway, because 85 per cent of people who need treatment need some kind of diagnosis. So, getting flow going in that pathway, trying to get people seen as fast as you can when it comes to diagnostics, will help bring those waiting lists down, but, crucially, will lead to better outcomes for patients.
Diolch yn fawr. Rwy'n gwybod bod yr Aelod yma ddoe ar gyfer y cyhoeddiad am ein strategaeth ddiagnostig newydd, ac ynddi nodwyd yn glir iawn ein bod yn bwriadu ehangu'r ffrâm amser pan all triniaeth ddiagnostig ddigwydd, i gynnwys oriau hirach yn ystod y dydd ac i gynnwys penwythnosau. Yn amlwg, os gwnawn hynny, mae'n rhaid inni ddod o hyd i arian ychwanegol i dalu pobl i wneud y gwaith hwnnw, ac fe fyddwch yn gwybod mai'r hyn a gawsom yw toriad mewn termau real i'n cyllideb eleni. Felly, nid yw'n hawdd dod o hyd i'r arian ychwanegol. Byddwn wrth fy modd yn gallu talu pobl i weithio mwy ar y penwythnosau, ond yn onest, mae'r sefyllfa ariannol yn hynod heriol ar hyn o bryd. Rwy'n siŵr y bydd yr Aelod yn falch iawn o nodi'r cyhoeddiad am yr hybiau llawfeddygol mewn perthynas â diagnosteg, ac mae'n bwysig pwysleisio pa mor hanfodol yw hynny i lwybr y rhestr aros, oherwydd mae angen rhyw fath o ddiagnosis ar 85 y cant o'r bobl sydd angen triniaeth. Felly, bydd cael llif cleifion ar hyd y llwybr hwnnw, a cheisio cael pobl i gael eu gweld mor gyflym ag y gallwch o ran diagnosteg, yn helpu i leihau'r rhestrau aros, ond yn hollbwysig, bydd yn arwain at ganlyniadau gwell i gleifion.
Llefarydd Plaid Cymru nawr. Peredur Owen Griffiths.
Plaid Cymru spokesperson, Peredur Owen Griffiths.
Since 2010, the NHS has lost almost 25,000 beds across the UK. In Wales, due to bed shortages, senior NHS staff have been advised by the Welsh Government to discharge people who are well enough to leave. This advice may come even if there is not a care package in place for patients being discharged. There also seems to be little consideration for the implications this might have on the care sector, which falls within my portfolio. Doctors have warned this discharge guidance could see patients die. This speaks volumes about the lack of joined-up thinking on the interactions between health and social care. It's one of the reasons why Plaid Cymru has pursued a merger between health and social care for a long time. Can you provide an update for us, Deputy Minister, about the expert group that is due to provide an implementation plan by the end of the year to integrate health and social care? Diolch.
Ers 2010, mae'r GIG wedi colli bron i 25,000 o welyau ar draws y DU. Yng Nghymru, oherwydd prinder gwelyau, mae uwch staff y GIG wedi cael cyngor gan Lywodraeth Cymru i ryddhau pobl sy'n ddigon iach i adael yr ysbyty. Gall y cyngor hwn ddod hyd yn oed os na fydd pecyn gofal yn ei le ar gyfer cleifion sy'n cael eu rhyddhau. Ymddengys hefyd nad oes fawr o ystyriaeth i'r goblygiadau y gallai hyn eu cael ar y sector gofal, sy'n dod o fewn fy mhortffolio i. Mae meddygon wedi rhybuddio y gallai'r canllawiau hyn ar ryddhau arwain at weld cleifion yn marw. Mae hyn yn dweud cyfrolau am y diffyg meddwl cydgysylltiedig ynglŷn â'r rhyngweithio rhwng iechyd a gofal cymdeithasol. Mae'n un o'r rhesymau pam fod Plaid Cymru wedi mynd ar drywydd uno iechyd a gofal cymdeithasol ers amser maith. A allwch chi ddarparu diweddariad i ni, Ddirprwy Weinidog, am y grŵp arbenigol sydd i fod i ddarparu cynllun gweithredu erbyn diwedd y flwyddyn ar gyfer integreiddio iechyd a gofal cymdeithasol? Diolch.
I thank Peredur very much for that question. The expert group, as you will know, has now reported, and I'm very pleased to be working with Plaid Cymru, as part of the co-operation agreement, on what we're going to do as a result of the expert group. We're approaching it in stages. The first stage will be the implementation of a national office, a national framework, and putting in place the building blocks that eventually will lead to a national care service. I absolutely agree with Peredur that it's essential that health and social care work closely together, and the Minister for Health and Social Services and myself have been working together to try to ensure that we make the liaison between the two absolutely as easy and as quick as it possibly can. We have got some very good examples of how that has worked.
Diolch yn fawr i Peredur am y cwestiwn. Mae'r grŵp arbenigol, fel y byddwch yn gwybod, wedi cyflwyno ei adroddiad erbyn hyn, ac rwy'n falch iawn o gael gweithio gyda Phlaid Cymru, fel rhan o'r cytundeb cydweithio, ar yr hyn rydym yn mynd i'w wneud o ganlyniad i'r grŵp arbenigol. Rydym yn ei wneud fesul cam. Y cam cyntaf fydd gweithredu swyddfa genedlaethol, fframwaith cenedlaethol, a rhoi'r blociau adeiladu yn eu lle a fydd yn y pen draw yn arwain at wasanaeth gofal cenedlaethol. Rwy'n cytuno'n llwyr â Peredur ei bod yn hanfodol fod iechyd a gofal cymdeithasol yn cydweithio'n agos, ac mae'r Gweinidog Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol a minnau wedi bod yn gweithio gyda'n gilydd i geisio sicrhau ein bod yn gwneud y cydgysylltiad rhwng y ddau mor hawdd a chyn gynted ag sy'n bosibl. Mae gennym enghreifftiau da iawn o sut mae hynny wedi gweithio.
Diolch. It's good to hear that progress is being made, so thank you for that update. One of the key contributors to delays in discharge to care is high bed occupancy. As I mentioned in the previous question, this is often due to the social care sector being unable to cope with the volume of patients being discharged from hospital that still need help at home. Patients are still continuing to face long waits, and even the smallest of delays to care can have severe consequences to their chances of a full recovery. Can the Deputy Minister outline the Welsh Government's plan to ensure that the social care sector will be supported and made more robust to cope with this year's anticipated winter pressures, taking on board some of the learnings that we've had coming out of the last winter?
Diolch. Mae'n dda clywed bod cynnydd yn cael ei wneud, felly diolch am y diweddariad. Un o'r pethau sy'n cyfrannu'n allweddol at oedi cyn rhyddhau i ofal yw'r nifer mawr o welyau sy'n cael eu defnyddio. Fel y soniais yn y cwestiwn blaenorol, mae hyn yn aml yn digwydd am nad yw'r sector gofal cymdeithasol yn gallu ymdopi â faint o gleifion sy'n cael eu rhyddhau o'r ysbyty ac sy'n dal i fod angen cymorth gartref. Mae cleifion yn parhau i wynebu arosiadau hir, a gall hyd yn oed yr oedi lleiaf cyn rhyddhau i ofal arwain at ganlyniadau difrifol i'w gobaith o wella'n iawn. A all y Dirprwy Weinidog amlinellu cynllun Llywodraeth Cymru i sicrhau y bydd y sector gofal cymdeithasol yn cael ei gefnogi a'i wneud yn fwy cadarn i ymdopi â phwysau'r gaeaf a ddisgwylir eleni, gan ddysgu rhai o'r gwersi o'r gaeaf diwethaf?
Yes, certainly. The last winter was difficult, but we worked together very closely with the care action committee, which was a committee made up of people from local authorities and from the health boards—key people working together. What we did was create extra capacity in the system. We actually created 687 beds or equivalent beds—step-down beds or community care packages—which made a big impact on the situation in the hospitals. I know that it was a difficult winter, but I think if we hadn't had that really great working together it would have been much, much worse. We did do that last winter, and we're working now in preparation for next winter. The Minister for Health and Social Services will actually be making an announcement in May, I think, about some details of our plans to move forward. What we want to do is—it's not really anything new—put more emphasis and support in having community-based local-facing help in order to ensure that people don't go into hospital. What we want to do is try and stop people going into hospital at all and to try to give that support in the community with multidisciplinary teams, health and social care working together on the ground, and with a lot of work with volunteers. We will be announcing that in May, but we are working now in order to try to improve the situation next winter.
Yn sicr. Roedd y gaeaf diwethaf yn anodd, ond fe wnaethom gydweithio'n agos iawn gyda'r pwyllgor gweithredu gofal, sef pwyllgor a oedd yn cynnwys pobl o awdurdodau lleol ac o'r byrddau iechyd—pobl allweddol yn gweithio gyda'i gilydd. Yr hyn a wnaethom oedd creu capasiti ychwanegol yn y system. Mewn gwirionedd, fe wnaethom greu 687 o welyau neu welyau cyfatebol—gwelyau gofal llai dwys neu becynnau gofal cymunedol—a gafodd effaith fawr ar y sefyllfa yn yr ysbytai. Rwy'n gwybod ei fod yn aeaf anodd, ond pe na baem wedi cydweithio mor wirioneddol wych rwy'n credu y byddai wedi bod yn llawer iawn gwaeth. Fe wnaethom hynny y gaeaf diwethaf, ac rydym yn gweithio nawr i baratoi ar gyfer y gaeaf nesaf. Mewn gwirionedd, bydd y Gweinidog Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol yn gwneud cyhoeddiad ym mis Mai, rwy'n meddwl, am rai o fanylion ein cynlluniau ar gyfer y dyfodol. Yr hyn rydym eisiau ei wneud—nid yw'n rhywbeth newydd mewn gwirionedd—yw cefnogi a rhoi mwy o bwyslais ar gael help lleol yn y gymuned er mwyn sicrhau nad yw pobl yn mynd i'r ysbyty. Rydym am geisio atal pobl rhag mynd i'r ysbyty o gwbl a cheisio rhoi cefnogaeth yn y gymuned gyda thimau amlddisgyblaethol, iechyd a gofal cymdeithasol yn cydweithio ar lawr gwlad, a chyda llawer o waith gyda gwirfoddolwyr. Byddwn yn cyhoeddi hynny ym mis Mai, ond rydym yn gweithio nawr er mwyn ceisio gwella'r sefyllfa y gaeaf nesaf.
3. Beth mae'r Llywodraeth yn ei wneud i sicrhau bod safleoedd ysbytai yn Nwyrain De Cymru yn hygyrch i bawb? OQ59412
3. What is the Government doing to ensure that hospital sites in South Wales East are accessible for all? OQ59412
Dylai pobl claf sydd angen mynediad i ysbytai allu gwneud hynny. Nid yw'r NHS yn gwahaniaethu wrth ymdrin â chleifion, gan gynnwys pobl anabl, pobl hŷn, pobl fregus ac eraill. Mae gan yr NHS yng Nghymru ddyletswydd gyfreithiol o dan Ddeddf Cydraddoldeb 2010 i sicrhau bod gwasanaethau yn hygyrch neu yn accessible i bawb.
Every patient who need to access a hospital should be able to do that. The NHS doesn't discriminate in dealing with patients, including disabled people, older people, vulnerable people and others. The NHS in Wales has a legal duty under the Equality Act 2010 to ensure that services are accessible to all.
Diolch yn fawr am yr ateb yna.
Thank you very much for that response.
Minister, one of the primary considerations for the location of a new hospital should be whether it is accessible for all patients, staff and visitors alike. The Grange hospital, near Cwmbran, may be a modern hospital, but it is, in fact, difficult to access for many of the communities it's meant to serve. We saw this when my Plaid Cymru colleagues Steve Skivens and Councillor Charlotte Bishop, both councillors representing Caerphilly—one in Penyrheol and one in the Aber valley—attempted to get to the hospital from Abertridwr using public transport. It took them two buses, more than two hours and at a cost of more than £9 each to get there. With the Government withdrawing pandemic funding for bus companies later this year, and the predictions of a catastrophic fallout for many bus services, the Grange hospital could become even more difficult for anyone not travelling by private motor vehicle. What consideration have you given to improving access to hospitals for those without motor vehicles? Do you share the concerns of Plaid Cymru about the fallout from the withdrawal of funding for bus companies from the perspective of accessing health services?
Weinidog, un o'r prif ystyriaethau ar gyfer lleoli ysbyty newydd yw a yw'n hygyrch i bob claf, ac i staff ac ymwelwyr fel ei gilydd. Efallai fod ysbyty'r Faenor, ger Cwmbrân, yn ysbyty modern, ond mewn gwirionedd nid yw'n hygyrch iawn i lawer o'r cymunedau y mae i fod i'w gwasanaethu. Gwelsom hyn pan wnaeth fy nghyd-aelodau o Blaid Cymru Steve Skivens a'r Cynghorydd Charlotte Bishop, y ddau'n gynghorwyr sy'n cynrychioli Caerffili—un ym Mhenyrheol ac un yng nghwm Aber—geisio cyrraedd yr ysbyty o Abertridwr gan ddefnyddio trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus. Fe gymerodd ddau fws a mwy na dwy awr ac ar gost o fwy na £9 yr un iddynt gyrraedd yno. Gyda'r Llywodraeth yn tynnu arian pandemig i gwmnïau bysiau yn ôl yn ddiweddarach eleni, a'r rhagfynegiadau o ganlyniadau trychinebus i lawer o wasanaethau bws, gallai fod yn anos byth i unrhyw un nad yw'n teithio mewn cerbyd preifat gyrraedd ysbyty'r Faenor. Pa ystyriaeth a roddwyd gennych i wella hygyrchedd ysbytai i bobl sydd heb gar? A ydych chi'n rhannu pryderon Plaid Cymru ynglŷn â chanlyniadau tynnu'r arian i gwmnïau bysys yn ôl o safbwynt hygyrchedd gwasanaethau iechyd?
Thanks very much. We are committed to trying to make sure that access is available for all. We have been concerned about access to the Grange hospital in particular, and I'd like to thank in particular my colleague Hefin, who's been working very hard on a particular project. I know that recently the Minister and Deputy Minister for Climate Change have agreed to a proposal to fund an initial trial bus service between Blackwood, Newbridge, Pontypool and the Grange hospital. The aim is to have that new bus service operational by the middle of June, and that, of course, adds to the bus routes that already go to the Grange hospital from the Gwent area—the route 29 from Newport, the 29A from Chepstow, the X1 from Brynmawr, the X24 from Blaenavon. What I can tell you is that, actually, £114,000 was committed to help community transport by the health board, and they are now co-ordinating a scheme to make sure that we can get as many community providers to help deliver the transport services needed under that scheme.
Diolch yn fawr. Rydym wedi ymrwymo i geisio sicrhau hygyrchedd i bawb. Rydym wedi bod yn pryderu am hygyrchedd ysbyty'r Faenor yn enwedig, a hoffwn ddiolch yn arbennig i fy nghyd-Aelod Hefin, sydd wedi bod yn gweithio'n galed iawn ar brosiect penodol. Rwy'n gwybod bod y Gweinidog a'r Dirprwy Weinidog Newid Hinsawdd wedi cytuno'n ddiweddar i gynnig ariannu treial cychwynnol ar gyfer gwasanaeth bws rhwng y Coed Duon, Trecelyn, Pont-y-pŵl ac ysbyty'r Faenor. Y nod yw cael y gwasanaeth bws newydd hwnnw'n weithredol erbyn canol mis Mehefin, ac mae hynny, wrth gwrs, yn ychwanegu at y llwybrau bysiau sydd eisoes yn mynd i ysbyty'r Faenor o ardal Gwent—llwybr 29 o Gasnewydd, 29A o Gas-gwent, X1 o Fryn-mawr, X24 o Flaenafon. Yr hyn y gallaf ei ddweud wrthych yw bod y bwrdd iechyd wedi addo £114,000 ar gyfer helpu trafnidiaeth gymunedol, ac maent bellach yn cydlynu cynllun i wneud yn siŵr y gallwn gael cymaint o ddarparwyr cymunedol i helpu i ddarparu'r gwasanaethau trafnidiaeth sydd eu hangen o dan y cynllun hwnnw.
Cwestiwn—. Nage, wir—Peter Fox.
Question—. No, indeed—Peter Fox.
Thank you, Llywydd. Minister, accessibility to hospital comes in different ways. Just yesterday, people were urged by Aneurin Bevan University Health Board not to attend the Grange hospital's A&E unless they had a life-threatening condition or serious injury. We learnt very late last night that the urgent message was made after the site faced two days of IT problems. I'm sure all would agree it is unacceptable for a hospital to essentially shut down vital services. One would have thought that all hospitals would have contingency plans to deal with these sorts of problems should they arise. Minister, what reassurances can you give my constituents that hospitals in south-east Wales have the appropriate contingency plans to ensure that they can be accessed at all times, and vital services aren't disrupted in the way that they were at the Grange, or still are at the Grange?
Diolch, Lywydd. Weinidog, mae sawl ffurf ar hygyrchedd ysbyty. Ddoe, cafodd pobl eu hannog gan Fwrdd Iechyd Prifysgol Aneurin Bevan i beidio â mynychu adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys ysbyty'r Faenor oni bai bod ganddynt gyflwr a oedd yn peryglu eu bywydau neu fod ganddynt anaf difrifol. Clywsom yn hwyr iawn neithiwr fod y neges frys wedi'i rhoi ar ôl i'r safle wynebu dau ddiwrnod o broblemau TG. Rwy'n siŵr y byddai pawb yn cytuno ei bod yn annerbyniol i ysbyty gau gwasanaethau hanfodol. Byddai rhywun wedi meddwl y byddai gan bob ysbyty gynlluniau wrth gefn i ymdopi â phroblemau o'r fath pe baent yn digwydd. Weinidog, pa sicrwydd y gallwch ei roi i fy hetholwyr fod gan ysbytai yn ne-ddwyrain Cymru gynlluniau wrth gefn priodol i sicrhau eu bod bob amser yn hygyrch, ac nad amharir ar wasanaethau hanfodol yn y ffordd a ddigwyddodd yn ysbyty'r Faenor, neu sy'n dal i ddigwydd yn ysbyty'r Faenor?
Thanks very much. This issue at the Grange was a global issue that affected a number of NHS Wales bodies in south Wales in particular who were using the Welsh Government's public sector broadband aggregation service. That's the service that's managed by BT. I'm very pleased to say that it has been mostly resolved now. BT and its partners have delivered a temporary fix while they're planning to undertake a permanent fix, and that's expected to be completed in two weeks.
I think it's fair to say that all NHS bodies kept citizens informed in relation to possible long waiting times for non-life-threatening treatments. What I can tell you is that, obviously, I'm very concerned about the situation. I had a meeting with my digital team this morning. We're going to work to quickly identify any continuing issues and, obviously, a lessons-learnt exercise will be carried out to make sure that we can prevent a similar occurrence from happening again.
Diolch yn fawr. Roedd y broblem hon yn ysbyty'r Faenor yn broblem fyd-eang a effeithiodd ar nifer o gyrff GIG Cymru yn ne Cymru yn enwedig a oedd yn defnyddio gwasanaeth cydgasglu band-eang sector cyhoeddus Llywodraeth Cymru. Dyna'r gwasanaeth sy'n cael ei reoli gan BT. Rwy'n falch iawn o ddweud ei fod wedi'i ddatrys i raddau helaeth bellach. Mae BT a'i bartneriaid wedi darparu ateb dros dro tra'u bod yn cynllunio datrysiad parhaol, ac mae disgwyl i hynny gael ei gwblhau mewn pythefnos.
Rwy'n credu ei bod yn deg dweud bod holl gyrff y GIG wedi rhoi gwybod i ddinasyddion ynglŷn â'r perygl o arosiadau hir am driniaethau lle nad oedd bywyd yn y fantol. Yn amlwg, yr hyn y gallaf ei ddweud wrthych yw fy mod yn bryderus iawn ynglŷn â'r sefyllfa. Cefais gyfarfod gyda fy nhîm digidol y bore yma. Rydym yn mynd i weithio ar nodi unrhyw broblemau sy'n parhau yn gyflym ac yn amlwg, bydd ymarfer dysgu gwersi yn cael ei gynnal i wneud yn siŵr y gallwn atal digwyddiad tebyg rhag digwydd eto.
5. Pa gamau mae Llywodraeth Cymru'n bwriadu eu cymryd i fynd i'r afael â chamddefnyddio Botox er mwyn gwneud elw? OQ59407
5. What action is Welsh Government planning to take to tackle the misuse of Botox for profit? OQ59407
Botulinum toxin—I'm sure I've mispronounced that, but I hope you can tell I don't use it—injections such as Botox, relax the muscles in the face to smooth out lines and wrinkles. Now, the effect isn't permanent, and it usually lasts for about three to four months. The Public Health (Wales) Act 2017 provides the ability to add procedures to a special procedure register and for local authorities to then issue licences to providers. Now, we're starting that process with tattooing, acupuncture, electrolysis and body piercing, but we will consider adding other cosmetic procedures in future based on the evidence of risk.
Mae chwistrelliadau o botulinum tocsin—rwy'n siŵr fy mod wedi'i gam-ynganu, ond rwy'n gobeithio y gallwch ddweud nad wyf yn ei ddefnyddio—fel Botox, yn llacio cyhyrau yn yr wyneb i lyfnhau crychion a rhychau. Nawr, nid yw'r effaith yn barhaol, ac fel arfer mae'n para am oddeutu tri i bedwar mis. Mae Deddf Iechyd y Cyhoedd (Cymru) 2017 yn darparu'r gallu i ychwanegu triniaethau at gofrestr o driniaethau arbennig ac i awdurdodau lleol roi trwyddedau i ddarparwyr yn sgil hynny. Nawr, rydym yn dechrau'r broses honno gyda thatŵio, aciwbigo, electrolysis a thyllu'r corff, ond byddwn yn ystyried ychwanegu triniaethau cosmetig eraill yn y dyfodol yn seiliedig ar dystiolaeth o risg.
Thank you for that answer. Research done by University College London of clinics in London found that nine out of 10 are flouting the regulations that are intended to protect public health, which ban the advertising of this drug and other products of botulinum toxin, or, indeed, any other prescribed medicine for profit. It's difficult to believe that practitioners in Wales are being more adherent to the rules. Clearly, there are situations where somebody can be delegated to prescribe a medicine, but, in this case, this is an attempt to make money out of people's anxiety about different parts of their body—nothing to do with public health. And, in contrast, people are being prescribed these things without people having even been seen. We know that these sorts of injections can cause pain, headaches, swelling, bruising, partial facial paralysis, and even disfigurement, so safe prescribing practice is an essential component of public protection. We do not know what we are walking into in terms of the way it can come back to hit us in the NHS. So, it would be very useful to know why we cannot pay more attention to this abuse of prescribed medicines at this point being used by private clinics where the oversight is almost non-existent.
Diolch am yr ateb. Canfu ymchwil gan Goleg Prifysgol Llundain o glinigau yn Llundain fod naw o bob 10 yn diystyru’r rheoliadau a fwriadwyd ar gyfer diogelu iechyd y cyhoedd, sy'n gwahardd hysbysebu'r cyffur hwn a chynhyrchion botulinum tocsin eraill, neu'n wir, unrhyw feddyginiaeth arall a roddir ar bresgripsiwn er mwyn gwneud elw. Mae'n anodd credu bod ymarferwyr yng Nghymru yn glynu'n well at y rheolau. Yn amlwg, ceir sefyllfaoedd lle gellir dirprwyo rhywun i bresgripsiynu meddyginiaeth, ond yn yr achos hwn, dyma ymgais i wneud arian o bryder pobl am wahanol rannau o'u cyrff—dim i'w wneud ag iechyd y cyhoedd. A chaiff y pethau hyn eu presgripsiynu i bobl heb iddynt gael eu gweld hyd yn oed. Rydym yn gwybod y gall y mathau hyn o chwistrelliadau achosi poen, cur pen, chwyddo, cleisio, parlys rhannol i'r wyneb, a hyd yn oed anffurfiad, felly mae ymarfer presgripsiynu diogel yn elfen hanfodol o ddiogelu'r cyhoedd. Ni wyddom beth rydym yn ei wynebu o ran y ffordd y gall ddod yn ôl i'n taro yn y GIG. Felly, byddai'n ddefnyddiol iawn gwybod pam na allwn dalu mwy o sylw i'r camddefnydd o feddyginiaethau presgripsiwn yn y ffordd hon sy'n digwydd ar hyn o bryd gan glinigau preifat lle na cheir fawr ddim goruchwyliaeth.
Thanks very much. I think this is an area that we should be concerned about. I would urge anyone thinking of having one of these procedures to check the credentials of the people administering Botox because they may not always be qualified or experienced. There are regulations surrounding this and the professional regulators require any practitioner prescribing Botox—. Botox is one of about seven different—. That’s a kind of name for a particular type of treatment. But, what happens is that often they delegate that administration to another person, and that person who's administering the prescription doesn't necessarily have the knowledge, the skills and the training to administer it. So, I would expect professional regulators to take action against any registrant who doesn't adhere to accepted professional standards on delegating that responsibility to others. But, obviously, such matters are reserved and they're not devolved to Welsh Ministers.
Diolch yn fawr. Rwy'n credu bod hwn yn faes y dylem fod yn bryderus yn ei gylch. Byddwn yn annog unrhyw un sy'n ystyried cael un o'r triniaethau hyn i wirio cymwysterau'r bobl sy'n rhoi Botox oherwydd efallai na fyddant bob amser yn gymwys neu'n brofiadol. Ceir rheoliadau'n ymwneud â hyn ac mae'r rheoleiddwyr proffesiynol yn ei gwneud yn ofynnol i bob ymarferydd sy'n presgripsiynu Botox—. Mae Botox yn un o oddeutu saith gwahanol—. Mae'n fath o enw am fath arbennig o driniaeth. Ond yr hyn sy'n digwydd yw eu bod yn aml yn dirprwyo'r gwaith o'i roi i rywun arall, ac nid yw'r person sy'n rhoi'r presgripsiwn o reidrwydd yn meddu ar yr wybodaeth na'r sgiliau, nac wedi cael hyfforddiant addas i allu ei ddarparu. Felly, byddwn yn disgwyl i reoleiddwyr proffesiynol roi camau ar waith yn erbyn unrhyw un sydd wedi cofrestru ond nad yw'n cydymffurfio â safonau proffesiynol priodol ar ddirprwyo'r cyfrifoldeb hwnnw i eraill. Ond yn amlwg, mae materion o'r fath wedi'u cadw yn ôl a heb eu datganoli i Weinidogion Cymru.
5. A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad am ddarparu gwasanaethau tynnu cwyr clust diogel o fewn y GIG? OQ59388
5. Will the Minister make a statement on the provision of safe ear wax removal services within the NHS? OQ59388
The new NHS Wales pathway, with national clinical standards for the safe delivery of wax management services, is being implemented across all health boards, with advanced progress made by Betsi Cadwaladr and Swansea Bay University Health Boards. Good practice is being shared with the other health boards to support implementation.
Mae llwybr newydd GIG Cymru, gyda safonau clinigol cenedlaethol ar gyfer darparu gwasanaethau tynnu cwyr clust yn ddiogel, ar waith ym mhob bwrdd iechyd, ac mae byrddau Iechyd Betsi Cadwaladr a Phrifysgol Bae Abertawe wedi gwneud cynnydd da yn hyn o beth. Mae arferion da'n cael eu rhannu gyda'r byrddau iechyd eraill i gefnogi'r broses o'u gweithredu.
Thanks for that answer, Minister. I've been contacted by a lot of constituents who are concerned about the impact cutting NHS wax removal services will have on them. For many people, this service is absolutely essential, but they're now being told that the service is no longer provided in primary care. One constituent told me that her son had an ear wax build-up and his school had contacted her several times to say that this was affecting his hearing, which was in turn impacting his learning. Having been refused NHS treatment, his mum is now ineffectively managing the issue at home with no idea how safe it actually is. Another constituent told me that, with the cost-of-living pressures, he can no longer afford to pay privately for treatment and can no longer access it through the NHS. With private treatment costing between £50 and £100, many residents simply can't afford this extra cost. Personally, I can't see any reason why treatment can't be provided in different community-based settings. So, Minister, what discussions have you had with the Aneurin Bevan health board about this? And will you commit to looking at new ways for this essential treatment to be delivered to residents all across Wales? Thanks.
Diolch am yr ateb hwnnw, Weinidog. Mae llawer o etholwyr wedi cysylltu â mi am eu bod yn poeni am yr effaith y bydd torri gwasanaethau tynnu cwyr y GIG yn ei chael arnynt hwy. I lawer o bobl, mae'r gwasanaeth hwn yn gwbl hanfodol, ond dywedir wrthynt bellach nad yw'r gwasanaeth yn cael ei ddarparu mewn gofal sylfaenol mwyach. Dywedodd un etholwr wrthyf fod gan ei mab lawer o gŵyr clust a bod ei ysgol wedi cysylltu â hi sawl gwaith i ddweud ei fod yn effeithio ar ei glyw, a hynny'n ei dro yn effeithio ar ei ddysgu. Gwrthodwyd triniaeth GIG iddo ac mae'r fam bellach yn rheoli'r mater yn aneffeithiol gartref heb unrhyw syniad pa mor ddiogel yw hynny mewn gwirionedd. Dywedodd etholwr arall wrthyf nad yw bellach yn gallu fforddio talu'n breifat am driniaeth oherwydd y pwysau costau byw ac nad yw'n gallu cael y driniaeth drwy'r GIG mwyach. Gan fod triniaeth breifat yn costio rhwng £50 a £100, mae llawer o drigolion yn methu fforddio'r gost ychwanegol hon. Yn bersonol, ni allaf weld unrhyw reswm pam na ellir darparu triniaeth mewn gwahanol leoliadau yn y gymuned. Felly, Weinidog, pa drafodaethau a gawsoch chi gyda bwrdd iechyd Aneurin Bevan ynglŷn â hyn? Ac a fyddwch chi'n ymrwymo i edrych ar ffyrdd newydd o ddarparu'r driniaeth hanfodol hon i drigolion ledled Cymru? Diolch.
Well, thanks very much. And I want to make it clear that no-one should expect to have to pay for this service. So, actually, in terms of audiology, we have a pathway now that is very different from what is happening elsewhere in the United Kingdom. We are trying to move to a community-based service, but I recognise that waiting times are not where we want them to be and tackling that backlog is a key priority for me. That emphasis on delivery of care in the community is crucial. I've asked all the health boards to look at best practice. So, we know it's working well in Betsi and it's working well in Swansea. If you want to write to me about the specific case so that I can just look at where the gap is, it may be useful for me to just put a little bit of pressure on. Thank you.
Wel, diolch yn fawr. Ac rwyf am ei gwneud yn glir na ddylai neb ddisgwyl gorfod talu am y gwasanaeth hwn. Felly, mewn gwirionedd, mae gennym lwybr awdioleg nawr sy'n wahanol iawn i'r hyn sy'n digwydd mewn rhannau eraill o'r Deyrnas Unedig. Rydym yn ceisio symud i wasanaeth yn y gymuned, ond rwy'n cydnabod nad yw amseroedd aros lle rydym am iddynt fod ac mae mynd i'r afael â'r ôl-groniad hwnnw'n flaenoriaeth allweddol i mi. Mae'r pwyslais ar ddarparu gofal yn y gymuned yn hollbwysig. Rwyf wedi gofyn i'r holl fyrddau iechyd edrych ar arferion gorau. Felly, fe wyddom ei fod yn gweithio'n dda yn Betsi Cadwaladr ac mae'n gweithio'n dda yn Abertawe. Os hoffech ysgrifennu ataf am yr achos penodol hwn imi allu edrych i weld ble mae'r bwlch, efallai y byddai'n ddefnyddiol pe bawn yn pwyso rhywfaint i'r perwyl hwnnw. Diolch.
6. A wnaiff y Gweinidog roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf am recriwtio nyrsys? OQ59397
6. Will the Minister provide an update on the recruitment of nurses? OQ59397
Rŷn ni’n recriwtio a hyfforddi mwy o nyrsys nag erioed. Rŷn ni’n defnyddio ffyrdd amrywiol o recriwtio a denu staff, gan gynnwys recriwtio'n rhyngwladol a mwy o fuddsoddi nag erioed mewn addysg a hyfforddiant. Mae ein cynllun gweithredu cenedlaethol ar gyfer y gweithlu yn cynnwys nifer o gamau gweithredu. Fe fydd y camau hyn yn cael eu cymryd ar y cyd, gan ddarparu gweithlu cynaliadwy ar gyfer y dyfodol.
We are recruiting and training more nurses than ever before. We are using a range of approaches to recruit and attract staff, including international recruitment and record investment in education and training. Our national workforce implementation plan contains a number of actions, and these actions will be delivered collaboratively, providing a sustainable workforce for the future.
Diolch i'r Gweinidog am yr ateb. Fe glywodd y Gweinidog fi wrth gwrs yn gofyn cwestiwn i’r Prif Weinidog ddoe ynghylch Ysbyty Tywyn. Yn ei ymateb, fe ddywedodd y Prif Weinidog fod staff yn cael eu trosglwyddo i Ddolgellau er mwyn sicrhau gwasanaethau yn yr ardal. Doedd o ddim yn glir pa ardal yr oedd y Prif Weinidog yn cyfeirio ati gan fod Tywyn dros hanner awr i ffwrdd o Ddolgellau mewn car, heb sôn am mewn bws. Felly, erys y pwynt fod Bro Dysynni wedi colli gwasanaeth hanfodol yn ddiweddar. Rŵan, mae Bro Dysynni yn ardal odidog. Mae’n lle gwych i weithio ynddo, efo safon bywyd uchel ac addysg ragorol yn yr ardal. Os oes yna unrhyw nyrs allan yno am brofi gweithle gwych mewn ardal hyfryd, yna mi fuaswn i'n argymell ystyried gweithio yn Nhywyn. Ond bob tro rydyn ni'n codi'r cwestiwn am niferoedd nyrsys, fel rŵan, rydych chi, y Gweinidog, ac eraill, yn sôn bod yna fwy o nyrsys nag erioed yn gweithio i'r gwasanaeth iechyd. Efallai fod hynny'n wir, ond mae yna brinder dybryd mewn rhannau o Gymru. Dim ond pedwar nyrs ar fandiau 6 a 7 sydd eu hangen er mwyn galluogi ailagor ward Dyfi yn Nhywyn. Mi drïodd y bwrdd recriwtio nyrsys o asiantaethau nyrsio gan ddiogelu llety iddyn nhw, ond fe fethodd yr asiantaethau â darparu'r nyrsys hynny. Mae hyn yn ei hun yn gywilyddus. Felly, pa gamau mae'r Gweinidog yn eu cymryd er mwyn sicrhau bod yna ddigon o nyrsys ar gael i ailagor ward Dyfi ac uned mân anafiadau Tywyn? Ydy'r Gweinidog yn medru gweithredu i sicrhau bod asiantaethau nyrsys yn darparu'r nyrsys sy'n cael eu haddo?
I thank the Minister for that response. The Minister will have heard me asking a question of the First Minister yesterday on Tywyn Hospital. In his response, the First Minister said that staff were transferred to Dolgellau in order to ensure services in the area. It wasn't clear which area the First Minister was referring to because Tywyn is over half an hour away from Dolgellau by car, never mind those using buses. So, it remains that Bro Dysynni has lost a crucial service recently. Now, Bro Dysynni is a glorious area. It's a wonderful place to work, it has a good quality of life and excellent education in the area. If any nurse out there wants to experience a great workplace in a wonderful area, then I would recommend that they consider working in Tywyn. But every time we raise the question of nurse numbers, as I've just done, you as Minister, and others, tell us that there are more nurses than ever before working in the health service. That might be true, but there is a great shortage in some parts of Wales. Only four nurses in bands 6 and 7 are required to reopen the Dyfi ward in Tywyn. The board tried to recruit nurses from nursing agencies, having secured accommodation for them, but the agencies failed to provide those nurses. This in itself is disgraceful. What steps is the Minister taking in order to ensure that there are adequate numbers of nurses available to reopen the Dyfi ward and the minor injuries unit in Tywyn? Can the Minister take action to ensure that nursing agencies do provide nurses as promised?
Diolch yn fawr. Rŷch chi'n ymwybodol bod y bwrdd iechyd wedi mynd ati yn arw i wneud ymgais i recriwtio i'r ardal yna. Un o'r pethau sydd gyda ni mewn lle yw'r national workforce implementation plan ac, fel rhan o hynny, rŷn ni'n gosod mewn lle incentives i dargedu nid yn unig y grwpiau rŷn ni eisiau gweld mwy ohonyn nhw, ond i ble yn union rŷn ni eisiau anfon y bobl yma. Rŷn ni'n gwneud hynny, er enghraifft, gyda deintyddion—yn ceisio anfon deintyddion i ardaloedd lle, yn draddodiadol, mae hi wedi bod yn anodd recriwtio iddyn nhw. Mae gwaith yn cael ei wneud gan Addysg a Gwella Iechyd Cymru ar hynny.
Ond, mae 446 mwy o nyrsys yn gweithio, er enghraifft, yn Betsi na 10 mlynedd yn ôl. Felly, mae'r gyfran wedi mynd i fyny, ond mae'r galw wedi mynd i fyny. Dyna ran o'r broblem—mae'r galw yn uwch nag erioed. Byddwch chi'n ymwybodol ein bod ni'n gwario dros £0.25 biliwn yn flynyddol ar hyfforddiant ar gyfer y gwasanaeth iechyd. Rŷn ni yn amlwg yn ceisio recriwtio. Fe wnaethon ni recriwtio 400 o nyrsys y llynedd, ac mae lot o waith ar y gweill ar hyn o bryd i recriwtio mwy o nyrsys rhyngwladol. Rhan o'r sialens ar hyn o bryd yw, hyd yn oed os ŷn ni'n gallu eu recriwtio nhw, ble i'w rhoi nhw. Mae yna broblem o ran ble rŷn ni'n rhoi'r bobl yma unwaith inni eu recriwtio nhw. Mae hwnna hefyd yn sialens y mae'n rhaid inni feddwl amdani ac ymdrin â hi, yn arbennig yng nghefn gwlad Cymru.
Thank you very much. You're aware that the health board has tried very hard to recruit to that area. One of the things that we have in place is the national workforce implementation plan and, as part of that, we are putting incentives in place to target not only the groups that we want to see more of, but where exactly we want to send those people. We are doing that, for example, with dentists—we're trying to send dentists to areas where it's traditionally been difficult to recruit to that profession. Work is being done by Health Education and Improvement Wales on that.
But 446 more nurses are working in Betsi, for example, than there were 10 years ago. So, the proportion has gone up, but the demand has gone up. That's part of the problem—the demand is higher than ever before. You'll be aware that we spend more than £0.25 billion annually on training for the NHS. Evidently, we're trying to recruit. We recruited 400 nurses last year and there is lots of work in the pipeline to recruit more nurses internationally. Part of the challenge at present is, even if you can recruit them, where to put them. There is a problem in terms of where we put these people once we recruit them. That is also a challenge that we have to think about and tackle, particularly in rural areas.
Minister, nurse recruitment is something that's actually really important to me, and I've talked to you on a number of occasions about getting more access for nurses to come into the NHS. When my mother was a nurse starting off in the NHS, she went from a vocational route, coming in at the bottom and learning on the job, getting more and more qualifications right the way up to ward sister. What is the Welsh Government doing to make sure that there are more routes into nursing other than the ones that are currently available through university?
Weinidog, mae recriwtio nyrsys yn rhywbeth sy'n bwysig iawn i mi, ac rwyf wedi siarad â chi ar sawl achlysur am gael mwy o fynediad i nyrsys allu dod i mewn i'r GIG. Pan oedd fy mam yn nyrs yn dechrau yn y GIG, aeth o lwybr galwedigaethol, a dod i mewn ar y gwaelod a dysgu yn y swydd, cael mwy a mwy o gymwysterau, yr holl ffordd i fyny at fod yn brif nyrs ward. Beth mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei wneud i sicrhau bod mwy o lwybrau i mewn i nyrsio heblaw am y rhai sydd ar gael drwy'r brifysgol ar hyn o bryd?
Thanks very much. Over the past five years, we have increased the number of training places by 41 per cent for nurses. But you're quite right, we've got to find new ways of getting people in, and in particular into some of those areas where it's more difficult to recruit. That's why we have, for example, nurse apprenticeship routes. I know that that has been used extensively in some healthcare settings. There's a lot more distance learning whereby people can start off on that route but then go and do their placements later on. It's where they're training as well, which is why, for example, we've opened—I was pleased to see the Llywydd at that event—a new facility in Aberystwyth, so that we're training people and then the placements will be locally. It's really important, I think, for us to, as you suggest, find new routes for people to come in, in particular since it's become a degree-level course now. What we're keen to see is people who perhaps haven't gone to university like that. Actually, compassion is probably one of the key things that you need to be a nurse, and I think there are real opportunities for people. One of the things we're keen to do, of course, is to work with the care sector to provide a route for people to enter into the workforce as well, into the NHS workforce, so that those pathways are clearer for people.
Diolch yn fawr. Dros y pum mlynedd diwethaf, rydym wedi cynyddu nifer y lleoedd hyfforddi 41 y cant ar gyfer nyrsys. Ond rydych chi'n hollol iawn, mae'n rhaid inni ddod o hyd i ffyrdd newydd o gael pobl i mewn, ac yn arbennig i rai o'r meysydd y mae'n anos recriwtio iddynt. Dyna pam mae gennym lwybrau prentisiaeth nyrsio er enghraifft. Gwn fod hynny wedi'i ddefnyddio'n helaeth mewn rhai lleoliadau gofal iechyd. Ceir llawer mwy o ddysgu o bell lle gall pobl ddechrau ar y llwybr a mynd i wneud eu lleoliadau gwaith yn nes ymlaen. Dyna lle maent yn hyfforddi hefyd, a dyna pam, er enghraifft, ein bod ni wedi agor cyfleuster newydd yn Aberystwyth—roeddwn yn falch o weld y Llywydd yn y digwyddiad hwnnw—fel ein bod yn hyfforddi pobl ac yna bydd y lleoliadau gwaith yn lleol. Fel rydych chi'n awgrymu, rwy'n credu ei bod hi'n bwysig iawn inni ddod o hyd i lwybrau newydd i bobl allu dod i mewn, yn enwedig ers iddo ddod yn gwrs lefel gradd bellach. Yr hyn rydym yn awyddus i'w weld yw pobl sydd efallai heb fynd i'r brifysgol fel hynny. Mewn gwirionedd, mae'n debyg mai tosturi yw un o'r pethau allweddol sydd eu hangen arnoch i fod yn nyrs, ac rwy'n meddwl bod cyfleoedd go iawn i bobl. Un o'r pethau rydym yn awyddus i'w wneud, wrth gwrs, yw gweithio gyda'r sector gofal i ddarparu llwybr i bobl fynd i mewn i'r gweithlu hefyd, i weithlu'r GIG, fel bod y llwybrau hynny'n fwy eglur i bobl.
7. Pa gamau mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn eu cymryd i gyflymu'r llwybr trin canser? OQ59380
7. What action is the Welsh Government taking to speed up the cancer treatment pathway? OQ59380
We set out our expectations of the NHS in the 2021 quality statement for cancer and a series of national actions in our 2022 programme for transforming and modernising planned care. In January of this year, I also announced the NHS response, as set out in the cancer improvement plan.
Rydym wedi amlinellu ein disgwyliadau ar gyfer y GIG yn natganiad ansawdd 2021 ar gyfer canser a chyfres o gamau gweithredu cenedlaethol yn rhaglen 2022 ar gyfer trawsnewid a moderneiddio gofal a gynlluniwyd. Ym mis Ionawr eleni, cyhoeddais ymateb y GIG hefyd, fel y nodwyd yn y cynllun gwella gwasanaethau canser.
