National Assembly for Wales

Good morning, everyone. Welcome to the Children, Youth People and Education Committee. I've received apologies for absence from Suzy Davies. Can I ask Members if there are any declarations of interest, please? No. Okay, thank you.

We'll move on then to item 2, which is our session with Members of the Welsh Young Parliament. Today, of course, is the thirtieth anniversary of the opening of the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child for signatories. And to mark this occasion, we are delighted to be joined by Members of the Welsh Youth Parliament who are going to update us on their progress with their Parliament's three main priorities, and also update us on the work that they've done to inform this committee's inquiry on children's rights.

As a committee, we are particularly proud to see our National Assembly deliver on the 2016 recommendation from the United Nations that a youth parliament be established in Wales. So, it is absolutely fitting that we will celebrate this important anniversary with our colleagues from the Welsh Youth Parliament.

So, I'd like to welcome this morning, Betsan Angell Roberts, Welsh Youth Parliament Member for Cardiff North; Todd Murray, Welsh Youth Parliament Member for Bridgend; Ffion Griffith, Welsh Youth Parliament Member for Islwyn; and Maisy Evans, Welsh Youth Parliament Member for Torfaen.

What we're going to do this morning is touch on each of the Welsh Youth Parliament's three key priorities, receiving an update on each, and then a chance for Members to ask some questions. And then we're going to move on to talk about our children's rights inquiry and the work that's being done to ensure that children and young people's voices are clearly heard as part of that inquiry.

Just before we move on to the priorities, I'm very conscious, of course, that the work of the Welsh Youth Parliament is relevant to all committees in the Assembly, not just ours, and with that in mind, I'm delighted that Dai Lloyd, Chair of the Health, Social Care and Sport Committee, is able to join us today. Welcome, Dai, and thank you for coming.

Okay, so the first priority, then, we're going to discuss is life skills in the curriculum. Betsan, would you like to update us on the work of the Welsh Youth Parliament in this area?

Thank you very much, Betsan. That was a really helpful update. So, I'd like to ask Members now to ask their questions. We've got a question from Siân Gwenllian first.

Okay, thank you. Can I ask a question as well? Betsan, you said that you're planning on holding the Government to account for their response to your recommendations. Can you just tell us how they've responded so far?

Okay, thank you very much. Thank you, Betsan.

We're going to move on now, then, to the second priority of the Welsh Youth Parliament, which is littering and plastic waste. Todd, can I ask you to update us on the work to date in this area?

Yes. As part of the team that presented a summary of our work so far in the Siambr to our fellow Youth Parliament Members—that was on Friday, 25 October—during the October half-term at our residential, we went to committee room 3, with representatives from the rest of my committee, and met with some guests who we asked to come in. These were Professor Wouter Poortinga from Cardiff University, who is a climate psychologist; Ella Daish, a campaigner for End Period Plastic; Alwen Marshall from Iechyd Da, which is a plastic-free vegan shop in Whitchurch in Cardiff, so she runs that as her own business and is a plastic-free entrepreneur; Luisa Pastore from WRAP Cymru, which is a charity that is trying to raise awareness of single-use plastics; and Lorna Collinson from Cardiff Council, and she is the head of initiative in Cardiff Council, basically to end littering and to get better at how Cardiff Council is recycling.

We asked our guests questions and we're planning to take this information along with our own research to decide on our campaign and our terms of reference. At this point, our main areas of interest are to work with schools to educate on—. There are different proposals on the banning of single-use plastics in schools, because a couple of our Welsh Youth Parliament Members' schools have done that now, and it's been quite a successful move to ban non-essential single-use plastics in public sector buildings. We want to increase awareness amongst school pupils about the importance of recycling and what materials can and can't be recycled, because from our research, we found that a lot of the people who we spoke to are trying to recycle, but they just don't really know what can and can't be recycled. This may include a step-by-step guide to encourage schools to produce less waste and increase their recycling, because it is down to individual schools what they do with their waste.

Something else we've been discussing is proposing a plastic tax. Assembly staff are currently working with our committee to decide our next steps. So, if any of you have any insight, information or ideas, we'd like to know about them. We're also planning our consultation events. So, Betsan spoke of their consultation events in Wrexham and Swansea. Obviously, the life skills in the curriculum was a bit more time-sensitive with the new curriculum coming out, so we're a bit behind on that one, but we are currently looking at where we're going to run them—it'll be one south one and one north one most probably—and where exactly we're going to hold it and who we're going to ask to come.

Okay, thank you, that's very helpful. So, I'll go to questions from Members now, and I've got Hefin David.

What are the next steps—but you just said that you want us to suggest some ideas as well. Is that right?

Yes. So, our next steps—one of the bigger steps we want to take is raising awareness amongst other young people. That's one of our biggest priorities moving forward. Our issue, I think, is a lot about raising awareness and education, which I think can be done quite easily. We can learn a lot from the report by the life skills committee. We can learn what they've done and we can then adopt the structure and style of that report and the nature of their recommendations moving forward.