Thank you, Minister. In February, only 58 per cent of men and 57 per cent of women in north Wales were starting treatment within the 62-day target. That was worse than December 2022. Behind those figures are some of my constituents in serious distress. One of my residents died, sadly, before receiving any treatment for stomach cancer in Liverpool. Another one of my constituents has waited around four months for lung cancer treatment in Liverpool, but has now just had the treatment, thanks to coming to see me. And a consultant at the Christie has identified that another in one of my residents, who was told by Ysbyty Gwynedd that she was clear, it's now been found, since her going privately, that she has four pockets of cancer in the abdomen and the folds of the liver. This is a very young mother. Now, Richard Pugh, Macmillan Cancer Support Wales, has stated that:
'Cancer treatment in Wales now rests firmly on the flip of a coin – people with cancer face no better than 50/50 odds on whether they are treated on time'.
Now, I am currently liaising with the health board and the ombudsman in relation to the examples that I have had to provide you with, and it wasn't easy to give you those examples. These are individuals with families. But in this instance, they highlight the importance to north Wales of specialist services in England. So, my main question to you today, Minister, is: what steps are you taking to speed up the process of Aberconwy patients, and people across Wales, especially when these patients require treatment outside Wales? The funding applications are very, very problematic and there are huge delays. You cannot delay when someone is diagnosed with life-threatening cancer. Diolch.
Diolch, Weinidog. Ym mis Chwefror, dim ond 58 y cant o ddynion a 57 y cant o fenywod yng ngogledd Cymru oedd yn dechrau triniaeth o fewn y targed o 62 diwrnod. Roedd hynny'n waeth na mis Rhagfyr 2022. Y tu ôl i'r ffigyrau hynny mae rhai o fy etholwyr mewn gofid difrifol. Bu farw un o fy nhrigolion cyn cael unrhyw driniaeth ar gyfer canser y stumog yn Lerpwl. Mae un arall o fy etholwyr wedi aros tua phedwar mis am driniaeth canser yr ysgyfaint yn Lerpwl, ond mae bellach newydd gael y driniaeth, diolch i'r ffaith iddynt ddod i fy ngweld i. Ac mae meddyg ymgynghorol yn ysbyty Christie wedi nodi bod un arall o fy nhrigolion, a gafodd wybod gan Ysbyty Gwynedd ei bod hi'n glir, bellach wedi canfod, ers iddi fynd yn breifat, fod ganddi bedwar tiwmor canser yn yr abdomen a chrychion yr afu. Mam ifanc iawn yw hon. Nawr, mae Richard Pugh, Cymorth Canser Macmillan Cymru, wedi dweud:
'Mae triniaeth canser yng Nghymru bellach yn fater o hap - nid yw pobl â chanser yn wynebu tebygolrwydd gwell na 50/50 o gael eu trin mewn pryd'.
Nawr, rwy'n cysylltu â'r bwrdd iechyd a'r ombwdsmon ar hyn o bryd mewn perthynas â'r enghreifftiau y bu'n rhaid i mi eu darparu i chi, ac nid oedd yn hawdd rhoi'r enghreifftiau hynny i chi. Mae'r rhain yn unigolion a chanddynt deuluoedd. Ond yn yr achos hwn, maent yn tynnu sylw at bwysigrwydd gwasanaethau arbenigol yn Lloegr i ogledd Cymru. Felly, fy mhrif gwestiwn i chi heddiw, Weinidog, yw: pa gamau rydych yn eu cymryd i gyflymu'r broses i gleifion Aberconwy, a phobl ledled Cymru, yn enwedig pan fo'r cleifion hyn angen triniaeth y tu allan i Gymru? Mae'r ceisiadau am arian yn broblematig iawn ac mae yna oedi enfawr. Ni allwch oedi pan fydd rhywun yn cael diagnosis o ganser sy'n peryglu bywyd. Diolch.
Thanks, Janet, and I want to extend my empathy to those people who are suffering. One in two people are going to get cancer during their lifetime, so we're talking about huge numbers of the population, and in order to get a diagnosis of cancer, to get to the 5 per cent, we need to test 95 per cent of the public. And, obviously, we want to get there early, as soon as we can—early.
So, you weren't here for my statement yesterday, when I announced our new diagnostics recovery and transformation strategy, and diagnostics is absolutely key to addressing the issue in relation to cancer. So, if that process at the beginning of the system is held up in any way, then it's more difficult to reach the 62-day waiting time. So, we have got a long way to go on cancer. It is absolutely in the top six priorities that I've set the health boards. Some are more challenging than others. I have regular cancer summit meetings. You will also have heard that, actually, there are really new advances in technology, and I'm hoping to make sure that we exploit those. So, for example, I went to Cardiff University on Thursday to look at how they're using liquid biopsies to take blood samples that can detect cancer, and if you do that, then you don't need these huge machines and all the stress; the results come back much quicker.
Now, we're very much at the beginning of this process and we're doing very, very cutting edge things here in Wales. But I'm hoping, in years to come, that, actually, we'll be going a lot more down that route, and that will speed the whole process up. So, I've asked them to concentrate, for now, on the ones who are waiting for more than 62 days, because those are the people we absolutely need to get to, and, obviously, as we do that, the 62-day target will go up a little bit. So, we're in that situation now, but they are starting to come down. I'm pleased to say that 12,700 patients in Wales were informed that they didn't have cancer in February. So, there are lots of people getting good news, but I'm concerned about the ones who are waiting for the bad news, so that they can start their recovery quicker.
Diolch, Janet, ac rwyf am gydymdeimlo â'r bobl sy'n dioddef. Mae un o bob dau unigolyn yn mynd i gael canser yn ystod eu hoes, felly rydym yn siarad am niferoedd enfawr o'r boblogaeth, ac er mwyn cael diagnosis o ganser, i gyrraedd y 5 y cant, mae angen inni brofi 95 y cant o'r cyhoedd. Ac yn amlwg, rydym eisiau cyrraedd yno'n gynnar, cyn gynted ag y gallwn.
Felly, nid oeddech yma ar gyfer fy natganiad ddoe, pan gyhoeddais ein strategaeth adfer a thrawsnewid diagnosteg newydd, ac mae diagnosteg yn gwbl allweddol i fynd i'r afael â chanser. Felly, os yw'r broses ar ddechrau'r system yn cael ei dal yn ôl mewn unrhyw ffordd, mae'n anos cyrraedd yr amser aros o 62 diwrnod. Felly, mae gennym ffordd bell i fynd gyda chanser. Mae'n sicr yn y chwe blaenoriaeth uchaf a osodais i'r byrddau iechyd. Mae rhai yn fwy heriol nag eraill. Rwy'n cael uwchgyfarfodydd rheolaidd ar ganser. Fe fyddwch wedi clywed hefyd fod datblygiadau newydd iawn mewn technoleg, ac rwy'n gobeithio sicrhau ein bod yn manteisio ar y rheini. Felly, er enghraifft, fe euthum i Brifysgol Caerdydd ddydd Iau i edrych ar sut maent yn defnyddio biopsïau hylifol i gymryd samplau gwaed sy'n gallu canfod canser, ac os gwnewch chi hynny, nid oes angen y peiriannau enfawr hyn a'r holl straen; daw'r canlyniadau yn eu holau'n llawer cyflymach.
Nawr, nid yw'r broses hon ond megis dechrau ac rydym yn gwneud pethau blaengar tu hwnt yma yng Nghymru. Ond rwy'n gobeithio, mewn blynyddoedd i ddod, y byddwn yn mynd ar y trywydd hwnnw'n amlach, a bydd hynny'n cyflymu'r holl broses. Felly, rwyf wedi gofyn iddynt ganolbwyntio, am y tro, ar y rhai sy'n aros am fwy na 62 diwrnod, oherwydd dyna'r bobl y mae gwir angen inni eu cyrraedd, ac yn amlwg, wrth inni wneud hynny, bydd y targed o 62 diwrnod yn codi ychydig bach. Felly, rydym yn y sefyllfa honno nawr, ond maent yn dechrau gostwng. Rwy'n falch o ddweud bod 12,700 o gleifion yng Nghymru wedi cael gwybod nad oedd ganddynt ganser ym mis Chwefror. Felly, mae yna lawer o bobl yn cael newyddion da, ond rwy'n pryderu am y rhai sy'n aros am y newyddion drwg, fel bod modd iddynt ddechrau eu hadferiad yn gynt.
Yn olaf, cwestiwn 8, Llyr Gruffydd.
Finally, question 8, Llyr Gruffydd.
8. Pa asesiad y mae'r Gweinidog wedi'i wneud o ddigonolrwydd gwasanaethau deintyddol plant yn y GIG? OQ59398
8. What assessment has the Minister made of the adequacy of children's dental services in the NHS? OQ59398
Mae dros 277,000 o blant wedi cael eu trin mewn gwasanaethau deintyddol cyffredin ers Ebrill 2022. Mae dros 60,000 o’r rhain yn gleifion newydd.
Over 277,000 children have been treated in general dental services since April 2022. More than 60,000 of these are new patients.
Mae yna deulu wedi cysylltu â fi yn tynnu sylw at sefyllfa eu merch. Mae hi wedi bod yn disgwyl cael triniaeth gan orthodeintydd ers yr oedd hi’n 11 oed. Erbyn hyn, mae’n 14 oed. Dyw hi ddim wedi derbyn unrhyw apwyntiad yn y dair blynedd y mae hi wedi bod yn aros am un. Pythefnos yn ôl, mi gafodd hi wybod bod yr orthodeintydd yn ei chyfeirio hi yn ôl at ei deintyddfa leol. Nawr, yn y cyfamser, wrth gwrs, dyw’r ddeintyddfa leol yna bellach ddim yn cynnig gwasanaethau NHS, ac hefyd, mae’r rhestr ar gyfer triniaeth breifat yn llawn—hynny yw, mae’r gofrestr breifat yn llawn. Nawr, yn amlwg, mae dirywiad deintyddol wedi digwydd dros y dair blynedd y mae hi wedi bod yn aros. Does dim golwg o hynny yn cael ei ddatrys. Ond mae hefyd, bellach, wrth gwrs, yn dechrau cael effaith ar iechyd meddyliol unigolyn sydd yn aros gyhyd mewn oed mor ifanc. Nawr, dwi’n gwybod allwch chi ddim gwneud sylw ar achos unigol, a dwi ddim yn gofyn i chi wneud hynny. Yr hyn dwi’n gofyn yw: beth yn y byd, yn eich barn chi, yw’r opsiynau sydd yna i blant sydd wedi’u cau allan o’r gwasanaeth iechyd pan fo’n dod at ddeintyddiaeth?
A family has contacted me drawing my attention to the situation of their daughter. She’s been awaiting treatment from an orthodontist since she was 11 years old. She’s now 14. She hasn’t had a single appointment in the three years that she’s been waiting. A fortnight ago, she was informed that the orthodontist was referring her back to her local dentist. Now, in the meantime, of course, the local dentist doesn’t offer NHS services, and also, the waiting list for private treatment is full—the private register is full. Clearly, there’s been dental decline over the three years that she’s been waiting. There’s no sign of that being resolved, but it’s also now starting to have an impact on the individual’s mental health, having waited for so long at such a young age. Now, I know that you can’t comment on an individual case, and I’m not asking you to do that. But what I am asking is: what on earth, in your view, are the options available for children who have been excluded from the NHS when it comes to dentistry?
Dwi yn meddwl bod yn rhaid i ni ddeall, yn amlwg, bod pethau wedi newid ers COVID. Rŷn ni nôl at sefyllfa lle mae 70 y cant o bobl a oedd yn cael triniaeth cyn COVID nawr yn cael triniaeth, ond fyddwn ni byth yn mynd nôl i 100 y cant heb gynyddu’r capasiti, achos mae rheolau mwy llym nawr sy’n ymwneud â sicrhau ein bod ni ddim yn gweld yr un math o safonau a oedd cyn y pandemig.
Felly, beth rŷn ni wedi’i wneud yw newid y cytundeb i sicrhau bod mwy o blant yn cael eu gweld, ac yn ardal Betsi, er enghraifft, mae 12,900 mwy o blant wedi cael eu gweld. Maen nhw’n newydd—mae’r rhain yn apwyntiadau newydd, ac mae’r rheini wedi digwydd dros y flwyddyn diwethaf. Yn amlwg, rŷn ni nawr yn negodi ar gyfer y cytundeb nesaf, ac mae’n anodd achos, wrth gwrs, beth rŷn ni’n ei weld yw bod rhai deintyddion yn gadael y gwasanaeth iechyd ac yn mynd yn breifat. Wel, maen nhw’n unigolion; dŷn nhw ddim yn gweithio yn uniongyrchol i’r NHS—dyw deintyddion byth wedi gweithio yn uniongyrchol i’r NHS—a gallwn ni ddim ond mynd mor bell ag y gallwn ni fforddio i dalu’r bobl yma i weithio yn ein system ni.FootnoteLink Felly, mae hwnna yn creu problem i ni, a dyna pam dwi’n falch o weld yn ddiweddar bod y rheolau wedi newid, felly, mae pobl fel dental technicians a dental therapists yn cael agor a chau achosion nawr. Mae hwnna’n rhywbeth sydd wedi digwydd yn ystod y pythefnos diwethaf, a bydd hwnna, gobeithio, yn golygu bod y model yn gallu newid ac fe fydd yn fwy hyblyg na’r un sydd ar gael ar hyn o bryd.
So, I do think that we do need to understand that things have clearly changed since COVID. We’re back in a situation where 70 per cent of people who were having treatment before are now having treatment, but we’ll never get back to 100 per cent without increasing capacity, because there are stricter rules now in terms of ensuring that we don’t see the same kind of standards that we saw before the pandemic.
So, what we have done is we’ve changed the contract to ensure that more children are being seen, and in the Betsi area, 12,900 more children have been seen. These are new appointments and they happened over the last year. Evidently, we’re in negotiations for the next contract, and it is difficult because what we see is that some dentists are leaving the NHS and going private. Well, they are individuals; they don’t work directly for the NHS—dentists have never worked directly for the NHS—and so, we can only go as far as we can afford to go to pay these people to work in our system.FootnoteLink So, that does cause a problem for us, and that’s why I’m pleased to see that recently, the rules have changed so that people such as dental technicians and therapists can open and close cases now. That’s something that’s happened in the last two weeks, and hopefully, that will mean that the model can adapt and be more flexible than what’s available at present.
Diolch i'r Gweinidog.
I thank the Minister.
Does dim cwestiynau amserol.
No topical questions have been accepted.
Datganiadau 90 eiliad sydd nesaf, felly, a’r un cyntaf heddiw gan Mabon ap Gwynfor.
We’ll move, therefore, to the 90-second statements, and the first today is from Mabon ap Gwynfor.
Diolch, Llywydd. Dwi am gymryd y cyfle yma i longyfarch Ynys Enlli a phawb sydd yn rhan o gynnal y darn bach yna o'r nefoedd ar ennill y gydnabyddiaeth o gael yr awyr tywyllaf yn Ewrop, yn ôl y Gymdeithas Awyr Dywyll Rhyngwladol.
Mae'r dynodiad yma yn cydnabod yr awyr unigryw sydd uwchben Enlli a'i phwysigrwydd i bobl, bywyd gwyllt a chenedlaethau'r dyfodol yno. Bydd noddfa awyr dywyll Enlli yn cael ei ddathlu trwy gydol eleni, a hithau yn rhan o rwydwaith cynyddol o lefydd sydd ag awyr dywyll ar draws Cymru, gyda digwyddiadau i bobl fedru rhannu yn y dathliadau ar Enlli ac ar draws gogledd Cymru. Rwy'n gobeithio y bydd y dynodiad yma yn cynyddu ymwybyddiaeth o’r angen i nid yn unig gwarchod yr awyr dywyll ar gyfer cenedlaethau'r dyfodol, ond hefyd yn pwysleisio safle unigryw Enlli fel yr unig ynys fach yng Nghymru sydd â chymuned byw arni drwy gydol y flwyddyn ac sydd yn trio rheoli ei hadnoddau dynol er lles yr ynys, ei natur a'i phobl.
Mae gan Enlli bysgodfa byrlymus, ffermio sydd yn gweithio yn unol â natur, arsyllfa adar hynaf Cymru, ac mae'n gartref i gymuned fechan, ynghyd â'r ffaith ei bod yn croesawu ymwelwyr yn ystod y gwanwyn a'r haf. Llongyfarchiadau mawr i Ynys Enlli.
Thank you, Llywydd. I wish to take this opportunity to congratulate Ynys Enlli, Bardsey Island, and everyone who is involved in maintaining this little piece of heaven on being recognised as having the darkest sky in Europe, according to the International Dark Sky Association.
This designation recognises the unique sky above Enlli, and its importance to people, wildlife, and future generations there. Enlli's dark sky sanctuary will be celebrated throughout the year, as it is part of a growing network of places with dark skies across Wales, with events where people can share in the celebrations on Enlli and across north Wales. I hope that this designation will not only increase awareness of the need not only to protect the dark sky for future generations, but also to emphasise the unique site of Enlli, as the only small island in Wales that has a community that lives on it throughout the year, and that tries to manage its human resources for the benefit of the island, its nature and its people.
Enlli has a thriving fishery, farming that works in harmony with nature, and Wales's oldest bird observatory. It is also home to a small community, as well as the fact that it welcomes visitors during the spring and the summer. Congratulations to Ynys Enlli.
Mae ymgyrchwyr yn hanfodol i unrhyw genedl iach, ond yr un mor bwysig, byddwn i'n ei ddweud, yw’r gwladgarwyr hynny sy’n gweithio oddi fewn y system i’w newid a’i gwella. Un yn perthyn i’r ail gategori oedd Illtyd Rhys Lloyd, a fuodd farw wythnos a hanner yn ôl.
Yn frodor o Gwmafan, roedd wedi ei drwytho yn y traddodiadau Cymreig, sosialaidd ac anghydffurfiol. Wedi cyfnod fel dirprwy bennaeth yn un o ysgolion mawr Caerdydd, fe’i apwyntiwyd i’r arolygiaeth addysg ym 1964 a buodd yno tan ei ymddeoliad fel prif arolygydd ysgolion ym 1990. Yn ei gyfnod fel prif arolygydd, fe weithiodd y sosialydd yma o Gwmafan yn agos ac yn effeithiol iawn gyda Syr Wyn Roberts, Nicholas Edwards a hyd yn oed Margaret Thatcher, o bawb.
Dyma ddywed y cyn-brifathro Dr Huw Thomas yn ei lyfr, Brwydr i Baradwys, ar dwf addysg Gymraeg yn y de-ddwyrain, am Illtyd Lloyd:
'Ni chollai gyfle i hybu’r Gymraeg ac addysg ddwyieithog, weithiau drwy godi sgwrs broffesiynol mewn ysgol er mwyn gwthio’r ffiniau, bryd arall drwy weld potensial deddf newydd ac awgrymu ffyrdd ymarferol ymlaen. Gweithredu bob tro y deuai cyfle oedd un o’i nodweddion.'
Pan wnaeth Illtyd ymddeol, fe wnaeth e roi gwybod i’r awdurdodau yn Whitehall nad oedd diddordeb ganddo mewn derbyn gong, ond roedd yn ddigon hapus i gael ei anrhydeddu gan yr Orsedd a chan Undeb Bedyddwyr Cymru. Mae byd addysg, yr iaith Gymraeg a’r Bedyddwyr wedi colli cyfaill mawr ym marwolaeth Illtyd Lloyd. Braint heddiw yw ei goffau ar lawr y Senedd. Diolch yn fawr.
Campaigners are essential to any healthy nation, but of equal importance, I would say, are those patriots who work within the system to change and improve it. One person who belonged to the second category was Illtyd Rhys Lloyd, who died a week and a half ago.
A native of Cwmafan, he was steeped in the Welsh, socialist and non-conformist traditions. After a period serving as deputy head in one of Cardiff's large schools, he was appointed to the inspectorate of education in 1964, and remained there until his retirement as chief inspector of schools in 1990. During his time as chief inspector, this socialist from Cwmafan worked closely and very effectively with Sir Wyn Roberts, Nicholas Edwards and even Margaret Thatcher, of all people.
This is what former headmaster Huw Thomas said in his book, Brwydr i Baradwys, on the growth of Welsh education in the south-east, about Illtyd Lloyd:
'He would not miss an opportunity to promote the Welsh language and bilingual education, sometimes by starting a professional conversation in a school in order to push the boundaries, and at other times by seeing the potential of new legislation and suggesting practical ways forward. Taking action every time an opportunity arose was one of his characteristics.'
When Illtyd retired, he informed the authorities that he was not interested in a gong, but he was happy enough to be honoured by the Gorsedd and the Baptist Union of Wales. The world of education, the Welsh language and the Baptists have lost a great friend following the death of Illtyd Lloyd. It is a great privilege today to commemorate him on the floor of the Senedd. Thank you very much.
April is PMD, or premenstrual disorder, Awareness Month. To mark this, I'd like to raise awareness specifically of premenstrual dysphoric disorder, or PMDD. PMDD affects one in 20 women and those assigned female at birth, who experience very severe symptoms in the weeks before their period. PMDD is a type of premenstrual disorder, complex conditions at the intersection of mental and menstrual health, which are linked to hypersensitivity to normal hormone changes across the menstrual cycle. They can cause or contribute to significant emotional and physical symptoms in the weeks leading up to, and even during, a period, such as depressed or severe low mood, rapid changes in mood, feelings of being overwhelmed and difficulty with concentration. As has been described to me, this can lead to women simply blowing up their lives, leaving jobs, education, relationships, even leading to suicidal thoughts.
PMDD is sometimes misdiagnosed as depression, anxiety or bipolar disorder, and this is due to a lack of understanding of the condition. Today, I was glad to sponsor an event in the Senedd to raise awareness about PMDD, supported by the International Association for Premenstrual Disorders, the National Centre for Mental Health and researchers from Cardiff University, and I want to thank many of you for attending.
The event was organised by campaigner Becci Smart, one of my constituents from Bridgend. Becci has lived with PMDD since she was 14. She's told me how she had to wait 18 years for diagnosis and treatment, and this is, unfortunately, the norm in Wales and across the UK. She says that it's often hard to find the right words that can properly explain the totality of living with PMDD and spoke to me about the struggles and heartbreak that cyclical hormone-based mood disorders cause. This is a condition that can destroy lives, this is a condition that we must learn more about and it's a condition that has not been sufficiently recognised or treated effectively. We must make sure that Wales is a nation where people with PMDD can survive and thrive.
Mae mis Ebrill yn Fis Ymwybyddiaeth Anhwylder Cyn Mislif. I nodi hyn, hoffwn godi ymwybyddiaeth yn benodol o anhwylder dysfforig cyn mislif, neu PMDD. Mae PMDD yn effeithio ar un o bob 20 o fenywod a'r rhai a bennwyd yn fenywod ar adeg eu geni, sy'n profi symptomau trwm iawn yn yr wythnosau cyn eu mislif. Mae PMDD yn fath o anhwylder cyn mislif, cyflyrau cymhleth ar y ffin rhwng iechyd meddwl a iechyd mislif sy'n gysylltiedig â gorsensitifrwydd i newidiadau hormonaidd arferol ar draws y gylchred fislifol. Gallant achosi neu gyfrannu at symptomau emosiynol a chorfforol sylweddol yn yr wythnosau cyn, a hyd yn oed yn ystod mislif, megis iselder neu hwyliau gwael iawn, newid cyflym mewn hwyliau, teimlo fod pethau'n mynd yn drech ac anhawster i ganolbwyntio. Fel y disgrifiwyd i mi, gall hyn arwain at fenywod yn chwalu eu bywydau, drwy adael swyddi, addysg, perthnasoedd, ac arwain at feddyliau hunanladdol hyd yn oed.
Weithiau caiff PMDD ei ddiagnosio'n anghywir fel iselder, gorbryder neu anhwylder deubegynol, ac mae hyn yn digwydd oherwydd diffyg dealltwriaeth o'r cyflwr. Heddiw, roeddwn yn falch o noddi digwyddiad yn y Senedd i godi ymwybyddiaeth o PMDD, gyda chefnogaeth y Gymdeithas Ryngwladol ar gyfer Anhwylderau Cyn Mislif, y Ganolfan Genedlaethol ar gyfer Iechyd Meddwl ac ymchwilwyr o Brifysgol Caerdydd, ac rwyf am ddiolch i sawl un ohonoch am ei fynychu.
Yr ymgyrchydd Becci Smart, un o fy etholwyr o Ben-y-bont ar Ogwr, oedd wedi trefnu'r digwyddiad. Mae Becci wedi byw gyda PMDD er pan oedd yn 14 oed. Mae wedi dweud wrthyf sut y bu'n rhaid aros 18 mlynedd am ddiagnosis a thriniaeth, ac yn anffodus, dyma yw'r norm yng Nghymru ac ar draws y DU. Mae'n dweud ei bod yn aml yn anodd dod o hyd i'r geiriau cywir sy'n gallu esbonio'n llawn y profiad o fyw gyda PMDD ac fe wnaeth siarad â mi am y trafferthion a'r torcalon y mae anhwylderau cylchredol sy'n gysylltiedig â'r hormonau yn eu hachosi. Mae hwn yn gyflwr sy'n gallu dinistrio bywydau, mae hwn yn gyflwr y mae'n rhaid inni ddysgu mwy amdano ac mae'n gyflwr nad yw wedi cael ei gydnabod yn ddigonol na'i drin yn effeithiol. Rhaid inni wneud yn siŵr fod Cymru'n wlad lle gall pobl â PMDD oroesi a ffynnu.
Eitem 5 sydd nesaf. Yr eitem yma yw'r datganiad gan Gadeirydd y Pwyllgor Safonau Ymddygiad ar y rheolau ynghylch gweithredu grwpiau trawsbleidiol. Rwy'n galw ar y Cadeirydd, Vikki Howells.
Item 5 is next: a statement by the Chair of the Standards of Conduct Committee on the rules for the operation of cross-party groups. I call on the Chair, Vikki Howells.
Good afternoon and thank you, Llywydd, for the opportunity to make this statement today. Today, the committee has laid its report on the revised rules for the operation of cross-party groups. The rules will be published and come into force on 2 May.
Cross-party groups are widely considered to be a valuable part of the democratic process and provide a forum for Members from different political groups to consider shared interests in subject areas relevant to the Senedd. The rules for the operation of cross-party groups provide Members and outside bodies with the information that they need to set up a group and ensure that its activities are transparent. I am therefore pleased to be able to make this statement today, outlining how the committee has updated and improved the rules to simplify them and make them easier for everyone to understand and comply with.
Prynhawn da a diolch i chi, Lywydd, am y cyfle i wneud y datganiad hwn heddiw. Heddiw, mae'r pwyllgor wedi gosod ei adroddiad ar y rheolau diwygiedig ar gyfer gweithredu grwpiau trawsbleidiol. Bydd y rheolau'n cael eu cyhoeddi ac yn dod i rym ar 2 Mai.
Ystyrir yn eang fod grwpiau trawsbleidiol yn rhan werthfawr o'r broses ddemocrataidd ac maent yn cynnig fforwm i Aelodau o wahanol grwpiau gwleidyddol ystyried diddordebau cyffredin mewn meysydd pwnc sy'n berthnasol i'r Senedd. Mae'r rheolau ar gyfer gweithredu grwpiau trawsbleidiol yn rhoi'r wybodaeth sydd ei hangen ar Aelodau a chyrff allanol i sefydlu grŵp a sicrhau bod ei weithgareddau'n dryloyw. Rwy'n falch felly o allu gwneud y datganiad hwn heddiw, yn amlinellu sut mae'r pwyllgor wedi diweddaru a gwella'r rheolau i'w symleiddio a'u gwneud yn haws i bawb eu deall ac i gydymffurfio â hwy.
The previous iteration of the rules was drawn up by the fourth Assembly’s Standards of Conduct Committee, after it reviewed the arrangements for cross-party groups as part of an inquiry into lobbying in 2013. Having been in place for almost a decade, it seemed timely to review the rules alongside the committee’s current ongoing inquiry into lobbying, given the crossover in the subject area. The committee agreed to consider whether the rules as they stood provided sufficient guidance, and whether they were clear, accessible and transparent for key stakeholders.
The committee asked a question on cross-party groups as part of its lobbying consultation, which ran between 13 May and 23 June 2022, and then went on to issue a cross-party group specific consultation, which ran between 11 July and 2 September 2022. Eleven respondents answered the question in the lobbying inquiry, and there were six respondents to the second consultation. I would like to take this opportunity to thank those organisations and individuals who contributed to these consultations.
The committee were pleased to find that the rules have generally been working well, and that respondents to the consultations were positive about the role and value of cross-party groups. Respondents felt that the current arrangements were robust and continued to strike the right balance between transparency and practicality. However, there was still room for improvement, and the committee endeavoured to bring the rules up to date and also to simplify them where possible. We also produced a summary sheet to sit in front of the rules and provide the important information to key stakeholders at a glance.
In order to ensure that cross-party groups remain in step with Senedd business and can continue to attract high levels of participation without increasing the need for participants to travel, the committee formalised the ability for cross-party groups to be held in virtual and hybrid meeting formats.
Following the changing landscape of groups during the fifth Senedd, and since the sixth Senedd only contains three political groups, the committee agreed that the cross-party group membership requirement of three political party groups was no longer appropriate. We therefore changed the requirement to three political parties, to facilitate Members who represent a political party that does not meet the Senedd’s threshold for forming a political group. In order to increase transparency, the committee also agreed to introduce a requirement in the rules for at least one Member of the Senedd to be present throughout all cross-party group meetings.
To encourage Members to fully engage in the work of cross-party groups, the committee clarified the financial rules in relation to those groups. Where the subject of the cross-party group has particular relevance to the Member's constituency or region, or the group is discussing matters that may be debated by the Senedd, it is now clear that Members are now able to claim in accordance with the rules and guidance on use of Senedd resources.
Outside of the rules themselves, the committee considered how to make cross-party group meetings more easily accessible and to engage a wider audience, and concluded that all meetings should be published to one calendar on the Senedd’s website. We considered this to be a relatively straightforward change that would have a large effect without making a fundamental change to the way that groups are able to access Senedd resources. Officials are currently working on the best way of presenting this information.
The committee made further changes to the rules to simplify them and remove out-of-date references to policies. These changes are outlined in our report, and add-up to a document that is much easier to understand and takes into account changes made over the last 10 years.
The committee also considered the possible effects of Senedd reform, and agreed to return to the rules before the end of the sixth Senedd, when these will be more clear. In particular, the committee resolved to review the requirement for at least one Member of the Senedd to be present throughout all cross-party group meetings.
Once again, I would like to thank all of those who contributed to this inquiry for taking the time to provide us with valuable evidence and ensure that we've been able to make the rules fit for purpose. I look forward to answering any questions that Members have here now.
Lluniwyd yr iteriad blaenorol o'r rheolau gan Bwyllgor Safonau Ymddygiad y pedwerydd Cynulliad, wedi iddo adolygu'r trefniadau ar gyfer grwpiau trawsbleidiol fel rhan o ymchwiliad i lobïo yn 2013. Ar ôl bod ar waith ers bron i ddegawd, roedd yn ymddangos yn amserol i adolygu'r rheolau ochr yn ochr ag ymchwiliad parhaus cyfredol y pwyllgor i lobïo, o ystyried y gorgyffwrdd yn y maes pwnc. Cytunodd y pwyllgor i ystyried a oedd y rheolau fel yr oeddent yn darparu digon o arweiniad, ac a oeddent yn glir, yn hygyrch ac yn dryloyw i randdeiliaid allweddol.
Gofynnodd y pwyllgor gwestiwn ar grwpiau trawsbleidiol fel rhan o'i ymgynghoriad i lobïo, a gynhaliwyd rhwng 13 Mai a 23 Mehefin 2022, ac aeth rhagddo i gyhoeddi ymgynghoriad penodol ar grwpiau trawsbleidiol, a gynhaliwyd rhwng 11 Gorffennaf a 2 Medi 2022. Atebodd 11 o ymatebwyr y cwestiwn yn yr ymchwiliad i lobïo, ac roedd chwe ymatebydd i'r ail ymgynghoriad. Hoffwn fanteisio ar y cyfle hwn i ddiolch i'r sefydliadau a'r unigolion a gyfrannodd at yr ymgynghoriadau hyn.
Roedd y pwyllgor yn falch o ganfod bod y rheolau wedi bod yn gweithio'n dda ar y cyfan, a bod ymatebwyr i'r ymgynghoriadau yn gadarnhaol am rôl a gwerth grwpiau trawsbleidiol. Roedd yr ymatebwyr yn teimlo bod y trefniadau cyfredol yn gadarn ac yn parhau i daro'r cydbwysedd cywir rhwng tryloywder ac ymarferoldeb. Fodd bynnag, roedd lle i wella o hyd, ac ymdrechodd y pwyllgor i ddiweddaru'r rheolau a hefyd i'w symleiddio lle bo modd. Gwnaethom hefyd gynhyrchu taflen grynhoi i fod ar flaen y rheolau a darparu'r wybodaeth bwysig i randdeiliaid allweddol mewn amrantiad.
Er mwyn sicrhau bod grwpiau trawsbleidiol yn parhau i gydymffurfio â busnes y Senedd a'u bod yn gallu parhau i ddenu lefelau uchel o gyfranogiad heb gynyddu'r angen i'r cyfranogwyr deithio, ffurfiolodd y pwyllgor y gallu i grwpiau trawsbleidiol gael eu cynnal ar ffurf cyfarfodydd rhithwir a hybrid.
Yn dilyn y newid i dirwedd grwpiau yn ystod y bumed Senedd, a chan fod y chweched Senedd ond yn cynnwys tri grŵp gwleidyddol, cytunodd y pwyllgor nad oedd gofyniad aelodaeth y grwpiau trawsbleidiol i gael tri grŵp gwleidyddol yn briodol mwyach. Felly, newidiwyd y gofyniad i dair plaid wleidyddol, er mwyn ei gwneud yn haws i Aelodau sy'n cynrychioli plaid wleidyddol nad yw'n cyrraedd trothwy'r Senedd ar gyfer ffurfio grŵp gwleidyddol. Er mwyn cynyddu tryloywder, cytunodd y pwyllgor hefyd i gyflwyno gofyniad yn y rheolau i o leiaf un Aelod o'r Senedd fod yn bresennol drwy gydol pob cyfarfod grŵp trawsbleidiol.
Er mwyn annog Aelodau i gymryd rhan lawn yng ngwaith y grwpiau trawsbleidiol, eglurodd y pwyllgor y rheolau ariannol mewn perthynas â'r grwpiau hynny. Pan fo pwnc y grŵp trawsbleidiol yn benodol berthnasol i etholaeth neu ranbarth yr Aelod, neu os yw'r grŵp yn trafod materion a all gael eu trafod gan y Senedd, mae'n amlwg bellach y gall Aelodau hawlio yn unol â'r rheolau a'r canllawiau ar ddefnyddio adnoddau'r Senedd.
Y tu hwnt i'r rheolau eu hunain, bu'r pwyllgor yn ystyried sut i wneud cyfarfodydd grwpiau trawsbleidiol yn fwy hygyrch ac i ennyn diddordeb cynulleidfa ehangach, a daethant i'r casgliad y dylid cyhoeddi pob cyfarfod ar un calendr ar wefan y Senedd. Roeddem o'r farn fod hwn yn newid cymharol syml a fyddai'n cael effaith fawr heb wneud newid sylfaenol i'r ffordd y mae grwpiau'n gallu cael mynediad at adnoddau'r Senedd. Ar hyn o bryd, mae swyddogion yn gweithio ar y ffordd orau o gyflwyno'r wybodaeth hon.
Gwnaeth y pwyllgor newidiadau pellach i'r rheolau i'w symleiddio a dileu cyfeiriadau sydd wedi dyddio i bolisïau. Mae'r newidiadau hyn wedi'u nodi yn ein hadroddiad, ac yn creu dogfen sy'n llawer haws i'w deall ac sy'n ystyried newidiadau a wnaed dros y 10 mlynedd diwethaf.
Hefyd, ystyriodd y pwyllgor effeithiau posibl diwygio'r Senedd, a chytunodd i edrych eto ar y rheolau cyn diwedd y chweched Senedd, pan fydd y rhain yn fwy eglur. Yn benodol, penderfynodd y pwyllgor adolygu'r gofyniad i o leiaf un Aelod o'r Senedd fod yn bresennol drwy gydol pob cyfarfod grŵp trawsbleidiol.
Unwaith eto, hoffwn ddiolch i bawb a gyfrannodd at yr ymchwiliad hwn am roi amser i roi tystiolaeth werthfawr i ni a sicrhau ein bod wedi gallu gwneud y rheolau'n addas i'r diben. Edrychaf ymlaen at ateb unrhyw gwestiynau sydd gan yr Aelodau yma nawr.
I welcome the statement given this afternoon in the Siambr, and I want to thank Vikki for chairing the committee, and my fellow Members, and I also want to thank the clerking team for their assistance in this consultation and the report. I'm a member of a number of cross-party groups and also chair the substance use and addiction cross-party group, which I established with the drug charity Kaleidoscope. I'm of the firm opinion that hearing lived experience can have a lasting impact on policy development, and CPGs provide a vehicle for those personal stories to be heard.
In terms of the update today, I welcome the guidance on hybrid and translation facilities. It's also important that these translation facilities are given their rightful importance in line with us striving to be a fully bilingual nation. It is good to see conclusions highlighting the various ways to conduct meetings. I'm also glad to see the caveat that proceedings will be conducted at the discretion of the group hosting said meetings, because they are best placed to know the ideal format for those particular meetings. In my experience, CPGs can provide valuable opportunities for extra depth and scrutiny on matters that are pertinent to life here in Wales. They provide a valuable space for discussion that is friendly and inclusive; long may that continue. Diolch yn fawr.
Rwy'n croesawu'r datganiad a roddwyd y prynhawn yma yn y Siambr, ac rwyf am ddiolch i Vikki am gadeirio'r pwyllgor, ac i'm cyd-Aelodau, ac rwyf hefyd am ddiolch i'r tîm clercio am eu cymorth yn yr ymgynghoriad hwn a'r adroddiad. Rwy'n aelod o nifer o grwpiau trawsbleidiol ac rwyf hefyd yn cadeirio'r grŵp trawsbleidiol ar gamddefnyddio sylweddau a dibyniaeth, a sefydlais gyda'r elusen gyffuriau Kaleidoscope. Rwyf o'r farn gadarn y gall clywed profiad byw gael effaith barhaol ar ddatblygu polisi, ac mae grwpiau trawsbleidiol yn gyfrwng i'r straeon personol hynny gael eu clywed.
O ran y diweddariad heddiw, rwy'n croesawu'r canllawiau ar gyfleusterau hybrid a chyfieithu. Mae'n bwysig hefyd fod y cyfleusterau cyfieithu hyn yn cael parch haeddiannol yn unol â'n hymdrech i fod yn genedl gwbl ddwyieithog. Mae'n dda gweld casgliadau'n tynnu sylw at y gwahanol ffyrdd o gynnal cyfarfodydd. Rwy'n falch hefyd o weld y cafeat y bydd gweithgaredd yn digwydd yn ôl disgresiwn y grŵp sy'n cynnal y cyfryw gyfarfodydd, oherwydd mai hwy sydd yn y sefyllfa orau i wybod beth yw'r fformat delfrydol ar gyfer y cyfarfodydd penodol hynny. Yn fy mhrofiad i, gall grwpiau trawsbleidiol gynnig cyfleoedd gwerthfawr i sicrhau dyfnder ychwanegol a chraffu ar faterion sy'n berthnasol i fywyd yma yng Nghymru. Maent yn cynnig lle gwerthfawr i drafodaethau sy'n gyfeillgar a chynhwysol; hir y parhaed hynny. Diolch yn fawr.
I'd like to thank Peredur Owen Griffiths for his contribution and echo his thanks also to the clerking team. It has been a pleasure to work as a cross-party committee on this important inquiry. And I agree with you, Pered, that cross-party groups are really important vehicles here in the Senedd, and they do allow that forum where people are able to give their own personal stories, and the personal impact on various different issues is one that I think is the strength of our cross-party group system.
I'm glad also that you raised the issue of translation, which I know was important to you at the outset of this inquiry, and we were assured as a committee that translation facilities are available to all cross-party group meetings, whether they are being held face to face, hybrid or virtual. And I think it's important that we spread that message far and wide. Let's take that message back to our political groups to make sure that all chairs of cross-party groups avail themselves of those translation facilities.
So, to conclude, I also agree with everything you said there about cross-party groups being a valuable addition to our Senedd, and I'm hopeful that the updated rules that we've worked on as a committee will assist us in maintaining that. Thank you, Llywydd.
Hoffwn ddiolch i Peredur Owen Griffiths am ei gyfraniad ac rwy'n adleisio ei ddiolch hefyd i'r tîm clercio. Mae wedi bod yn bleser gweithio fel pwyllgor trawsbleidiol ar yr ymchwiliad pwysig hwn. Ac rwy'n cytuno â chi, Pered, fod grwpiau trawsbleidiol yn gyfryngau pwysig iawn yma yn y Senedd, ac maent yn caniatáu fforwm lle gall pobl roi eu straeon personol eu hunain, a'r effaith bersonol ar wahanol faterion yw cryfder ein system grwpiau trawsbleidiol yn fy marn i.
Rwy'n falch hefyd eich bod wedi codi mater cyfieithu, y gwn ei fod yn bwysig i chi ar ddechrau'r ymchwiliad hwn, a chawsom sicrwydd fel pwyllgor fod cyfleusterau cyfieithu ar gael ym mhob cyfarfod grŵp trawsbleidiol, boed yn rhai wyneb yn wyneb, hybrid neu rithwir. Ac rwy'n credu ei bod yn bwysig ein bod yn lledaenu'r neges honno ym mhobman. Gadewch inni fynd â'r neges honno yn ôl i'n grwpiau gwleidyddol i wneud yn siŵr fod pob cadeirydd grŵp trawsbleidiol yn manteisio ar y cyfleusterau cyfieithu hynny.
Felly, i gloi, rwyf hefyd yn cytuno â phopeth a ddywedoch chi ynglŷn â bod grwpiau trawsbleidiol yn ychwanegiad gwerthfawr i'n Senedd, ac rwy'n obeithiol y bydd y rheolau wedi'u diweddaru y buom yn gweithio arnynt fel pwyllgor yn ein cynorthwyo i gynnal hynny. Diolch, Lywydd.
Thank you to the Chair for that statement.
Diolch i'r Cadeirydd am y datganiad hwnnw.
Yr eitem nesaf, felly, fydd y ddadl ar adroddiad y Pwyllgor Cyfrifon Cyhoeddus a Gweinyddiaeth Gyhoeddus ar graffu ar gyfrifon Llywodraeth Cymru 2020-21. Galwaf ar Gadeirydd y pwyllgor i wneud y cynnig—Mark Isherwood.
The next item will be a debate on the Public Accounts and Public Administration Committee report, scrutiny of the Welsh Government's accounts 2020-21. I call on the Chair of the committee to move the motion—Mark Isherwood.
Cynnig NDM8246 Mark Isherwood
Cynnig bod y Senedd:
Yn nodi adroddiad y Pwyllgor Cyfrifon Cyhoeddus a Gweinyddiaeth Gyhoeddus ar ei ymchwiliad, Craffu ar Gyfrifon Llywodraeth Cymru 2020-21, a osodwyd yn y Swyddfa Gyflwyno ar 27 Mawrth 2023.
Motion NDM8246 Mark Isherwood
To propose that the Senedd:
Notes the report of the Public Accounts and Public Administration on its inquiry, Scrutiny of the Welsh Government’s Accounts 2020-21, which was laid in the Table Office on 27 March 2023.
Cynigiwyd y cynnig.
Motion moved.
Diolch, Llywydd.
Diolch, Lywydd.
As if by magic, it appears.
Fel hud a lledrith, mae'n ymddangos.
Apologies, yes. We were lectern-less.
Well, scrutiny of the accounts of publicly funded organisations is a core part of the Public Accounts and Public Administration Committee's work, and has been undertaken on an annual basis since 2014. This work is an important driver of transparent financial reporting and provides the Public Accounts and Public Administration Committee with an opportunity to explore issues of governance and financial management by highlighting any issues in the public domain, offering transparency and openness.
Scrutiny of the Welsh Government's consolidated accounts for 2020-21 was anything but ordinary. Delayed and signed nine months later than the timetable originally agreed, the accounts were also qualified by the Auditor General for Wales on three separate issues. These included a payment made to the former Permanent Secretary, clinicians' pension tax liabilities, and expenditure for some COVID-19 business grants. This meant that scrutiny was conducted by this committee significantly later than originally intended, with a limited opportunity to make impactful recommendations ahead of the preparation of the Welsh Government's accounts for the following year, 2021-22. These are serious and complex matters.
I thank, on the record, the time taken by Audit Wales to thoroughly audit these accounts to ensure that these matters were explored and reported on appropriately. We welcome Audit Wales's positive and proactive engagement with the committee throughout this process. I also thank Welsh Government officials for their engagement with our scrutiny work.
The main findings of our report are that significant funds for essential public services were lost due to shortcomings in the Welsh Government's accounting. We found many examples where poor record-keeping and mismanagement of public accounts have cost the people of Wales. This includes £155.5 million lost to Wales due to poor account management; serious concerns about record-keeping relating to an £80,000 payment made to the former Permanent Secretary; and concerns about the level of fraud and error in the COVID-19 business grants scheme.
In relation to the payment made to the former Permanent Secretary, the committee has made a number of recommendations on the need for the Welsh Government to improve its transparency around decision making in relation to the role and working arrangements of the Permanent Secretary. Deficient record-keeping about how important decisions were taken resulted in a lack of clarity and insufficient opportunity for this committee to scrutinise this payment. The Welsh Government failed to provide the auditor general with sufficient contemporaneous evidence to establish the change in the former Permanent Secretary's working arrangements and to justify the payment made on her departure.
Our report also raises concerns regarding the appointment process of the current Permanent Secretary, who remains on secondment from Aneurin Bevan University Health Board. The post had been advertised with a salary of between £162,500 and £180,000, but Dr Goodall confirmed after his appointment that he remained on the NHS chief executive pay framework, meaning his current salary exceeds the advertised salary. This raises the question of whether the Welsh Government may have attracted different candidates had the post been advertised at a higher pay scale.
The process for backfilling the Permanent Secretary's former post, that of director general for the health and social services group and chief executive of NHS Wales, was also unclear. It was suggested to us that the process for appointing Judith Paget into the role—another secondee from Aneurin Bevan University Health Board—was conducted without any competitive recruitment exercise.
The committee also considered the lack of transparency regarding the continuation of the Permanent Secretary's secondment after his appointment to Permanent Secretary, especially since these arrangements were only made clear during our evidence gathering. The committee felt these arrangements were interim and confusing.
We recommend that the Welsh Government reviews its reporting and record-keeping practices to ensure that internal decisions around the Permanent Secretary role, along with any other roles at director general level or above, are clearly documented.
Moving to the Welsh Government's £155.5 million underspend, the committee is disappointed that significant funding was lost to Wales as a result of the Welsh Government's underspend in 2020-21. It is frustrating, the committee felt, that £155.5 million could have been used in Wales to fund essential services at a time those services are under serious financial pressure.
Ymddiheuriadau. Nid oedd gennym ddarllenfwrdd.
Wel, mae craffu ar gyfrifon sefydliadau sy'n cael eu hariannu'n gyhoeddus yn rhan greiddiol o waith y Pwyllgor Cyfrifon Cyhoeddus a Gweinyddiaeth Gyhoeddus, ac mae wedi'i wneud yn flynyddol ers 2014. Mae'r gwaith hwn yn sbardun pwysig i adrodd ariannol tryloyw ac yn rhoi cyfle i'r Pwyllgor Cyfrifon Cyhoeddus a Gweinyddiaeth Gyhoeddus archwilio materion llywodraethu a rheoli ariannol drwy dynnu sylw at unrhyw faterion cyhoeddus sy'n codi, gan gynnig tryloywder a didwylledd.
Roedd craffu ar gyfrifon cyfunol Llywodraeth Cymru ar gyfer 2020-21 yn unrhyw beth ond cyffredin. Wedi'u gohirio a'u llofnodi naw mis yn ddiweddarach na'r amserlen a gytunwyd yn wreiddiol, roedd y cyfrifon hefyd yn cynnwys barn amodol gan Archwilydd Cyffredinol Cymru ar dri mater gwahanol. Roedd y rhain yn cynnwys taliad a wnaed i'r cyn Ysgrifennydd Parhaol, rhwymedigaethau treth pensiwn clinigwyr, a gwariant ar rai grantiau busnes COVID-19. Golygai hyn fod craffu wedi'i gynnal gan y pwyllgor hwn yn sylweddol hwyrach na'r bwriad gwreiddiol, gyda chyfle cyfyngedig i wneud argymhellion effeithiol cyn paratoi cyfrifon Llywodraeth Cymru ar gyfer y flwyddyn ganlynol, 2021-22. Mae'r rhain yn faterion difrifol a chymhleth.
Rwyf am gofnodi fy niolch am yr amser a roddodd Archwilio Cymru i archwilio'r cyfrifon hyn yn drylwyr er mwyn sicrhau bod y materion hyn yn cael eu harchwilio a'u hadrodd yn briodol. Rydym yn croesawu ymgysylltiad cadarnhaol a rhagweithiol Archwilio Cymru â'r pwyllgor drwy gydol y broses hon. Diolch hefyd i swyddogion Llywodraeth Cymru am eu hymgysylltiad â'n gwaith craffu.
Prif ganfyddiadau ein hadroddiad yw bod arian sylweddol ar gyfer gwasanaethau cyhoeddus hanfodol wedi'i golli oherwydd diffygion yng nghyfrifyddu Llywodraeth Cymru. Gwelsom lawer o enghreifftiau lle mae arferion cadw cofnodion gwael a chamreoli cyfrifon cyhoeddus wedi costio i bobl Cymru. Mae hyn yn cynnwys £155.5 miliwn a gollodd Cymru oherwydd rheolaeth wael ar gyfrifon; pryderon difrifol ynglŷn â chadw cofnodion yn ymwneud â thaliad o £80,000 a wnaed i'r cyn Ysgrifennydd Parhaol; a phryderon ynglŷn â lefel twyll a gwall yn y cynllun grantiau busnes COVID-19.
Mewn perthynas â'r taliad a wnaed i'r cyn Ysgrifennydd Parhaol, mae'r pwyllgor wedi gwneud nifer o argymhellion ar yr angen i Lywodraeth Cymru wella'i thryloywder wrth wneud penderfyniadau'n gysylltiedig â rôl a threfniadau gweithio'r Ysgrifennydd Parhaol. Arweiniodd diffygion yn y broses o gadw cofnodion ynghylch y ffordd y gwnaed penderfyniadau pwysig at ddiffyg eglurder a dim digon o gyfle i'r pwyllgor hwn graffu ar y taliad hwn. Methodd Llywodraeth Cymru ddarparu digon o dystiolaeth gyfoes i'r archwilydd cyffredinol sefydlu'r newid yn nhrefniadau gwaith y cyn Ysgrifennydd Parhaol ac i gyfiawnhau'r taliad a wnaed ar ei hymadawiad.
Mae ein hadroddiad hefyd yn codi pryderon ynghylch proses benodi'r Ysgrifennydd Parhaol presennol, sy'n parhau ar secondiad o Fwrdd Iechyd Prifysgol Aneurin Bevan. Roedd y swydd wedi cael ei hysbysebu gyda chyflog o rhwng £162,500 a £180,000, ond cadarnhaodd Dr Goodall wedi ei benodiad ei fod yn parhau ar fframwaith tâl prif weithredwr y GIG, sy'n golygu bod ei gyflog presennol yn uwch na'r cyflog a hysbysebwyd. Mae hyn yn codi cwestiwn ynglŷn ag a allai Llywodraeth Cymru fod wedi denu ymgeiswyr gwahanol pe bai'r swydd wedi ei hysbysebu ar raddfa gyflog uwch.
Roedd y broses ar gyfer ôl-lenwi swydd flaenorol yr Ysgrifennydd Parhaol, sef cyfarwyddwr cyffredinol y grŵp iechyd a gwasanaethau cymdeithasol a phrif weithredwr GIG Cymru, hefyd yn aneglur. Clywsom awgrym fod y broses ar gyfer penodi Judith Paget i'r rôl—secondai arall o Fwrdd Iechyd Prifysgol Aneurin Bevan—wedi'i chynnal heb unrhyw ymarfer recriwtio cystadleuol.
Bu'r pwyllgor hefyd yn ystyried y diffyg tryloywder ynghylch parhau â secondiad yr Ysgrifennydd Parhaol ar ôl ei benodi i rôl yr Ysgrifennydd Parhaol, yn enwedig gan mai dim ond yn ystod ein proses o gasglu tystiolaeth y gwnaed y trefniadau hyn yn glir. Teimlai'r pwyllgor fod y trefniadau hyn yn rhai dros dro ac yn ddryslyd.
Rydym yn argymell bod Llywodraeth Cymru yn adolygu ei harferion adrodd a chadw cofnodion er mwyn sicrhau bod penderfyniadau mewnol ynghylch rôl yr Ysgrifennydd Parhaol, ynghyd ag unrhyw rolau eraill ar lefel cyfarwyddwr cyffredinol neu uwch, wedi'u cofnodi'n glir.
Gan symud tuag at y tanwariant o £155.5 miliwn gan Lywodraeth Cymru, mae'r pwyllgor yn siomedig fod Cymru wedi colli arian sylweddol o ganlyniad i danwariant Llywodraeth Cymru yn 2020-21. Teimlai'r pwyllgor ei bod hi'n rhwystredig y gallai £155.5 miliwn fod wedi'i ddefnyddio yng Nghymru i ariannu gwasanaethau hanfodol ar adeg pan fo'r gwasanaethau hynny dan bwysau ariannol difrifol.
Would you give way on that, Mark?
A wnewch chi ildio ar hynny, Mark?
By all means, yes.
Ar bob cyfrif, gwnaf.
Mark, I wonder whether the committee turned its attention to, as well, the decision that could have been made by the Chief Secretary to the Treasury at the UK level to actually allow flexibility to use that and to pull it back, and to use it for other purposes. It has been done before. There's no reason it couldn't have been done now, particularly in a very difficult year, and a challenging year as well. So, I appreciate you're pointing the finger very much at 'Welsh Government should have used it', but actually their return clawback was dwarfish compared to that being clawed back from other departments in the UK, but it could have been different. This rests with the Chief Secretary to the Treasury. He could have allowed Welsh Government to keep that money.
Mark, tybed a wnaeth y pwyllgor droi ei sylw, yn ogystal, at y penderfyniad y gellid bod wedi'i wneud gan Brif Ysgrifennydd y Trysorlys ar lefel y DU i ganiatáu hyblygrwydd i ddefnyddio hwnnw a'i dynnu'n ôl, a'i ddefnyddio at ddibenion eraill. Mae wedi cael ei wneud o'r blaen. Ni cheir rheswm pam na ellid bod wedi'i wneud nawr, yn enwedig mewn blwyddyn anodd iawn, a blwyddyn heriol hefyd. Felly, rwy'n deall eich bod yn pwyntio bys yn fawr at 'dylai Llywodraeth Cymru fod wedi ei ddefnyddio', ond roedd yr arian a adfachwyd ganddynt yn fach iawn o'i gymharu â'r hyn a gâi ei adfachu oddi wrth adrannau eraill yn y DU, ond fe allai fod wedi bod yn wahanol. Mae hyn yn nwylo Prif Ysgrifennydd y Trysorlys. Fe allai fod wedi caniatáu i Lywodraeth Cymru gadw'r arian hwnnw.
If you read our report, you'll see we fully address that and incorporate some of the specific matters you highlight received in evidence. In fact, I will develop on some of your points in my speech now.
It's difficult to understand why the Welsh Government waited so long to be told it could not do as it wished with the underspend, and why a request to use the underspend was made retrospectively. The Welsh Government appears to have assumed, based on previous HM Treasury decisions, that it would be granted the flexibility to use the funding. It raises questions as to whether making a request sooner may have enabled the funds to be used. [Interruption.] I see the Minister shaking her head adversely; remember, this is a cross-party committee and the wording was agreed unanimously, after receiving extensive evidence, both in public and private session. So, we did consider all these matters. Lessons must be learned to ensure such vital funding is not lost from Wales again.
Os darllenwch ein hadroddiad, fe welwch ein bod yn mynd i'r afael yn llawn â hynny ac yn cynnwys rhai o'r materion penodol yr ydych yn tynnu sylw atynt a gyflwynwyd fel tystiolaeth. Yn wir, byddaf yn datblygu rhai o'ch pwyntiau yn fy araith nawr.
Mae'n anodd deall pam y bu i Lywodraeth Cymru aros cyhyd i gael clywed na allai wneud fel y mynnai gyda'r tanwariant, a pham y cafodd cais i ddefnyddio'r tanwariant ei wneud yn ôl-weithredol. Mae'n ymddangos bod Llywodraeth Cymru wedi tybio, ar sail penderfyniadau blaenorol Trysorlys Ei Fawrhydi, y byddai'n cael yr hyblygrwydd i ddefnyddio'r cyllid. Mae'n codi cwestiynau ynglŷn ag a allai gwneud cais yn gynt fod wedi galluogi'r arian i gael ei ddefnyddio. [Torri ar draws.] Gwelaf y Gweinidog yn ysgwyd ei phen yn wrthwynebus; cofiwch, pwyllgor trawsbleidiol yw hwn a chytunwyd ar y geiriad yn unfrydol, ar ôl derbyn tystiolaeth helaeth, mewn sesiynau cyhoeddus a phreifat. Felly, fe wnaethom ystyried yr holl faterion hyn. Rhaid dysgu'r gwersi er mwyn sicrhau na fydd Cymru'n colli arian mor hanfodol eto.
Would he give way on that point?
A wnaiff ildio ar y pwynt hwnnw?
Well, time's limited, you know—I've only got 15 minutes in total.
Wel, mae amser yn brin, wyddoch chi—dim ond 15 munud sydd gennyf i gyd.
Indeed—I really appreciate you giving way. But have you picked up, either during the report or since, any evidence that the Minister actually was engaged in discussions with the UK Treasury, with the Chief Secretary, actually making this point consistently, and that, actually, the failure was for the Chief Secretary of the Treasury to clarify to the Minister?
Yn wir—rwy'n ddiolchgar i chi am ildio. Ond a wnaethoch chi nodi, naill ai yn ystod yr adroddiad neu ers hynny, unrhyw dystiolaeth fod y Gweinidog wedi cymryd rhan mewn trafodaethau gyda Thrysorlys y DU, gyda’r Prif Ysgrifennydd, a gwneud y pwynt hwn yn gyson, ac mewn gwirionedd, mai methiant Prif Ysgrifennydd y Trysorlys i egluro i'r Gweinidog ydoedd?
This is in the report. The problem is the evidence we received from the most senior level of the Welsh Government: this was retrospective.
The committee recommended that the Welsh Government provides the committee with further information on the timescales and discussions that took place between the Welsh Government and HM Treasury—so we're prepared to look at any further evidence that might exist—regarding the Welsh Government’s request to carry forward at 31 March 2021 a sum in excess of the limit on the Wales reserve. We did ask the questions. The committee does not expect any further funds to be lost to Wales, and recommends that it seeks approval for flexibility from HM Treasury as early as possible before the end of the financial year, so that funds can be utilised in-year, should its request not be granted.
Finally, in relation to the COVID business grants scheme, we raised concerns about how the discretion given to local authorities to apply the COVID-19 non-domestic rates grant scheme was used. We found that the inconsistent application of the amended guidance issued in relation to self-catering businesses resulted in support being paid out by some local authorities to legitimate businesses, even when they did not meet the discretionary criteria set, while in other local authorities, which strictly applied the criteria—particularly one—some legitimate businesses did not receive the support they needed. It was not clear from the evidence provided to us the degree to which discretion had been applied and what redress is available for legitimate businesses who were denied support to which they were otherwise entitled.
Our report also flags concern that the Welsh Government has not met the timescales it set for the completion of its post-completion monitoring, which is aimed at ensuring that grant terms and conditions are adhered to and to address instances of incorrect awards. This process is likely to be ongoing for quite some time. Furthermore, the Welsh Government has not explicitly confirmed it would amend its methodology for calculating the estimate of fraud and error within the COVID grant schemes, in light of auditors’ findings and the auditor general’s observations in his audit certificate on the 2020-21 accounts. These findings highlighted that there are uncertainties in the estimate as a result of data limitations and how the rate has been calculated.
The committee has made a recommendation that the Welsh Government provides further clarity on the latest position on recovery from the COVID-19 support for business schemes it has administered, including an explanation of how these figures relate back to the sums reflected in the auditor general’s memorandum and those provided by the Welsh Government during oral evidence to the committee. We note that the UK Government Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy, or BEIS, has set out details about the calculation of its estimates of fraud and error in relation to UK Government COVID-19 grants in its annual report and accounts 2020-21, which the Welsh Government has not.
We are particularly concerned that, in one Welsh local authority, where extra National Fraud Initiative checks were conducted, fraud and error amounting to £570,000 was identified. This raises concerns whether, without these additional checks, fraud and error could be missed by those local authorities that have not opted to undertake the additional National Fraud Initiative checks. The committee is disappointed to note that the Welsh Government’s consolidated accounts 2020-21, which were laid before the Senedd on 13 December 2022, did not include an up-to-date estimate of fraud and error, even though we were told in advance that they would.
The committee will continue to pursue these issues with the Welsh Government, and looks forward to further dialogue on this topic. We'll be closely monitoring the implementation of our recommendations. Diolch yn fawr.
Mae hyn yn yr adroddiad. Y broblem yw’r dystiolaeth a gawsom gan lefel uchaf Llywodraeth Cymru: roedd hyn yn ôl-weithredol.
Argymhellodd y pwyllgor fod Llywodraeth Cymru yn rhoi rhagor o wybodaeth i'r Pwyllgor am yr amserlenni a'r trafodaethau a ddigwyddodd rhwng Llywodraeth Cymru a Thrysorlys EF—felly rydym yn barod i edrych ar unrhyw dystiolaeth bellach a allai fodoli—ynghylch cais Llywodraeth Cymru i gario ymlaen swm sy'n fwy na'r hyn a ganiateir ar gyfer cronfa wrth gefn Cymru ar 31 Mawrth 2021. Fe wnaethom ofyn y cwestiynau. Nid yw’r pwyllgor yn disgwyl y bydd Cymru'n colli rhagor o gyllid, ac mae'n argymell ei bod yn gofyn am gymeradwyo hyblygrwydd gan Drysorlys EF cyn gynted â phosibl cyn diwedd y flwyddyn ariannol fel y gellir defnyddio cyllid yn ystod y flwyddyn os gwrthodir ei chais.
Yn olaf, mewn perthynas â'r cynllun grantiau busnes COVID, codwyd pryderon gennym ynghylch sut y defnyddiwyd y disgresiwn a roddwyd i awdurdodau lleol ddefnyddio'r cynllun grant ardrethi annomestig COVID-19. Canfuom fod defnydd anghyson o'r canllawiau diwygiedig a gyhoeddwyd ar gyfer busnesau hunanddarpar wedi arwain at rai awdurdodau lleol yn rhoi taliadau cymorth i fusnesau dilys, hyd yn oed pan nad oeddent yn bodloni’r meini prawf disgresiynol, ond mewn awdurdodau lleol eraill a roddodd y meini prawf ar waith yn llym—yn enwedig un—ni chafodd rhai busnesau dilys y cymorth roeddent ei angen. Nid oedd yn glir o'r dystiolaeth a roddwyd i ni i ba raddau roedd disgresiwn wedi'i ddefnyddio a pha iawn sydd ar gael i fusnesau dilys a amddifadwyd o gymorth yr oedd hawl ganddynt iddo fel arall.
Mae ein hadroddiad hefyd yn tynnu sylw at bryder nad yw Llywodraeth Cymru wedi bodloni’r amserlenni a bennwyd ganddi ar gyfer cyflawni ei gwaith monitro ar ôl cwblhau, gyda’r nod o sicrhau y cedwir at delerau ac amodau grant a mynd i'r afael ag achosion o ddyfarniadau anghywir. Mae'r broses hon yn debygol o barhau am gryn dipyn o amser. Yn ogystal â hynny, nid yw Llywodraeth Cymru wedi cadarnhau'n benodol y byddai'n diwygio ei methodoleg ar gyfer cyfrifo'r amcangyfrif o dwyll a gwall yn y cynlluniau grant COVID yn sgil canfyddiadau archwilwyr a sylwadau'r archwilydd cyffredinol yn ei dystysgrif archwilio ar gyfrifon 2020-21. Amlygodd y canfyddiadau hyn fod ansicrwydd yn yr amcangyfrif hwn o ganlyniad i gyfyngiadau data a sut y cyfrifwyd y gyfradd.
Mae’r pwyllgor wedi gwneud argymhelliad y dylai Llywodraeth Cymru roi rhagor o eglurder ar y safbwynt ddiweddaraf ar adfer arian o'r cynlluniau cymorth COVID-19 i fusnesau y mae wedi'u gweinyddu, gan gynnwys esboniad o sut mae'r ffigurau hyn yn cysylltu â'r symiau a adlewyrchir ym memorandwm yr archwilydd cyffredinol a'r rhai a ddarparwyd gan Lywodraeth Cymru yn ystod tystiolaeth lafar i’r pwyllgor. Rydym yn nodi bod Adran Busnes, Ynni a Strategaeth Ddiwydiannol Llywodraeth y DU, neu BEIS, wedi nodi manylion ynghylch cyfrifo ei hamcangyfrifon twyll a gwall mewn perthynas â grantiau COVID-19 Llywodraeth y DU yn ei hadroddiad blynyddol a'i chyfrifon ar gyfer 2020-21, rhywbeth nad yw Llywodraeth Cymru wedi’i wneud.
Rydym yn arbennig o bryderus fod twyll a gwall gwerth £570,000 wedi'i nodi mewn un awdurdod lleol lle cynhaliwyd gwiriadau ychwanegol gan y Fenter Twyll Genedlaethol. Mae hyn yn codi pryderon y gallai awdurdodau lleol nad ydynt wedi dewis cynnal gwiriadau ychwanegol y Fenter Twyll Genedlaethol fethu canfod twyll a gwall heb yr archwiliadau ychwanegol hyn. Mae’r pwyllgor yn siomedig i nodi nad oedd cyfrifon cyfunol Llywodraeth Cymru 2021-22, a osodwyd gerbron y Senedd ar 13 Rhagfyr 2022, yn cynnwys amcangyfrif diweddaraf o dwyll a gwall, er inni gael gwybod ymlaen llaw y byddent.
Bydd y pwyllgor yn parhau i fynd ar drywydd y materion hyn gyda Llywodraeth Cymru, ac mae'n edrych ymlaen at drafodaethau pellach ar y pwnc. Byddwn yn monitro gweithrediad ein hargymhellion yn fanwl. Diolch yn fawr.
Daeth Paul Davies i’r Gadair.
Paul Davies took the Chair.
Can I please put on record, alongside the Chair, my thanks to my fellow committee members, clerks and all those involved in brining this report together? It really was a team effort in every sense of the word. It has been a long and arduous journey getting these accounts published, and I'm really glad that they're now finally seeing the light of day. There are several serious and shocking revelations within the 2020-21 Welsh Government accounts. Some of the issues, dare I say, were more than likely avoidable. One thing is for certain though: there are plenty of lessons for the Welsh Government to learn going forward. Perhaps the most shocking of all—and this is the one that really gets me—is the fact that £155 million was sent back to Westminster because of the Welsh Government's mismanagement. In the midst of a global pandemic, £155 million would have gone a long way in keeping vital public services in Wales up and running.
A gaf gofnodi fy niolch, gyda’r Cadeirydd, i fy nghyd-aelodau o'r pwyllgor, y clercod a phawb a fu’n gysylltiedig â'r gwaith o lunio’r adroddiad hwn? Roedd yn ymdrech tîm ym mhob ystyr. Mae cyhoeddi'r cyfrifon hyn wedi bod yn daith hir a llafurus, ac rwy'n falch iawn eu bod yn gweld golau dydd o'r diwedd. Mae sawl agoriad llygad difrifol ac ysgytwol yng nghyfrifon Llywodraeth Cymru ar gyfer 2020-21. Meiddiaf ddweud bod rhai o'r materion yn rhai y gellid bod wedi eu hosgoi yn ôl pob tebyg. Mae un peth yn sicr, serch hynny: mae digon o wersi i Lywodraeth Cymru eu dysgu wrth symud ymlaen. Efallai mai’r mwyaf ysgytwol—a dyma’r un sy'n fy ngwylltio fwyaf—yw’r ffaith bod £155 miliwn wedi’i anfon yn ôl i San Steffan oherwydd camreolaeth Llywodraeth Cymru. Yng nghanol pandemig byd-eang, byddai £155 miliwn wedi mynd yn bell i gadw gwasanaethau cyhoeddus hanfodol yng Nghymru ar waith.
Will you take an intervention?
A wnewch chi dderbyn ymyriad?
Go on.
Iawn.
I thank you for giving way because it's point that I do take some issue with: £80.6 billion was returned to Government by the Department of Health and Social Care, some of which would have had consequentials for the UK, by the way. Now, in Wales, it was 1 per cent. It was 6 per cent for that department, and 6 per cent across the UK departments. Why did that happen right across Whitehall?
Diolch am ildio, gan ei fod yn bwynt y mae gennyf broblem gydag ef: rhoddwyd £80.6 biliwn yn ôl i’r Llywodraeth gan yr Adran Iechyd a Gofal Cymdeithasol, a byddai rhywfaint ohono wedi arwain at gyllid canlyniadol ar gyfer y DU, gyda llaw. Nawr, yng Nghymru, roedd yn 1 y cant. Roedd yn 6 y cant ar gyfer yr adran honno, ac yn 6 y cant ar draws adrannau’r DU. Pam y digwyddodd hynny ar draws Whitehall?
Huw, can I ask you a question? Have you read the report?
Huw, a gaf fi ofyn cwestiwn i chi? A ydych chi wedi darllen yr adroddiad?
Yes, I have.
Do.
You have. Okay.
Do. Iawn.
It doesn't sound like it.
Nid yw'n swnio felly.
But it doesn't seem as though you are reflecting the report.
Ond nid yw'n ymddangos eich bod chi'n adlewyrchu'r adroddiad.
To be fair, both of your Members who represent the Labour group were in the meeting with us. We went through everything line by line, and everything was met with and approved by them.
A bod yn deg, roedd eich dau Aelod sy’n cynrychioli’r grŵp Llafur yn y cyfarfod gyda ni. Fe aethom drwy bopeth fesul linell, a chafodd popeth ei gymeradwyo ganddynt.
But I'm not on the committee, so I'm asking you.
Ond nid wyf fi ar y pwyllgor, felly rwy'n gofyn i chi.
No, and I'm absolutely letting you know that everything was done with the approval, with all the associated research, and all of the answers were given to us through those who were in—
Nac ydych, ac rwy'n rhoi gwybod i chi fod popeth wedi'i wneud gyda'r gymeradwyaeth, gyda'r holl waith ymchwil cysylltiedig, a rhoddwyd yr holl atebion i ni drwy'r rheini a oedd yn—
That figure was in the report. It's in the report, that figure.
Roedd y ffigur hwnnw yn yr adroddiad. Mae yn yr adroddiad, y ffigur hwnnw.
It was in the report, Huw, and I'm afraid that that's the way we're going to go with this.
Roedd yn yr adroddiad, Huw, ac mae arnaf ofn mai dyna’r ffordd rydym yn mynd i fynd gyda hyn.
Six per cent for Westminster—
Chwech y cant ar gyfer San Steffan—
Can I remind Members that this is not a discussion, this is a debate? So, Natasha Asghar.
A gaf fi atgoffa’r Aelodau nad trafodaeth yw hon, ond dadl? Felly, Natasha Asghar.
Thank you very much. I could think of a million different ways that the money could have been spent here in Wales for the people of Wales, like extra doctors, extra nurses, ways to reduce the waiting lists, or even, in fact, to get extra teachers. Or maybe even help for users of public transport. The UK Government spent £155 million on capping bus fares at £2 in a bid to attract more people. The options are endless as to where this money could have actually been spent. But, no, due to poor financial management by this Labour Government, the people of Wales were deprived of £155 million. We're not talking about a couple of quid here, or even talking about finding some spare change down the back of a sofa. That's enough money to give every public sector worker in Wales a 1.5 per cent pay rise of one year, or as the COVID-19 Bereaved Families for Justice Cymru group have stated, that money could have paid for a lot of—and pardon my pronunciation—high efficiency particulate air filters for hospitals.
Time and time again, glum-faced Labour Ministers stand in front of this very Chamber pleading poverty and austerity, telling everyone who will listen that they simply don't have enough money in their back pockets. Or they say they wish they could do more, but their hands are tied due to a lack of cash. They are always quick to point the finger at Westminster, accusing the UK Government of not pumping enough cash into the Welsh Government's coffers, and the number of times I have literally sat here and rolled my eyes, because one Minister or another likes to say 'Why don't you ask your colleagues in London for more money for Wales?' It's ridiculous. Well, that certainly does not wash with me anymore, as we can all see that the reality is that the Welsh Government had plenty of money, so much in fact that they couldn't even spend it.
Diolch yn fawr iawn. Gallwn feddwl am filiwn o wahanol ffyrdd y gallai’r arian fod wedi’i wario yma yng Nghymru ar gyfer pobl Cymru, fel meddygon ychwanegol, nyrsys ychwanegol, ffyrdd o leihau’r rhestrau aros, neu i gael athrawon ychwanegol hyd yn oed. Neu gymorth i ddefnyddwyr trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus efallai. Gwariodd Llywodraeth y DU £155 miliwn ar gapio prisiau tocynnau bws ar £2 mewn ymgais i ddenu mwy o bobl. Mae’r opsiynau’n ddiddiwedd o ran ble gellid bod wedi gwario’r arian mewn gwirionedd. Ond na, oherwydd rheolaeth ariannol wael gan y Llywodraeth Lafur hon, amddifadwyd pobl Cymru o £155 miliwn. Nid ydym yn sôn am gwpwl o bunnoedd yma, na hyd yn oed yn sôn am ddod o hyd i ychydig o newid mân i lawr cefn soffa. Mae hynny'n ddigon o arian i roi codiad cyflog o 1.5 y cant am flwyddyn i bob gweithiwr yn y sector cyhoeddus yng Nghymru, neu fel y mae grŵp COVID-19 Bereaved Families for Justice Cymru wedi'i nodi, gallai'r arian hwnnw fod wedi talu am lawer o hidlyddion HEPA ar gyfer ysbytai.
Dro ar ôl tro, mae Gweinidogion Llafur prudd wedi sefyll o flaen yr union Siambr hon yn cwyno am dlodi a chyni, gan ddweud wrth bawb sy'n gwrando nad oes ganddynt ddigon o arian yn eu pocedi ôl. Neu maent yn dweud eu bod yn dymuno gallu gwneud mwy, ond mae eu dwylo wedi'u clymu oherwydd prinder arian. Maent bob amser yn barod i bwyntio bys at San Steffan, gan gyhuddo Llywodraeth y DU o beidio â phwmpio digon o arian i goffrau Llywodraeth Cymru, a’r nifer o weithiau rwyf wedi eistedd yma yn llythrennol yn rholio fy llygaid, am fod rhyw Weinidog neu’i gilydd yn dweud 'Pam na wnewch chi ofyn i'ch cymheiriaid yn Llundain am fwy o arian i Gymru?' Mae'n hurt. Wel, yn sicr, ni wnaiff hynny mo'r tro mwyach, gan fod pob un ohonom yn gallu gweld mai’r realiti yw bod gan Lywodraeth Cymru ddigon o arian ar y pryd, cymaint mewn gwirionedd fel na allent ei wario hyd yn oed.
Natasha, would you give way on that point?
Natasha, a wnewch chi ildio ar y pwynt hwnnw?
No, Huw, with all due respect, you've had plenty of chances. And I'm taking note from Dawn earlier: you can keep asking the same question again and again, but you're going to get the same answer. I don't want to hear a single Labour politician stand up in this Chamber in the future talking about how cash-strapped they are. This Government's financial mismanagement has cost the people of Wales dearly, and it simply cannot happen again.
Another point I'd like to draw on in particular here is the level of fraud and error when it comes to the COVID business grant scheme, which was administered via local authorities. The Welsh Government reckons the amount of fraud and error could be anywhere between £700,000 and £37 million. This is an incredibly broad estimate. What I don't understand is why the Welsh Government didn't put more pressure on local authorities to identify incidents of fraud and error. Some councils are saying they had not found a single case of fraud and error. Surely, that can't be right.
I cannot stress enough how important it is that lessons are learnt from this sorry saga, so the people of Wales don't get shortchanged again because of this Welsh Labour Government's sheer incompetence. At the very least, the people of Wales deserve an apology from the Welsh Government and an assurance that there will be real consequences if this sort of sheer negligence should ever happen again. Thank you so much.
Na, Huw, gyda phob parch, rydych wedi cael digon o gyfleoedd. Ac rwy'n adleisio'r hyn a ddywedodd Dawn yn gynharach: gallwch barhau i ofyn yr un cwestiwn dro ar ôl tro, ond rydych yn mynd i gael yr un ateb. Nid wyf am glywed yr un gwleidydd Llafur yn sefyll yn y Siambr hon yn y dyfodol yn sôn am ba mor brin o arian ydynt. Mae camreolaeth ariannol y Llywodraeth hon wedi costio’n ddrud i bobl Cymru, ac ni all ddigwydd eto.
Pwynt arall yr hoffwn sôn yn benodol amdano yma yw lefel twyll a gwall yn y cynllun grantiau busnes COVID-19, a weinyddwyd drwy awdurdodau lleol. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn credu y gallai cyfanswm twyll a gwall fod rhwng £700,000 a £37 miliwn. Mae hwn yn amcangyfrif anhygoel o eang. Yr hyn nad wyf yn ei ddeall yw pam na roddodd Llywodraeth Cymru fwy o bwysau ar awdurdodau lleol i nodi achosion o dwyll a gwall. Mae rhai cynghorau'n dweud nad ydynt wedi dod o hyd i unrhyw achos o dwyll a gwall. Nid yw'n bosibl fod hynny'n wir.
Ni allaf bwysleisio digon pa mor bwysig yw hi fod gwersi’n cael eu dysgu o’r saga druenus hon, fel nad yw pobl Cymru yn cael cam eto oherwydd analluogrwydd pur y Llywodraeth Lafur hon. Mae pobl Cymru o leiaf yn haeddu ymddiheuriad gan Lywodraeth Cymru a sicrwydd y bydd canlyniadau difrifol os bydd y math hwn o esgeulustod llwyr yn digwydd eto. Diolch yn fawr iawn.
Diolch am y cyfle i gael cymryd rhan yn y ddadl yma y prynhawn yma ar gyfer y drafodaeth am gyfrifon y Llywodraeth. Mae'n amlwg bod yr ymchwiliad yma wedi bod yn un trylwyr; mae'r ystod o ganfyddiadau yn dyst i hynny.
Yr elfen gyntaf dwi am edrych arni ydy'r £155 miliwn a ddychwelwyd i'r Trysorlys yn Llundain. Mae'n rhaid cyfaddef fy mod i wedi bod yn syfrdan wrth glywed hyn yn gyntaf. Yn wir, mae'n parhau i fy syfrdanu. Drosodd a thro, rydym ni'n clywed Gweinidogion o'r Llywodraeth yma, heb sôn am Aelodau meinciau cefn y Blaid Lafur, yn dadlau nad ydy Cymru yn cael ei hariannu'n gywir. Yn ddiweddar, mae Gweinidogion wedi bod yn dweud nad oes yna bres i gynnal y grantiau bysiau, er enghraifft, a bod yn rhaid torri'r got yn ôl y brethyn. Yna, rydym ni'n cael ar ddeall eu bod nhw'n gyrru £155 miliwn yn ôl i'r Trysorlys.
Rŵan, dwi'n clywed dadleuon y Llywodraeth—y dadleuon ddaru Huw Irranca ddweud rŵan—eu bod nhw wedi gwneud cais i'r Llywodraeth Geidwadol i gario pres ymlaen o un flwyddyn i'r llall, ac mai bai'r Ceidwadwyr ydy hyn. Ond, o ddifrif, oeddech chi'n disgwyl i'r Ceidwadwyr yn Llundain, yn enwedig wrth ystyried y berthynas wael efo Boris Johnson ar y pryd, i gydymdeimlo? Beth ydych chi'n ei ddisgwyl gan ful ond cic? Mae'n rhaid i'r Llywodraeth yma ddechrau cymryd cyfrifoldeb am ei methiannau ei hun. Drosodd a thro, maen nhw'n gwadu cyfrifoldeb ac yn gwrthod cymryd y bai, er gwaethaf eu bod nhw wedi bod mewn Llywodraeth ers 24 mlynedd.
Thank you for the opportunity to participate in this debate this afternoon on the Welsh Government's accounts. Clearly, this inquiry has been a thorough one; the range of findings are testament to that.
The first element I want to look at is the £155 million that was returned to the Treasury in London. I have to admit that I was aghast when I heard this news first. Indeed, I continue to be astonished. Time and again, we hear Ministers from the Government, never mind backbench Members of the Labour Party, arguing that Wales isn't properly funded. Ministers have recently been saying that there isn't money available to maintain bus grants, for example, and that we have to cut our coat according to our cloth. Then, we're given to understand that they are sending £155 million back to the Treasury.
Now, I hear the Government's arguments—the arguments put forward by Huw Irranca—that they had requested that the Conservative Government allow them to carry funding forward from one year to the next, and that it's the fault of the Conservatives. But, really, did you expect the Conservatives in London, particularly given the poor relationship with Boris Johnson at the time, to sympathise? What do you expect from a mule, but a kick? The Government here has to start taking responsibility for its own failings. Time and again, they deny responsibility and refuse to take the blame, despite the fact that they've been in Government for 24 years.
Ar y pwynt hwn—
On this point—
 chroeso.
You're welcome.
Diolch yn fawr iawn, Mabon. And it's not the same point, despite what was said before. Can I just say: what I would expect from UK Government is responsible engagement with Welsh Government, if there was a responsible Government, in order to negotiate that flexibility? But what does he think of the 6 per cent of Whitehall budgets that were returned to the tune of £1 billion? It is tiny, the £155 million. That would have been £1 billion to Wales as a consequentials—£1 billion.
Diolch yn fawr iawn, Mabon. Ac nid yr un pwynt ydyw, er gwaethaf yr hyn a ddywedwyd ynghynt. A gaf fi ddweud: yr hyn y byddwn yn ei ddisgwyl gan Lywodraeth y DU yw ymgysylltu cyfrifol â Llywodraeth Cymru, pe bai yna Lywodraeth gyfrifol, er mwyn negodi'r hyblygrwydd hwnnw? Ond beth yw ei farn am y 6 y cant o gyllidebau Whitehall a roddwyd yn ôl, y swm o £1 biliwn? Mae'n fach iawn, y £155 miliwn. Byddai hynny wedi bod yn £1 biliwn o gyllid canlyniadol i Gymru—£1 biliwn.
Dwi'n cytuno'n llwyr efo'r Aelod ar y pwynt yna. Ac mae'r ffordd mae Llywodraeth y Ceidwadwyr yn San Steffan yn trin Cymru ac yn trin pobl y wladwriaeth hon yn gywilyddus, ond, yn yr achos yma, rydym ni'n edrych ar £155 miliwn gan Lywodraeth Cymru yn mynd nôl i Drysorlys San Steffan fuasai wedi talu am y bus emergency scheme bedair gwaith, bum gwaith drosodd. Felly, mae'n rhaid i Lywodraeth Cymru gymryd cyfrifoldeb am eu methiannau nhw, yn yr un modd ag y mae'n rhaid i'r Ceidwadwyr gymryd cyfrifoldeb am eu methiannau hwythau yn San Steffan.
Os edrychwch chi ar y straeon ynghylch yr SNP yn yr Alban a'r Ceidwadwyr yn San Steffan, mae'r sylwebyddion yn unfrydol bod y ffaeleddau sy'n cael eu hadrodd yn y newyddion yn ganlyniad i bleidiau gwleidyddol sydd wedi treulio gormod o amser mewn llywodraeth ac wedi mynd yn ddiog. Dyna meddai nhw. Eu bod nhw wedi colli'u sbarc a'u gweledigaeth, meddai nhw, ac wedi colli cyfeiriad. Wel, os ydy hynny'n wir am blaid sydd wedi bod mewn grym ers 15 mlynedd, beth am blaid sydd wedi bod yn llywodraethu yma am 24 mlynedd? Os nad ydyn nhw'n gallu ffeindio achos i wario £155 miliwn yn un o wledydd tlotaf gogledd Ewrop, pan eu bod nhw'n byw drwy argyfwng tai, argyfwng iechyd a methiannau addysg, heb sôn am broblemau lu eraill, yna Duw a'n gwaredo.
Yna mae'r mater o daliadau i'r cyn-Ysgrifennydd Parhaol a'r gyfres o gwestiynau a ddaw yn sgil hynny. Sut gall taliadau sylweddol gael eu gwneud am waith na wnaed, heb fod yn gyntaf fod wedi derbyn cyngor cyfreithiol? Sut bod trefniadau cyflogaeth ac ymddeoliad yn cael eu gwneud sydd ddim yn rhan o reolau adnoddau dynol cyflogaeth y Llywodraeth? A sut nad oedd y wybodaeth yma am y newidiadau i gyflogaeth wedi cael eu cyfathrebu'n glir i'r gwahanol reolwyr llinell? Mae'r cyfan yn rhoi'r awgrym o un rheol i un a rheol arall i eraill. Ond, yn fwy na hyn oll, mae wedi cael ei amlygu eto fyth nad ydy'r Llywodraeth yma yn hoff o dryloywder ac yn methu â chadw cofnodion clir o benderfyniadau. Sawl gwaith mae'n rhaid i'r Llywodraeth gael ei beirniadu am hyn cyn iddyn nhw weithredu? Mae'r adroddiad i mewn i'r cytundeb cyflogaeth i'r cyn-Ysgrifennydd Parhaol yn dangos yn glir nad oedd cofnodion clir wedi cael eu cadw. Rydym ni'n gwybod, o achos Fferm Gilestone, fod cyfarfodydd wedi'u cynnal heb fod cofnodion yn cael eu cadw, a, nôl yn 2020, fe ysgrifennodd y Pwyllgor Cyfrifon Cyhoeddus bryd hynny i'r Ysgrifennydd Parhaol yn mynegi pryderon am fethiant y Llywodraeth i gadw cofnodion cywir.
Pam y cyfrinachedd? Pam y cyndynrwydd i fod yn dryloyw? Mae'r Llywodraeth yn ffodus nad oes yna lawer o graffu cyhoeddus ar ei gwaith yma yng Nghymru, a hynny o ganlyniad i wasg Gymreig fach a straeon gorffwyll San Steffan yn cymryd yr holl bandwidth gwleidyddol Prydeinig, neu efallai fod y Llywodraeth yma yn deall yn iawn fod yna ddiffyg craffu cyhoeddus. Ond gall pethau ddim parhau fel yma. Mae'n rhaid cael tryloywder a dwi'n erfyn ar y Llywodraeth i ddysgu gwersi o'r adroddiad yma a sicrhau bod pobl Cymru yn gwybod yn union sut mae'u pres yn cael ei wario a sut mae'r bobl yma yn cael eu cyflogi. Diolch yn fawr iawn.
I agree entirely with the Member on that point. And the way in which the Conservative Government in Westminster treats Wales and the people of the state is disgraceful, but, in this case, we're looking at £155 million being returned to the Treasury from the Welsh Government, which would have paid for the bus emergency scheme, four or even five times over. So, the Welsh Government must take responsibility for their own failings, just as the Conservatives have to take responsibility for their failings in Westminster.
If you look at the stories around the SNP in Scotland and the Conservatives in Westminster, commentators are united that the failings that are being reported in the news are the result of political parties that have spent too much time in power and have become lazy. That's what they say. They've lost their spark and vision apparently and they've lost direction. Well, if that's true of a party that's been in power for 15 years, what about a party that's been in government here for 24 years? If they can't find a case to spend £155 million in one of the poorest nations of northern Europe, when we're living through a housing crisis, a health crisis and failings in education, never mind untold other problems, then God help us.
And then the issue of payments to the former Permanent Secretary and the range of questions that come around as a result of that. How can significant payments be made for work that hasn't been done, without first taking legal advice? How can employment and retirement arrangements be made that aren't part of the Welsh Government's HR rules? And why was this information on changes to employment not being communicated clearly to line managers? It all suggests that there's one rule for one and another for the others. But, more than all of this, it's been highlighted once again that this Government is not fond of transparency and fails to keep clear records of decisions. How many times does the Government need to be criticised for this before they take action? The report into the employment of the former Permanent Secretary shows clearly that clear records were not kept. We know from the Gilestone Farm issue that meetings were held without records being kept, and, back in 2020, the Public Accounts Committee at that time wrote to the Permanent Secretary expressing concerns about the failure of Government to keep accurate, clear records.
But why the secrecy? Why the reluctance to be transparent? The Government is fortunate that there isn't much public scrutiny of its work here in Wales, as a result of a weak Welsh press and the stories from Westminster taking all of the political bandwidth on a UK level, or maybe the Government here understands full well that there is a lack of public scrutiny. But things can't go on like this. We must have transparency and I urge the Government to learn the lessons from this report and to ensure that the people of Wales know exactly how their money is spent and how people are employed. Thank you.
Jack Sargeant.
Jack Sargeant.
I'm grateful, acting Presiding Officer. It's wonderful to see you in the chair today. I'd like to take the opportunity, if I may, Chair, to set the context of public finances across the United Kingdom, because it is rather important to set the context here today: this scandalous waste of money in Westminster; the UK Government's decision to withhold billions, as we know—as we've discussed many a time here—in terms of capital funding for Wales. If we look back, many of us were here during the time of the pandemic. Let's have a look at some of the things that happened there in the realm of public finances. I think we all remember Matt Hancock, maybe from his I'm a Celebrity days, but certainly from his days as health Minister—that £40 million of Government COVID-related work won by his former pub landlord. It was the same Matt Hancock whose health department at the time underspent over 10 per cent of their departmental funding, which had to be returned to the Treasury, similar to what we're talking about today.
Let's look at department underspends. We touched on department underspends in the Welsh Government, of just 1 per cent, but let's look at the Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy, for example. Alok Sharma and the disastrous Kwasi Kwarteng had £4.1 billion—that's a 16 per cent underspend there. 'The department for so-called levelling up', as I would call it, under Robert Jenrick, £1 billion—that's a 4 per cent department underspend. The Department for Transport, again, 4 per cent; the Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport, as it was, a 19 per cent departmental underspend. That's what we're here to discuss in this debate. If we reflect and contrast the two styles of approaches, NHS England test and trace compared to NHS Wales test and trace, in NHS England, a significant amount of money was spent on that, and a significant amount was wasted as well. Let's look at the efficiency of those two programmes—two different programmes. Wales was led by the public sector, much more efficient than the English system led by the private sector and friends of that Government.
There are countless examples, Presiding Officer, but I do want to touch, before closing, on one. Let's touch again on the fraud example and the levels of fraud. Natasha Asghar, a member of the committee, rightly mentioned it in the debate and I'm glad it was looked at by the committee. The committee report itself sets out that there were very low levels of fraud and error in our grants to businesses as a result of the approach in Wales. Surely that's a lesson to be learnt for the UK Government when they look at their departmental budgets. Let's seek the reality of where we are: the Welsh Government returned less than 1 per cent of its total expenditure limit. Huw Irranca-Davies, in his number of interventions this afternoon, has already explained about that £155 million and how the UK Government could and should have been flexible in their approach, as they have done on many occasions in the past. But the reality again is that Wales and the Welsh Government remain, as it has consistently been, at the top of the league table for spending by all UK Government departments. I've set out before the big departments—BEIS, so-called levelling-up, plenty of others, DCMS—and again, Wales, the Welsh Government, is at the top of the league table.
The bottom line, I think, Presiding Officer, is that, yes, there is £155 million, but it's £155 million that belongs to the people of Wales. It is owed to the people of Cymru, and the decision to take it back—it wasn't given back; it was taken back by the UK Conservative Government—was sadly, and it is sad to say this, a politically motivated one. Diolch.
Rwy’n ddiolchgar, Lywydd dros dro. Mae'n hyfryd eich gweld yn y gadair heddiw. Hoffwn achub ar y cyfle, os caf, Gadeirydd, i nodi cyd-destun arian cyhoeddus ar draws y Deyrnas Unedig, gan ei bod yn bwysig iawn nodi'r cyd-destun yma heddiw: y gwastraff arian gwarthus hwn yn San Steffan; penderfyniad Llywodraeth y DU i wrthod biliynau, fel y gwyddom—fel rydym wedi’i drafod droeon yma—o gyllid cyfalaf i Gymru. Os edrychwn yn ôl, roedd llawer ohonom yma yn ystod cyfnod y pandemig. Gadewch inni edrych ar rai o'r pethau a ddigwyddodd bryd hynny gyda chyllid cyhoeddus. Rwy'n credu bod pob un ohonom yn cofio Matt Hancock, efallai o'i ddyddiau ar I'm a Celebrity, ond yn sicr, o'i ddyddiau fel Gweinidog iechyd—y gwerth £40 miliwn o waith COVID y Llywodraeth a enillwyd gan gyn-landlord ei dafarn leol. Yr un Matt Hancock y gwnaeth ei adran iechyd ar y pryd danwario dros 10 y cant o’u cyllid adrannol, y bu’n rhaid ei roi yn ôl i’r Trysorlys, yn debyg i’r hyn rydym yn sôn amdano heddiw.
Gadewch inni edrych ar danwariant adrannau. Fe wnaethom sôn am danwariant adrannau yn Llywodraeth Cymru o 1 y cant yn unig, ond gadewch inni edrych ar yr Adran Busnes, Ynni a Strategaeth Ddiwydiannol, er enghraifft. Roedd gan Alok Sharma a’r trychinebus Kwasi Kwarteng £4.1 biliwn—mae hwnnw’n danwariant o 16 y cant. 'Yr adran godi'r gwastad fel y'i gelwir', fel y byddwn yn ei galw, o dan Robert Jenrick, £1 biliwn—dyna danwariant o 4 y cant yn yr adran honno. Yr Adran Drafnidiaeth, unwaith eto, 4 y cant; yr Adran dros Dechnoleg Ddigidol, Diwylliant, y Cyfryngau a Chwaraeon, fel yr oedd, tanwariant adrannol o 19 y cant. Dyna rydym yma i’w drafod yn y ddadl hon. Os ydym yn ystyried ac yn cyferbynnu’r ddau ddull o weithredu, sef cynllun profi ac olrhain GIG Lloegr o gymharu â chynllun profi ac olrhain GIG Cymru, yn GIG Lloegr, gwariwyd swm sylweddol o arian ar hynny, a gwastraffwyd swm sylweddol hefyd. Gadewch inni edrych ar effeithlonrwydd y ddwy raglen—dwy raglen wahanol. Cafodd system Cymru ei harwain gan y sector cyhoeddus a oedd yn llawer mwy effeithlon na system Lloegr a gâi ei harwain gan y sector preifat a chyfeillion y Llywodraeth honno.
Mae yna enghreifftiau dirifedi, Lywydd, ond hoffwn gyffwrdd ar un cyn cloi. Gadewch inni gyffwrdd eto ar yr enghraifft o dwyll a lefelau twyll. Soniodd Natasha Asghar, aelod o’r pwyllgor, am hyn yn y ddadl, yn gywir ddigon, ac rwy’n falch fod y pwyllgor wedi edrych arno. Mae adroddiad y pwyllgor ei hun yn nodi bod lefelau isel iawn o dwyll a gwall yn ein grantiau i fusnesau o ganlyniad i’r dull o weithredu yng Nghymru. Mae honno’n wers i Lywodraeth y DU ei dysgu pan fyddant yn edrych ar eu cyllidebau adrannol. Gadewch inni geisio deall realiti ein sefyllfa: rhoddodd Llywodraeth Cymru lai nag 1 y cant o gyfanswm ei therfyn gwariant yn ôl. Mae Huw Irranca-Davies, yn ei nifer o ymyriadau y prynhawn yma, eisoes wedi egluro am y £155 miliwn hwnnw a sut y gallai ac y dylai Llywodraeth y DU fod wedi bod yn hyblyg yn eu hymagwedd, fel y maent wedi bod ar sawl achlysur yn y gorffennol. Ond y gwir amdani unwaith eto yw bod Cymru a Llywodraeth Cymru yn parhau i fod, fel y maent wedi bod yn gyson, ar frig tabl gwariant holl adrannau Llywodraeth y DU. Rwyf wedi sôn eisoes am yr adrannau mawr—BEIS, yr adran godi'r gwastad fel y'i gelwir, llwyth o rai eraill, yr Adran dros Dechnoleg Ddigidol, Diwylliant, y Cyfryngau a Chwaraeon—ac unwaith eto, mae Cymru, Llywodraeth Cymru, ar frig y tabl.
Credaf mai'r gwir amdani, Lywydd, yw oes, mae yna £155 miliwn, ond mae'n £155 miliwn sy'n perthyn i bobl Cymru. Mae'n ddyledus i bobl Cymru, ac mae'r penderfyniad i'w gymryd yn ôl—ni chafodd ei roi yn ôl; cafodd ei gymryd yn ôl gan Lywodraeth Geidwadol y DU—yn anffodus, ac mae'n drist dweud hyn, yn un sydd â chymhelliad gwleidyddol yn sail iddo. Diolch.
Clearly, there's some uncomfort with thorough scrutiny, scrutiny that has been presented in this report. I thank the PAC for doing such a thorough job and driving this debate today. We should never be frightened of scrutiny, even though it may find us wanting. We have to learn from that scrutiny, and clearly today Huw has struggled with some of that scrutiny and is trying to challenge some of the areas in this repeatedly. But Wales requires its Government to be open and transparent with its finances. The money is not here for the Government to do what it wishes to do with impunity. Rather, it has to be entrusted to them by the working people of Wales. It is therefore crucial that this money is used properly, ensuring that taxpayers in Wales get value for money.
Firstly, I would like to highlight the fact that it is incredibly concerning that the laying of the Welsh Government's consolidated accounts for 2021 was significantly delayed and signed nine months later than the timetable originally agreed. And to make those matters worse—and I know I'm repeating things again—the accounts were also qualified by the auditor general on three separate issues, including the payment to the former Permanent Secretary, clinicians' pension tax liabilities, and expenditure for some COVID-19 business grants. One of the main concerns, as we've heard, that the auditor general has was the payment to the former Permanent Secretary of £80,500 upon the end their contract. I must say that I share the concerns of the auditor general. I am also concerned to see the Welsh Government fail to provide sufficient evidence for the auditor general to determine whether this payment was materially correct and properly authorised.
I also want to raise concerns highlighted by the auditor general on the possibility of fraud, again, as we've heard, relating to the Welsh Government's COVID grants. This came about as the public spending watchdog found that some councils had not identified any cases of fraud and error—a conclusion that Audit Wales found extremely unlikely, especially when, after additional checks, one authority found £570,000 worth of potential fraud and error, as pointed out by the Chair of the committee.
Finally, I will again raise the concerns surrounding the significant loss of that £155.5 million worth of revenue as a direct result of the Welsh Government's decision not to spend it, knowing full well that this funding could not be carried forward and only asking for greater flexibility once the financial year had ended. The people of Wales don't want to see the Welsh Government constantly butting heads with the UK Government over established processes—they need one willing to spend public finances here in Wales in a timely and appropriate manner. I certainly hope that this mistake will not be repeated again. Going forward, it's vital that the Welsh Government takes account of what the auditor general has said, ensuring that reports such as these are published and debated quicker in order to effectively scrutinise the use of taxpayers' money. I welcome the scrutiny that has been demonstrated and played out here this afternoon—it's quite right and what we should be doing here.
Yn amlwg, mae craffu trylwyr yn peri peth anesmwythyd, craffu a gyflwynwyd yn yr adroddiad hwn. Diolch i’r PCC am wneud gwaith mor drylwyr a llywio'r ddadl hon heddiw. Ni ddylem byth ofni craffu, er y gallai fod yn feirniadol ohonom. Mae’n rhaid inni ddysgu o’r craffu hwnnw, ac yn amlwg, mae Huw wedi cael trafferth gyda rhywfaint o’r craffu hwnnw heddiw, ac yn ceisio herio rhai o’r pethau yn hyn dro ar ôl tro. Ond mae Cymru angen i'w Llywodraeth fod yn agored ac yn dryloyw gyda’i materion ariannol. Nid yw’r arian yma i’r Llywodraeth wneud fel y mynno heb fod yn atebol i neb. Yn hytrach, mae gweithwyr Cymru'n ymddiried ynddynt i'w wario'n ddoeth. Mae’n hollbwysig, felly, fod yr arian hwn yn cael ei ddefnyddio’n briodol, gan sicrhau bod trethdalwyr Cymru'n cael gwerth am arian.
Yn gyntaf, hoffwn dynnu sylw at y ffaith ei bod yn peri cryn bryder fod y broses o osod cyfrifon cyfunol Llywodraeth Cymru ar gyfer 2021 wedi’i gohirio’n sylweddol a’i llofnodi naw mis yn ddiweddarach na’r amserlen y cytunwyd arni’n wreiddiol. Ac i wneud y materion hynny'n waeth—a gwn fy mod yn ailadrodd pethau eto—rhoddwyd barn amodol gan yr archwilydd cyffredinol ar dri mater gwahanol yn y cyfrifon, gan gynnwys y taliad i'r cyn-Ysgrifennydd Parhaol, rhwymedigaethau treth pensiwn clinigwyr a gwariant ar rai grantiau busnes COVID-19. Un o’r prif bryderon, fel y clywsom, sydd gan yr archwilydd cyffredinol oedd y taliad i’r cyn Ysgrifennydd Parhaol o £80,500 ar ddiwedd eu contract. Mae'n rhaid imi ddweud fy mod innau'n rhannu pryderon yr archwilydd cyffredinol. Mae hefyd yn peri pryder i mi fod Llywodraeth Cymru wedi methu rhoi digon o dystiolaeth briodol i’r archwilydd cyffredinol allu penderfynu a oedd y taliad hwn yn gywir ac wedi’i awdurdodi’n briodol.
Hefyd, hoffwn fynegi pryderon a amlygwyd gan yr archwilydd cyffredinol ynghylch y posibilrwydd o dwyll, unwaith eto, fel y clywsom, mewn perthynas â grantiau COVID Llywodraeth Cymru. Digwyddodd hyn am fod y corff gwarchod gwariant cyhoeddus wedi canfod nad oedd rhai cynghorau wedi nodi unrhyw achosion o dwyll a gwall—casgliad a oedd yn hynod annhebygol ym marn Archwilio Cymru, yn enwedig pan ddarganfu un awdurdod, ar ôl gwiriadau ychwanegol, y gallai fod gwerth £570,000 o dwyll a gwall wedi digwydd, fel y nodwyd gan Gadeirydd y Pwyllgor.
Yn olaf, rwyf am fynegi'r pryderon unwaith eto ynghylch y golled sylweddol o £155.5 miliwn o refeniw o ganlyniad uniongyrchol i benderfyniad Llywodraeth Cymru i beidio â’i wario, gan wybod yn iawn na ellid cario’r cyllid hwn ymlaen, a dim ond gofyn am fwy o hyblygrwydd wedi i'r flwyddyn ariannol ddod i ben. Nid yw pobl Cymru yn dymuno gweld Llywodraeth Cymru yn cecru o hyd ac o hyd gyda Llywodraeth y DU ynghylch prosesau sefydledig—mae arnynt angen un sy’n fodlon gwario arian cyhoeddus yma yng Nghymru mewn modd amserol a phriodol. Rwy’n sicr yn gobeithio na chaiff y camgymeriad hwn ei ailadrodd eto. Wrth symud ymlaen, mae’n hanfodol fod Llywodraeth Cymru yn ystyried yr hyn y mae’r archwilydd cyffredinol wedi’i ddweud, gan sicrhau bod adroddiadau fel y rhain yn cael eu cyhoeddi a’u trafod yn gyflymach er mwyn gallu craffu’n effeithiol ar y defnydd o arian trethdalwyr. Rwy'n croesawu'r gwaith craffu a wnaed ac a drafodwyd yma y prynhawn yma—mae’n gwbl briodol, a dyma ddylem fod yn ei wneud yma.
Dwi'n galw ar y Gweinidog Cyllid a Llywodraeth Leol, Rebecca Evans.
I call on the Minister for Finance and Local Government, Rebecca Evans.
Thank you. I welcome the committee's ongoing scrutiny of our annual accounts. It does help the Welsh Government in its efforts to continually improve the information being made available to readers of the accounts. Officials continue to work closely and constructively with the committee and with Audit Wales, and the Permanent Secretary will respond to the report's recommendations.
One area of interest is the management of the year end. Members will recall that in August of 2022, I provided the Finance Committee with a written report on the 2020-21 final outturn for the Welsh Government set against the spending plans that were approved in the third supplementary budget in line with my commitment to good practice and transparency. I have previously set out the facts in this Chamber many times now, and in the Finance Committee, but I will do so again today.
The pandemic and the funding made available for our response made the 2020-21 financial year an extraordinary year. Significant funding was provided by the UK Government very late in the financial year. To make the most effective use and secure the best value for money for taxpayers, we maximised expenditure wherever possible, including bringing forward our capital plans. To be very clear, we operated within the overall departmental expenditure limit budgetary controls set by HM Treasury and we should have been allowed some flexibility in respect of the individual revenue and capital controls. Our decisions to maximise capital spend were made having regard for the rules within HM Treasury's own consolidated budgeting guidance that revenue budgets can be switched to capital. It's a practice that we have used in the past.
Following a protracted exchange with the then Chief Secretary to the Treasury and HMT officials, we were denied the flexibility to switch revenue to capital, and this is despite being given to understand that the revenue and capital imbalance could be managed after the year end via an outturn adjustment. As a result, funding was reclaimed by the Treasury due to a completely arbitrary application of the consolidated budgeting guidance, which did not fully recognise the arrangements that had been agreed with this Government in our financial framework. I pressed the then CST repeatedly to allow for this flexibility so that we could have the money going forward, with a number of pragmatic suggestions as to how that could be done. However, all of these requests were denied, and that is clearly a position that is unacceptable. But there is a pattern of unreasonableness in HMT decisions and they have cost Wales dearly. This episode demonstrates again that they have an irresponsible and unsustainable approach to managing public finances across the UK. Our recommendations in 'Reforming our Union' seek to resolve these entirely avoidable issues.
So, what might explain Treasury's approach? As we've heard, the total underspend in 2020-21 by all UK Government departments was £29 billion. And we've heard some examples: the Department of Health and Social Care underspent by over 10 per cent of its budget, and Matt Hancock sent £20.2 billion back to the Treasury. Between them, Alok Sharma and Kwasi Kwarteng in BEIS returned £4.1 billion—16 per cent of their available funding went back to the Treasury. Robert Jenrick at the department for levelling up returned £1 billion, 4 per cent of his budget. Grant Shapps at the Department for Transport sent back £0.75 billion, again, 4 per cent of his budget. And Oliver Dowden—[Interruption.]—no, I won't—at the Department for Culture, Media and Sport, sent back £700 million, 19 per cent of his budget, to the Treasury. Overall, UK Government departments returned almost 7 per cent of their funding to the Treasury that year.
Diolch. Rwy'n croesawu gwaith craffu parhaus y pwyllgor ar ein cyfrifon blynyddol. Mae'n helpu Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei hymdrechion i wella'n barhaus yr wybodaeth sydd ar gael i ddarllenwyr y cyfrifon. Mae swyddogion yn parhau i weithio’n agos ac yn adeiladol gyda’r pwyllgor a chydag Archwilio Cymru, a bydd yr Ysgrifennydd Parhaol yn ymateb i argymhellion yr adroddiad.
Un maes o ddiddordeb yw rheolaeth diwedd blwyddyn. Bydd yr Aelodau’n cofio fy mod, ym mis Awst 2022, wedi darparu adroddiad ysgrifenedig i’r Pwyllgor Cyllid ar alldro terfynol 2020-21 ar gyfer Llywodraeth Cymru, wedi’i osod yn erbyn cynlluniau gwariant a gymeradwywyd yn y drydedd gyllideb atodol, yn unol â fy ymrwymiad i arferion da a thryloywder. Rwyf wedi nodi’r ffeithiau yn y Siambr hon ar sawl achlysur bellach, ac yn y Pwyllgor Cyllid, ond fe wnaf hynny eto heddiw.
Roedd y pandemig a’r cyllid a ddarparwyd ar gyfer ein hymateb yn golygu bod blwyddyn ariannol 2020-21 yn flwyddyn eithriadol. Darparwyd cyllid sylweddol gan Lywodraeth y DU yn hwyr iawn yn y flwyddyn ariannol. Er mwyn gwneud y defnydd mwyaf effeithiol o’r cyllid hwn a sicrhau’r gwerth gorau am arian i’r trethdalwr, fe wnaethom benderfyniadau i sicrhau’r gwariant mwyaf lle bynnag y bo modd, gan gynnwys bwrw ymlaen yn gynharach â’n cynlluniau cyfalaf. I fod yn gwbl glir, fe wnaethom weithredu o fewn y rheolaeth gyllidebol gyffredinol a osodwyd gan Drysorlys EF ar y pryd ar gyfer y terfyn gwariant adrannol, a dylem fod wedi cael rhywfaint o hyblygrwydd mewn perthynas â'r rheolaethau refeniw a chyfalaf unigol. Cafodd ein penderfyniadau i sicrhau’r gwariant cyfalaf mwyaf eu gwneud gan ystyried y rheolau yng nghanllawiau cyllidebu cyfunol y Trysorlys, sef bod modd newid cyllidebau refeniw yn gyfalaf. Mae'n arfer a ddefnyddiwyd gennym yn y gorffennol.
Yn dilyn trafodaeth hir gyda Phrif Ysgrifennydd y Trysorlys ar y pryd, a swyddogion y Trysorlys, gwrthodwyd yr hyblygrwydd inni newid refeniw yn gyfalaf, a hynny er inni gael deall y byddai modd i’r anghydbwysedd o ran refeniw a chyfalaf gael ei reoli ar ôl diwedd y flwyddyn drwy addasu alldro. O ganlyniad, cafodd cyllid ei hawlio’n ôl gan y Trysorlys oherwydd defnydd cwbl fympwyol o'r canllawiau cyllidebu cyfunol, nad oedd yn cydnabod yn llawn y trefniadau y cytunwyd arnynt gyda'r Llywodraeth hon yn ein fframweithiau ariannol. Pwysais dro ar ôl tro ar Brif Ysgrifennydd y Trysorlys ar y pryd i ganiatáu'r hyblygrwydd hwn fel y gallem gael yr arian wrth symud ymlaen, gyda nifer o awgrymiadau pragmatig ynglŷn â sut y gellid gwneud hynny. Fodd bynnag, gwrthodwyd pob un o’r ceisiadau hyn, ac mae honno’n amlwg yn sefyllfa annerbyniol. Ond mae patrwm o afresymoldeb ym mhenderfyniadau'r Trysorlys ac maent wedi costio’n ddrud i Gymru. Mae'r bennod hon yn dangos unwaith eto fod ganddynt ddull anghyfrifol ac anghynaliadwy o reoli cyllid cyhoeddus ledled y DU. Mae ein hargymhellion yn 'Diwygio ein Hundeb' yn ceisio datrys y materion cwbl osgoadwy hyn.
Felly, beth allai egluro ymagwedd y Trysorlys? Fel y clywsom, cyfanswm y tanwariant yn 2020-21 gan holl adrannau Llywodraeth y DU oedd £29 biliwn. Ac rydym wedi clywed rhai enghreifftiau: cafwyd tanwariant o dros 10 y cant o'i chyllideb gan yr Adran Iechyd a Gofal Cymdeithasol, a rhoddodd Matt Hancock £20.2 biliwn yn ôl i'r Trysorlys. Rhyngddynt, rhoddodd Alok Sharma a Kwasi Kwarteng yn BEIS £4.1 biliwn yn ôl—aeth 16 y cant o’r cyllid a oedd ar gael ganddynt yn ôl i’r Trysorlys. Rhoddodd Robert Jenrick yn yr adran ffyniant bro £1 biliwn yn ôl, 4 y cant o'i gyllideb. Rhoddodd Grant Shapps yn yr Adran Drafnidiaeth £0.75 biliwn yn ôl, unwaith eto, 4 y cant o’i gyllideb. A rhoddodd Oliver Dowden—[Torri ar draws.]—na wnaf—yn yr Adran dros Ddiwylliant, y Cyfryngau a Chwaraeon £700 miliwn, 19 y cant o'i gyllideb, yn ôl i'r Trysorlys. Yn gyffredinol, rhoddodd adrannau Llywodraeth y DU bron i 7 y cant o’u cyllid yn ôl i’r Trysorlys y flwyddyn honno.
In Wales, the money that was taken back represented 1 per cent of our available resources. A Barnett share of the funding returned to Treasury by UK departments would have been well over £1 billion rather than the much lower £155 million. But let's remember that would've been nothing at all, had the revenue-to-capital switch been agreed. While UK Ministers returned large parts of their budgets unspent, we spent every penny of our budget, but the UK Government refused that revenue-to-capital switch. But nobody could argue that we should've followed the UK Government's approach to managing public money during the pandemic. Nick Macpherson, the former Permanent Secretary to the UK Treasury, said that the £37 billion test and trace programme in England
'wins the prize for the most wasteful and inept public spending programme of all time'.
The fact is that the Welsh Government has a long record of outperforming the best UK departments and devolved Governments in terms of using our budget, and that remained the case in 2020-21. That is actually the real story here. I really do regret the ignorant, lazy, politically motivated willingness of some Members within this Chamber to mislead the public about the situation that occurred in that financial year. Our better management of public money here meant that we were able to do more in Wales to support people and businesses through the pandemic. Business support in Wales was significantly more generous. A typical medium-sized pub or restaurant here with 10 staff received £82,500 in Wales, but just £26,000 in England. A coffee shop with four staff received £33,000 here in Wales, just £18,000 in England, and that's thanks to the decisions that were taken here in Wales by the Welsh Government.
The Public Accounts and Public Administration Committee recommends that the Welsh Government should seek early approval for flexibility from HM Treasury before the end of the financial year and provide further details on the timeline for discussions over the 2020-21 year end with the Treasury. I hope I have again assured colleagues that we did all we could, before and after the year end, to resolve the issue, but the Permanent Secretary will be providing additional detail in his response. I have a list here of discussions that we had with HMT over the 2020-21 year end, which began in February 2021 and continued on until June of 2022. Those discussions go into double figures.
The Public Accounts and Public Administration Committee has also made a number of recommendations concerning the extensive range of COVID support provided to businesses during the 2020-21 period. During that time, 260,000 grants were made available to businesses impacted by the pandemic, with a combined value of £1.6 billion. This unprecedented package of assistance was delivered at pace to support businesses that were closed or severely impacted by the pandemic, which were at real risk of ceasing to trade, leading to the loss of thousands of jobs. Overall, 85.8 per cent of recipients agreed that the Welsh Government support was as important as furlough in safeguarding those businesses, and 91.9 per cent agreed that the funding helped safeguard jobs. This was only possible because of the close working with local authorities and partners, such as the Welsh Local Government Association and the Development Bank of Wales.
The level and the speed of our intervention of course brought with it a risk of fraud and error, but our approach was specific to Wales and included checks and balances at all stages. For example, our loan guarantee funding through the DBW, unlike the UK bounceback loans, required businesses to confirm their details for non-domestic rates support to enable us to compare against information of known ratepayers. AI checks were also used against available databases to validate the details. Applicants were checked against sources including Companies House VAT records, business rate registers and in-house databases, while payments were checked against internal financial records and bank accounts to ensure that payments were made to the correct businesses. This has led to a significantly lower rate of fraud and error in Wales, with 99 per cent of awards at this stage demonstrating a compliant approach. By comparison, the UK Government’s business support grants had a fraud error of up to 8.4 per cent, so despite the much lower levels of fraud here, we remain focused on clawback and appropriate measures for all instances of fraud and error detected. And by 'error', I mean error on the part of business in making the application.
So, we have established a dedicated post-completion team and we’re collating the fraud and error rates as part of our ongoing post-completion monitoring activity. And once again, I’m pleased that we haven’t followed the example of the UK Government. Lord Agnew, the Treasury and Cabinet Office Minister at the time, said the UK Government oversight of the various schemes has been nothing less than desperately inadequate, and that schoolboy errors were made.
So, coming to a conclusion, now, Chair, the Public Accounts and Public Administration Committee recommendations reflect on a previous report on the robustness of record keeping and communication of requirements to staff. The permanent secretary has, as recommended by the committee, taken action to ensure that all staff are aware of those requirements, and some other items that I know he will provide in his written response to the committee. There are many aspects of the report that concern the management of the civil service and the employment of staff by the Welsh Government. They are most properly addressed by the Permanent Secretary and he will do so in his written response to the committee.
Yng Nghymru, roedd yr arian a gymerwyd yn ôl yn 1 y cant o’r adnoddau a oedd ar gael i ni. Byddai cyfran Barnett o’r cyllid a roddwyd yn ôl i’r Trysorlys gan adrannau’r DU wedi bod ymhell dros £1 biliwn, yn hytrach na’r ffigur llawer is o £155 miliwn. Ond gadewch inni gofio na fyddai wedi bod yn ddim byd o gwbl pe bai'r newid o refeniw i gyfalaf wedi'i ganiatáu. Er bod Gweinidogion y DU wedi rhoi rhannau helaeth o’u cyllidebau yn ôl heb eu gwario, gwariwyd pob ceiniog o’n cyllideb ni, ond gwrthododd Llywodraeth y DU y newid o refeniw i gyfalaf. Ond ni allai unrhyw un ddadlau y dylem fod wedi dilyn dull Llywodraeth y DU o reoli arian cyhoeddus yn ystod y pandemig. Dywedodd Nick Macpherson, cyn Ysgrifennydd Parhaol Trysorlys y DU, fod y rhaglen profi ac olrhain gwerth £37 biliwn yn Lloegr
'yn ennill y wobr am y rhaglen wariant cyhoeddus fwyaf gwastraffus ac anobeithiol erioed'.
Y gwir amdani yw bod gan Lywodraeth Cymru hanes hir o berfformio’n well nag adrannau gorau'r DU a’r Llywodraethau datganoledig o ran defnyddio ein cyllideb, ac roedd hynny’n dal yn wir yn 2020-21. Dyna'r stori go iawn yma. Rwy’n gresynu’n fawr at barodrwydd anwybodus, diog, wedi'i gymell yn wleidyddol, rhai Aelodau yn y Siambr hon i gamarwain y cyhoedd am y sefyllfa a ddigwyddodd yn y flwyddyn ariannol honno. Golygodd ein rheolaeth well ar arian cyhoeddus yma y bu modd inni wneud mwy yng Nghymru i gefnogi pobl a busnesau drwy’r pandemig. Roedd cymorth busnes yng Nghymru'n fwy hael o lawer. Cafodd tafarn neu fwyty canolig eu maint gyda 10 aelod o staff £82,500 yma yng Nghymru, ond dim ond £26,000 yn Lloegr. Cafodd siop goffi gyda phedwar aelod o staff £33,000 yma yng Nghymru, a dim ond £18,000 yn Lloegr, ac mae hynny oherwydd y penderfyniadau a wnaed yma yng Nghymru gan Lywodraeth Cymru.
Mae’r Pwyllgor Cyfrifon Cyhoeddus a Gweinyddiaeth Gyhoeddus yn argymell y dylai Llywodraeth Cymru geisio cymeradwyaeth gynnar am hyblygrwydd gan Drysorlys Ei Fawrhydi cyn diwedd y flwyddyn ariannol a darparu rhagor o fanylion am yr amserlen ar gyfer trafodaethau ynglŷn â diwedd blwyddyn 2020-21 gyda’r Trysorlys. Rwy'n gobeithio fy mod wedi rhoi sicrwydd eto i fy nghyd-Aelodau ein bod wedi gwneud popeth yn ein gallu, cyn ac ar ôl diwedd y flwyddyn, i ddatrys y mater, ond bydd yr Ysgrifennydd Parhaol yn darparu manylion ychwanegol yn ei ymateb. Mae gennyf restr yma o drafodaethau a gawsom gyda Thrysorlys Ei Fawrhydi ynglŷn â diwedd blwyddyn 2020-21, trafodaethau a ddechreuodd ym mis Chwefror 2021 ac a barhaodd tan fis Mehefin 2022. Mae nifer y trafodaethau hynny'n cyrraedd ffigurau dwbl.
Mae’r Pwyllgor Cyfrifon Cyhoeddus a Gweinyddiaeth Gyhoeddus hefyd wedi gwneud nifer o argymhellion ynghylch yr ystod eang o gymorth COVID a ddarparwyd i fusnesau yn ystod cyfnod 2020-21. Yn ystod y cyfnod hwnnw, cafodd 260,000 o grantiau eu darparu i fusnesau yr effeithiwyd arnynt gan y pandemig, gwerth cyfanswm o £1.6 biliwn. Cyflwynwyd y pecyn cymorth digynsail hwn yn gyflym i gefnogi busnesau a oedd ar gau neu a gafodd eu heffeithio’n ddifrifol gan y pandemig, ac a oedd mewn perygl gwirioneddol o roi’r gorau i fasnachu, gan arwain at golli miloedd o swyddi. Yn gyffredinol, cytunodd 85.8 y cant o’r derbynwyr fod cymorth Llywodraeth Cymru wedi bod yr un mor bwysig â'r cynllun ffyrlo i ddiogelu’r busnesau hynny, a chytunodd 91.9 y cant fod y cyllid wedi helpu i ddiogelu swyddi. Dim ond oherwydd y cydweithio agos ag awdurdodau lleol a phartneriaid, megis Cymdeithas Llywodraeth Leol Cymru a Banc Datblygu Cymru, y bu hyn yn bosibl.
Wrth gwrs, daeth lefel a chyflymder ein hymyrraeth â risg o dwyll a gwall yn ei sgil, ond roedd ein dull o weithredu yn benodol i Gymru ac yn cynnwys mesurau gwirio ac archwilio ar bob cam. Er enghraifft, roedd ein cyllid gwarantu benthyciadau drwy Fanc Datblygu Cymru, yn wahanol i fenthyciadau adfer y DU, yn ei gwneud yn ofynnol i fusnesau gadarnhau eu manylion ar gyfer cymorth ardrethi annomestig i’n galluogi i gymharu â gwybodaeth am drethdalwyr hysbys. Defnyddiwyd gwiriadau deallusrwydd artiffisial hefyd yn erbyn cronfeydd data a oedd ar gael i ddilysu'r manylion. Gwiriwyd ymgeiswyr yn erbyn ffynonellau a oedd yn cynnwys cofnodion TAW Tŷ’r Cwmnïau, cofrestrau ardrethi busnes a chronfeydd data mewnol, tra bo taliadau wedi'u gwirio yn erbyn cofnodion ariannol mewnol a chyfrifon banc i sicrhau bod taliadau’n cael eu gwneud i’r busnesau cywir. Mae hyn wedi arwain at gyfradd sylweddol is o dwyll a gwall yng Nghymru, gyda 99 y cant o ddyfarniadau ar hyn o bryd yn dangos cydymffurfiaeth. Mewn cymhariaeth, roedd gan grantiau cymorth busnes Llywodraeth y DU lefelau twyll o hyd at 8.4 y cant, felly er gwaethaf y lefelau llawer is o dwyll yma, rydym yn parhau i ganolbwyntio ar adfachu a mesurau priodol ar gyfer pob achos o dwyll a gwall a ganfuwyd. Ac wrth 'gwall', rwy'n golygu gwall ar ran busnes wrth wneud y cais.
Felly, rydym wedi sefydlu tîm pwrpasol ar gyfer gwaith ar ôl cwblhau ac rydym yn coladu'r cyfraddau twyll a gwall fel rhan o'n gweithgarwch parhaus yn monitro ar ôl cwblhau. Ac unwaith eto, rwy'n falch nad ydym wedi dilyn esiampl Llywodraeth y DU. Dywedodd yr Arglwydd Agnew, Gweinidog y Trysorlys a Swyddfa’r Cabinet ar y pryd, fod goruchwyliaeth Llywodraeth y DU ar yr amrywiol gynlluniau wedi bod yn ddifrifol o annigonol, a bod gwallau sylfaenol wedi’u gwneud.
Felly, i gloi, Gadeirydd, mae argymhellion y Pwyllgor Cyfrifon Cyhoeddus a Gweinyddiaeth Gyhoeddus yn ystyried adroddiad blaenorol ar gadernid prosesau cadw cofnodion a chyfathrebu gofynion i staff. Mae’r ysgrifennydd parhaol, fel yr argymhellwyd gan y pwyllgor, wedi cymryd camau i sicrhau bod yr holl staff yn ymwybodol o’r gofynion hynny, ac eitemau eraill y gwn y bydd yn eu darparu yn ei ymateb ysgrifenedig i’r pwyllgor. Mae sawl agwedd ar yr adroddiad yn ymwneud â rheolaeth y gwasanaeth sifil a chyflogi staff gan Lywodraeth Cymru. Yr Ysgrifennydd Parhaol yw'r person mwyaf priodol i fynd i'r afael â hwy a bydd yn gwneud hynny yn ei ymateb ysgrifenedig i’r pwyllgor.
Dwi’n galw ar Mark Isherwood i ymateb i’r ddadl.
I call on Mark Isherwood to reply to the debate.
Thanks to everybody who contributed, starting with Natasha Asghar, who stated that there are plenty of lessons for the Welsh Government to learn going forward. She identified a number of key funding needs that the underspend of £155.5 million could have met, and she said that fraud and error could be between £700,000 and £30 million—but we don’t know. Mabon ap Gwynfor said that he was aghast when he heard that the £155.5 million had been returned to the UK Treasury, which would have paid for, he said, the bus emergency scheme four or five times over. He said this Welsh Government is not fond of transparency and clear records are not kept. We can’t go on with a lack of public accountability in Wales, he rightly stated.
Jack Sargeant spoke about the UK Government’s use of money in Westminster, yet, this debate is about the Welsh Government’s accounts, and the Public Accounts and Public Administration Committee considers matters that relate to the economy, efficiency and effectiveness with which resources are employed in the discharge of public functions in Wales, and the Welsh Government is required to respond objectively and transparently to our evidenced findings and recommendations.
Peter Fox said that taxpayers in Wales must get value for money. He again pointed out that the accounts were significantly late, and qualified by the Auditor General for Wales. He shared all the concerns highlighted by Audit Wales and the Auditor General for Wales.
The Minister referred to the management of year end. She stated that Welsh Government operated with the financial controls set by UK Treasury. I didn’t hear her mention that the sum they requested to carry forward was in excess of the limit upon the Welsh reserve, for example. She then reverted to talking about the UK Government when, again, PAPAC’s remit applies in this context to its duty to scrutinise the Welsh Government. Her apparent approach—and I hope I’m wrong—to the findings of the Welsh Parliament’s Public Accounts and Public Administration Committee, and the evidence on which this was based, could have been interpreted as concerning, and I hope will not be allowed, if carried through, to set a precedent.
The committee considers matters, as I said, relating to the economy, efficiency and effectiveness within which resources are employed in the discharge of public functions in Wales. This report is produced by the Senedd’s Public Accounts and Public Administration Committee, which operates independently and which rightly has representation from all the main parties, and let me assure the Minister that the wording in the report was unanimously agreed by all Members, having heard the evidence that we heard together.
Our report highlighted a number of serious issues within the accounts, many of which were rehearsed by speakers. We believe that late notification, coupled with insufficient record keeping and reporting practices employed by the Welsh Government, materially complicated the process of auditing the accounts. The underspend was referenced by a number of speakers; in terms of Huw Irranca-Davies, please look at paragraphs 173-175 of the report, which directly address the points you made.
One small point, I understand, is that UK Government state departments that received blocks of money had to spend that money on the specified purpose, and if they didn't, they knew they had to hand it back, whilst the Welsh Government had discretion, as Welsh Government, within its own powers. The committee found it difficult to understand, as I said, why the Welsh Government waited so long to be told it could not do as it wished with the underspend and why such a request was made retrospectively, raising questions as to whether making a request sooner may have enabled the funds to be used.
In terms of the Permanent Secretary's appointment, a key issue was the question of whether the Welsh Government may have attracted different candidates had the post been advertised at the higher pay scale now being paid to the current Permanent Secretary. Lots of outstanding issues remain around the appointment of the Permanent Secretary. To whom is the Permanent Secretary accountable? Where are they accountable? They're accountable to the UK Cabinet Secretary, but it's unclear whether they were involved. They're also accountable to the First Minister, so who managed this recruitment process and who should be held accountable for that? We hope that the Minister and Welsh Government's formal response to our report will address these points.
Diolch i bawb a gyfrannodd, gan ddechrau gyda Natasha Asghar, a ddywedodd fod digon o wersi i Lywodraeth Cymru eu dysgu wrth symud ymlaen. Nododd nifer o anghenion cyllid allweddol y gallai'r tanwariant o £155.5 miliwn fod wedi eu diwallu, a dywedodd y gallai lefel twyll a gwall fod rhwng £700,000 a £30 miliwn—ond nad ydym yn gwybod. Dywedodd Mabon ap Gwynfor ei fod wedi synnu pan glywodd fod y £155.5 miliwn wedi cael ei anfon yn ôl i Drysorlys y DU, a byddai wedi talu, meddai, am y cynllun brys ar gyfer y sector bysiau bedair neu bum gwaith drosodd. Dywedodd nad yw Llywodraeth Cymru yn hoff o dryloywder ac na chedwir cofnodion clir. Roedd yn gywir i ddweud na allwn barhau heb atebolrwydd cyhoeddus yng Nghymru.
Siaradodd Jack Sargeant am ddefnydd Llywodraeth y DU o arian yn San Steffan, ac eto, mae'r drafodaeth hon yn ymwneud â chyfrifon Llywodraeth Cymru, ac mae'r Pwyllgor Cyfrifon Cyhoeddus a Gweinyddiaeth Gyhoeddus yn ystyried materion sy'n ymwneud ag economi, effeithlonrwydd ac effeithiolrwydd y defnydd o adnoddau i gyflawni swyddogaethau cyhoeddus yng Nghymru, ac mae'n ofynnol i Lywodraeth Cymru ymateb yn wrthrychol ac yn dryloyw i'n canfyddiadau a'n hargymhellion sydd wedi'u seilio ar dystiolaeth.
Dywedodd Peter Fox fod yn rhaid i drethdalwyr yng Nghymru gael gwerth am arian. Tynnodd sylw eto at y ffaith bod y cyfrifon yn hwyr iawn, a bod yr Archwilydd Cyffredinol Cymru wedi rhoi barn amodol arnynt. Rhannodd yr holl bryderon a nodwyd gan Archwilio Cymru ac Archwilydd Cyffredinol Cymru.
Cyfeiriodd y Gweinidog at reolaeth diwedd blwyddyn. Dywedodd fod Llywodraeth Cymru yn gweithredu gyda'r mesurau rheolaeth ariannol a osodir gan Drysorlys y DU. Ni chlywais hi'n sôn bod y swm y gwnaethant ofyn am gael ei gario ymlaen yn fwy na'r terfyn ar gronfa wrth gefn Cymru, er enghraifft. Yna aeth yn ôl i siarad am Lywodraeth y DU pan fo cylch gwaith y Pwyllgor Cyfrifon Cyhoeddus a Gweinyddiaeth Gyhoeddus, unwaith eto, yn berthnasol yn y cyd-destun hwn i'w ddyletswydd i graffu ar Lywodraeth Cymru. Mae'n ymddangos y gellid bod wedi dehongli ei hymagwedd hi—ac rwy'n gobeithio fy mod yn anghywir—tuag at ganfyddiadau Pwyllgor Cyfrifon Cyhoeddus a Gweinyddiaeth Gyhoeddus Senedd Cymru, a'r dystiolaeth y seiliwyd hyn arni, fel un sy'n peri pryder, ac rwy'n gobeithio na chaniateir i hynny osod cynsail pe bai'n cael ei barhau.
Fel y dywedais, mae'r pwyllgor yn ystyried materion sy'n ymwneud ag economi, effeithlonrwydd ac effeithiolrwydd y defnydd o adnoddau i gyflawni swyddogaethau cyhoeddus yng Nghymru. Cynhyrchwyd yr adroddiad gan Bwyllgor Cyfrifon Cyhoeddus a Gweinyddiaeth Gyhoeddus y Senedd, sy'n gweithredu'n annibynnol ac sydd, yn briodol, yn cynnwys cynrychiolaeth o'r holl brif bleidiau, a gadewch imi sicrhau'r Gweinidog fod yr holl Aelodau'n cytuno'n unfrydol ar y geiriad yn yr adroddiad, ar ôl clywed y dystiolaeth a glywsom gyda'n gilydd.
Tynnodd ein hadroddiad sylw at nifer o faterion difrifol sy'n codi yn y cyfrifon, a chafodd nifer ohonynt eu nodi gan siaradwyr. Credwn fod hysbysu hwyr, ynghyd â phroses annigonol ar gyfer cadw cofnodion ac arferion adrodd a ddefnyddir gan Lywodraeth Cymru, wedi cymhlethu'r broses o archwilio'r cyfrifon yn sylweddol. Cyfeiriwyd at y tanwariant gan nifer o siaradwyr; Huw Irranca-Davies, edrychwch ar baragraffau 173-175 o'r adroddiad, sy'n mynd i'r afael yn uniongyrchol â'r pwyntiau a wnaethoch.
Rwy'n deall mai un pwynt bach yw bod adrannau gwladwriaethol Llywodraeth y DU a dderbyniodd flociau o arian wedi gorfod gwario'r arian hwnnw ar y pwrpas penodedig, ac os nad oeddent yn gwneud hynny, roeddent yn gwybod bod yn rhaid iddynt ei roi yn ôl, tra bod gan Lywodraeth Cymru ddisgresiwn, fel Llywodraeth Cymru, o fewn ei phwerau ei hun. Roedd y pwyllgor yn ei chael hi'n anodd deall, fel y dywedais, pam fod Llywodraeth Cymru wedi aros cyhyd i gael gwybod na allai wneud fel y mynnai gyda'r tanwariant a pham y gwnaed cais o'r fath yn ôl-weithredol, gan godi cwestiynau ynglŷn ag a fyddai gwneud cais yn gynt wedi ei gwneud hi'n bosibl i'r arian i gael ei ddefnyddio.
Ar benodiad yr Ysgrifennydd Parhaol, un o'r prif gwestiynau oedd a fyddai Llywodraeth Cymru wedi gallu denu gwahanol ymgeiswyr pe bai'r swydd wedi'i hysbysebu ar y raddfa gyflog uwch sy'n cael ei thalu i'r Ysgrifennydd Parhaol presennol erbyn hyn. Mae llawer o faterion yn parhau i fod heb eu datrys mewn perthynas â phenodi'r Ysgrifennydd Parhaol. I bwy mae'r Ysgrifennydd Parhaol yn atebol? Ble maent yn atebol? Maent yn atebol i Ysgrifennydd Cabinet y DU, ond nid yw'n glir a oedd ganddynt ran yn y penodiad. Maent hefyd yn atebol i Brif Weinidog Cymru, felly pwy oedd yn rheoli'r broses recriwtio a phwy ddylai fod yn atebol am hynny? Rydym yn gobeithio y bydd ymateb ffurfiol y Gweinidog a Llywodraeth Cymru i'n hadroddiad yn mynd i'r afael â'r pwyntiau hyn.
Can the Member please now come to an end?
A wnaiff yr Aelod ddirwyn i ben nawr?
I'll conclude by stating that the Public Accounts and Public Administration Committee will continue to pursue these issues and we will be closely monitoring the implementation of our recommendations. I know that all of its members will jealously guard our reputation for objectivity, evidence-based reports and positive engagement with the public bodies with which we work. Diolch.
Fe ddof i ben drwy ddweud y bydd y Pwyllgor Cyfrifon Cyhoeddus a Gweinyddiaeth Gyhoeddus yn parhau i fynd ar drywydd y materion hyn a byddwn yn monitro'n fanwl y modd y gweithredir ein hargymhellion. Gwn y bydd pob un o'i aelodau'n gwarchod ein henw da am wrthrychedd, adroddiadau sy'n seiliedig ar dystiolaeth ac ymgysylltu cadarnhaol â'r cyrff cyhoeddus yr ydym yn gweithio gyda hwy. Diolch.
Y cwestiwn yw: a ddylid nodi adroddiad y pwyllgor? A oes unrhyw Aelod yn gwrthwynebu? Nac oes. Felly, derbynnir y cynnig yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 12.36.
The proposal is to note the committee's report. Does any Member object? No. The motion is, therefore, agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.
Derbyniwyd y cynnig yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 12.36.
Motion agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.
Fe symudwn ni ymlaen nawr at eitem 7, sef dadl Plaid Cymru ar ailddynodi HS2. Dwi'n galw ar Luke Fletcher i wneud y cynnig.
We'll move on now to item 7, the Plaid Cymru debate on HS2 redesignation. I call on Luke Fletcher to move the motion.
Cynnig NDM8245 Siân Gwenllian
Cynnig bod y Senedd:
Yn galw ar Lywodraeth y DU i ailddynodi HS2 fel prosiect i Loegr yn unig, a rhoi'r symiau canlyniadol sy'n ddyledus i Gymru.
Motion NDM8245 Siân Gwenllian
To propose that the Senedd:
Calls on the UK Government to redesignate HS2 as an England-only project, and provide Wales with the resultant consequentials it is rightfully owed.
Cynigiwyd y cynnig.
Motion moved.
Diolch, Llywydd dros dro. Today, we demand that the UK Government recognises its unjust neglect of Wales and provides us with the consequential funding owed to us. For too long, Westminster has ignored the needs and aspirations of Wales. We have seen successive Governments invest billions of pounds in London and the south-east, while leaving our nation with crumbling infrastructure and underfunded public services.
The high speed 2 line is just one example of how Westminster prioritises England at the expense of Wales. The Tory Government demonstrates yet again that Wales is an afterthought in Whitehall, but the sad truth is that Wales could face the same fate under a Labour-led UK Government. While the First Minister supported our calls for HS2 to be reclassified as an England-only project, Starmer has refused to agree with the First Minister. Let's make this very clear: regardless of which party is in power at Westminster, whether it's Labour or whether it's the Conservatives, none of them has committed to reclassifying HS2 as an England-only project, thus robbing Wales of £5 billion.
Today, we expect the Labour Government in Wales to commit to calling on a future Labour administration to rectify that decision, and today, we expect the Tory Party here to push their Government to do it now. Despite Wales not being directly connected to the proposed route, we are still entitled to receive our fair share of funding, as per the Barnett formula. As we all know, this formula dictates that any funding allocated to England must be mirrored in funding for the devolved nations. But, the designation of HS2 as an England-and-Wales project means we are being deprived of the billions of pounds we are rightfully owed, in contrast to Scotland and the north of Ireland.
As a Senedd, we should unite and demand that the UK Government redesignates HS2 as an England-only project, thus providing Wales with essential consequential funding. Funding that could be used to repair and modernise our broken railway network. It could be used to connect our communities, making travel more accessible, affordable and sustainable. It is a well-known fact that our railways are outdated and underfunded, resulting in slower services, poor connections and inadequate capacity, and the Deputy Minister was honest about this recently. But with this funding, we could significantly improve the efficiency and effectiveness of our rail system. In turn, we could encourage more people to use public transport, thereby reducing congestion on our roads, cutting carbon emissions and fighting climate change. The chronic underinvestment in Wales’s rail infrastructure is well-documented and there’s been no shortage of discussion in this Chamber.
But let us use this opportunity today to remind ourselves of the extent of the unfair, unchecked underinvestment facing us. The travesty of HS2 is part of a broader plight facing Wales, which has resulted in a 200:1 ratio between UK Government’s rail investment in England versus Wales. This is a constitutional outrage. Let’s break this down: last year, analysis showed that the Department for Transport's £180 million contribution to the core Valley lines transformation now being delivered by Transport for Wales is part of a UK Government forward commitment rail enhancement investment in Wales of less than £500 million. In contrast, there are well over £100 billion of rail enhancements set out by DfT in England, specifically the integrated rail plan, which includes funding for HS2 and Northern Powerhouse Rail. Compare that with a population ratio of approximately 20:1 and the route length, just 10:1. This is daylight robbery; it's staggering and completely undefendable. Both HS2 and national rail enhancements are defined by the UK Treasury as England-and-Wales expenditure. The UK Treasury determined the DfT comparability factor for Barnett consequentials to Wales at now just 36 per cent in comparison to 90 per cent in 2015. This applies to any Barnett-isable changes to the DfT’s budget, not just rail.
If you don’t invest in your network to expand capacity, reduce journey times, and improve reliability, your operations become less efficient and more costly and so attract fewer passengers. It is clear that the rail industry and associated DfT ecosystem via its rail network enhancement pipeline and Treasury Barnett policy continue to systematically fail Wales. Wales has and continues to lose out on billions of pounds of necessary rail investment. It is politically, constitutionally, economically and environmentally unacceptable.
Llywydd dros dro, Wales deserves better. We deserve a fair share of funding that reflects our needs and aspirations. It is time for Westminster to recognise the historical injustices and invest in our infrastructure, therefore I urge the Chamber to support Plaid Cymru’s motion. Together, as a Senedd united across party lines, we can boldly assert the rights of Wales and send a clear message to Westminster.
Diolch, Lywydd dros dro. Heddiw, rydym yn mynnu bod Llywodraeth y DU yn cydnabod y modd anghyfiawn y mae'n esgeuluso Cymru ac yn rhoi i ni'r cyllid canlyniadol sy'n ddyledus i ni. Am gyfnod rhy hir, mae San Steffan wedi anwybyddu anghenion a dyheadau Cymru. Rydym wedi gweld Llywodraethau olynol yn buddsoddi biliynau o bunnoedd yn Llundain a de-ddwyrain Lloegr, gan adael ein gwlad ni gyda seilwaith sy'n dadfeilio a gwasanaethau cyhoeddus heb ddigon o arian.
Dim ond un enghraifft o'r ffordd y mae San Steffan yn blaenoriaethu Lloegr ar draul Cymru yw llwybr cyflym HS2. Mae Llywodraeth y Torïaid yn dangos unwaith eto fod Cymru'n ôl-ystyriaeth yn Whitehall, ond y gwir trist yw y gallai Cymru wynebu'r un dynged o dan Lywodraeth y DU sy'n cael ei harwain gan Lafur. Er i Brif Weinidog Cymru gefnogi ein galwadau i HS2 gael ei ailgategoreiddio fel prosiect ar gyfer Lloegr yn unig, mae Starmer wedi gwrthod cytuno â'r Prif Weinidog. Gadewch inni wneud hyn yn glir iawn: ni waeth pa blaid sydd mewn grym yn San Steffan, boed yn Lafur neu'r Ceidwadwyr, nid oes yr un ohonynt wedi ymrwymo i ailgategoreiddio HS2 fel prosiect i Loegr yn unig, gan amddifadu Cymru o £5 biliwn.
Heddiw, rydym yn disgwyl i'r Llywodraeth Lafur yng Nghymru ymrwymo i alw ar weinyddiaeth Lafur yn y dyfodol i gywiro'r penderfyniad hwnnw, a heddiw, rydym yn disgwyl i'r Blaid Dorïaidd yma wthio eu Llywodraeth i wneud hynny nawr. Er nad yw Cymru wedi'i chysylltu'n uniongyrchol â'r llwybr arfaethedig, mae gennym hawl o hyd i dderbyn ein cyfran deg o gyllid, yn unol â fformiwla Barnett. Fel y gwyddom i gyd, mae'r fformiwla'n datgan bod yn rhaid i unrhyw gyllid a ddyrannwyd i Loegr gael ei adlewyrchu mewn cyllid ar gyfer y gwledydd datganoledig. Ond mae dynodi bod HS2 yn brosiect ar gyfer Cymru a Lloegr yn golygu ein bod yn cael ein hamddifadu o'r biliynau o bunnoedd y mae hawl gennym i'w gael, yn wahanol i'r Alban a gogledd Iwerddon.
Fel Senedd, dylem uno a mynnu bod Llywodraeth y DU yn ailddynodi HS2 yn brosiect ar gyfer Lloegr yn unig, gan roi cyllid canlyniadol hanfodol i Gymru. Arian y gellid ei ddefnyddio i atgyweirio a moderneiddio ein rhwydwaith rheilffyrdd diffygiol. Gellid ei ddefnyddio i gysylltu ein cymunedau, gan wneud teithio'n fwy hygyrch, yn fwy fforddiadwy ac yn fwy cynaliadwy. Mae'n ffaith hysbys iawn fod ein rheilffyrdd yn hen ffasiwn a heb eu hariannu'n ddigonol, gan arwain at wasanaethau arafach, cysylltiadau gwael a dim digon o gapasiti, ac roedd y Dirprwy Weinidog yn onest ynglŷn â hyn yn ddiweddar. Ond gyda'r cyllid hwn, gallem wella effeithlonrwydd ac effeithiolrwydd ein system reilffyrdd yn sylweddol. Yn sgil hynny, gallem annog mwy o bobl i ddefnyddio trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus, a thrwy hynny leihau tagfeydd ar ein ffyrdd, torri allyriadau carbon ac ymladd newid hinsawdd. Mae'r tanfuddsoddi cronig yn seilwaith rheilffyrdd Cymru wedi'i gofnodi'n dda a chafwyd llawer o drafod ar y mater yn y Siambr hon.
Ond gadewch inni ddefnyddio'r cyfle hwn heddiw i atgoffa ein hunain ynglŷn â graddau'r tanfuddsoddi annheg a diymatal sy'n ein hwynebu. Mae trybestod HS2 yn rhan o'r trafferthion ehangach sy'n wynebu Cymru, sydd wedi arwain at gymhareb 200:1 rhwng buddsoddiad Llywodraeth y DU mewn rheilffyrdd yn Lloegr o gymharu â Chymru. Mae'n warth cyfansoddiadol. Gadewch inni ei ddadansoddi: y llynedd, dangosodd dadansoddiadau fod cyfraniad £180 miliwn yr Adran Drafnidiaeth i drawsnewid rheilffyrdd craidd y Cymoedd sydd bellach yn cael ei ddarparu gan Trafnidiaeth Cymru yn rhan o ymrwymiad Llywodraeth y DU o lai na £500 miliwn i fuddsoddi mewn gwella rheilffyrdd yn y dyfodol yng Nghymru. Mewn cyferbyniad, mae ymhell dros £100 biliwn o welliannau rheilffyrdd wedi'u nodi gan yr Adran Drafnidiaeth yn Lloegr, yn fwyaf arbennig y cynllun rheilffyrdd integredig, sy'n cynnwys cyllid ar gyfer HS2 a Northern Powerhouse Rail. Cymharwch hynny â chymhareb poblogaeth o tua 20:1 a hyd llwybr sydd ond yn 10:1. Lladrad noeth yw hyn; mae'n syfrdanol ac nid oes modd ei gyfiawnhau. Diffinnir HS2 a gwelliannau rheilffyrdd cenedlaethol gan Drysorlys y DU fel gwariant Cymru a Lloegr. Penderfynodd Trysorlys y DU fod ffactor cymharedd yr Adran Drafnidiaeth ar gyfer symiau canlyniadol Barnett i Gymru bellach ond yn 36 y cant o'i gymharu â 90 y cant yn 2015. Mae hyn yn berthnasol i unrhyw newidiadau y gellid eu Barnetteiddio i gyllideb yr Adran Drafnidiaeth, nid rheilffyrdd yn unig.
Os nad ydych yn buddsoddi yn eich rhwydwaith i ehangu capasiti, lleihau amseroedd teithio, a gwella dibynadwyedd, mae eich gweithgarwch yn mynd yn llai effeithlon ac yn fwy costus ac felly'n denu llai o deithwyr. Mae'n amlwg fod y diwydiant rheilffyrdd ac ecosystem gysylltiedig yr Adran Drafnidiaeth drwy ei darpariaeth ar gyfer gwella'i rhwydwaith rheilffyrdd cenedlaethol a pholisi Barnett y Trysorlys yn parhau i wneud cam systematig â Chymru. Mae Cymru wedi, ac yn parhau i gael ei hamddifadu o biliynau o bunnoedd o fuddsoddiad angenrheidiol ar y rheilffyrdd. Mae'n annerbyniol yn wleidyddol, yn gyfansoddiadol, yn economaidd ac yn amgylcheddol.
Lywydd dros dro, mae Cymru'n haeddu gwell. Rydym yn haeddu cyfran deg o gyllid sy'n adlewyrchu ein hanghenion a'n dyheadau. Mae'n bryd i San Steffan gydnabod yr anghyfiawnder hanesyddol a buddsoddi yn ein seilwaith, felly rwy'n annog y Siambr i gefnogi cynnig Plaid Cymru. Gyda'n gilydd, fel Senedd wedi'i huno ar draws y pleidiau, gallwn fynnu hawliau Cymru yn hyderus ac anfon neges glir i San Steffan.
Thank you so much, acting Presiding Officer. And can I also thank Plaid Cymru for tabling this debate today? Now, let me be clear: it's the Welsh Conservative view that Wales should receive consequentials as a result of HS2. However—and let me please emphasise this 'however'—there's an important point that I must stress: we don't want to see a single penny go directly into the hands of this Labour Government, and let me explain why. Any money—[Interruption.]—any money coming to Wales should go directly to Network Rail, because we have absolutely no confidence that this Government would spend the money wisely to deliver major infrastructure projects. I've shared my view on this matter on countless occasions, and I will say it again today: Labour in Wales have a horrendous track record of frittering away millions of pounds of taxpayers' cash on their vanity projects. They wasted £150 million on the M4 relief road project before spiking it, they pumped in excess of £200 million into a failing airport, and as we've all just heard, they've sent £155 million back to Westminster because they didn't spend it. And please don't even get me started on the south Wales metro and the cost that has now ballooned up to £1 billion.
The list of wasting taxpayers' money goes on and on. Does this really sound like a financially responsible Government that we can trust to deliver for the people of Wales? I think not, and the record speaks for itself. So, yes, the Welsh Conservatives agree that Wales should get money from HS2, just as long as it does not go anywhere near this financially irresponsible Labour Government. And that's not to say HS2 will not bring about benefits to Wales, because, despite what Labour and Plaid might say, it most certainly will.
Diolch o galon, Lywydd dros dro. Ac a gaf fi ddiolch hefyd i Blaid Cymru am gyflwyno'r ddadl hon heddiw? Nawr, gadewch imi fod yn glir: barn y Ceidwadwyr Cymreig yw y dylai Cymru gael arian canlyniadol o ganlyniad i HS2. Fodd bynnag—a gadewch i mi bwysleisio'r 'fodd bynnag'—mae yna un pwynt pwysig sy'n rhaid imi ei bwysleisio: nid ydym eisiau gweld yr un geiniog yn mynd yn uniongyrchol i ddwylo'r Llywodraeth Lafur hon, a gadewch imi egluro pam. Dylai unrhyw arian—[Torri ar draws.]—dylai unrhyw arian sy'n dod i Gymru fynd yn uniongyrchol i Network Rail, oherwydd nid oes gennym unrhyw hyder o gwbl y byddai'r Llywodraeth hon yn gwario'r arian yn ddoeth ar gyflawni prosiectau seilwaith mawr. Rwyf wedi rhannu fy marn ar y mater ar achlysuron dirifedi, ac fe'i dywedaf eto heddiw: mae gan Lafur yng Nghymru hanes erchyll o wastraffu miliynau o bunnoedd o arian trethdalwyr ar eu prosiectau porthi balchder. Fe wnaethant wastraffu £150 miliwn ar brosiect ffordd liniaru'r M4 cyn rhoi'r gorau iddo, fe wnaethant chwistrellu dros £200 miliwn i faes awyr sy'n methu, ac fel rydym i gyd newydd glywed, maent wedi anfon £155 miliwn yn ôl i San Steffan am na wnaethant ei wario. A da chi, peidiwch â gadael imi gychwyn ar fetro de Cymru a'r gost sydd bellach wedi chwyddo i £1 biliwn.
Mae'r rhestr o enghreifftiau o wastraffu arian trethdalwyr yn mynd ymlaen ac ymlaen. A yw hon o ddifrif yn swnio fel Llywodraeth sy'n gyfrifol yn ariannol y gallwn ymddiried ynddi i gyflawni dros bobl Cymru? Nid wyf yn credu hynny, ac mae'r hanes yn siarad drosto'i hun. Felly, mae'r Ceidwadwyr Cymreig yn cytuno y dylai Cymru gael arian o HS2, ond ni ddylai fynd yn agos at y Llywodraeth Lafur anghyfrifol yn ariannol. Ac nid yw hynny'n dweud na fydd HS2 yn creu buddion i Gymru, oherwydd, er gwaethaf yr hyn y bydd Llafur a Phlaid Cymru yn ei ddweud, fe fydd yn sicr o wneud hynny.
How?
Sut?
I'm going to carry on. You'll—. Yes, Jack.
Rwy'n mynd i barhau. Fe—. Ie, Jack.
Thank you very much. Diolch yn fawr iawn, Natasha, for that. You say you agree that money should come across from HS2; we disagree that it shouldn't come to the Welsh Government, the elected Welsh Government. But, having said that, do you think then—? Or will the United Kingdom Conservative Government give the money to north Wales for the electrification of the north Wales line, and when will that happen, because it hasn't happened yet?
Diolch yn fawr iawn. Diolch yn fawr iawn am hynny, Natasha. Rydych chi'n dweud eich bod yn cytuno y dylai arian ddod drosodd o HS2; rydym yn anghytuno na ddylai ddod i Lywodraeth Cymru, sef Llywodraeth etholedig Cymru. Ond wedi dweud hynny, a ydych chi'n meddwl felly—? Neu a wnaiff Llywodraeth Geidwadol y Deyrnas Unedig roi'r arian i ogledd Cymru ar gyfer trydaneiddio rheilffordd gogledd Cymru, a phryd fydd hynny'n digwydd, oherwydd nid yw wedi digwydd eto?
Jack, you've got the Deputy Minister for transport sitting right in front of you—why is he not asking that question and making that call and making those calls? He needs to be able to have that communication. This is what I've been saying. In every contribution I've made, I've constantly asked all your Ministers: make that communication, have that relationship with Westminster. But they don't seem to be doing it, so therefore we're at a loss. We're not in power; if we were, I'd happily pick up the phone and make the call.
So, going back to what I was saying, that's not to say that HS2 will not bring about any benefits to Wales, because, despite what Labour and Plaid might say, it most certainly will. Not only will HS2 deliver faster and more frequent train services to Wales, it will also benefit businesses as some of our nation's companies will be working on the project. In fact, did you know that 44 of HS2 suppliers are actually Welsh SMEs? Labour politicians in this Chamber will often criticise the HS2 scheme and demand extra money for Wales as a result of the project and pull faces—as one is doing right now—yet, rather interestingly, HS2 was first investigated under Gordon Brown's Labour Government back in 2009. And I feel like it's worth reminding you that the current Labour leader has refused to guarantee that he would give Wales a fair share of HS2 funding if, god forbid, he was ever made Prime Minister. So, it would be interesting to hear what Labour Ministers here have to say about Keir Starmer's refusal. It's all well and good tabling this debate today, but what are Plaid going to be doing about it, going forward? You're here with Labour. Are you going to be pushing for action behind the scenes today, or is today's debate just for show?
Jack, mae gennych chi'r Dirprwy Weinidog dros drafnidiaeth yn eistedd o'ch blaen—pam nad yw'n gofyn y cwestiwn hwnnw a gwneud yr alwad honno a gwneud y galwadau hynny? Mae angen iddo allu cyfathrebu yn y ffordd honno. Dyma y bûm yn ei ddweud. Ym mhob cyfraniad a wneuthum, rwyf wedi gofyn i'ch holl Weinidogion yn gyson: cyfathrebwch ar hynny, gwnewch yn siŵr fod gennych y berthynas honno â San Steffan. Ond mae'n ymddangos nad ydynt yn ei wneud, felly rydym mewn penbleth. Nid ni sydd mewn grym; pe baem mewn grym, byddwn yn hapus i godi'r ffôn a gwneud yr alwad honno.
Felly, i fynd yn ôl at yr hyn roeddwn yn ei ddweud, nid yw hynny'n golygu na fydd HS2 yn arwain at unrhyw fuddion i Gymru, oherwydd, er gwaethaf yr hyn y bydd Llafur a Phlaid Cymru'n ei ddweud, mae'n sicr y bydd. Bydd HS2 yn darparu gwasanaethau trên cyflymach ac amlach i Gymru, bydd hefyd o fudd i fusnesau gan y bydd rhai o gwmnïau ein gwlad yn gweithio ar y prosiect. Mewn gwirionedd, a wyddech chi fod 44 o gyflenwyr HS2 yn fusnesau bach a chanolig Cymreig? Bydd gwleidyddion Llafur yn y Siambr hon yn aml yn beirniadu cynllun HS2 ac yn mynnu arian ychwanegol i Gymru o ganlyniad i'r prosiect ac yn tynnu wynebau—fel mae un yn ei wneud yr eiliad hon—ond eto, yn ddigon diddorol, cafodd HS2 ei ymchwilio am y tro cyntaf o dan Lywodraeth Lafur Gordon Brown yn ôl yn 2009. Ac rwy'n teimlo ei bod hi'n werth eich atgoffa bod yr arweinydd Llafur presennol wedi gwrthod gwarantu y byddai'n rhoi cyfran deg i Gymru o gyllid HS2 pe bai, Duw a'n gwaredo, yn cael ei wneud yn Brif Weinidog. Felly, byddai'n ddiddorol clywed beth sydd gan Weinidogion Llafur yma i'w ddweud am wrthodiad Keir Starmer. Un peth yw cyflwyno'r ddadl hon heddiw, ond beth mae Plaid Cymru'n mynd i wneud am hyn wrth symud ymlaen? Rydych chi yma gyda Llafur. A ydych chi'n mynd i fod yn pwyso am weithredu y tu ôl i'r llenni heddiw, neu a yw'r ddadl heddiw'n ddim byd ond sioe?
We live on a different planet, Natasha Asghar and I, because the idea that the UK Government has got a track record of delivery on this matter is just extraordinary. The HS2 facts and figures are the following. The cost initially outlined in 2010 was for a project that would cost £33 billion. By 2015, it had risen to £56 billion, and it has now ballooned to somewhere between £72 billion and £98 billion at 2019 prices, for a project that has cut off the line to Leeds. It's certainly going to cost above £100 billion—almost certainly—and what is Wales going to get for it? Absolutely nothing. These people in the Treasury and the Department for Transport who are trying to argue that this is an England-and-Wales project obviously need a geography lesson, because, when I last looked, the line going from Birmingham to Old Oak Common is nowhere near Wales—absolutely nowhere near. In fact, it makes it less attractive to invest in Wales, because it improves the attractiveness of Birmingham and gives nothing to Wales. It's a real abuse of the devolution settlement and really undermines people's faith in the democratic process.
I heard the really interesting idea that the money that should be due to Wales should be given to Network Rail. Well, that would be better than not giving it to Wales at all, because there's a huge backlog of repairs to be done on Cardiff Central station, which is the only station in Wales that is the responsibility of Network Rail, in case some of you don't realise it; it's nothing to do with Transport for Wales. And last weekend, I had a complaint from a family who was stuck in one of these lifts—very old lifts; I use them quite frequently because I take a bike up there. And they were stuck in it for several hours. And this sort of thing is going to go on, along with the signalling breakdowns. That has a knock-on effect on the smooth running of our train system. So, it really is totally disappointing that the UK Government is simply unable to realise that Wales has transport needs as well. This is not—. They should not just be running the UK Government on behalf of England. They have to take account of the whole of the United Kingdom, and we are getting nothing as a result of this, and it goes with the broken promise that we had back in 2018, when they decided they weren't going to electrify the line to Swansea, as a result of which we're having to run a whole load of inappropriate trains on the lines, when we could be using electrified trains. So, the track record of the UK Government in this is absolutely shameful, and this isn't just a debate that is occurring amongst ourselves. I can tell you that constituents of mine are raising this and saying this is an absolute fiction. This is the sort of thing where they're taking Wales for granted.
If you want to do better, Conservatives, in getting people to vote for you, you'd better start championing the needs of Wales.
Rydym yn byw ar blanedau gwahanol, Natasha Asghar a mi, oherwydd mae'r syniad fod gan Lywodraeth y DU hanes o gyflawni ar y mater hwn yn rhyfeddol. Ffeithiau a ffigyrau HS2 yw hyn. Roedd y gost a amlinellwyd yn wreiddiol yn 2010 ar gyfer prosiect a fyddai'n costio £33 biliwn. Erbyn 2015, roedd wedi codi i £56 biliwn, ac mae bellach wedi chwyddo i rywle rhwng £72 biliwn a £98 biliwn ar brisiau 2019, am brosiect sydd wedi cael gwared ar y rheilffordd i Leeds. Mae'n sicr yn mynd i gostio dros £100 biliwn—bron yn sicr—a beth mae Cymru'n mynd i'w gael amdano? Dim byd o gwbl. Mae'n amlwg fod y bobl hyn yn y Trysorlys a'r Adran Drafnidiaeth sy'n ceisio dadlau bod hwn yn brosiect i Gymru a Lloegr angen gwers ddaearyddiaeth, oherwydd, pan edrychais i ddiwethaf, nid yw'r rheilffordd sy'n mynd o Birmingham i Old Oak Common yn agos at Gymru—nid yw'n dod unman yn agos. Yn wir, mae'n ei gwneud yn llai deniadol i fuddsoddi yng Nghymru, oherwydd ei fod yn gwella atyniad Birmingham ac nid yw'n rhoi dim i Gymru. Mae'n gamddefnydd go iawn o'r setliad datganoli ac yn tanseilio ffydd pobl yn y broses ddemocrataidd.
Clywais y syniad gwirioneddol ddiddorol y dylai'r arian a ddylai fod yn ddyledus i Gymru gael ei roi i Network Rail. Wel, fe fyddai hynny'n well na pheidio ei roi i Gymru o gwbl, oherwydd mae ôl-groniad enfawr o waith atgyweirio i'w wneud ar orsaf Caerdydd Canolog, sef yr unig orsaf yng Nghymru sy'n gyfrifoldeb i Network Rail, rhag ofn nad yw rhai ohonoch yn sylweddoli hynny; nid yw'n ddim byd i'w wneud gyda Trafnidiaeth Cymru. A'r penwythnos diwethaf, cefais gŵyn gan deulu a oedd yn sownd yn un o'r lifftiau hyn—lifftiau hen iawn; rwy'n eu defnyddio'n eithaf aml am fy mod yn mynd â beic i fyny yno. Ac roeddent yn sownd ynddi am sawl awr. Ac mae'r math hwn o beth yn mynd i barhau, ynghyd â signalau'n torri. Mae hynny'n cael sgil-effaith ar rediad llyfn ein system drenau. Felly, mae'n gwbl siomedig mewn gwirionedd nad yw Llywodraeth y DU yn gallu sylweddoli bod gan Gymru anghenion trafnidiaeth hefyd. Nid yw hyn—. Ni ddylent fod yn rhedeg Llywodraeth y DU ar ran Lloegr yn unig. Mae'n rhaid iddynt ystyried y Deyrnas Unedig yn ei chyfanrwydd, ac nid ydym ni'n cael unrhyw beth o ganlyniad i hyn, ac mae'n mynd gyda'r addewid toredig a gawsom yn ôl yn 2018, pan wnaethant benderfynu nad oeddent yn mynd i drydaneiddio'r rheilffordd i Abertawe, ac o ganlyniad i hynny rydym yn gorfod rhedeg llwyth o drenau anaddas ar y rheilffyrdd, pan allem fod yn defnyddio trenau wedi'u trydaneiddio. Felly, mae hanes Llywodraeth y DU yn hyn o beth yn gwbl gywilyddus, ac nid dadl sydd ond yn digwydd ymysg ein gilydd yw hon. Gallaf ddweud wrthych fod etholwyr i mi yn ei godi ac yn dweud bod hyn yn ffuglen lwyr. Dyma'r math o beth lle maent yn cymryd Cymru'n ganiataol.
Os ydych chi am wneud yn well, Geidwadwyr, a chael pobl i bleidleisio drosoch, byddai'n well ichi ddechrau hyrwyddo anghenion Cymru.
Thank you for giving way, Jenny. Would you accept, though, that some of the rolling stock, particularly in north Wales, is the responsibility of the Welsh Labour Government? My constituents are still having to travel on 30 or 40-year-old rolling stock, and they are that old. What my constituents are seeing is Cardiff and the Valleys getting new rolling stock and the Welsh Government making a good advert for that, which is great, but the people of north Wales are having to rely on old trains in order to get from A to B. Would you accept that's the responsibility of the Welsh Government?
Diolch am ildio, Jenny. A fyddech chi'n derbyn, serch hynny, mai cyfrifoldeb Llywodraeth Lafur Cymru yw rhai o'r trenau, yn enwedig yng ngogledd Cymru? Mae fy etholwyr yn dal i orfod teithio ar drenau 30 neu 40 oed, ac maent mor hen â hynny. Beth mae fy etholwyr yn ei weld yw Caerdydd a'r Cymoedd yn cael trenau newydd a Llywodraeth Cymru yn hysbysebu hynny'n dda, sy'n wych, ond mae pobl gogledd Cymru'n gorfod dibynnu ar hen drenau er mwyn mynd o A i B. A fyddech chi'n derbyn mai cyfrifoldeb Llywodraeth Cymru yw hynny?
Well, we've got to start somewhere, and obviously the majority of the population lives in south-east Wales, but I don't discount the fact that the rolling stock in north Wales definitely needs replacing, because I've experienced it myself. But the network lines—[Interruption.] The lines are the responsibility of the UK Government. These main national infrastructure lines are the responsibility of the UK Government and of Network Rail. Instead, Network Rail is being starved of resources across the whole UK network, which means that the whole rail system across the UK is going to be grinding to a halt because of the delays, the signal breakdowns, that will happen across the piece, which means that they are literally trying to make sure that the rail industry dies on its feet. It's an absolute tragedy, and this is just one iteration of that.
Wel, mae'n rhaid i ni ddechrau yn rhywle, ac yn amlwg mae mwyafrif y boblogaeth yn byw yn ne-ddwyrain Cymru, ond nid wyf yn diystyru'r ffaith bod angen trenau newydd yn lle'r rhai yng ngogledd Cymru, yn bendant, oherwydd rwyf wedi'i weld fy hun. Ond y rheilffyrdd rhwydwaith—[Torri ar draws.] Llywodraeth y DU sy'n gyfrifol am y rheilffyrdd. Llywodraeth y DU a Network Rail sy'n gyfrifol am y prif reilffyrdd seilwaith cenedlaethol hyn. Yn lle hynny, mae Network Rail yn cael ei amddifadu o adnoddau ar draws holl rwydwaith y DU, sy'n golygu bod yr holl system reilffyrdd ar draws y DU yn mynd i ddod i stop oherwydd yr oedi, signalau'n torri, a fydd yn digwydd ym mhobman, sy'n golygu eu bod yn llythrennol yn ceisio sicrhau bod y diwydiant rheilffyrdd yn marw ar ei draed. Mae'n drasiedi lwyr, a dim ond un enghraifft o hynny yw hwn.
Wrth amddiffyn y penderfyniad i beidio â rhoi'r arian sydd yn ddyledus i Gymru yn sgil y prosiectau yma, mae Llywodraeth San Steffan wedi dadlau y bydd o fudd i ogledd Cymru, oherwydd y gall pobl y gogledd, credwch chi neu beidio, gyrraedd Llundain ynghynt. Dyma yn ei hanfod ddangos feddylfryd y wladwriaeth Brydeinig; boed yn Geidwadwyr neu'n Llafur, Llundain ydy canol y byd. Bwydo Llundain ydy'r flaenoriaeth, nid hyrwyddo economi ardaloedd eraill.
Ond nid cysylltu pobl efo Llundain ydy ein blaenoriaeth ni. Yn ôl datganiad cynnydd comisiwn trafnidiaeth y gogledd, mae dwy ran o dair o holl siwrneiau pobl y gogledd yn 15 km neu lai. Felly, mae angen buddsoddi i ddatblygu cysylltedd rhwng ein cymunedau ni yma. Dyma ein blaenoriaeth ni.
Ddoe a heddiw, dwi wedi sôn am y ffaith bod ward Dyfi yn Ysbyty Tywyn wedi cael ei gau oherwydd diffyg nyrsys. Un ffaith sydd heb gael y sylw teilwng yn gyhoeddus ydy bod y bwrdd iechyd wedi gofyn i asiantaeth nyrsio ddarparu nyrsys. Byddai hyn wedi cadw'r ward ar agor. Ond, yn anffodus, methodd yr asiantaeth â sicrhau bod y nyrsys yma yn troi i fyny. Pam? Oherwydd bod Tywyn yn rhy bell a bod yna ddiffyg trafnidiaeth ac isadeiledd gwael. Mae'r ffyrdd yma yn droellog ac yn hir, ac mae trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus yn anodd.
Mae gen i etholwr yn cysgu mewn pabell yn ystod yr wythnos yn hytrach na mynd adref i'w gartref gan nad oes yna drafnidiaeth gyhoeddus ar gael i'w gymryd adref ar ôl i'w sifft waith orffen yn y ffatri. Mae gen i etholwr sydd yn gorfod symud o Flaenau Ffestiniog i fyw i Landudno oherwydd bod y gwasanaeth fws wedi gorffen a does dim modd iddyn nhw wneud eu siopa ac ymweld â'r teulu ar adegau cyfleus. Mae gen i fyfyrwyr sydd yn gorfod teithio dwy awr un ffordd ar drên neu gyfres o drenau er mwyn cyrraedd coleg. Mae yna gleifion sydd yn gorfod aros am oriau am gysylltiadau bysys er mwyn cyrraedd eu hapwyntiad yn Ysbyty Alltwen. Sut aflwydd mae trên sy'n cyrraedd Llundain chwarter awr ynghynt yn mynd i helpu'r bobl yma? Mae angen y pres yma arnom ni yma i wella isadeiledd Cymru.
Yna, fe ddywed Llywodraeth San Steffan fod HS2 am fod o fudd economaidd i ni yma. Nonsens llwyr ydy hyn, wrth gwrs. Mae'n wir i ddweud bod buddsoddi mewn isadeiledd yn hwb economaidd. Fe wnaeth Adam Smith hynny'n glir yn ei lyfr, The Wealth of Nations. Dyma ddywedodd yr Institute for Public Policy Research yn eu hadroddiad am y Northern Powerhouse nôl yn 2017:
In defending the decision not to provide the money that is owed to Wales as a result of these projects, the Westminster Government has argued that they will benefit north Wales, because the people of north Wales, believe it or not, will be able to reach London earlier. This essentially shows the mentality of the British state; whether Labour or Conservatives, London is the centre of the world. Feeding London is the priority, not promoting the economy of other areas.
But linking people with London is not our priority. According to the North Wales Transport Commission, two thirds of all journeys made by people in north Wales are 15 km or less. So, we need investment to develop connectivity between our communities here in Wales. This is our priority.
Yesterday and today, I've mentioned the fact that the Dyfi ward in Tywyn Hospital has been closed because of a shortage of nurses. One fact that hasn't been given its deserved coverage publicly is that the health board had asked a nursing agency to provide nurses. This would have kept the ward open. But, unfortunately, the agency failed to ensure that these nurses were available. Why? Because Tywyn is too far, and there is a lack of infrastructure and public transport. These roads are winding and long, and public transport is difficult in the area.
I have a constituent who sleeps in a tent during the week rather than travelling home, because there is no public transport available to take him home once his shift finishes in the factory. I have a constituent who has to move from Blaenau Ffestiniog to live in Llandudno because the bus service has come to an end, and they can't do their shopping or visit their family at convenient times. I have students who have to travel two hours one way on a train, or a series of trains, in order to get to college. There are patients who have to wait for hours for bus connections in order to get to their appointments at Alltwen Hospital. How on earth is a train that gets to London a quarter of an hour more quickly going to help these people? We need this funding here in order to improve Welsh infrastructure.
Then, the Westminster Government claims that HS2 will be of economic benefit to us here in Wales. That is utter nonsense, of course. It’s true to say that investment in infrastructure is an economic boost. Adam Smith made that clear in his book, The Wealth of Nations. This is what the Institute for Public Policy Research said in its report on the Northern Powerhouse back in 2017:
'A very large number of studies from all over the world have demonstrated a clear and positive correlation between public sector infrastructure investment and economic growth, with the multiplier varying from country to country and investment to investment, but always positive'.
'Mae nifer fawr iawn o astudiaethau o bob cwr o'r byd wedi dangos cydberthynas glir a chadarnhaol rhwng buddsoddiad seilwaith y sector cyhoeddus a thwf economaidd, gyda'r lluosydd yn amrywio o wlad i wlad ac o fuddsoddiad i fuddsoddiad, ond bob amser yn gadarnhaol'.
Ond er mwyn gweld y budd economaidd mae'n rhaid gweld y buddsoddiad yma, nid mewn gwlad arall. Dydy arbed chwarter awr ar daith trên ddim yn mynd i ychwanegu at GDP pendraw Llŷn neu arfordir Ardudwy. Os ydym ni am weld twf economaidd go iawn yma, yna mae angen galluogi rheilffyrdd y gogledd a'r canolbarth i gario ffreit, er enghraifft. Bydd hyn yn golygu y gall gweithgynhyrchwyr gynhyrchu nwyddau yn y gogledd orllewin a'u cael i'r farchnad yn hawdd.
Mae angen edrych i ailagor ein rheilffyrdd yma, nid o reidrwydd fel rheilffordd trwm, ond efallai rheilffordd ysgafn i gysylltu cymunedau mewn modd ecolegol a fforddiadwy.
Sy'n dod â fi at y budd mawr olaf, sef y gall buddsoddi yn ein hisadeiledd a'n trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus ni yma olygu bod Cymru'n arwain y gad o ddatgarboneiddio, gan chwarae ein rhan yn llawn yn y frwydr yn erbyn newid hinsawdd.
Byddai derbyn y gyllideb sydd yn ddyledus i ni o HS2 a rheilffordd y Northern Powerhouse yn gallu gweddnewid Cymru er gwell, a chyfoethogi ein cymunedau, helpu i atal diboblogi gwledig, a chyfrannu'n adeiladol at sicrhau nad ydy'r byd am gynhesu dros 1.5 gradd yn fwy na'r tymheredd cyn-ddiwydiannol. Ar sail hyn oll, felly, dwi'n eich annog chi i gyd i gefnogi'r cynnig.
But in order to see those economic benefits you have to see investment here, not in another country. Saving a quarter of an hour on a train journey isn't going to add to the GDP of the far end of the Llŷn Peninsula or the Ardudwy coast. If we want to see real economic growth here, then we need to enable the railways of north and mid Wales to carry freight, for example. This will mean that manufacturers can produce materials in the north-west and get them to market easily.
We need to look to reopen our rail lines, not necessarily as conventional railway, but as light railway to connect communities in a green and affordable manner.
That brings me to the final benefit: investment in our infrastructure and public transport here can mean that Wales is in the vanguard in decarbonising, playing our full part in the battle against climate change.
Receiving what we are owed from HS2 and the Northern Powerhouse railway could transform Wales for the better, enhance our communities, help to avoid depopulation of our rural areas, and make a constructive contribution to ensure that the world isn't going to warm up over 1.5 degrees above pre-industrial levels. On the basis of all of this, I encourage you all to support the motion.
Darren Millar.
Darren Millar.
Thank you, temporary Presiding Officer, or interim Presiding Officer—I'm not quite sure how we refer to you. Can I just say I'm really disappointed with this debate because I thought it would be a good, consensual debate where we were able to gather around the motion on the Order paper that we all support on a cross-party basis here in the Senedd? But it's quite clear that it's gloves off. So, let me get going.
Let's talk—[Interruption.] Let's talk about the absolute dreadful hypocrisy from the Labour Party in this Chamber today that gripe and gripe and gripe about the unfairness that they suggest the UK Government shows towards Wales. We know that, for every £1 spent on transport in England, with the exception of HS2 and some other projects—[Interruption.]—absolutely, and I support that for you—£1.20 comes to Wales. But what doesn't happen is the way that you—. What isn't fair is the way that you carve that cake up within Wales.
Let's have a look at your record on transport spending, because it is absolutely dismal for north Wales. You have spent, or you're going to spend, £1 billion on the south Wales metro, and there's a miserly £50 million—one twentieth of that sum—for a quarter of the population in north Wales, that you've allocated to the north Wales metro, a metro that doesn't appear to be going anywhere at the moment, and which you've scaled back since the original announcement was made. I'll come to you in a second, Jenny. I'll come to you in a second.
Let's talk about the fact that you've dualled the Heads of the Valleys road, right, at extortionate cost. The final project cost was twice the original budget and it took twice as long as it should have taken to deliver that project. In fact, it was nearly three times as long as the original forecasted completion date. It cost £190 million over budget. I mean, that is an extortionate sum of money.
We know as well that you've sunk over £200 million—over £200 million of taxpayers' money—on an airport that is consistently making loses, which is, frankly, like a ghost town in the Vale of Glamorgan, empty nearly every time I go there. Goodness knows what you're doing, but you certainly have no idea how to run an airport. And then you publish a roads review, right—a roads review that ends up scrapping projects the length and breadth of the country, apart from, of course, some key projects in a few Labour and Plaid Cymru constituencies elsewhere, particularly in the south. That is your idea of fairness. Where's the north Wales consequential? When are we going to get our fair share of investment in north Wales to deal with our traffic infrastructure problems? Because I tell you, Jenny, you haven't experienced the half of it. You might have sat on a dodgy old train in the past, but if you had to drive the roads that I have to drive down every week in order to get to this Senedd, or get on the trains that I experience when I have to come down here, you would be absolutely appalled. And frankly, people need to open their eyes and start looking northward and making a bit of investment in my area and my region. I've got essential road safety projects that have been scrapped on the basis of climate change. It doesn't matter if people die on a dangerous junction. It's not going to have any impact on climate change, but they've still been scrapped and shelved by this Government. That's not good enough. I'll take the intervention.
Diolch, Lywydd dros dro, neu Lywydd interim—nid wyf yn hollol siŵr sut i'ch cyfarch. A gaf fi ddweud fy mod yn siomedig iawn gyda'r ddadl hon oherwydd roeddwn i'n meddwl y byddai'n ddadl dda, gydsyniol lle gallem gefnogi'r cynnig ar y papur trefn ar sail drawsbleidiol yma yn y Senedd? Ond mae'n hollol amlwg fod yma anghydweld. Felly, gadewch imi fwrw iddi.
Gadewch inni siarad—[Torri ar draws.] Gadewch inni siarad am y rhagrith ofnadwy ar ran y Blaid Lafur yn y Siambr hon heddiw sy'n cwyno am yr annhegwch y maent yn awgrymu bod Llywodraeth y DU yn ei ddangos tuag at Gymru. Am bob £1 sy'n cael ei wario ar drafnidiaeth yn Lloegr, ac eithrio HS2 a rhai prosiectau eraill—[Torri ar draws.]—yn bendant, ac rwy'n cefnogi hynny i chi—fe wyddom fod £1.20 yn dod i Gymru. Ond yr hyn nad yw'n digwydd yw'r ffordd rydych chi—. Yr hyn nad yw'n deg yw'r ffordd rydych chi'n rhannu'r arian hwnnw o fewn Cymru.
Gadewch inni gael golwg ar eich hanes o wario ar drafnidiaeth, oherwydd mae'n gwbl druenus i ogledd Cymru. Rydych chi wedi gwario, neu rydych chi'n mynd i wario, £1 biliwn ar fetro de Cymru, a dim ond £50 miliwn—un rhan o ugain o'r swm hwnnw—ar gyfer chwarter y boblogaeth yng ngogledd Cymru, a ddyrannwyd gennych ar gyfer metro gogledd Cymru, metro nad yw'n ymddangos ei fod yn mynd i unman ar hyn o bryd, ac rydych wedi'i leihau ers i'r cyhoeddiad gwreiddiol gael ei wneud. Dof atoch mewn eiliad, Jenny. Dof atoch mewn eiliad.
Gadewch inni siarad am y ffaith eich bod wedi deuoli ffordd Blaenau'r Cymoedd ar gost aruthrol. Roedd cost derfynol y prosiect ddwywaith cymaint â'r gyllideb wreiddiol ac fe gymerodd ddwywaith mor hir ag y dylai fod wedi cymryd i gyflawni'r prosiect hwnnw. Yn wir, roedd bron i dair gwaith mor hir â'r dyddiad cwblhau gwreiddiol a ragwelwyd. Fe gostiodd £190 miliwn yn fwy na'r gyllideb. Mae hwnnw'n swm aruthrol o arian.
Fe wyddom hefyd eich bod chi wedi taflu dros £200 miliwn—dros £200 miliwn o arian trethdalwyr—at faes awyr sy'n gwneud colledion yn gyson, ac sydd, yn gwbl onest, fel tref heb bobl ym Mro Morgannwg, yn wag bron bob tro yr af yno. Dyn a ŵyr beth rydych chi'n ei wneud, ond yn sicr nid oes gennych unrhyw syniad sut i redeg maes awyr. Ac yna rydych chi'n cyhoeddi adolygiad ffyrdd—adolygiad ffyrdd sy'n diddymu prosiectau ar hyd a lled y wlad, ar wahân i rai prosiectau allweddol mewn ambell etholaeth Lafur a Phlaid Cymru mewn mannau eraill, yn enwedig yn y de. Dyna yw eich syniad chi o degwch. Ble mae'r swm canlyniadol ar gyfer gogledd Cymru? Pryd y cawn ein cyfran deg o fuddsoddiad yng ngogledd Cymru i ymdopi â'n problemau seilwaith traffig? Oherwydd rwy'n dweud wrthych, Jenny, nid ydych chi wedi profi dim o'i gymharu. Efallai eich bod wedi eistedd ar hen drên da i ddim yn y gorffennol, ond pe bai'n rhaid ichi yrru ar hyd y ffyrdd y mae'n rhaid i mi yrru ar hyd-ddynt bob wythnos er mwyn cyrraedd y Senedd hon, neu fynd ar y trenau rwy'n mynd arnynt pan fydd yn rhaid imi ddod i lawr yma, fe fyddech yn arswydo. Ac a dweud y gwir, mae angen i bobl agor eu llygaid a dechrau edrych tua'r gogledd a gwneud ychydig o fuddsoddi yn fy ardal i a fy rhanbarth i. Mae gennyf brosiectau diogelwch ffyrdd hanfodol sydd wedi cael eu diddymu ar sail newid hinsawdd. Nid oes ots os yw pobl yn marw ar gyffordd beryglus. Nid yw'n mynd i gael unrhyw effaith ar newid hinsawdd, ond maent yn dal i gael eu diddymu a'u rhoi o'r neilltu gan y Llywodraeth hon. Nid yw hynny'n ddigon da. Fe dderbyniaf yr ymyriad.
Thank you very much. Just to remind you that the A470 is one of the nicest drives I experience. I love going north-south on the A470. I can't tell you about your particular projects on—[Interruption.] I absolutely enjoy that. What I wanted to remind you about earlier on—[Interruption.] What I wanted to remind you about earlier on is that the reason we have £1 billion available for the south Wales metro is because we didn't spend £2 billion on 12 miles of road on the M4. That's why we are going to have a much better, much more joined-up south-east Wales transport system.
Diolch yn fawr iawn. Hoffwn eich atgoffa bod yr A470 yn un o'r teithiau mwyaf braf rwy'n eu gyrru. Rwyf wrth fy modd yn mynd o'r gogledd i'r de ar yr A470. Ni allaf ddweud wrthych am eich prosiectau penodol ar—[Torri ar draws.] Rwy'n sicr yn mwynhau'r daith honno. Yr hyn roeddwn eisiau eich atgoffa amdano'n gynharach—[Torri ar draws.] Yr hyn roeddwn eisiau eich atgoffa amdano'n gynharach yw mai'r rheswm fod gennym £1 biliwn ar gael ar gyfer metro de Cymru yw oherwydd na wnaethom wario £2 biliwn ar 12 milltir o ffordd ar yr M4. Dyna pam ein bod yn mynd i gael system drafnidiaeth llawer gwell a llawer mwy cydgysylltiedig ar gyfer de-ddwyrain Cymru.
I would point out, actually, that the UK Government offered to underwrite and fund the cost of the M4 relief road. Yes, it did, and it made it quite clear that it was prepared to do that, and the Welsh Government of course abandoned it—a £100-odd million road to nowhere, with now properties on your hands that you don't know what to do with. So, look, if we want to talk about fairness, we need fairness within Wales as well as within the United Kingdom. So, give us our fair share in all parts of Wales—north, south, east and west—and let's make sure that everybody can benefit from transport infrastructure investments, not just the south.
Hoffwn nodi, mewn gwirionedd, fod Llywodraeth y DU wedi cynnig ariannu cost ffordd liniaru'r M4. Do, fe wnaeth, ac fe wnaeth yn hollol glir ei bod yn barod i wneud hynny, ac wrth gwrs fe wnaeth Llywodraeth Cymru droi ei chefn ar y cynllun—ffordd £100 miliwn i unlle, ac mae gennych eiddo ar eich dwylo nad ydych yn gwybod beth i'w wneud ag ef nawr. Felly, edrychwch, os ydym eisiau siarad am degwch, mae angen tegwch yng Nghymru yn ogystal ag o fewn y Deyrnas Unedig. Felly, rhowch ein cyfran deg i ni ym mhob rhan o Gymru—gogledd, de, dwyrain a gorllewin—a gadewch inni sicrhau bod pawb yn gallu elwa o fuddsoddiadau seilwaith trafnidiaeth, nid y de yn unig.
Daeth y Llywydd i’r Gadair.
The Llywydd took the Chair.
Mae'r cyhoeddiad bod cymal Birmingham i Crewe o'r cynllun HS2 wedi'i oedi ac mai'r lein o Lundain i Birmingham, sef cymal 1, fydd yn mynd ymlaen, mae hyn wedi rhoi sylw newydd. Ond mae'r broblem yn mynd yn ôl 30 o flynyddoedd, a'r broblem hynny, y camgymeriad enbyd hynny, oedd dynodi'r cynllun HS2 yn gynllun Cymru a Lloegr yn hytrach nag yn un Lloegr yn unig, gan amddifadu Cymru o symiau anferth o arian. Roedd penderfyniad y Trysorlys yn un cwbl wallus, ac a dweud y gwir, yn gwbl anghrediniol i unrhyw un sydd wedi edrych ar fap o wledydd Prydain a lle y bwriedir adeiladu'r rheilffordd newydd. Does yna ddim modfedd ohoni hi yng Nghymru, yr Alban nag yng Ngogledd Iwerddon, ond dim ond Cymru sy'n colli allan yn ariannol. Ac, yn y cyfamser, mae ein gwlad ni yn dioddef o danfuddsoddi ar raddfa eang.
Mae'n system trenau ni yn gwegian. Dwi yn gwybod hyn o brofiad. Dwi'n treulio wyth awr o fy mywyd ar drên bob wythnos dwi'n dod i'r Senedd. A Jenny, mae hynna yn well gen i na theithio ar yr A470, er gwaethaf yr amgylchiadau. Mae Trafnidiaeth Cymru wedi newid pethau er gwell rhyw fymryn; dwi yn gweld gwahaniaeth ers i fi ddod i'r Senedd yn 2016. Mae pethau'n dechrau newid yn gan bwyll bach. O leiaf mae yna well cynllunio gwasanaethau. Mae yna well telerau gwaith i weithwyr Trafnidiaeth Cymru nag i'r cwmnïau preifat. Mae gorsaf Bangor yn fy etholaeth i ymhlith y prysuraf yn y gogledd, ac mae yna gynlluniau ar y gweill i wella'r cyfleusterau. Ond, fel mae nifer o etholwyr yn Arfon yn dweud wrthyf fi bob wythnos: mae angen gwelliannau pellgyrhaeddol er mwyn eu hannog nhw i fod yn deithwyr trên cyson.
Mi fyddai'r £5 biliwn o arian cyfatebol HS2, sy'n perthyn i Gymru, yn amhrisiadwy er mwyn gwella gwasanaethau. Ond, yn ogystal â'r tanfuddsoddiad, mae yna broblem arall sy'n milwrio yn erbyn creu system rheilffordd i fod yn falch ohoni, a hynny ydy'r sefyllfa wallgof fod cyfrifoldeb dros y rheiliau, yr isadeiledd, gyda chorff sy'n dod o dan San Steffan. Mae Network Rail wedi tanfuddsoddi ar raddfa eang yng Nghymru ers blynyddoedd, ac mae angen datganoli’r cyfrifoldeb dros yr isadeiledd a’r arian dilynol i’r Senedd hon. Wedyn, mi fedrwn ni fwrw ati o ddifrif i greu system sy’n cysylltu Cymru gyfan â'i gilydd, ac allan o Gymru i weddill y byd.
Un o’r projectau sydd angen ei flaenoriaethu ydy trydaneiddio rheilffordd y gogledd. Mae prif lein y gogledd yn rhedeg am bron 170 km o hyd, ac yn mynd ar draws arfordir y gogledd—golygfeydd prydferth iawn—ond does yna ddim ohoni hi wedi cael ei thrydaneiddio. Trydaneiddio ydy’r allwedd ar gyfer trenau cyflymach, glanach a mwy rheolaidd ar gyfer teithwyr a nwyddau. Ac yn ôl Growth Track 360—[Torri ar draws.] Gwnaf ddod atoch chi mewn dau funud. Yn ôl Growth Track 360, sydd wedi bod yn hybu hyn, mi fyddai rhaglen o drydaneiddio lein y gogledd yn costio £1 biliwn, chweched rhan o’r arian sydd angen dod i ni yn sgil y cynlluniau Lloegr yn unig.
The announcement that the Birmingham to Crewe leg of HS2 has been delayed and that it'll be the line from London to Birmingham, which is phase 1, that will proceed has placed a new highlight on the issue. But the problem goes back 30 years, and that problem, the huge mistake was to designate the HS2 scheme as an England-and-Wales project rather than an England-only project, depriving Wales of huge sums of money. The decision by the Treasury was entirely deficient, to be honest, and totally incredible to anyone who's ever looked at a map of the nations of Britain and where the new rail line is proposed. There's not an inch of it in Wales, Scotland or Northern Ireland, but it's only Wales that is missing out financially as a result of it. And, in the meantime, our nation is suffering from large-scale underinvestment.
Our train system is creaking. I know this from experience. I spend eight hours of my life on a train every week that I come to the Senedd. And Jenny, that is better for me than travelling on the A470, despite the circumstances. Transport for Wales has changed things for the better ever so slightly; I do see a difference since I came to the Senedd in 2016. Things are starting to change very slowly. At least there is better service planning now. There are better working conditions for the staff of Transport for Wales than there were for the private companies. Bangor station in my constituency is among the busiest in north Wales, and there are plans afoot to make improvements to facilities there. But, as many constituents in Arfon tell me on a weekly basis, we need far-reaching improvements in order to encourage them to become regular train users.
The £5 billion of HS2 consequentials, which should come to Wales, would be invaluable in improving services here. But, in addition to the underinvestment, there is another problem that militates against the creation of a rail system that we can be proud of, and that is the absurd situation that the responsibility for the infrastructure, the rail lines, is with a body under Westminster. Network Rail has underinvested on a broad scale in Wales for many years, and we need to devolve responsibility for infrastructure and the consequential funding to this Senedd. Then we can make real progress in creating a system that connects the whole of Wales with itself and outside of Wales, to the rest of the world.
One of the projects that needs to be prioritised is the electrification of the north Wales rail line. The north Wales main line runs for almost 170 km and travels across the north Wales coast. There are wonderful views from the trains, but not a centimetre has been electrified. Electrification is the key for faster, cleaner trains and more regular services for passengers and goods. According to Growth Track 360—[Interruption.] I will come to you in two minutes. According to Growth Track 360, which has been promoting this, the electrification programme for the north Wales main line would cost £1 billion, a sixth of the money that should be coming to us as a result of the England-only plans.
I of course support Growth Track 360’s proposals, but do you agree that, despite the two-year delay to the Birmingham to Crewe stretch of HS2, the Crewe HS2 hub will be critical not only to general rail access to north Wales improvements, but particularly to future electrification?
Rwy'n cefnogi cynigion Growth Track 360 wrth gwrs, ond er gwaethaf yr oedi o ddwy flynedd i lwybr HS2 Birmingham i Crewe, a ydych chi'n cytuno y bydd canolfan Crewe HS2 yn hanfodol nid yn unig i fynediad cyffredinol ar y rheilffyrdd at welliannau gogledd Cymru, ond yn enwedig i drydaneiddio yn y dyfodol?
Y broblem ydy fy mod i ddim yn meddwl bod hwnna’n mynd i ddigwydd, byth, ac na welith hynny mo golau dydd. Mae yna oedi o ddwy flynedd. Faint o grediniaeth ydyn ni’n mynd i'w roi y byddwn ni yn gweld unrhyw gam pellach? A hyd yn oed wedyn, dwi ddim wedi cael fy argyhoeddi bod y newidiadau yma yn Crewe yn mynd i fod yn wirioneddol o fudd i weddill ein gwlad ni.
Dwi’n meddwl bod angen i Lafur a’r Torïaid gydnabod bod angen datganoli’r seilwaith reilffyrdd i Gymru. Hynny yn y pen draw sydd yn mynd i wneud y gwahaniaeth mawr. Ond, yn y cyfamser, heddiw, beth am i ni i gyd ddod at ein gilydd, er gwaethaf y gwahaniaethau ynglŷn ag agweddau o hyn? Mae yna un peth rydyn ni yn cytuno arno fo, a beth am i ni anfon neges glir i San Steffan heddiw fod Senedd Cymru yn mynnu ei chyfran deg o’r arian sy’n ddyledus i ni o gynllun HS2?
The problem is that I don’t think that that will happen, that it will ever happen, and that it will never see the light of day. There’s been a delay of two years. How convinced can we be that we will see any further steps in that regard? Even then, I haven't been convinced that these changes in Crewe will be truly beneficial to the rest of our country.
I think that Labour and the Tories need to recognise that we need to devolve rail infrastructure to Wales. That, ultimately, is what will make a major difference. But in the meantime, today, let us all come together and unite, despite our differences on certain aspects on this. There is one thing that we are agreed on, and let’s send a clear message to Westminster today that the Welsh Parliament insists on its fair share of the funding owed to us from the HS2 project.
I’m going to begin by trying to echo that call for all of us to come together and say what we’ve currently got is just wrong, with the HS2 funding and other funding, over many years, and the Northern Powerhouse Rail plans as well. All of that is wrong, and it shouldn’t rely on changes of Government, by the way. We need to either look at that issue of devolving the rail investment here to Wales, and I would take issue strongly with Natasha’s point—simply allocating it to a body where there is no democratic input would be a travesty. We had a debate earlier this afternoon about scrutiny of decisions and spending of money. We devolve that decision making, that money comes here and then we allocate it, and then scrutiny committees can actually take to task the allocation of that to north or south or east or west or whatever. That’s the way to do it.
It shouldn’t rely on what Government is in power in Westminster. Now, there are ways to do this. It could be devolution; it could be, actually, engagement with the Treasury. The big villain in this, I have to say, is the Treasury. The Treasury makes top-down decisions and says, ‘That’s the way it is.’ And yes, they’re instructed by No. 10, but they’re instructed by the Chancellor as well, and if the Chancellor decides HS2 funding is England-and-Wales spend, or that the Northern Powerhouse Rail is England-and-Wales spend, so be it. There’s no input here from Welsh Ministers whatsoever, or anybody else. Now, surely that has to change. The stage of devolution that we’re at means that Treasury has to be open.
Now, I would suggest that the inter-governmental machinery that has been put forward over the last year or so, which is still bedding in, might be one way forward. But of course there are exclusions within that inter-governmental machinery for Treasury decisions. What a surprise. So, I suspect, unless the Ministers this afternoon can disabuse me of this, I don’t think there is a way forward within the inter-governmental machinery to actually raise this and say, either currently or next time there’s a HS2, or next year’s financial settlement, let’s get in there and let's agree what the proportion is. Should we have full consequentials from it or should there be an agreement? For example, as UK Governments have traditionally argued, if you invest in the south-east in rail, there is a benefit to people who are travelling from north Wales and south Wales. Well, let's actually discuss that and negotiate what benefit does come to Wales, and then say, 'But, it's not the entirety; we want 80 per cent here or we want 90 per cent coming back.'
The practical reality of this—. Luke, I'm glad you introduced the debate, because you'll know some of the hard realities on the ground for us. We have been waiting for something like 15 years for the investment in the electronic signalling of the Maesteg loop. It has been promised time and time again; time and time again, it has been taken away, and I actually remember being told, 'For investment in the south-east of England.' And I think, 'Well, fantastic, I'll visit the south-east of England, I'll go there to Westminster for my committee things and I'll have some benefit', but it's my—I was about to swear—my constituents in Maesteg, they want that electrified. We've got a guy who goes up and down the stairs with an old-fashioned Victorian key to change the signalling to allow it to go. Why is that important? Because we can only have one train an hour on the track. Until we deal with that, and we have the straightening of the loop around the Tondu thing, which we've been promised as well, we can't actually have a half-hourly train. The Pencoed level crossing, we've got to deal with that. We've had no investment in that as part of levelling up.
This is exactly why we either need to have the ability to negotiate with Treasury to say, 'Let's agree what should be coming to Wales and what should stay in England', or, alternatively, we devolve the funding of it. But I welcome the debate today. I think it would be good to have unanimity from this place that we need to change this one way or the other, because we're looking at £5 billion in terms of the HS2 expenditure in Wales—the consequential—and £1 billion from the Northern Powerhouse Rail, potentially, and that ignores the historic underspends here in Wales that will affect every one of us in our constituencies in different ways.
Mark Barry—Professor Mark Barry of Cardiff University—who played, indeed, a key role in the development of the south Wales metro and is acknowledged as somebody who speaks with authority on this, has estimated that the UK Government is now investing 200 times more in England's rail network than in Wales's. You can't argue that on a population basis or any other factual basis whatsoever; it's just unfair. A Cardiff University report in 2021 concluded that if rail were devolved, Wales would have received an extra £514 million in investment in its rail infrastructure in—. Now, that's significant; that is enormous for the Tondu loop, for Maesteg, for north Wales and everywhere else.
But, fundamentally, we must agree that this has now got to change. Top-down decisions that tell us what we get and what we don't get on rail are no longer sustainable whatsoever. So, I would ask Senedd Members to strongly support this today and to look at the options that we have for going forward, and for Ministers to argue for those options with Treasury, which, at the moment, just seems to be a law unto itself.
Rwyf am ddechrau drwy geisio adleisio'r alwad ar bob un ohonom i ddod at ein gilydd a dweud bod yr hyn sydd gennym ar hyn o bryd yn anghywir, gyda chyllid HS2 a chyllid arall, dros nifer o flynyddoedd, a chynlluniau Northern Powerhouse Rail hefyd. Mae hynny i gyd yn anghywir, ac ni ddylai ddibynnu ar newid Llywodraeth, gyda llaw. Mae angen inni naill ai edrych ar fater datganoli'r buddsoddiad rheilffyrdd yma i Gymru, a byddwn yn anghytuno'n gryf â phwynt Natasha—byddai ei ddyrannu i gorff lle nad oes unrhyw fewnbwn democrataidd yn ofnadwy. Cawsom ddadl yn gynharach y prynhawn yma ynglŷn â chraffu ar benderfyniadau a gwario arian. Rydym yn datganoli'r gwaith o wneud penderfyniadau, daw'r arian yma ac rydym yn ei ddyrannu, ac yna gall pwyllgorau craffu feirniadu'r modd y caiff ei ddyrannu i'r gogledd neu'r de neu'r dwyrain neu'r gorllewin neu beth bynnag. Dyna'r ffordd i wneud hyn.
Ni ddylai ddibynnu ar ba Lywodraeth sydd mewn grym yn San Steffan. Nawr, mae yna ffyrdd o wneud hyn. Gallai fod yn ddatganoli; gallai ddigwydd drwy ymgysylltiad â'r Trysorlys mewn gwirionedd. Y drwg yn hyn i gyd, mae'n rhaid imi ddweud, yw'r Trysorlys. Mae'r Trysorlys yn gwneud penderfyniadau o'r brig i lawr ac yn dweud, 'Dyna fel mae pethau.' Ac maent yn cael cyfarwyddyd gan Rif 10, ond maent yn cael cyfarwyddyd gan y Canghellor hefyd, ac os yw'r Canghellor yn penderfynu bod cyllid HS2 yn wariant ar Loegr a Chymru, neu fod Northern Powerhouse Rail yn wariant ar Loegr a Chymru, dyna ni. Nid oes unrhyw fewnbwn yma gan Weinidogion Cymru o gwbl, nac unrhyw un arall. Nawr, mae'n rhaid i hynny newid. Mae'r cam datganoli rydym arno'n golygu bod yn rhaid i'r Trysorlys fod yn agored.
Nawr, byddwn yn awgrymu y gallai'r peirianwaith rhynglywodraethol sydd wedi'i gyflwyno dros y flwyddyn neu ddwy ddiwethaf, sy'n dal i ymwreiddio, fod yn un ffordd ymlaen. Ond wrth gwrs mae yna eithriadau o fewn y peirianwaith rhynglywodraethol hwnnw ar gyfer penderfyniadau'r Trysorlys. Am syndod. Felly, oni bai y gall y Gweinidogion y prynhawn yma fy argyhoeddi fel arall, nid wyf yn credu bod ffordd ymlaen o fewn y peirianwaith rhynglywodraethol i godi hyn a dweud, naill ai ar hyn o bryd neu'r tro nesaf y bydd yna HS2, neu setliad ariannol y flwyddyn nesaf, gadewch inni fwrw iddi a gadewch inni gytuno ar y gyfran. A ddylem gael swm canlyniadol llawn ohono neu a ddylai fod cytundeb? Er enghraifft, fel y mae Llywodraethau'r Deyrnas Unedig wedi dadlau'n draddodiadol, os ydych yn buddsoddi mewn rheilffyrdd yn y de-ddwyrain, mae yna fudd i bobl sy'n teithio o ogledd Cymru a de Cymru. Wel, gadewch inni drafod hynny mewn gwirionedd a thrafod pa fudd sy'n dod i Gymru, ac yna dweud, 'Ond nid dyna'r cyfan; rydym eisiau 80 y cant yma neu rydym eisiau 90 y cant yn dod yn ôl.'
Realiti ymarferol hyn—. Luke, rwy'n falch eich bod wedi cyflwyno'r ddadl, oherwydd fe fyddwch yn gwybod am rai o'r gwirioneddau anodd sy'n ein hwynebu ar lawr gwlad. Rydym wedi bod yn aros am rywbeth fel 15 mlynedd am y buddsoddiad mewn signalau electronig ar gyfer dolen Maesteg. Mae wedi cael ei addo dro ar ôl tro; dro ar ôl tro, mae wedi cael ei dynnu'n ôl, ac mewn gwirionedd rwy'n cofio cael gwybod, 'Ar gyfer buddsoddiad yn ne-ddwyrain Lloegr.' Ac rwy'n meddwl, 'Wel, gwych, fe wnaf ymweld â de-ddwyrain Lloegr, fe af yno i San Steffan ar gyfer fy mhwyllgorau ac fe gaf fudd ohono', ond mae fy—roeddwn ar fin rhegi—mae fy etholwyr ym Maesteg eisiau trydaneiddio. Mae gennym ddyn sy'n mynd i fyny ac i lawr y grisiau gydag allwedd Fictoraidd hen ffasiwn i newid y signalau i ganiatáu i'r trên fynd heibio. Pam fod hynny'n bwysig? Oherwydd mai dim ond un trên yr awr y gallwn ei gael ar y trac. Hyd nes yr awn i'r afael â hynny, a mater sythu'r ddolen o gwmpas Ton-du, sydd wedi cael ei addo i ni hefyd, ni allwn gael trên bob hanner awr. Mae'n rhaid inni fynd i'r afael â chroesfan rheilffordd Pencoed. Nid ydym wedi cael unrhyw fuddsoddiad yn hynny fel rhan o ffyniant bro.
Dyma'n union pam mae angen i ni naill ai allu trafod â'r Trysorlys a dweud, 'Gadewch inni gytuno ar yr hyn a ddylai ddod i Gymru a'r hyn a ddylai aros yn Lloegr', neu fel arall, ein bod yn datganoli'r cyllid. Ond rwy'n croesawu'r ddadl heddiw. Rwy'n credu y byddai'n dda cael barn unfryd o'r lle hwn fod angen inni newid hyn un ffordd neu'r llall, oherwydd rydym yn edrych ar £5 biliwn o wariant HS2 yng Nghymru—y swm canlyniadol—a £1 biliwn o Northern Powerhouse Rail, o bosibl, a hynny heb ystyried y tanwariant hanesyddol yma yng Nghymru a fydd yn effeithio ar bob un ohonom yn ein hetholaethau mewn gwahanol ffyrdd.
Mae Mark Barry—yr Athro Mark Barry o Brifysgol Caerdydd—a chwaraeodd ran allweddol yn natblygiad metro de Cymru ac sy'n cael ei gydnabod fel rhywun sy'n siarad gydag awdurdod ar hyn, wedi amcangyfrif bod Llywodraeth y DU bellach yn buddsoddi 200 gwaith yn fwy yn rhwydwaith rheilffyrdd Lloegr nag yn rhwydwaith rheilffyrdd Cymru. Ni allwch ddadlau yn erbyn hynny ar sail poblogaeth nac unrhyw sail ffeithiol arall o gwbl; mae'n annheg. Daeth adroddiad gan Brifysgol Caerdydd yn 2021 i'r casgliad y byddai Cymru wedi cael £514 miliwn ychwanegol o fuddsoddiad yn ei seilwaith rheilffyrdd pe bai rheilffyrdd wedi'u datganoli. Nawr, mae hwnnw'n arian sylweddol; mae'n enfawr i ddolen Ton-du, i Faesteg, i ogledd Cymru ac i bobman arall.
Ond yn y bôn, mae'n rhaid inni gytuno bod yn rhaid i hyn newid bellach. Nid yw penderfyniadau o'r brig i lawr sy'n dweud wrthym beth a gawn ar gyfer y rheilffyrdd a beth nad ydym yn ei gael yn gynaliadwy o gwbl mwyach. Felly, rwy'n gofyn i Aelodau'r Senedd gefnogi hyn yn gryf heddiw ac i edrych ar yr opsiynau sydd gennym ar gyfer symud ymlaen, ac i Weinidogion ddadlau dros yr opsiynau hynny gyda'r Trysorlys, sy'n ymddangos fel pe bai'n dilyn rheolau gwahanol i bawb arall ar hyn o bryd.
Mae'r ffaith nad ydyn ni'n cael y £5 biliwn yma yn ddim byd mwy na sgandal, a bod yn honest, a dwi eisiau esbonio pam y byddai buddsoddiad o'r math yna yn gallu trawsnewid y ddarpariaeth drafnidiaeth gyhoeddus yn fy rhanbarth i ac ar draws Cymru. Mae'r rhanbarth dwi'n ei gynrychioli, fel rydych chi gyd yn gwybod, yn ardal wledig sydd yn bennaf dioddef gan ddiffyg gwasanaethau rheilffordd a bysys.
Nawr, pan rwy’n mynd mas i gwrdd â phobl ar draws y rhanbarth, ac yn siarad â nhw am y materion sydd o bwys mawr iddyn nhw, dro ar ôl tro maen nhw’n codi’r mater o ddiffyg trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus. I ormod o gymunedau gwledig, breuddwyd gwrach yw’r syniad o gael mynediad at gyswllt rheilffordd cyfleus. Yn aml, dyma’r un cymunedau sy’n wynebu colli eu gwasanaethau pan fydd y cynllun BES yn dod i ben cyn bo hir.
The fact that we are not having this £5 billion is nothing less than a scandal, to be honest, and I want to explain why that kind of investment would be able to transform the provision of public transport in my region and across Wales. The region I represent, as you will know, is a rural area that mainly suffers poor bus and rail services.
When I go out to meet people across the region and talk to them about the issues that are important to them, time and time again they raise the lack of public transport. For too many rural communities, the idea of having access to convenient rail links is a pipe dream. Very often, these are the same communities that face losing services when the BES scheme comes to an end before long.
Now, as we all know, a chronic lack of public transport connectivity has a profound impact on the economy, making it harder for businesses to thrive and for people to access education, training and other essential services. It is also a key factor in wider patterns of rural poverty and social exclusion in rural mid and west Wales.
Where rail services do exist, as anyone who has recently travelled on the Heart of Wales line, for example, will attest, they are regularly beset by delays and cancellations, often with little or no notice. I happened to travel recently on the Heart of Wales line, but unfortunately I wasn't allowed the joys of the railway line all the way because I had to catch a bus from Llandeilo to Llandrindod and from Llandrindod to Llandeilo on the way back.
Timetabling often fails to account for the needs of people. For instance, the final train from Tenby to Pembroke Dock leaves long before anyone on an evening shift in any of Tenby’s restaurants, pubs or bars would be able to catch it to get home. This acts as a barrier to accessing local job opportunities, particularly for young people, and it's an example of inadequate joined-up thinking.
But it doesn't have to be this way. The consequential funding that Wales is rightfully owed from HS2 could help to transform rail provision in mid and west Wales. By investing in our railways, it could also improve the efficiency and effectiveness of our services, providing faster, more frequent and more reliable connections across the region. Improving connectivity would support businesses and help to overcome key obstacles to investment in the region, supporting job creation and boosting growth. This, in turn—and this is really important—could help to reduce poverty and inequality in my region.
Quite simply, there is no way that people in mid and west Wales will be able to move away from private cars at the scale and speed required to combat climate change if public transport remains so unreliable and inconvenient.
Nawr, fel y gwyddom i gyd, mae diffyg cronig o gysylltedd trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus yn cael effaith ddofn ar yr economi, gan ei gwneud hi'n anos i fusnesau ffynnu ac i bobl gael mynediad at addysg, hyfforddiant a gwasanaethau hanfodol eraill. Mae hefyd yn ffactor allweddol ym mhatrymau ehangach tlodi gwledig ac allgáu cymdeithasol yng nghefn gwlad canolbarth a gorllewin Cymru.
Lle mae gwasanaethau rheilffordd yn bodoli, fel y bydd unrhyw un sydd wedi teithio ar reilffordd Calon Cymru yn ddiweddar, er enghraifft, yn tystio, mae yna oedi a chanslo rheolaidd, yn aml heb fawr o rybudd os o gwbl. Roeddwn yn digwydd teithio ar reilffordd Calon Cymru yn ddiweddar, ond yn anffodus ni chefais y pleser o deithio ar y rheilffordd yr holl ffordd oherwydd roedd rhaid i mi ddal bws o Landeilo i Landrindod ar y ffordd yno ac o Landrindod i Landeilo ar y ffordd yn ôl.
Yn aml, nid yw amserlennu'n ystyried anghenion pobl. Er enghraifft, mae'r trên olaf o Ddinbych-y-pysgod i Ddoc Penfro'n gadael ymhell cyn y byddai unrhyw un sydd ar shifft hwyr yn unrhyw un o fwytai, tafarndai neu fariau Dinbych-y-pysgod yn gallu ei ddal i gyrraedd adref. Mae hyn yn rhwystro pobl, yn enwedig pobl ifanc, rhag manteisio ar gyfleoedd gwaith lleol, ac mae'n enghraifft o fethu meddwl yn ddigon cydgysylltiedig.
Ond nid oes rhaid iddi fod fel hyn. Gallai'r cyllid canlyniadol sy'n ddyledus i Gymru o HS2 helpu i drawsnewid y ddarpariaeth reilffyrdd yng nghanolbarth a gorllewin Cymru. Drwy fuddsoddi yn ein rheilffyrdd, gallai hefyd wella effeithlonrwydd ac effeithiolrwydd ein gwasanaethau, gan ddarparu cysylltiadau cyflymach, mwy mynych a mwy dibynadwy ar draws y rhanbarth. Byddai gwella cysylltedd yn cefnogi busnesau ac yn helpu i oresgyn rhwystrau allweddol i fuddsoddi yn y rhanbarth, gan gefnogi creu swyddi a hybu twf. Gallai hyn, yn ei dro—ac mae hyn yn bwysig iawn—helpu i leihau tlodi ac anghydraddoldeb yn fy rhanbarth.
Yn syml iawn, nid oes unrhyw ffordd y bydd pobl canolbarth a gorllewin Cymru'n gallu newid o ddefnyddio ceir preifat ar y raddfa a'r cyflymder sydd ei angen i ymladd newid hinsawdd os yw trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus yn parhau i fod mor annibynadwy ac anghyfleus.
Byddai ailddynodi HS2 fel prosiect i Loegr yn unig a darparu’r cyllid canlyniadol i Gymru yn gwneud gwahaniaeth gwirioneddol i fywydau pobl ledled Cymru. Yn wir, ar bwynt o egwyddor, pa genedl wâr fyddai ddim eisiau cysylltu ei phobl â’i gilydd? Mae gyda ni gysylltiadau o'r gorllewin i'r dwyrain, ond dim o'r gogledd i'r de. A dyna'r pwynt. Rwy'n cytuno gyda Darren Millar: mae angen inni wella'r cyswllt o'r de i'r gogledd. Mae'r sefyllfa'n warth, a hynny ar ôl i Lywodraethau Torïaidd a Llafur gael digon o gyfle i unioni'r cam yma dros ddegawdau. Mae pobl yng nghanolbarth a gorllewin Cymru yn haeddu buddsoddiad yn eu heconomi leol sy'n creu swyddi a lleihau tlodi. Ond yn bennaf oll, maen nhw'n haeddu'r hawl i drafnidiaeth gyhoeddus gyfleus ac effeithiol. Byddai sicrhau'r arian sy'n ddyledus iddyn nhw gan Lywodraeth y Deyrnas Unedig yn mynd gam yn nes i ddarparu'r gwasanaethau sylfaenol hyn. Diolch.
Redesignating HS2 as an England-only project and providing the consequential funding to Wales would make a real difference to the lives of people across the country. Indeed, on a point of principle, what civilized nation would not want to connect people with each other? We have west-to-east connections, but none from north to south. And that's the point. I do agree with Darren Millar on that: we need to improve those north-south connections. The situation is a disgrace. And that's after Tory and Labour Governments have had plenty of opportunity to rectify this over decades. People in mid and west Wales deserve investment in their local economies, which creates jobs and reduces poverty. But more than anything, they deserve the right to public transport that is convenient and effective, and ensuring the money that's owed to them by the UK Government would take us a step closer to providing those basic services. Thank you.
My theme this afternoon is connecting Cymru, following from what Cefin Campbell has just said. Those speaking in favour of this motion today want to connect Cymru, to unleash the potential of our nation, to unite Wales rather than divide our country. We all know that Wales being starved of cash by Westminster is nothing new and we know that cuts are often forced on Wales.
This underinvestment and cutting back on Welsh rail infrastructure goes back decades. In the words of Professor Phil Williams, 'If you examine the criteria used by Lord Beeching and his successors to justify closing individual rail lines, there are huge deficiencies in the accounting methodology.' Phil Williams went on to say, 'What is even more significant in the case of Wales is the incompetent way in which individual lines were closed without any real assessment of the knock-on impact on other lines and on the whole network.' And he was right there. To an official in Whitehall, the closure of the lines between Pwllheli and Caernarfon and Aberystwyth and Carmarthen were relatively minor closures, but that destroyed the one remaining north-south link within Wales. At a stroke of a pen in Whitehall, these closures prejudiced any chance of developing an all-Wales rail network.
When people praise the union, perhaps they should consider these issues: that despite Westminster control of our rail network, we are still in the same situation today following the Beeching cutbacks. I’m pleased to see there’s an ever-growing Senedd petition by Gwynedd councillor Elfed Wyn ap Elwyn for the reopening of railway lines that connect the north and south of Wales. The latest delay on the HS2 line means more money spent, more money wasted, more money taken away from Wales. Research by Mark Barry has revealed Wales in effect pays for HS2. This results in fewer enhancements relative to the rest of the UK network, a less capable and efficient railway, carrying fewer passengers, with a higher subsidy per passenger.
Last month, the Trefnydd agreed to my call for a written statement on rail infrastructure funding lost to Wales. When can we have that written statement to the Members of the Senedd, Minister? Because I am sure Members across this Senedd would like to know how much money Wales has lost over the years due to the delay in the electrification of the Great Western rail line and the fact that HS2 and probably Northern Powerhouse Rail are classified as England-and-Wales projects. Cardiff to Swansea electrification was dropped by the UK Government in 2017. While there are calls to restart this scheme, the UK Government has given no indication that it intends to do so. What discussions, then, Minister, has the Welsh Government had with the Westminster Government and UK Labour colleagues regarding Cardiff to Swansea electrification?
I raised during First Minister’s questions recently the upgrading of the Cardiff West junction in Canton to enable four trains an hour to run through stations on the City line. This is the responsibility of Network Rail and the UK Government. This originally was included in the Department for Transport and Network Rail Cardiff area resignalling and renewal project 2012-15. But for whatever reason, which remains a mystery to me, it didn’t happen. They said they were going to do it between 2012 and 2015, but we are still waiting in 2023. Can the Minister and his officials please investigate this delay with Network Rail and the Department for Transport? The cost of this investment is about £30 million, therefore small fry in comparison with the vast spending on the HS2 project. And if the Westminster Government does come up with the money, will the Welsh Government please commit £20 million via Transport for Wales to improve the Coryton line in the north of Cardiff, so four trains per hour could run on that line as well?
As Siân Gwenllian mentioned at the end of her speech, the important thing here, the crucial thing here, is wouldn’t it be a so much better way of doing things in the future if Wales had full powers over rail, including infrastructure? Will the Minister therefore discuss with his UK colleagues in London to ensure a future Westminster Government would be open to this way forward? Diolch yn fawr.
Fy thema y prynhawn yma yw cysylltu Cymru, gan ddilyn yr hyn y mae Cefin Campbell newydd ei ddweud. Mae'r rhai sy'n siarad o blaid y cynnig hwn heddiw eisiau cysylltu Cymru, rhyddhau potensial ein cenedl, uno Cymru yn hytrach na rhannu ein gwlad. Rydym ni i gyd yn gwybod nad yw'r ffaith bod San Steffan yn amddifadu Cymru o arian yn unrhyw beth newydd a gwyddom fod toriadau'n aml yn cael eu gorfodi ar Gymru.
Mae'r tanfuddsoddiad hwn a thorri'n ôl ar gyllid i seilwaith rheilffyrdd Cymru yn digwydd ers degawdau. Yng ngeiriau'r Athro Phil Williams, 'Os edrychwch ar y meini prawf a ddefnyddiwyd gan yr Arglwydd Beeching a'i olynwyr i gyfiawnhau cau rheilffyrdd unigol, mae'r fethodoleg gyfrifyddu'n ddiffygiol tu hwnt.' Aeth Phil Williams yn ei flaen i ddweud, 'Yr hyn sydd hyd yn oed yn fwy arwyddocaol yn achos Cymru yw'r ffordd ddi-glem y caewyd rheilffyrdd unigol heb unrhyw asesiad gwirioneddol o'r sgil-effeithiau ar reilffyrdd eraill ac ar y rhwydwaith cyfan.' Ac roedd yn gywir yn hynny o beth. I swyddog yn Whitehall, roedd cau'r rheilffyrdd rhwng Pwllheli a Chaernarfon ac Aberystwyth a Chaerfyrddin yn gau cymharol fach, ond fe wnaeth hynny ddinistrio'r unig gysylltiad rhwng y gogledd a'r de a oedd ar ôl yng Nghymru. Gydag ychydig eiriau ar bapur yn Whitehall, gwnaeth cau'r rheilffyrdd hyn ddrwg i unrhyw obaith o ddatblygu rhwydwaith rheilffyrdd Cymru gyfan.
Pan fo pobl yn canmol yr undeb, efallai y dylent ystyried y materion hyn: er gwaethaf rheolaeth San Steffan ar ein rhwydwaith rheilffyrdd, rydym yn dal yn yr un sefyllfa heddiw yn dilyn toriadau Beeching. Rwy'n falch o weld bod gan y cynghorydd o Wynedd, Elfed Wyn ap Elwyn, ddeiseb i'r Senedd sy'n tyfu'n gynyddol dros ailagor rheilffyrdd sy'n cysylltu gogledd a de Cymru. Mae'r oedi diweddaraf ar reilffordd HS2 yn golygu bod mwy o arian yn cael ei wario, mwy o arian yn cael ei wastraffu, mwy o arian yn cael ei gymryd oddi wrth Gymru. Mae ymchwil gan Mark Barry wedi datgelu bod Cymru'n talu am HS2 i bob pwrpas. Mae hyn yn arwain at lai o welliannau o'i gymharu â gweddill rhwydwaith y DU, rheilffordd lai effeithlon, sy'n cludo llai o deithwyr, gyda chymhorthdal uwch am bob teithiwr.
Fis diwethaf, cytunodd y Trefnydd i fy ngalwad am ddatganiad ysgrifenedig ar gyllid seilwaith rheilffyrdd a gollwyd i Gymru. Pryd y gallwn ni gael y datganiad ysgrifenedig hwnnw i Aelodau'r Senedd, Weinidog? Oherwydd rwy'n siŵr yr hoffai Aelodau ar draws y Senedd hon wybod faint o arian y mae Cymru wedi'i golli dros y blynyddoedd oherwydd yr oedi cyn trydaneiddio rheilffordd y Great Western a'r ffaith bod HS2, a Northern Powerhouse Rail yn ôl pob tebyg, yn cael eu categoreiddio fel prosiectau ar gyfer Lloegr a Chymru. Cafodd trydaneiddio o Gaerdydd i Abertawe ei wrthod gan Lywodraeth y DU yn 2017. Er bod galwadau i ailddechrau'r cynllun, nid yw Llywodraeth y DU wedi rhoi unrhyw arwydd ei bod yn bwriadu gwneud hynny. Felly, Weinidog, pa drafodaethau mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi'u cael gyda Llywodraeth San Steffan a chyd-aelodau Llafur y DU ynghylch trydaneiddio o Gaerdydd i Abertawe?
Yn ystod cwestiynau'r Prif Weinidog yn ddiweddar, codais fater uwchraddio cyffordd Gorllewin Caerdydd yn Nhreganna er mwyn ei gwneud hi'n bosibl i bedwar trên yr awr redeg drwy orsafoedd ar reilffordd y Ddinas. Cyfrifoldeb Network Rail a Llywodraeth y DU yw hyn. Cafodd ei gynnwys yn wreiddiol ym mhrosiect adnewyddu signalau ardal Caerdydd 2012-15 yr Adran Drafnidiaeth a Network Rail. Ond am ba reswm bynnag, sy'n parhau'n ddirgelwch i mi, ni ddigwyddodd hynny. Dywedasant eu bod yn bwriadu ei wneud rhwng 2012 a 2015, ond rydym yn dal i aros yn 2023. A all y Gweinidog a'i swyddogion ymchwilio i'r oedi hwn gyda Network Rail a'r Adran Drafnidiaeth? Mae cost y buddsoddiad oddeutu £30 miliwn, felly swm bach o arian o'i gymharu â'r gwariant enfawr ar brosiect HS2. Ac os bydd Llywodraeth San Steffan yn talu am hyn, a wnaiff Llywodraeth Cymru ymrwymo £20 miliwn drwy Trafnidiaeth Cymru i wella rheilffordd Coryton yng ngogledd Caerdydd, fel bod pedwar trên yr awr yn gallu rhedeg ar y rheilffordd honno hefyd?
Fel y soniodd Siân Gwenllian tuag at ddiwedd ei haraith, y peth pwysig yma, y peth hollbwysig yma, yw, oni fyddai'n ffordd gymaint gwell o wneud pethau yn y dyfodol pe bai gan Gymru bwerau llawn dros reilffyrdd, gan gynnwys seilwaith? A wnaiff y Gweinidog drafod gyda'i gymheiriaid yn Llundain felly er mwyn sicrhau y byddai Llywodraeth San Steffan yn y dyfodol yn agored i'r ffordd hon ymlaen? Diolch yn fawr.
Y Dirprwy Weinidog Newid Hinsawdd nawr i gyfrannu at y ddadl. Lee Waters.
The Deputy Minister for Climate Change to contribute to the debate. Lee Waters.
Diolch, Llywydd. The Government will be supporting this motion this afternoon, and I’m grateful to Plaid Cymru for bringing it forward. The sadness I have listening to this debate is I listened very carefully and I don’t see anybody disagreeing with the motion, but it would be hard to get that conclusion from listening to the debate from the public gallery. We are focusing instead on those things that we disagree on, rather than the consensus we’ve finally reached—after the Conservatives eventually decided to support the call—that we now have cross-party support in this Parliament for this investment in Wales. You'll remember the last time we had cross-party support in this Senedd for a rail investment was for electrification of the Swansea and Cardiff main line, and to the credit of the Conservatives, they came together with other parties to lobby their own Government and succeeded in getting a decision that favoured Wales. So, it’s been done before and we can do it again. Sadly, in that case, the UK Government u-turned on its policy and we haven’t had electrification.
I was baffled, I must say, by Darren Millar’s opening, where he called for a good consensual debate and then lamented the fact there wasn’t one. He took his gloves off in what was clearly a preprepared speech, developing his usual wedge issue of trying to separate north and south, which is his usual clarion call, which is becoming rather tiresome. If he was sincere about advancing the interests of north Wales, rather than scoring points, he'd be making the case for the electrification of the north Wales railway line and doing that loudly and consistently. He doesn't do that—this is a non-devolved responsibility—and he'd rather play silly games. There is, in fact, £800 million of investment by this Government into new brand new trains, most of them made in Wales, currently being used and tested in north Wales.
Diolch, Lywydd. Bydd y Llywodraeth yn cefnogi'r cynnig hwn y prynhawn yma, ac rwy'n ddiolchgar i Blaid Cymru am ei gyflwyno. Roeddwn yn drist iawn wrth wrando ar y ddadl hon ac fe wrandewais yn ofalus iawn, ac nid wyf yn gweld unrhyw un yn anghytuno â'r cynnig, ond byddai'n anodd dod i'r casgliad hwnnw o wrando ar y ddadl o'r oriel gyhoeddus. Rydym yn canolbwyntio yn hytrach ar y pethau rydym yn anghytuno yn eu cylch, yn hytrach na'r consensws rydym wedi'i gyrraedd o'r diwedd—ar ôl i'r Ceidwadwyr benderfynu cefnogi'r alwad yn y pen draw—fod gennym gefnogaeth drawsbleidiol yn y Senedd hon bellach i'r buddsoddiad hwn yng Nghymru. Fe fyddwch yn cofio mai'r tro diwethaf inni gael cefnogaeth drawsbleidiol yn y Senedd hon i fuddsoddiad rheilffyrdd oedd dros drydaneiddio prif reilffordd Abertawe a Chaerdydd, ac er clod i'r Ceidwadwyr, fe ddaethant ynghyd â phleidiau eraill i lobïo eu Llywodraeth eu hunain a llwyddo i gael penderfyniad a oedd er budd i Gymru. Felly, mae wedi cael ei wneud o'r blaen a gallwn ei wneud eto. Yn anffodus, yn yr achos hwnnw, fe wnaeth Llywodraeth y DU dro pedol ar ei pholisi ac nid ydym wedi cael trydaneiddio.
Cefais fy synnu, rhaid i mi ddweud, gan agoriad Darren Millar, lle galwodd am ddadl gydsyniol dda a gresynu at y ffaith nad oedd yna un. Dadleuodd yn chwyrn yn yr hyn a oedd yn amlwg yn araith wedi'i pharatoi ymlaen llaw, gan ddatblygu ei destun cynnen arferol o geisio gwahanu'r gogledd a'r de, sef ei alwad groch arferol, sydd braidd yn ddiflas bellach. Pe bai'n ddiffuant ynglŷn â hyrwyddo buddiannau gogledd Cymru, yn hytrach na sgorio pwyntiau, fe fyddai'n dadlau dros drydaneiddio rheilffordd gogledd Cymru ac yn gwneud hynny'n uchel ac yn gyson. Nid yw'n gwneud hynny—cyfrifoldeb heb ei ddatganoli ydyw—a byddai'n well ganddo chwarae gemau gwirion. Mewn gwirionedd, mae'r Llywodraeth hon wedi buddsoddi £800 miliwn mewn trenau newydd sbon, y rhan fwyaf ohonynt wedi'u gwneud yng Nghymru, ac maent yn cael eu defnyddio a'u treialu ar hyn o bryd yng ngogledd Cymru.
Will you take an intervention?
A wnewch chi dderbyn ymyriad?
I won't take an intervention. [Interruption.] I won't take an intervention, no.
It is not true that we are not investing in north Wales. We have set up the North Wales Transport Commission, led, again, by Lord Burns, who is currently developing a pipeline of schemes for investment right across north Wales—urban and rural—and some of that will require UK Government investment because it will be in rail infrastructure. And I hope at that point, Darren Millar can put aside his love for wedge issues to focus on what we do agree on and argue for that investment to be made in Wales as it is non-devolved. We've seen the same in the south Wales Burns commission, where a series of recommendations have been put forward for a pipeline of schemes, and we are working constructively with the UK Government on finding funding for them—the electrification of the relief lines through Newport will be critical to realising the vision of the Burns commission. And I hope we can get cross-party support for that.
Natasha Asghar, I'm afraid, was completely wrong to say that HS2 will bring benefits to Wales. If she took the trouble to read the business case for the HS2 investment, she would find that, in the DfT's own business case, it shows that HS2 will take £200 million every single year out of the Welsh economy. There are no services coming into Wales, not a single mile of track will come into Wales. David T.C. Davies, and before him Robert Buckland, and before him whoever it was who was the Welsh Secretary—it's hard to remember—argued that HS2 would benefit north Wales because of trains coming to Crewe, but they can't even argue that now, because the DfT has postponed that development. And I think Siân Gwenllian is right to be sceptical that we will ever see this leg of HS2 developed. So, I'm afraid that Natasha Asghar, again, is putting siren calls ahead of national interest. They say they support the policy, they say they want a cross-party initiative, and then they have to trivialise it by a puerile call for giving the money not to the Welsh Government but giving it to Network Rail, a body that, as has been pointed out, is not accountable to this Parliament, it is not accountable to the people of Wales and is not devolved. And it'll achieve nothing. It's just, I'm afraid, a sign of the spite that, having taken so long to agree that this was a wrong that needing righting, they couldn't quite bring themselves to be grown up about it.
Just to add salt into this open wound, I'm sure Members will have read the announcement of Network Rail's most recent maintenance plans, with the so-called control period 7 settlement, which shows that Network Rail are planning, over the next five years, to cut spending on maintaining the railway in Wales. So, this body that the Tories want to give extra funding to is planning to underinvest in Wales, which will have the direct effect of worsening rail performance in Wales—a planned decline in the Welsh railways. Deteriorating assets, more service failures, performance predicted to worsen or barely improve—that's what the UK Government is delivering for Wales in a non-devolved area: worsening train performance. So, when they make accusations of a lack of investment, they need to turn their fire on where the blame lies. In fact, the only bright spot in the control period 7 settlement is that it will deliver a very marginal gain in Wales's on-time performance, which is good news. The reason why that's happening is because of the investment we've made in improved services: in new trains, in more and better-trained staff, and improvements to legacy fleet and performance. So, when Gareth Davies talks about the performance of rolling stock, he should remember that our investment is actually counteracting the conscious managed decline by the UK Government via Network Rail in services in Wales. They have an appalling record to defend and the barefaced cheek to criticise us.
Nid wyf am dderbyn ymyriad. [Torri ar draws.] Nid wyf am dderbyn ymyriad, na.
Nid yw'n wir nad ydym yn buddsoddi yng ngogledd Cymru. Rydym wedi sefydlu Comisiwn Trafnidiaeth Gogledd Cymru, sy'n cael ei arwain, unwaith eto, gan yr Arglwydd Burns, sydd wrthi'n datblygu llif o gynlluniau ar gyfer buddsoddi ledled gogledd Cymru—rhai trefol a gwledig—a bydd angen buddsoddiad Llywodraeth y DU ar beth o hynny oherwydd bydd yn fuddsoddiad mewn seilwaith rheilffyrdd. Ac rwy'n gobeithio, bryd hynny, y gall Darren Millar roi ei gariad at destunau cynnen i'r naill ochr er mwyn canolbwyntio ar yr hyn yr ydym yn cytuno arno, a dadlau dros wneud y buddsoddiad hwnnw yng Nghymru gan nad yw wedi'i ddatganoli. Rydym wedi gweld yr un peth yng nghomisiwn Burns de Cymru, lle cyflwynwyd cyfres o argymhellion ar gyfer llif o gynlluniau, ac rydym yn gweithio'n adeiladol gyda Llywodraeth y DU ar ddod o hyd i gyllid ar eu cyfer—bydd trydaneiddio'r rheilffyrdd lliniaru drwy Gasnewydd yn hanfodol er mwyn gwireddu gweledigaeth comisiwn Burns. Ac rwy'n gobeithio y gallwn gael cefnogaeth drawsbleidiol i hynny.
Mae arnaf ofn fod Natasha Asghar yn gwbl anghywir i ddweud y bydd HS2 yn dod â buddion i Gymru. Pe bai'n mynd i'r drafferth i ddarllen yr achos busnes dros fuddsoddiad HS2, byddai'n gweld, yn achos busnes yr Adran Drafnidiaeth ei hun, ei fod yn dangos y bydd HS2 yn cymryd £200 miliwn o economi Cymru bob blwyddyn. Nid oes unrhyw wasanaethau'n dod i Gymru, nid oes yr un filltir o drac yn dod i Gymru. Dadleuodd David T.C. Davies, a Robert Buckland o'i flaen, a phwy bynnag oedd yn Ysgrifennydd Cymru o'i flaen ef—mae'n anodd cofio—y byddai HS2 o fudd i ogledd Cymru am y byddai trenau'n dod i Crewe, ond ni allant ddadlau hynny nawr hyd yn oed, oherwydd mae'r Adran Drafnidiaeth wedi gohirio'r datblygiad hwnnw. Ac rwy'n credu bod Siân Gwenllian yn iawn i amau y gwelwn ni'r rhan hon o HS2 yn cael ei datblygu byth. Felly, mae arnaf ofn fod Natasha Asghar, unwaith eto, yn gosod galwadau seiren o flaen y budd cenedlaethol. Maent yn dweud eu bod yn cefnogi'r polisi, maent yn dweud eu bod eisiau menter drawsbleidiol, ac yna mae'n rhaid iddynt ei fychanu drwy wneud galwad blentynnaidd dros roi'r arian, nid i Lywodraeth Cymru, ond i Network Rail, corff nad yw'n atebol i'r Senedd hon, fel y nodwyd, corff nad yw'n atebol i bobl Cymru a chorff nad yw wedi'i ddatganoli. Ac ni fydd yn cyflawni unrhyw beth. Mae arnaf ofn nad yw'n ddim ond arwydd o falais, ar ôl cymryd cyhyd i gytuno bod hyn yn gamwedd yr oedd angen ei unioni, roedd hi'n ormod iddynt ymddwyn fel oedolion ynglŷn â'r peth.
I ychwanegu halen at y briw agored hwn, rwy'n siŵr y bydd yr Aelodau wedi darllen y cyhoeddiad am gynlluniau cynnal a chadw diweddaraf Network Rail, gyda'r setliad cyfnod rheoli 7 fel y'i gelwir, sy'n dangos bod Network Rail, dros y pum mlynedd nesaf, yn cynllunio i dorri gwariant ar gynnal a chadw'r rheilffyrdd yng Nghymru. Felly, mae'r corff hwn y mae'r Torïaid eisiau rhoi arian ychwanegol iddo yn cynllunio i danfuddsoddi yng Nghymru, a fydd yn cael yr effaith uniongyrchol o waethygu perfformiad y rheilffyrdd yng Nghymru—dirywiad wedi'i gynllunio yn rheilffyrdd Cymru. Asedau sy'n dirywio, mwy o wasanaethau'n methu, perfformiad y rhagwelir y bydd yn gwaethygu neu a fydd prin yn gwella—dyna mae Llywodraeth y DU yn ei gyflawni i Gymru mewn maes heb ei ddatganoli: perfformiad trenau sy'n gwaethygu. Felly, pan fyddant yn gwneud cyhuddiadau ynglŷn â diffyg buddsoddiad, mae angen iddynt fwrw'r bai lle mae'r bai yn gorwedd. Mewn gwirionedd, yr unig beth da am setliad cyfnod rheoli 7 yw y bydd yn sicrhau budd ymylol iawn i berfformiad ar-amser Cymru, sy'n newyddion da. Y rheswm pam mae hynny'n digwydd yw oherwydd y buddsoddiad rydym ni wedi'i wneud mewn gwasanaethau gwell: mewn trenau newydd, mewn mwy o staff sydd wedi'u hyfforddi'n well, a gwelliannau i'r fflyd etifeddol a pherfformiad. Felly, pan fo Gareth Davies yn sôn am berfformiad trenau, dylai gofio bod ein buddsoddiad ni mewn gwirionedd yn gwrthbwyso'r dirywiad bwriadol yn y gwasanaethau yng Nghymru dan reolaeth Llywodraeth y DU drwy Network Rail. Mae ganddynt hanes gwarthus i'w amddiffyn a'r hyfdra pur i'n beirniadu ni.
Will the Minister take an intervention?
A wnaiff y Gweinidog dderbyn ymyriad?
I won't, no.
Luke Fletcher rightly said at the beginning that this is daylight robbery, we are being deprived of investment. This is a very simple thing, really. This is an England-only project, and we should be getting a devolved consequential from that. It's a scandal that we are not. Interestingly, this is not just a party point. Lord Peter Hendy, the chair of Network Rail, Boris Johnson's former head of Transport for London and a cross-party figure sitting now as a cross-bencher in the House of Lords, widely respected right across the political spectrum, said in his maiden speech—. It's worth reading, it's a short speech, and significantly, of all the subjects he could have picked on in that opening speech to greet him into the House of Lords, he picked on the very curious decision not to give a Barnett consequential to Wales. I think that is significant. He used very guarded, measured language. He said it was 'strange', the way that the HS2 consequential for Wales was working, and that 'something is amiss' in the way the Barnett formula was applied. So, if the UK Government won't listen to the Welsh Conservatives, won't listen to this Parliament, they should at least listen to the chair of Network Rail, Lord Hendy, who is rightly pointing out a very strange shortcoming in the way that this key formula is applied.
We are doing what we can with the resources that we have to invest in rail right across Wales. It's a key part of our climate change targets and our vision for the Wales transport strategy. Having additional resources to spend on rail and bus, to have a truly integrated transport system, is something we desperately need. We're not short of ambition. We're not short of plans. But we are short of money, and putting this wrong right would help. Diolch.
Na wnaf.
Dywedodd Luke Fletcher yn gywir ar y dechrau mai lladrad noeth yw hwn, rydym yn cael ein hamddifadu o fuddsoddiad. Mae hon yn sefyllfa syml iawn, mewn gwirionedd. Prosiect i Loegr yn unig yw hwn, a dylem fod yn cael swm canlyniadol datganoledig o hynny. Mae'n sgandal nad ydym yn ei gael. Yn ddiddorol, nid pwynt pleidiol yn unig yw hwn. Dywedodd yr Arglwydd Peter Hendy, cadeirydd Network Rail, cyn bennaeth Transport for London Boris Johnson a ffigur trawsbleidiol sydd bellach yn aelod trawsfeinciol yn Nhŷ'r Arglwyddi, gŵr uchel ei barch ar draws y sbectrwm gwleidyddol, yn ei araith gyntaf—. Mae'n werth ei darllen, mae'n araith fer, ac yn arwyddocaol, o'r holl bynciau y gallai fod wedi'u dewis yn yr araith agoriadol honno i'w gyfarch i Dŷ'r Arglwyddi, dewisodd y penderfyniad rhyfedd iawn i beidio â rhoi swm canlyniadol Barnett i Gymru. Rwy'n credu bod hynny'n arwyddocaol. Defnyddiodd iaith ofalus a phwyllog iawn. Dywedodd fod y ffordd roedd swm canlyniadol HS2 i Gymru yn gweithio yn 'rhyfedd', a bod 'rhywbeth o'i le' yn y ffordd y caiff fformiwla Barnett ei chymhwyso. Felly, os na fydd Llywodraeth y DU yn gwrando ar y Ceidwadwyr Cymreig, yn gwrando ar y Senedd hon, dylent o leiaf wrando ar gadeirydd Network Rail, yr Arglwydd Hendy, sy'n tynnu sylw'n briodol at y diffyg rhyfedd iawn yn y ffordd y caiff y fformiwla allweddol hon ei chymhwyso.
Rydym yn gwneud yr hyn a allwn gyda'r adnoddau sydd gennym i fuddsoddi mewn rheilffyrdd ledled Cymru. Mae'n rhan allweddol o'n targedau newid hinsawdd a'n gweledigaeth ar gyfer strategaeth drafnidiaeth Cymru. Mae cael adnoddau ychwanegol i'w gwario ar reilffyrdd a bysiau, i sicrhau system drafnidiaeth wirioneddol integredig, yn rhywbeth rydym ei angen yn daer. Nid ydym yn brin o uchelgais. Nid ydym yn brin o gynlluniau. Ond rydym yn brin o arian, a byddai unioni'r cam hwn yn helpu. Diolch.
Fe wnaf i gychwyn drwy ddiolch i bawb am eu cyfraniadau. Dwi ddim yn mynd i redeg drwy bob un cyfraniad, fyddwch chi'n falch o glywed, ond dwi jest eisiau tynnu sylw at un neu ddau o bethau. Roedd Luke, wrth agor y ddadl, yn berffaith iawn i amlygu sut mae blaenoriaethu Lloegr dros Gymru wedi digwydd yn fan hyn, ond fyddwn i'n dweud, wrth gwrs, un o'r problemau yw bod blaenoriaethu Llundain wedi digwydd dros bob man arall dros y blynyddoedd. Efallai, yn ei hanfod, mai dyna yw un o'r problemau sylfaenol yn fan hyn. Mae'r ratio gwariant yma o 200:1 pan fo'n dod i wariant yn Lloegr o'i gymharu â Chymru—ac roedd Luke a Huw Irranca-Davies ac eraill yn cyfeirio at hynny—mae hynny jest yn amhosib i'w gyfiawnhau. Mae'n amhosib credu bod unrhyw un yn meddwl ei bod hi'n iawn i drio cyfiawnhau hynny hefyd, yn fy marn i.
I'll start by thanking everyone for their contributions. I'm not going to go through every contribution, you'll be pleased to hear, but I do want to highlight a few issues. Luke, in opening the debate, was quite right in highlighting how prioritising England over Wales has happened here, and I would say that one of the problems is that London has been prioritised over everywhere else over recent years. Essentially, perhaps that is one of the fundamental problems here. And the 200:1 ratio when it comes to expenditure in England as compared to Wales—and Luke and Huw Irranca-Davies and others referred to that—that is just indefensible. It's impossible to believe that anyone could believe that that could be justified, in my view.
Darren said that he was disappointed with the tone of the debate. I agree. Maybe not even Members of his own benches got the memo, but there we are, and I agree that we do need to see a more equitable spread of investment across Wales. I and others have been banging on about that for many, many years. But, of course, the focus of the motion here—maybe not the debate, but the motion—is about the quantum of that funding that you have to spread across Wales, and that is a different issue. As I say, that's what the motion calls for, not necessarily, maybe, what's been debated on occasion.
Dywedodd Darren ei fod yn siomedig ynghylch naws y ddadl. Rwy'n cytuno. Efallai na chafodd hyd yn oed Aelodau ei feinciau ei hun y memo, ond dyna ni, ac rwy'n cytuno bod angen inni weld buddsoddiad tecach yn cael ei wasgaru ledled Cymru. Rwyf fi ac eraill wedi bod yn rhygnu ymlaen am hynny ers blynyddoedd lawer. Ond wrth gwrs, mae ffocws y cynnig yma—nid y ddadl, efallai, ond y cynnig—yn ymwneud â faint o'r cyllid hwnnw sydd gennych i'w wasgaru ledled Cymru, sy'n fater gwahanol. Fel y dywedaf, dyna mae'r cynnig yn galw amdano, nid o reidrwydd, efallai, yr hyn a drafodwyd ar adegau.
Mi wnaeth y Dirprwy Weinidog, wrth gwrs, efelychu Darren ychydig bach, os caf i ddweud. Hynny yw, yn dechrau bant yn dweud bod eisiau consensws, wedyn fe wnaeth Darren dynnu ei fenig bant. Wel, rwy'n credu efallai fod y Dirprwy Weinidog wedi slipio cwpwl o bwniadau i mewn o dan y belt hefyd, ond dyna ni. Dyna pam maen nhw'n ei galw'n ddadl, onid yw e, ac yn enwedig os yw gwleidyddion yn involved, dwi ddim yn meddwl ein bod ni wastad yn mynd i gael pawb yn cytuno ar bopeth.
The Deputy Minister, of course, emulated Darren, ever so slightly, if I may say so. He started off by saying that we needed consensus, then Darren took his gloves off. Well, I think the Deputy Minister might have slipped in a few punches that were below the belt too, but there we are. That's why it's called a debate, isn't it, and particularly when you have politicians involved, we're not always going to get consensus on everything.
But I do have to come back to some of the comments that Natasha Asghar made in her contribution. I mean, you're effectively rewriting the devolution settlement in your five-minute contribution, and it does lift the veil, I think, on what the whole HS2 debacle is about. It's about the UK Government intentionally subverting the Barnett formula. That's what's playing out here. Now, I appreciate that the Welsh Conservatives' standpoint is different, although not as different as I thought it was before this debate, because what you're saying is that Wales can have the money as long as the UK Government decides how it's spent. That's a huge statement there in your lack of influence in this place, for one thing, and it's a bit like a grocer saying, 'I'll sell you the potatoes as long as I can tell you what you use those potatoes for.'
Ond mae'n rhaid imi ddychwelyd at rai o'r sylwadau a wnaeth Natasha Asghar yn ei chyfraniad. Hynny yw, i bob pwrpas, rydych yn ailysgrifennu'r setliad datganoli yn eich cyfraniad pum munud, ac mae'n codi'r llen, rwy'n credu, ar holl hanfod llanast HS2. Mae’n ymwneud â Llywodraeth y DU yn tanseilio fformiwla Barnett yn fwriadol. Dyna sy'n digwydd yma. Nawr, rwy’n sylweddoli bod safbwynt y Ceidwadwyr Cymreig yn wahanol, er nad yw mor wahanol ag y credwn ei fod cyn y ddadl hon, oherwydd yr hyn rydych chi'n ei ddweud yw y gall Cymru gael yr arian cyhyd â bod Llywodraeth y DU yn penderfynu sut y caiff ei wario. Dyna ddatganiad enfawr yno am eich diffyg dylanwad yn y lle hwn, yn un peth, ac mae braidd fel groser yn dweud, 'Fe werthaf y tatws i chi ar yr amod fy mod yn cael dweud wrthych sut i ddefnyddio'r tatws hynny.'
Will you take an intervention?
A wnewch chi dderbyn ymyriad?
Yes, I will.
Gwnaf.
With all due respect, did you listen to what I was saying? I was stating that we are more than happy for the money to come, but it mustn't go into this Government's hands; it must go into rail, which is what everyone wants here. We all want to see the rail services improve—north, south, east, west—but we don't have that trust in this Government. Let it go directly to the rail services so that people get the service that they need and deserve.
Gyda phob parch, a wnaethoch chi wrando ar yr hyn roeddwn yn ei ddweud? Roeddwn yn datgan ein bod yn fwy na bodlon i’r arian ddod yma, ond mae'n rhaid iddo beidio â mynd i ddwylo’r Llywodraeth hon; mae'n rhaid iddo fynd tuag at y rheilffyrdd, sef yr hyn y mae pawb yma'n ei ddymuno. Mae pob un ohonom am weld y gwasanaethau rheilffyrdd yn gwella—gogledd, de, dwyrain, gorllewin—ond nid oes gennym ffydd yn y Llywodraeth hon. Gadewch iddo fynd yn uniongyrchol i'r gwasanaethau rheilffyrdd fel bod pobl yn cael y gwasanaeth y maent ei angen ac yn ei haeddu.
And that says a lot about your lack of influence in this place—that you would wish others to make the decisions. It's exactly the point I was making, Natasha, so I don't quite get what you're getting at there.
There is consensus, no matter what anybody says—I insist there is. [Laughter.]
Ac mae hynny'n dweud llawer am eich diffyg dylanwad yn y lle hwn—y byddech yn dymuno i eraill wneud y penderfyniadau. Dyna'r union bwynt roeddwn yn ei wneud, Natasha, felly nid wyf yn deall beth rydych yn ceisio'i ddweud yno.
Mae yna gonsensws, ni waeth beth mae unrhyw un yn ei ddweud—rwy'n mynnu bod yna gonsensws. [Chwerthin.]
Na. Edrychwch, mae e'n arwyddocaol—peidiwch â gadael i ni anghofio hyn—mae e yn arwyddocaol, dwi'n meddwl, bod y Ceidwadwyr ar lefel y Deyrnas Unedig, drwy Lywodraeth y Deyrnas Unedig, yn dweud un peth, ond bod y Ceidwadwyr Cymreig â barn gwahanol, er efallai ddim y farn y byddwn i eisiau, ond dwi'n parchu ac yn cydnabod hynny. Ond, dwi hefyd yn cydnabod bod y Llywodraeth neu'r blaid Lafur ar lefel y Deyrnas Unedig ddim wedi rhoi unrhyw sicrwydd i ni y byddan nhw'n gwneud unrhyw beth yn wahanol i'r Ceidwadwyr ar lefel y Deyrnas Unedig petaen nhw mewn Llywodraeth. Ond eto, dwi'n cydnabod bod yna farn wahanol ar y meinciau yma.
Felly, mae yna dir cyffredin, a dwi'n falch, gobeithio, y byddwn ni'n symud tuag at gefnogaeth gan yr Aelodau yn gyfan yn fan hyn. Dwi yn eich annog chi, felly, ar draws y ffiniau pleidiol, i gefnogi cynnig Plaid Cymru'r prynhawn yma. Gadewch i ni anfon neges unfrydol i Lywodraeth San Steffan o ba bynnag liw, nawr ac yn y dyfodol, nad ŷn ni fel Senedd ac nad ŷn ni fel Cymry yn fodlon ar gael ein hesgeuluso yn hyn o beth, yn fodlon ar gael ein hanwybyddu, nac yn fodlon gyda'r anghyfiawnder yma o ddiffyg cyllido canlyniadol i Gymru. A gadewch i ni ddangos ein bod ni'n barod i godi'n llais ac ymladd am ein cyfran deg ni o'r hyn sy'n ddyledus i ni. Does bosib y gallwn ni gyd gytuno'n unfrydol bod Cymru, yn y cyd-destun hyn, yn haeddu gwell.
But, look, it is significant—and don't let us forget this—it is significant, I think, that the Conservatives at a UK level, through the UK Government, say one thing, but that the Welsh Conservatives have a differing view, although not the view that we would want to see, but I do acknowledge and respect that. But I also acknowledge that the Government, or rather the Labour Party at a UK level, haven't given us any assurance that they would do anything different to the Conservatives at a UK level if they were in Government. But, again, I recognise that there is a different view on the benches in this place.
So, there is common ground, and I am pleased that, hopefully, we will move towards support from all Members for this motion. I do encourage you, therefore, across party boundaries, to support the Plaid Cymru motion this afternoon. Let us send a united message to the Westminster Government, whatever its political hue now and in the future, that we as a Senedd and we as the people of Wales aren't willing to be neglected in this regard. We're not willing to be ignored, and we're not willing to accept this injustice of the lack of consequential funding for Wales. Let us show that we are willing to raise our voices and to fight for our fair share of what is owed to us. Surely, we can all agree unanimously that Wales, in this context, deserves better.
Y cwestiwn yw: a ddylid derbyn y cynnig? A oes unrhyw Aelod yn gwrthwynebu? Nac oes. Felly, mae'r cynnig yna wedi'i dderbyn.
The proposal is to agree the motion. Does any Member object? No. The motion is therefore agreed.
Derbyniwyd y cynnig yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 12.36.
Motion agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.
Sy'n golygu nad oes angen cyfnod pleidleisio y prynhawn yma.
Which means that we don't need to have voting time this afternoon.
Felly, byddwn ni'n symud ymlaen i eitem 9, sef y ddadl fer. Mae'r ddadl fer y prynhawn yma gan James Evans.
We'll move directly on to item 9, which is the short debate. The short debate this afternoon is from James Evans.
Thank you, Sam Rowlands, for your good assistance there. Diolch, Llywydd. I would like to give a minute of my time to Laura Anne Jones, Sam Kurtz, and Mabon ap Gwynfor. I'd like to thank you for the opportunity to do this debate today on the aspects of rural Welsh life, shooting and its benefits to the economy and conservation. I look forward to hearing the views of the Minister and Members throughout the Senedd and colleagues on this very important topic. As someone who took up shooting recently, and as a member of the cross-party group on shooting and conservation, it's a very important issue to me and many people right across Wales.
Shooting is fundamental to rural communities in Wales. It provides opportunities for people from all walks of life to come together in the great outdoors and enjoy each other's company. I agree with Sir Gareth Edwards CBE who has publicly stated that he truly believes that shooting in rural Wales is bound up with our nation's culture and traditions.
It is clear that sustainable shooting and the associated conservation activities provide a wide range of environmental and economic benefits, achieving each of the seven well-being goals set out in the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015. Almost a quarter of people in the most rural parts of Wales feel isolated, and shooting can be very beneficial in addressing this, and bring physical and mental health benefits. Shooting is a crucial part of bringing people together, and people make on average 20 friends when they get involved in their local shoots.
Shooting also has conservation benefits, such as the management of 380,000 hectares in Wales, which is 90 per cent of Wales's land mass. Associated management practices play a pivotal role in protecting ecosystems and helping wildlife to thrive. Shooting contributes an annual spend of £7.4 million on conservation across Wales—the equivalent of 490 full-time jobs, or 120,000 hours of conservation working days. Research has shown that good game management can lead to significant benefits for wildlife and biodiversity. For example, woodland managed for game shooting tends to support more songbirds and butterflies and bees in woodland edges.
Shooting practitioners and communities across my patch in Brecon and Radnorshire and beyond are well equipped with the unique skills to help tackle the challenges associated with the climate and nature emergencies head on. Those involved in shooting are passionate about the land and its wildlife. They also do a fantastic job in predator control to help restore ground-nesting bird populations from predators, such as the curlew, and I know that my colleague Mark Isherwood, who is the curlew champion in this Senedd, would agree with that.
Indeed, it is shooting that has ensured that farms across the land continue to thrive, with hedgerows, small woodlands, lakes and ponds and even stunning swathes of heather and moorland. The desire of farmers to enhance and improve the Welsh countryside gives them a motivation and often the finances needed to maintain habitats that might've otherwise been grazed or have fallen under the plough. Our farmers do a great job of protecting and maintaining the environment, and shooting helps do just that. It is the diversity of habitats found on shooting estates and the passion for wildlife found amongst the people who shoot that makes shooting so valuable in the fight to conserve declining bird species.
Diolch am eich cymorth, Sam Rowlands. Diolch, Lywydd. Hoffwn roi munud o fy amser i Laura Anne Jones, Sam Kurtz a Mabon ap Gwynfor. Hoffwn ddiolch i chi am y cyfle i gael y ddadl hon heddiw ar yr agweddau ar y ffordd wledig Gymreig o fyw, saethu a’i fanteision i’r economi a chadwraeth. Edrychaf ymlaen at glywed barn y Gweinidog ac Aelodau ar draws y Senedd a chyd-Aelodau ar y pwnc pwysig hwn. Fel rhywun a ddechreuodd saethu yn ddiweddar, ac fel aelod o'r grŵp trawsbleidiol ar saethu a chadwraeth, mae'n fater pwysig iawn i mi ac i lawer o bobl ledled Cymru.
Mae saethu'n hollbwysig i gymunedau gwledig Cymru. Mae'n darparu cyfleoedd i bobl o bob math o gefndir ddod at ei gilydd yn yr awyr agored a mwynhau cwmni ei gilydd. Rwy'n cytuno â Syr Gareth Edwards CBE sydd wedi datgan yn gyhoeddus ei fod yn credu o ddifrif fod saethu yng nghefn gwlad Cymru yn rhan annatod o ddiwylliant a thraddodiadau ein gwlad.
Mae’n amlwg fod saethu cynaliadwy a’r gweithgareddau cadwraeth cysylltiedig yn darparu ystod eang o fanteision amgylcheddol ac economaidd, ac yn cyflawni pob un o’r saith nod llesiant a nodir yn Neddf Llesiant Cenedlaethau’r Dyfodol (Cymru) 2015. Mae bron i chwarter y bobl yn rhannau mwyaf gwledig Cymru yn teimlo’n ynysig, a gall saethu fod yn fuddiol iawn i fynd i’r afael â hyn, a darparu manteision iechyd corfforol a meddyliol. Mae saethu'n rhan hanfodol o ddod â phobl at ei gilydd, ac ar gyfartaledd, mae pobl yn gwneud 20 o ffrindiau pan fyddant yn cymryd rhan yn eu digwyddiadau saethu lleol.
Mae gan saethu fanteision cadwraeth hefyd, megis rheoli 380,000 o hectarau yng Nghymru, sef 90 y cant o dir Cymru. Mae arferion rheoli cysylltiedig yn chwarae rhan ganolog yn y gwaith o ddiogelu ecosystemau a helpu bywyd gwyllt i ffynnu. Mae saethu’n cyfrannu £7.4 miliwn o wariant blynyddol ar gadwraeth ledled Cymru—sy’n cyfateb i 490 o swyddi amser llawn, neu 120,000 o oriau o ddiwrnodau gwaith cadwraeth. Mae ymchwil wedi dangos y gall rheolaeth dda ar anifeiliaid hela arwain at fanteision sylweddol i fywyd gwyllt a bioamrywiaeth. Er enghraifft, mae coetir a reolir ar gyfer saethu anifeiliaid hela yn tueddu i gynnal mwy o adar cân a gloÿnnod byw a gwenyn ar ymylon coetiroedd.
Mae ymarferwyr a chymunedau saethu ar draws fy ardal i ym Mrycheiniog a Sir Faesyfed a thu hwnt yn meddu ar y sgiliau unigryw i helpu i fynd i’r afael â’r heriau sy’n gysylltiedig â’r argyfyngau hinsawdd a natur yn uniongyrchol. Mae'r rheini sy'n ymwneud â saethu yn angerddol am y tir a'i fywyd gwyllt. Maent hefyd yn gwneud gwaith gwych yn rheoli ysglyfaethwyr i helpu i adfer poblogaethau adar sy’n nythu ar y ddaear rhag ysglyfaethwyr, megis y gylfinir, a gwn y byddai fy nghyd-Aelod, Mark Isherwood, sef hyrwyddwr y gylfinir yn y Senedd hon, yn cytuno â hynny.
Yn wir, saethu sydd wedi sicrhau bod ffermydd ledled y wlad yn parhau i ffynnu, gyda gwrychoedd, coetiroedd bychain, llynnoedd a phyllau a hyd yn oed ardaloedd syfrdanol o rug a rhostiroedd. Mae dyhead ffermwyr i gyfoethogi a gwella cefn gwlad Cymru yn rhoi cymhelliad iddynt, ac yn aml, y cyllid sydd ei angen i gynnal cynefinoedd a fyddai fel arall wedi cael eu pori neu eu haredig o bosibl. Mae ein ffermwyr yn gwneud gwaith gwych yn gwarchod a chynnal yr amgylchedd, ac mae saethu'n helpu i wneud hynny. Yr amrywiaeth o gynefinoedd a geir ar ystadau saethu a’r angerdd am fywyd gwyllt ymhlith pobl sy’n saethu sy’n gwneud saethu mor werthfawr yn y frwydr i warchod rhywogaethau adar sy’n dirywio.
But not only this, shooting contributes to the rural way of life and goes even further into the economic sphere. Let's have a look at the figures: shooting activities in Wales contribute £75 million to the economy, and research shows that there are 2,900 shooting-related businesses across the country, and they directly employ 2,400 full-time people supporting the rural economies and rural communities right across Wales.
The range of shooting activities in Wales has to offer sports tourism and are hospitality businesses throughout the year, which attracts visitors from across the UK and, more importantly, from around the world, and I'm sure Members in this Chamber can agree that some hospitality venues in the winter would have to close if it weren't for groups of people coming to that area to enjoy the countryside and go shooting. This provides our rural communities with that real economic lifeline by extending the tourism season into the winter months, when it's harder for those businesses to keep going. Tourism is the heartbeat of many communities and shooting provides young people in the hospitality and tourism sector with jobs and opportunities to keep our young people in rural Wales.
Shooting is an area of life that is open to all, and it's open to people from all walks of life; shooting is not elitist. There are people, from the estate managers, the farmers, the helpers, the conservationists, the breeders, the dog handlers, the dustbin men, even politicians like myself who didn't even go to university, who enjoy shooting, because we're all part of a wider team. And I would like to say about clay pigeon shooting, because shooting isn't just about game; clay pigeon shooting is a fantastic opportunity to get into the sport. It's increasing in popularity as well. It gives novice shooters—I know there are some in this Chamber, who have done some clay pigeon shooting—the opportunity to learn the ropes, and I can attest that it is a very, very good day out, and if anybody wants to go on a stag do or a hen do, it's also another fantastic opportunity to get out and enjoy shooting and the great outdoors.
Shooting and the associated conservation activities do bring communities together, and they encourage people of all ages and backgrounds to get involved with outdoor activities. Indeed, many of those activities, as I said before, take place in the winter months. This can be an isolating time for many people, and shooting provides the opportunity for those people to go out, and to regularly socialise and enjoy nature. It also provides regular exercise for participants by offering the chance to walk in the countryside, to walk their dogs and reconnect with nature, both having physical and mental health benefits, which, yet again, fits in to this Welsh Government's agenda. These are all things that we should wish to encourage in the population, so shooting really does work to everything that the Welsh Government is trying to do.
And perhaps my most favourite benefit of the sustainable Welsh shooting industry is the fantastic game meat that it provides. It's considered a core element of sustainable shooting: you eat what you shoot; nothing stays on the ground. Wild game has a lower carbon footprint than most widely produced meats, and the game shooting industry is essential to the management and maintenance of countryside environments. The majority of game meat is sold locally in the area in which it's produced to local shops, butchers, hotels and restaurants. And, of course, I'm sure that a lot of people—and my colleague Sam Kurtz sponsored an event here on game meat—. Welsh game meat really is the best and most tastiest in the whole world.
So, in concluding, I would like to ask that my colleagues agree with me in this Chamber that shooting sustainably and the associated conservation activities that it provides is brilliant for Wales—the economic benefit it provides and the opportunities for jobs and health-associated activities. And just finally in closing, I would like to thank the British Association of Shooting and Conservation, the Countryside Alliance and all their fantastic members who do an absolutely fantastic job of representing shooting right across Wales, and they will keep fighting for this very important industry, even when sometimes it doesn’t look like the Government is on their side. Six thousand people rely on shooting for jobs, and I would like to say to the Minister that those people have mortgages, those people have livelihoods, and it’s about time this Welsh Government supported our rural communities. Diolch yn fawr iawn.
Nid yn unig hyn, ond mae saethu'n cyfrannu at y ffordd wledig o fyw ac yn mynd ymhellach fyth i mewn i'r byd economaidd. Gadewch inni gael golwg ar y ffigurau: mae gweithgareddau saethu yng Nghymru yn cyfrannu £75 miliwn i’r economi, ac mae ymchwil yn dangos bod yna 2,900 o fusnesau’n gysylltiedig â saethu ledled y wlad, ac maent yn cyflogi 2,400 o bobl llawn amser i gefnogi’r economïau gwledig a chymunedau gwledig ledled Cymru.
Yr ystod o weithgareddau saethu sydd gan Gymru i’w chynnig i dwristiaeth chwaraeon ac maent yn fusnesau lletygarwch drwy gydol y flwyddyn, sy’n denu ymwelwyr o bob rhan o’r DU, ac yn bwysicach, o bob rhan o’r byd, ac rwy’n siŵr y gall Aelodau yn y Siambr hon gytuno y byddai'n rhaid i rai lleoliadau lletygarwch gau dros y gaeaf oni bai am grwpiau o bobl a ddaw i'r ardal honno i fwynhau cefn gwlad a mynd i saethu. Mae hyn yn rhoi’r rhaff achub economaidd honno i’n cymunedau gwledig drwy ymestyn y tymor twristiaeth i mewn i fisoedd y gaeaf, pan fydd yn anoddach i’r busnesau hynny oroesi. Twristiaeth yw calon llawer o gymunedau, ac mae saethu'n rhoi swyddi a chyfleoedd i bobl ifanc yn y sector lletygarwch a thwristiaeth er mwyn cadw ein pobl ifanc yng nghefn gwlad Cymru.
Mae saethu'n faes sy'n agored i bawb, ac mae'n agored i bobl o bob cefndir; nid yw saethu'n elitaidd. Mae yna bobl, o reolwyr ystadau, ffermwyr, cynorthwywyr, cadwraethwyr, bridwyr, trinwyr cŵn, dynion sbwriel, hyd yn oed gwleidyddion fel fi nad aeth i'r brifysgol hyd yn oed, sy'n mwynhau saethu, gan fod pob un ohonom yn rhan o dîm ehangach. A hoffwn sôn am saethu colomennod clai, gan fod saethu'n ymwneud â mwy na hela'n unig; mae saethu colomennod clai yn gyfle gwych i ymgymryd â'r gamp. Mae'n cynyddu mewn poblogrwydd hefyd. Mae'n rhoi cyfle i saethwyr newydd—gwn fod rhai yn y Siambr hon sydd wedi gwneud rhywfaint o saethu colomennod clai—i ddysgu saethu, a gallaf gadarnhau ei fod yn ddiwrnod allan da iawn, iawn, ac os oes unrhyw un yn dymuno mynd i barti 'stag' neu 'hen', mae hefyd yn gyfle gwych arall i fynd allan a mwynhau saethu a'r awyr agored.
Mae saethu a’r gweithgareddau cadwraeth cysylltiedig yn dod â chymunedau ynghyd, ac maent yn annog pobl o bob oed a chefndir i gymryd rhan mewn gweithgareddau awyr agored. Yn wir, mae llawer o’r gweithgareddau hynny, fel y dywedais, yn digwydd yn ystod misoedd y gaeaf. Gall hwn fod yn gyfnod pan fydd llawer o bobl yn teimlo'n ynysig, ac mae saethu'n rhoi cyfle i’r bobl hynny fynd allan, a chymdeithasu'n rheolaidd a mwynhau natur. Mae hefyd yn rhoi cyfle i'r rhai sy'n cymryd rhan wneud ymarfer corff yn rheolaidd drwy gynnig cyfle i gerdded yng nghefn gwlad, i fynd â’u cŵn am dro ac i ailgysylltu â byd natur, gyda manteision iechyd corfforol a meddyliol, sydd, unwaith eto, yn cyd-fynd ag agenda Llywodraeth Cymru. Mae’r rhain oll yn bethau y dylem fod yn awyddus i'w hannog yn y boblogaeth, felly mae saethu o ddifrif yn cyd-fynd â phopeth y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ceisio ei wneud.
Ac efallai mai fy hoff fantais o ddiwydiant saethu cynaliadwy Cymru yw’r helgig gwych y mae’n ei ddarparu. Caiff ei ystyried yn elfen graidd o saethu cynaliadwy: rydych yn bwyta'r hyn rydych yn ei saethu; nid oes unrhyw beth yn aros ar lawr. Mae gan helgig gwyllt ôl troed carbon is na'r rhan fwyaf o gigoedd a gynhyrchir ar raddfa eang, ac mae'r diwydiant saethu anifeiliaid hela'n hanfodol i reoli a chynnal a chadw amgylcheddau cefn gwlad. Mae'r rhan fwyaf o helgig yn cael ei werthu'n lleol yn yr ardal lle caiff ei gynhyrchu i siopau, cigyddion, gwestai a bwytai lleol. Ac wrth gwrs, rwy'n siŵr fod llawer o bobl—ac mae fy nghyd-Aelod, Sam Kurtz, wedi noddi digwyddiad yma ar helgig—. Helgig Cymreig yw'r gorau a'r mwyaf blasus yn y byd i gyd.
Felly, i gloi, hoffwn ofyn i fy nghyd-Aelodau gytuno â mi yn y Siambr hon fod saethu cynaliadwy a’r gweithgareddau cadwraeth cysylltiedig y mae’n eu darparu yn wych i Gymru—y budd economaidd y mae’n ei ddarparu a’r cyfleoedd ar gyfer swyddi a gweithgareddau sy’n gysylltiedig ag iechyd. Ac yn olaf, i gloi, hoffwn ddiolch i Gymdeithas Saethu a Chadwraeth Prydain, y Gynghrair Cefn Gwlad a'u holl aelodau gwych sy'n gwneud gwaith hollol ardderchog yn cynrychioli saethu ledled Cymru, a byddant yn parhau i ymladd dros y diwydiant hynod bwysig hwn, hyd yn oed pan nad yw’n edrych fel pe bai'r Llywodraeth ar eu hochr weithiau. Mae 6,000 o bobl yn dibynnu ar saethu am eu swyddi, a hoffwn ddweud wrth y Gweinidog fod gan y bobl hynny forgeisi, fod gan y bobl hynny fywoliaeth, a'i bod yn hen bryd i Lywodraeth Cymru gefnogi ein cymunedau gwledig. Diolch yn fawr iawn.
I’d like to thank James, firstly, for giving me a minute in this important debate today, but also thank him for his contribution—I thought that was absolutely fantastic. You were bang on, and I completely concur with you on the multitude of benefits that shooting brings to our rural areas, and the necessity of shooting in our rural areas as well. What we are currently seeing is this Welsh Government putting forth the beginning of an anti-shooting agenda by wanting to change the regulation of this release of game birds. The divisive agenda is another example of large-scale state intervention, with increasing red tape around licensing. This Government is intent on using taxpayers’ money to restrict freedoms instead of using the legal framework that is already being used successfully across the UK. Why do we need to be different? It’s yet another example of the Welsh Government trying to make changes for the sake of it than taking a more cautious, pragmatic approach. The proposal would see additional and undisclosed conditions, including on licences. Because of this, licences run the risk of being open to challenge by those who oppose shooting. I know from my patch that many constituents across south-east Wales are opposed to this ludicrous idea. It’s high time the Welsh Government got on with their day job in trying to fix the record of the NHS waiting times and failing education system instead of meddling in our rural way of life.
Hoffwn ddiolch i James, yn gyntaf, am roi munud i mi yn y ddadl bwysig hon heddiw, ond diolch iddo hefyd am ei gyfraniad—roedd yn gyfraniad gwych, yn fy marn i. Roeddech yn llygad eich lle, ac rwy'n cytuno’n llwyr â chi ar y llu o fanteision y mae saethu'n eu darparu i’n hardaloedd gwledig, a’r angen am saethu yn ein hardaloedd gwledig hefyd. Yr hyn a welwn ar hyn o bryd yw'r Llywodraeth hon yng Nghymru yn cychwyn ar agenda wrth-saethu drwy fod o blaid newidiadau i reoliadau rhyddhau adar hela. Mae'r agenda ymrannol hon yn enghraifft arall o ymyrraeth ar raddfa fawr gan y wladwriaeth, gyda biwrocratiaeth gynyddol mewn perthynas â thrwyddedu. Mae’r Llywodraeth hon yn benderfynol o ddefnyddio arian trethdalwyr i gyfyngu ar ryddid yn hytrach na defnyddio’r fframwaith cyfreithiol sydd eisoes yn cael ei ddefnyddio’n llwyddiannus ledled y DU. Pam fod angen inni fod yn wahanol? Mae'n enghraifft arall eto o Lywodraeth Cymru yn ceisio gwneud newidiadau er mwyn gwneud newidiadau yn hytrach na mabwysiadu ymagwedd fwy pwyllog a phragmatig. Byddai'r cynnig yn arwain at amodau ychwanegol a heb eu datgelu, gan gynnwys ar drwyddedau. Oherwydd hyn, mae perygl y bydd trwyddedau'n agored i gael eu herio gan bobl sy'n gwrthwynebu saethu. Yn fy ardal i, gwn fod llawer o etholwyr ar draws de-ddwyrain Cymru yn gwrthwynebu’r syniad chwerthinllyd hwn. Mae’n hen bryd i Lywodraeth Cymru fwrw ymlaen â’u gwaith bob dydd ar geisio mynd i'r afael ag amseroedd aros y GIG a system addysg sy’n methu yn hytrach nag ymyrryd yn ein ffordd wledig o fyw.
I’d like to thank James Evans from Brecon and Radnorshire for giving me a minute of his time. As chair of the cross-party group on shooting and conservation, it’s a real privilege to be able to contribute in this debate this afternoon. One thing that struck me when recently meeting with BASC was that they said, and I quote, that the ‘C’ in BASC is equally as important as the ‘S’. The conservation element of shooting is equally important, and I think that’s really something that we need to fully understand—the environmental, the conservational, impacts of shooting and the good game management, good wildlife management, that come from that. I’ve been out on shoots as a picker-upper looking at the benefits of what the shoot does, and it really struck me: where else in our society would we have a sport where we have a grandfather and his granddaughter going out for a day, spending time together in the great outdoors in the countryside, being able to name the birds in the trees, the plants on the ground, and the trees growing, and their roots in that part of the world? I think it was a fantastic opportunity to really see first-hand, and, as chair of the cross-party group, I was disappointed when an invite went out—and I won’t name the individual—but a response came back from a Member saying, ‘Are you seriously putting shooting and conservation in the same title?’ I only wish that Member had attended a couple of our CPG meetings just to see for themselves the benefit that shooting and conservation have to each other.
I have to pay tribute as well to the Countryside Alliance and BASC because, as James mentioned, I sponsored, with Llyr Gruffydd, the Aim to Sustain event in the Pierhead building, which was fantastic, showing the nutritional value of game meat, showing how carbon neutral it is in that sense, and how it ticks so many of those boxes. The English NHS have noticed the benefits of game meat, introducing it into the menus in hospitals across the border. I only wish, when I’d written to the health Minister, that she’d taken that opportunity up as well, so that we could support our game industry here in Wales by having the procurement through our hospitals as well.
So, thank you very much, James, for bringing this debate forward. Diolch yn fawr.
Hoffwn ddiolch i James Evans o Frycheiniog a Sir Faesyfed am roi munud o'i amser i mi. Fel cadeirydd y grŵp trawsbleidiol ar saethu a chadwraeth, braint wirioneddol yw cael cyfrannu yn y ddadl hon y prynhawn yma. Un peth a’m trawodd wrth gyfarfod â Chymdeithas Saethu a Chadwraeth Prydain yn ddiweddar oedd eu bod wedi dweud, a dyfynnaf, fod 'Cadwraeth' eu henw yr un mor bwysig â’r 'Saethu'. Mae'r elfen gadwraethol sy'n gysylltiedig â saethu yr un mor bwysig, a chredaf fod hynny'n rhywbeth y mae angen inni ei ddeall yn iawn—effeithiau amgylcheddol a chadwraethol saethu a'r rheolaeth dda ar anifeiliaid hela, y rheolaeth dda ar fywyd gwyllt sy'n deillio o hynny. Rwyf wedi bod allan mewn digwyddiadau saethu fel codwr yn edrych ar fanteision y digwyddiad saethu, ac fe wnaeth argraff gref arnaf: ble arall yn ein cymdeithas y byddai gennym gamp lle mae gennym daid a'i wyres yn mynd allan am ddiwrnod, yn treulio amser gyda’i gilydd yn yr awyr agored yng nghefn gwlad, yn gallu enwi’r adar yn y coed, y planhigion ar y ddaear, a’r coed sy’n tyfu, a’u gwreiddiau yn y rhan honno o’r byd? Credaf ei fod yn gyfle gwych i weld drosof fy hun, ac fel cadeirydd y grŵp trawsbleidiol, roeddwn yn siomedig pan anfonwyd gwahoddiad—ac nid wyf am enwi’r unigolyn—ond daeth ymateb yn ôl gan Aelod yn dweud, 'A ydych chi o ddifrif yn rhoi saethu a chadwraeth yn yr un teitl?' O na fyddai'r Aelod wedi mynychu un neu ddau o gyfarfodydd ein grŵp trawsbleidiol i weld drostynt eu hunain y budd sydd gan saethu a chadwraeth i'w gynnig i'w gilydd.
Mae’n rhaid imi dalu teyrnged hefyd i’r Gynghrair Cefn Gwlad a Chymdeithas Saethu a Chadwraeth Prydain, oherwydd, fel y soniodd James, noddais, gyda Llyr Gruffydd, ddigwyddiad Aim to Sustain yn adeilad y Pierhead, a oedd yn wych, yn dangos gwerth maethol helgig, a pha mor garbon niwtral ydyw yn yr ystyr honno, a sut mae'n ticio cymaint o'r blychau hynny. Mae’r GIG yn Lloegr wedi sylwi ar fanteision helgig, gan ei gyflwyno i’r bwydlenni mewn ysbytai dros y ffin. Pan ysgrifennais at y Gweinidog iechyd, byddwn wedi hoffi pe bai hi wedi achub ar y cyfle hwnnw hefyd, fel y gallem gefnogi ein diwydiant helgig yma yng Nghymru drwy sicrhau ei fod yn cael ei gaffael drwy ein hysbytai hefyd.
Felly, diolch yn fawr iawn, James, am gyflwyno’r ddadl hon. Diolch yn fawr.
Diolch i James am ddod â’r ddadl yma ymlaen. Dwi jest eisiau dangos fy nghefnogaeth iddo fo. Dwi’n byw mewn cymuned lle mae yna chwech shoot o fy amgylch i, ac mae’n flin gen i ddweud ein bod ni wedi colli dau yn ddiweddar oherwydd yr amgylchiadau economaidd, ac mae hynny wedi cael effaith economaidd andwyol ar yr ardal. Ond dwi’n gweld gwerth economaidd, gwerth diwylliannol a gwerth cymdeithasol y shoots drwy’r amser. Mae’n hyfryd gweld y tafarnau yn llawn o’r bore, efo’r brecwastau, drwyddo i’r cymdeithasu yn yr hwyr, a’r impact economaidd hynny.
Mae o’n bwysig pwysleisio yn y fan yma hefyd, dwi’n teimlo, fod cig gêm yn cael ei ddefnyddio drwyddo draw; mae pob rhan ohono fo yn cael ei ddefnyddio—nid y cig yn unig, ond y carcas cyfan. Mae’r cyfan yn mynd mewn i’r gadwyn fwyd mewn rhyw ffordd neu gilydd. Ac ar adeg pan ydyn ni’n gweld pryder ynghylch y cynnydd cig gwyn cyw iâr yn benodol, felly, mae eisiau i ni weld hyrwyddo mwy o gig gêm hefyd. Mae o'n gig sydd yn flasus, mae'n gig maethlon ac mae e ar gael mewn amrywiaeth eang ar hyd a lled y wlad. Mae eisiau inni, felly, weld hyrwyddo hyn, heb anghofio'r hyn mae Sam yn ei ddweud hefyd, rôl a chydnabod rôl gadwriaethol saethu gêm yn ein cymunedau gwledig, sydd mor, mor bwysig. Felly, diolch am ddod â'r ddadl ymlaen, a gobeithio byddwn ni'n gweld pobl yn gwrando ar y ddadl.
Thank you to James for bringing this short debate forward. I just want to show my support for it. I live in a community where there are six shoots around me, and I’m sorry to say that we lost two recently because of the economic circumstances, and that’s had a detrimental economic impact on the area. But I see the economic value, the cultural value and the social value of these shoots. It’s wonderful to see the pubs full from morning, at breakfast time, through to the socialising in the evening, and the economic impact that that has.
It is important to emphasise here, I feel, that game meat is used in full; every part of the animal is used—not just the meat but the whole carcass. It all goes into the food chain in one way or another. And, at a time when we are seeing concerns about the increase in the price of white meat, and chicken particularly, we want to see more promotion of game too. It is tasty, it is nutritious and it is available across the country. So, we need to see that promoted, without forgetting what Sam has also said, the role in terms of conservation that shooting game has in our rural communities, which is so very important. So, thank you for bringing this debate forward, and I hope we will see people listening to it.
Y Gweinidog Newid Hinsawdd nawr i ymateb i'r ddadl. Julie James.
The Minister for Climate Change to reply to the debate. Julie James.
Diolch, Llywydd. Members will know the importance I place and this Government places on tackling the climate and nature emergencies. I will take this opportunity to set out just some of the examples of the action Welsh Government is taking for nature, the rural economy and to support our rural communities. The natural environment of Wales is a precious resource, which we have a moral and legal duty to protect. The welfare of the wildlife that depends on our natural environment should always be a key concern for us all.
James Evans has spoken about what he sees as the importance of shooting to the Welsh economy. He's pointed to suggested benefits for nature when land is managed for shooting. I and my fellow Ministers, however, have been very clear: faced with the challenges I have outlined, there are many vital uses for our limited resources. I will go on to outline a few examples of how we are using those resources to support rural economies and the environment. However, just to be very clear, the Welsh Government does not support the shooting of live animals or birds as a leisure activity. Our natural resources—.
Diolch, Lywydd. Bydd yr Aelodau’n gwybod pa mor bwysig yw mynd i’r afael â’r argyfyngau hinsawdd a natur i mi a’r Llywodraeth hon. Rwyf am achub ar y cyfle hwn i nodi ambell enghraifft o’r camau y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn eu cymryd dros natur, yr economi wledig ac i gefnogi ein cymunedau gwledig. Mae amgylchedd naturiol Cymru yn adnodd gwerthfawr, ac mae gennym ddyletswydd foesol a chyfreithiol i’w warchod. Dylai lles y bywyd gwyllt sy’n dibynnu ar ein hamgylchedd naturiol fod yn bryder allweddol i bob un ohonom bob amser.
Mae James Evans wedi sôn am bwysigrwydd saethu yn ei farn ef i economi Cymru. Mae wedi tynnu sylw at y manteision awgrymedig i natur pan fydd tir yn cael ei reoli ar gyfer saethu. Rwyf fi a fy nghyd-Weinidogion, fodd bynnag, wedi dweud yn glir iawn: yn wyneb yr heriau a amlinellais, mae llawer o ddefnyddiau hanfodol i’n hadnoddau cyfyngedig. Af ymlaen i amlinellu ychydig o enghreifftiau o sut rydym yn defnyddio’r adnoddau hynny i gefnogi economïau gwledig a’r amgylchedd. Fodd bynnag, i fod yn glir iawn, nid yw Llywodraeth Cymru yn cefnogi saethu anifeiliaid byw nac adar fel gweithgaredd hamdden. Mae ein hadnoddau naturiol—.
Can I ask for some clarification on that, Minister? I've seen a number of written responses to my colleagues that outline that you don't support activities that are linked with shooting. However, I know there are a number of events that you're supporting now and this year. The Welsh Government financially supports events that are connected with the shooting of live game. So, can I ask for some clarification—if not today, perhaps a written statement to clarify what the Welsh Government's policy is on supporting events connected with shooting of live game?
A gaf fi ofyn am rywfaint o eglurhad ar hynny, Weinidog? Rwyf wedi gweld nifer o ymatebion ysgrifenedig i fy nghyd-Aelodau sy’n nodi nad ydych yn cefnogi gweithgareddau sy’n gysylltiedig â saethu. Fodd bynnag, gwn fod nifer o ddigwyddiadau rydych yn eu cefnogi nawr ac eleni. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn rhoi cymorth ariannol i ddigwyddiadau sy’n gysylltiedig â saethu anifeiliaid hela byw. Felly, a gaf fi ofyn am rywfaint o eglurhad—os nad heddiw, efallai ar ffurf datganiad ysgrifenedig, i egluro beth yw polisi Llywodraeth Cymru ar roi cymorth i ddigwyddiadau sy’n gysylltiedig â saethu anifeiliaid hela byw?
Well, perhaps if you'd let me get past four sentences, you might find out. Our natural resources are central to supporting Wales's communities and livelihoods. The clean, green landscape of Wales, alongside our language and our culture, makes Wales a uniquely wonderful place for visitors—visitors who come here for quiet, undisturbed enjoyment of the countryside. And I'm in no doubt the peaceful and beautiful countryside of Wales is what helps attract investment. It is part of what makes Wales such a great place to live, work and do business.
Our rural economy also provides us with so much of the quality food we eat and the natural resources we enjoy. It supports communities and livelihoods across Wales. Local food and resources produced here in Wales are really important in delivering our net-zero targets, and delivering those targets is absolutely essential to tackling the climate emergency that threatens our natural environment. So, it is absolutely vital that we leave no community behind as we move to a cleaner, stronger, fairer Wales. We need a decade of action to support green skills for the jobs of the future. We need to understand the impacts of change and to make sure that these are fairly distributed in our society. Our values underpin all of this. We don't believe we can just consume endlessly or that new technology will bail us out, nor should the worst-off in society shoulder the burden of change. We do believe that, by working together and taking collective action, we can deliver a stronger, fairer and cleaner Wales for future generations.
I want to turn to some practical ways we're delivering for our rural economy and our environment and set out what we are supporting and why it is important that we do so. Last year, in 2022, the Minister for Rural Affairs and North Wales, and Trefnydd announced £227 million would be made available over three years to support the resilience of Wales's rural economy. So, I'm pleased to say we are indeed supporting farmers, foresters, land managers and other rural sectors. We are supporting them to deliver on-farm sustainable land management actions, enhancements to fuel and feed efficiency and nutrient deficiency on farms. Using only what we need and minimising waste is one of the examples of the behaviour change we need to see. It helps farmers and rural businesses be more resilient; it helps them to mitigate the huge cost-of-living impacts we are all experiencing. I recognise to be more efficient will often require upfront investment, and that's why we're making the support available.
The funding complements the development of the sustainable farming scheme. The scheme will reward farmers and land managers for the work they do to help our biodiversity recover. It will reward them as they continue to produce food sustainably in Wales. And it is essential that the scheme helps tackle both the nature and climate emergencies as well as sustaining farm businesses. The scheme will have a set of universal actions, requiring at least 10 per cent tree cover and 10 per cent semi-natural habitats. It would also contain a collaborative element, enabling farmers to work together to create interconnected habitats across landscapes. I am really determined that we will foster the team Wales approach to getting the outcomes right for both our environment and our farmers, working collectively. Our aim is to create a sustainable agricultural sector in Wales for future generations, one which is prosperous and resilient. However, change is needed so the farming sector plays its part in tackling the climate and the nature emergencies. The challenge we face is significant and the time to act is now. Biodiversity loss and ecosystem collapse are really leading threats to humanity. Our relationship with the natural environment is completely unsustainable and must change. We need to accelerate the actions we are taking to halt the decline in biodiversity. Our environment is absolutely central to who we are as a nation here in Wales. Just don't imagine for one moment that biodiversity loss and ecosystem collapse is something happening far away or only gradually. It is happening right here in Wales and it is happening right now. Our programme for government gives a commitment to establish statutory nature targets to protect and restore biodiversity, but that's not enough; we must continue to build our capacity to change and to make that change effective.
Some examples now of the kind of change we are supporting for efficiency on farms: we need to extend that and better understand what is needed for everyone to behave sustainably. To be clear, that means behaving differently, learning new skills and teaching them to others and delivering for nature at a far greater pace. I've committed to refreshing our natural resources policy and our national biodiversity strategy. These need to change to reflect the new global biodiversity framework and the 30x30 target we have agreed, as well as the recommendations of our partners and stakeholders in the biodiversity deep-dive. Wales needs to deliver a decade of action if we are to become nature positive. And importantly, we absolutely know that we in Welsh Government cannot do this alone. We will not deliver net zero or restore biodiversity if only a few people or businesses are taking action. A team Wales approach means the whole of society playing their role. We make sure we have the right policies in place, placing collaboration at the heart of our sustainable farming scheme. We are bringing organisations together and providing direct support to enable that team Wales approach.
We launched our pledge campaign at our climate change conference in 2019. Since then, we've received 139 pledges from organisations, all of which committed to doing their bit for the climate. These include action to restore ancient woodlands and heathlands, restoration of peatland and creating local places for nature. Over the next five years, we aim to increase the restoration of degraded peatland from a target of 600 to 800 hectares per year to 1,800 hectares, through our national peatland action programme.
On the back of the biodiversity deep-dive, the Minister for Rural Affairs and North Wales, and Trefnydd and I provided £2.4 million last year for peatland restoration and, over the next two years, we've committed £8 million to the national peatland action programme.
We need every citizen, community group and business in Wales to embed the climate emergency in the way they think, work, play and travel. Working in partnership with Natural Resources Wales and Heritage Lottery, we're investing £15 million to support the delivery of the nature networks programme. This will ensure our most precious habitats and species are given the chance to both recover and to thrive. And as part of this, earlier this year, I announced the allocation of over £3.5 million—[Interruption.] Certainly, Mabon.
Wel, efallai pe baech yn gadael imi ddweud mwy na phedair brawddeg, efallai y byddech yn clywed. Mae ein hadnoddau naturiol yn hollbwysig i gefnogi cymunedau a bywoliaeth pobl yng Nghymru. Mae tirwedd lân, werdd Cymru, ochr yn ochr â’n hiaith a’n diwylliant, yn gwneud Cymru’n lle unigryw o ryfeddol i ymwelwyr—ymwelwyr sy’n dod yma i fwynhau cefn gwlad yn dawel a heb ddim i darfu arnynt. Ac nid oes gennyf unrhyw amheuaeth mai cefn gwlad heddychlon a hardd Cymru sy'n helpu i ddenu buddsoddiad. Mae’n rhan o’r hyn sy’n gwneud Cymru yn lle mor wych i fyw, gweithio a gwneud busnes ynddo.
Mae ein heconomi wledig hefyd yn darparu cymaint o’r bwyd o safon rydym yn ei fwyta a’r adnoddau naturiol rydym yn eu mwynhau. Mae’n cefnogi cymunedau a bywoliaeth pobl ledled Cymru. Mae bwyd ac adnoddau lleol a gynhyrchir yma yng Nghymru yn wirioneddol bwysig i gyflawni ein targedau sero net, ac mae cyflawni’r targedau hynny'n gwbl hanfodol er mwyn mynd i’r afael â’r argyfwng hinsawdd sy’n bygwth ein hamgylchedd naturiol. Felly, mae’n gwbl hanfodol nad ydym yn gadael unrhyw gymuned ar ôl wrth inni symud i Gymru lanach, gryfach, decach. Mae arnom angen degawd o weithredu i gefnogi sgiliau gwyrdd ar gyfer swyddi’r dyfodol. Mae angen inni ddeall effeithiau newid a sicrhau eu bod yn cael eu dosbarthu'n deg yn ein cymdeithas. Ein gwerthoedd sy'n sail i hyn oll. Nid ydym yn credu y gallwn ddefnyddio adnoddau'n dragwyddol nac y bydd technoleg newydd yn ein hachub, nac y dylai'r rhai tlotaf mewn cymdeithas ysgwyddo baich y newid ychwaith. Drwy gydweithio a gweithredu ar y cyd, credwn y gallwn sicrhau Cymru gryfach, decach a glanach ar gyfer cenedlaethau’r dyfodol.
Hoffwn droi at rai o'r ffyrdd ymarferol yr awn ati i gyflawni ar gyfer ein heconomi wledig a'n hamgylchedd a nodi'r hyn rydym yn ei gefnogi a pham ei bod yn bwysig ein bod yn gwneud hynny. Y llynedd, yn 2022, cyhoeddodd y Gweinidog Materion Gwledig a Gogledd Cymru, a’r Trefnydd y byddai £227 miliwn ar gael dros dair blynedd i gefnogi cadernid economi wledig Cymru. Felly, rwy'n falch o ddweud ein bod, yn wir, yn cefnogi ffermwyr, coedwigwyr, rheolwyr tir a sectorau gwledig eraill. Rydym yn eu cefnogi i weithredu mesurau rheoli tir yn gynaliadwy ar ffermydd, gwelliannau i effeithlonrwydd bwyd anifeiliaid a thanwydd a diffyg maethynnau ar ffermydd. Mae defnyddio'r hyn sydd ei angen arnom yn unig a lleihau gwastraff yn un o'r enghreifftiau o'r newid ymddygiad sydd angen inni ei weld. Mae’n helpu ffermwyr a busnesau gwledig i fod yn fwy gwydn; mae'n eu helpu i liniaru'r effeithiau costau byw enfawr sy'n wynebu pob un ohonom. Rwy'n cydnabod bod angen buddsoddiad ymlaen llaw yn aml er mwyn bod yn fwy effeithlon, a dyna pam ein bod yn sicrhau bod y cymorth ar gael.
Mae'r cyllid yn ategu datblygiad y cynllun ffermio cynaliadwy. Bydd y cynllun yn gwobrwyo ffermwyr a rheolwyr tir am y gwaith y maent yn ei wneud i helpu i adfer ein bioamrywiaeth. Bydd yn eu gwobrwyo wrth iddynt barhau i gynhyrchu bwyd yn gynaliadwy yng Nghymru. Ac mae'n hanfodol fod y cynllun yn helpu i fynd i'r afael â'r argyfyngau natur a hinsawdd yn ogystal â chynnal busnesau fferm. Bydd gan y cynllun gyfres o gamau gweithredu cyffredinol, a fydd yn ei gwneud yn ofynnol cael gorchudd coed o 10 y cant a 10 y cant o gynefinoedd lled-naturiol fan lleiaf. Byddai hefyd yn cynnwys elfen gydweithredol, gan alluogi ffermwyr i gydweithio i greu cynefinoedd rhyng-gysylltiedig ar draws tirweddau. Rwy’n wirioneddol benderfynol o'n gweld yn meithrin dull tîm Cymru o sicrhau’r canlyniadau iawn ar gyfer ein hamgylchedd a’n ffermwyr, gan weithio ar y cyd. Ein nod yw creu sector amaethyddol cynaliadwy yng Nghymru ar gyfer cenedlaethau’r dyfodol, un sy’n ffyniannus ac yn wydn. Fodd bynnag, mae angen newid er mwyn i’r sector ffermio chwarae ei ran wrth fynd i’r afael â’r argyfyngau hinsawdd a natur. Mae’r her sy’n ein hwynebu yn sylweddol, a nawr yw’r adeg i weithredu. Mae colli bioamrywiaeth a chwymp ecosystemau yn fygythiadau mawr i'r ddynoliaeth. Mae ein perthynas â'r amgylchedd naturiol yn gwbl anghynaliadwy, ac mae'n rhaid ei newid. Mae angen inni gyflymu’r camau rydym yn eu cymryd i atal y dirywiad mewn bioamrywiaeth. Mae ein hamgylchedd yn gwbl ganolog i bwy ydym fel cenedl yma yng Nghymru. Peidiwch â dychmygu am un eiliad fod colli bioamrywiaeth a chwymp ecosystemau'n rhywbeth sy'n digwydd ymhell i ffwrdd neu'n raddol yn unig. Mae’n digwydd yma yng Nghymru ac mae’n digwydd nawr. Mae ein rhaglen lywodraethu'n ymrwymo i sefydlu targedau natur statudol i warchod ac adfer bioamrywiaeth, ond nid yw hynny’n ddigon; mae'n rhaid inni barhau i feithrin ein gallu i newid a gwneud y newid hwnnw’n effeithiol.
Rhai enghreifftiau nawr o’r math o newid rydym yn ei gefnogi ar gyfer effeithlonrwydd ar ffermydd: mae angen inni ymestyn hynny a deall yn well beth sydd ei angen er mwyn i bawb ymddwyn yn gynaliadwy. I fod yn glir, mae hynny’n golygu ymddwyn yn wahanol, dysgu sgiliau newydd a’u haddysgu i eraill a chyflawni ar ran byd natur yn gyflymach o lawer. Rwyf wedi ymrwymo i adnewyddu ein polisi adnoddau naturiol a'n strategaeth fioamrywiaeth genedlaethol. Mae angen i’r rhain newid i adlewyrchu’r fframwaith bioamrywiaeth byd-eang newydd a’r targed 30x30 rydym wedi cytuno arno, yn ogystal ag argymhellion ein partneriaid a’n rhanddeiliaid yn yr archwiliad dwfn bioamrywiaeth. Mae angen i Gymru gyflawni degawd o weithredu os ydym am ddod yn gadarnhaol o ran natur. Ac yn bwysig, gwyddom yn iawn na allwn ni yn Llywodraeth Cymru wneud hyn ar ein pennau ein hunain. Ni fyddwn yn cyflawni sero net nac yn adfer bioamrywiaeth os mai ychydig o bobl neu fusnesau yn unig sy'n gweithredu. Mae ymagwedd tîm Cymru yn golygu'r gymdeithas gyfan yn chwarae eu rhan. Rydym yn sicrhau bod gennym y polisïau cywir ar waith, gan roi cydweithredu wrth wraidd ein cynllun ffermio cynaliadwy. Rydym yn dod â sefydliadau ynghyd ac yn darparu cymorth uniongyrchol i alluogi’r dull tîm Cymru hwnnw o weithio.
Lansiwyd ein hymgyrch addewidion yn ein cynhadledd newid hinsawdd yn 2019. Ers hynny, rydym wedi derbyn 139 o addewidion gan sefydliadau, pob un ohonynt wedi ymrwymo i chwarae eu rhan dros yr hinsawdd. Mae’r rhain yn cynnwys camau i adfer coetiroedd a rhostiroedd hynafol, adfer mawndiroedd a chreu mannau lleol ar gyfer natur. Dros y pum mlynedd nesaf, ein nod yw cynyddu gwaith adfer mawndiroedd sydd wedi dirywio o darged o 600 i 800 hectar y flwyddyn i 1,800 hectar, drwy ein rhaglen weithredu genedlaethol ar fawndiroedd.
O ganlyniad i'r archwiliad dwfn bioamrywiaeth, darparodd y Gweinidog Materion Gwledig a Gogledd Cymru, a’r Trefnydd a minnau £2.4 miliwn y llynedd ar gyfer adfer mawndiroedd, a dros y ddwy flynedd nesaf, rydym wedi ymrwymo £8 miliwn i’r rhaglen weithredu genedlaethol ar fawndiroedd.
Mae arnom angen i bob dinesydd, grŵp cymunedol a busnes yng Nghymru ymwreiddio’r argyfwng hinsawdd yn y ffordd y maent yn meddwl, yn gweithio, yn chwarae ac yn teithio. Gan weithio mewn partneriaeth â Cyfoeth Naturiol Cymru a Chronfa Dreftadaeth y Loteri, rydym yn buddsoddi £15 miliwn i gefnogi’r gwaith o gyflawni'r rhaglen rhwydweithiau natur. Bydd hyn yn sicrhau bod ein cynefinoedd a’n rhywogaethau mwyaf gwerthfawr yn cael cyfle i adfer ac i ffynnu. Ac fel rhan o hyn, yn gynharach eleni, cyhoeddais y dyraniad o dros £3.5 miliwn—[Torri ar draws.] Yn sicr, Mabon.
I'm hearing what you're saying about protecting nature and ensuring that we have a thriving biodiversity. Do you accept that shooting also plays a part in conservation and ensuring that we have a diverse nature in the country?
Rwy'n clywed yr hyn a ddywedwch am warchod natur a sicrhau bod gennym fioamrywiaeth ffyniannus. A ydych yn derbyn bod saethu hefyd yn chwarae rhan mewn cadwraeth a'r broses o sicrhau bod gennym natur amrywiol yn y wlad?
Well, I've been very clear about that. Shooting can play a part in that, and, absolutely, because we have predator species and so on, sometimes that is necessary. But I don't, I'm afraid, support it in any way as a leisure activity. I do not think killing anything as a sport or leisure is anything any civilised society should support, I'm afraid, and I've been very clear about that.
These things need to change, in line with the way we work. We absolutely do need to protect our way of life and we need to protect our communities, but we also need to change our behaviour. Anyway, as I was saying, this will fund projects ranging between £30,000 and—[Interruption.] I listened very quietly to all of you; are you going to give me the same—? I listened very quietly to all of you. [Interruption.] So, give me the same courtesy.
Wel, rwyf wedi bod yn glir iawn am hynny. Gall saethu chwarae rhan yn hynny, ac yn sicr, gan fod gennym rywogaethau ysglyfaethus ac ati, mae hynny'n angenrheidiol weithiau. Ond mae arnaf ofn nad wyf yn ei gefnogi mewn unrhyw ffordd fel gweithgaredd hamdden. Nid wyf yn credu bod lladd unrhyw beth at ddibenion chwaraeon neu hamdden yn rhywbeth y dylai unrhyw gymdeithas wâr ei gefnogi, mae arnaf ofn, ac rwyf wedi dweud hynny'n glir iawn.
Mae angen i'r pethau hyn newid, yn unol â'r ffordd rydym yn gweithio. Yn sicr, mae angen inni amddiffyn ein ffordd o fyw ac mae angen inni amddiffyn ein cymunedau, ond mae angen inni newid ein hymddygiad hefyd. Beth bynnag, fel roeddwn yn dweud, bydd hyn yn darparu rhwng £30,000 a—[Torri ar draws.] Gwrandewais yn dawel iawn ar bob un ohonoch chi; a ydych am ddangos yr un—? Gwrandewais yn dawel iawn ar bob un ohonoch. [Torri ar draws.] Felly, dangoswch yr un cwrteisi i mi.
You're doing my job for me now, Minister. Are you taking the intervention from Russell George?
Rydych yn gwneud fy ngwaith drosof nawr, Weinidog. A ydych yn derbyn yr ymyriad gan Russell George?
No. I've already taken one off you, Russell.
Nac ydw. Rwyf eisoes wedi derbyn un gennych, Russell.
You haven't answered the question.
Nid ydych wedi ateb y cwestiwn.
I haven't finished.
Nid wyf wedi gorffen.
The Minister isn't taking an intervention.
Nid yw’r Gweinidog yn derbyn ymyriad.
As part of this, earlier this year I announced the allocation of over £3.5 million under the nature networks fund. This will fund projects ranging between £30,000 and £250,000 supporting our most threatened habitats and species. I'm pleased to say that I will confirm the nine projects that will receive the funding tomorrow to help create resilient ecological networks. Our protected sites will be at the core of these projects. And that's not all: the Welsh Government is investing £800,000 over the next four years in the Natural Resources Wales-led Natur am Byth! project. It aims to reverse the decline in our most endangered and iconic species in Wales. [Interruption.]
Fel rhan o hyn, yn gynharach eleni, cyhoeddais ddyraniad o dros £3.5 miliwn o dan y gronfa rhwydweithiau natur. Bydd hyn yn darparu rhwng £30,000 a £250,000 i brosiectau sy'n cefnogi ein cynefinoedd a’n rhywogaethau sy'n wynebu'r bygythiad mwyaf. Rwy’n falch o ddweud y byddaf yn cadarnhau’r naw prosiect a fydd yn cael y cyllid yfory i helpu i greu rhwydweithiau ecolegol gadarn. Bydd ein safleoedd gwarchodedig yn cael lle canolog yn y prosiectau hyn. Ac nid dyna’r cyfan: mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn buddsoddi £800,000 dros y pedair blynedd nesaf ym mhrosiect Natur am Byth! a arweinir gan Cyfoeth Naturiol Cymru. Ei nod yw gwrthdroi’r dirywiad yn ein rhywogaethau mwyaf eiconig a'r rhai sy'n wynebu'r perygl mwyaf yng Nghymru. [Torri ar draws.]
Can we listen to the Minister, please? You are all—. The Tories themselves want to listen to you as well, or some of them do, so, carry on, Minister.
A gawn ni wrando ar y Gweinidog, os gwelwch yn dda? Mae pob un ohonoch—. Mae’r Torïaid eu hunain am wrando arnoch hefyd, neu mae rhai ohonynt am wneud hynny, felly, parhewch, Weinidog.
The Natur am Byth! project aims to reverse the decline in our most endangered and iconic species in Wales, contributing to the 30x30 target, and connect people with nature. The project has nine focus areas integrating terrestrial and marine management issues, supporting vulnerable marine species as well as those on land and in fresh water. This will also complement the Nature Networks programme and it will target and reverse the decline of some of our most endangered species and connect people with nature.
So, in conclusion, tackling the emergency posed by a destabilising climate, biodiversity loss and ecosystem collapse is central to our work as Government. The rural economy and rural economies are vital contributors to that effort, but behaviour change and changes in modes of life are necessary to do this. You have agreed that there is a climate and nature emergency. You cannot just continue to tell me that doing everything that you've always done in the way you've always done it will achieve that, because it will not. Diolch.
Nod prosiect Natur am Byth! yw gwrthdroi’r dirywiad yn ein rhywogaethau mwyaf eiconig a'r rhai sy'n wynebu'r perygl mwyaf yng Nghymru, gan gyfrannu at y targed 30x30, a chysylltu pobl â byd natur. Mae gan y prosiect naw maes ffocws sy'n integreiddio materion rheoli tir a môr, cefnogi rhywogaethau morol bregus yn ogystal â rhywogaethau ar y tir ac mewn dŵr croyw. Bydd hyn hefyd yn ategu’r rhaglen Rhwydweithiau Natur ac yn targedu ac yn gwrthdroi dirywiad rhai o’n rhywogaethau sy'n wynebu'r perygl mwyaf ac yn cysylltu pobl â byd natur.
Felly, i gloi, mae mynd i’r afael â’r argyfwng a achosir gan hinsawdd sy’n ansefydlogi, colli bioamrywiaeth a chwymp ecosystemau yn ganolog i’n gwaith fel Llywodraeth. Mae’r economi wledig ac economïau gwledig yn gyfranwyr hanfodol i’r ymdrech honno, ond mae angen newid ymddygiad a newid ffyrdd o fyw er mwyn gwneud hyn. Rydych wedi cytuno bod yna argyfwng hinsawdd a natur. Ni allwch barhau i ddweud wrthyf y bydd gwneud popeth rydych bob amser wedi'i wneud yn y ffordd rydych bob amser wedi'i wneud yn cyflawni hynny, oherwydd nid yw hynny'n wir. Diolch.
Dyna ni, dyna ddiwedd ar ein gwaith ni am y dydd heddiw. Diolch yn fawr.
That's the end of our work for today. Thank you very much.
Daeth y cyfarfod i ben am 17:31.
The meeting ended at 17:31.