Our next steps are, at the moment, the consultation event, and once we've got that and we've done that and we've spoken to other young people—because we'll be inviting different schools, different youth groups, different experts on this subject—then we'll be really figuring out and planning what our next steps are.

At the moment, we know that we want an educational campaign. We want to move away from the fear factor of showing animals choking on plastic bits and the horrific images you're subjected to with a lot of the raising-awareness campaigns, and move towards a more positive message: so, trying to encourage the use of bottles that you use again and again and again, and just trying to educate rather than scare and frighten.

Okay, thank you. I've got a question from Janet Finch-Saunders now. 

Thank you, Chair. Is there anything that you've learnt from the life skills in the curriculum project that has influenced how you will take this piece of work forward?

From our colleagues in the life skills in the curriculum committee, there's a lot we can learn, especially with them, like you said, being the first committee to take anything forward. We can learn from the way in which they gathered information and their research and how they presented those findings in their recommendations.

We heard in the last plenary session from members of the life skills in the curriculum committee, as well as the mental health and well-being committee, the different steps they'd taken in their own schools, which would reduce plastic waste. So, that's something that we would like to learn.

But we've realised that it is quite a different issue, in that their report to the Welsh Government is probably going to be the most impactful way for that committee to take their work forward; whereas with ours, I think we could run a campaign ourselves, as well as having help from and recommendations for the Government. We can run a campaign by ourselves alongside that, which will be educational and would be helpful. We just have to keep in mind the differences in the nature of the two issues.

So, I think there's a lot that can be learned, especially from their report and how they presented everything, but I think it's important to remember that we don't want to copy them. Obviously, they've done great work, and we don't want to just make a carbon copy of that. But we are going to learn from them and ask them for their advice when we create our report, but, yes, I think our issue is very different in the fact that we can do a lot of it as our Parliament with help from the Government, rather than just make recommendations to the Government.

Okay, thank you. That's very helpful. Thank you, Todd, for that update, which, again, was really informative for the committee.

We'll move on now, then, to the third priority of the Welsh Youth Parliament, which relates to the emotional and mental health of children and young people. Ffion, can I ask you to update us on your work in this important area?

Yes, thank you, Lynne. Article 24 states you have the right to good-quality healthcare, and article 12 states you have the right to say what you think in all matters affecting you, and for your views to be taken seriously.

It's been 30 years since the signing of the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child and we've certainly seen these rights being put into place, with youth services, schools, organisations such as the Welsh Youth Parliament, and the success of the Children, Young People and Education Committee in promoting youth engagement, not only in politics but in their rights too. I am privileged to be here today on behalf of the Welsh Youth Parliament’s emotional and mental health support committee, where we definitely see these previous rights being put into place.

So, back in February of this year, two thirds of the Welsh Youth Parliament, and 36 per cent of young people voted 'mental health' as one of their key issues. And as a result of this, we formed the mental health committee, which is made up of 26 Welsh Youth Parliament Members from across Wales. Since then, we've had regional meetings where we've discussed tackling the topic, and ensuring that we complement schemes that already exist.

Common themes that have been raised in all four regions are raising awareness and training opportunities, because young people feel that these are the best ways to tackle mental health, especially with pressures on young people nowadays, such as school and social media.

In addition to the regional meetings, we've had opportunities to raise awareness about mental health through radio interviews, panel discussions, blogs and videos, in addition to talking to other young people across Wales. We've also had the fantastic opportunity to discuss with you, Lynne, and I'd just like to take this time to thank you all very much for your contribution. We understand that the work your committee does is extremely important, such as scrutinising the Welsh Government after the 'Mind over matter' report in 2018. You're certainly paving the way for bettering young people's mental health.

Moving forward from our discussions, we had our residential meeting at the end of October, where we invited local authority representatives, in addition to representatives from education, health and the National Assembly, to discuss and feed back on work that's been done in Wales surrounding mental health.

The carousel discussion worked extremely effectively to discuss work that's already being done, in addition to holding a question-and-answer session with a panel of young people. Through this, we were able to identify key issues, such as stigma, training, preventative care and communication, which will certainly help us focus our work on the emotional and mental health committee. As a result of this, we've released our questionnaire to Welsh Youth Parliament Members in order to vote on our next steps.

It's been such a privilege for me, being part of this committee—it's a topic that's extremely close to me. I see it in my peers and my friends—everyone, really—and not just young people, but older members of society too. There is a clear need for change, especially in young people, with 20 per cent of adolescents experiencing mental health problems at some time in their life. And although we already have seen movement, such as the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child, and, obviously, your support, we believe the best way to move forward is, certainly, communication with the people who are most affected—us. Thank you.

Thank you very much, Ffion, and thank you for your kind words about the work of the committee, which are much appreciated. If I could start, then, by asking you: as you've already highlighted, mental health is very close to this committee's heart. Have you got any ideas how we can work together to progress these issues and how we can help you with your work?

Yes, I really think that maintaining the communication that we have had is extremely crucial to the success not only of our committee but also to bettering young people's mental health across Wales. I think that we've talked about, perhaps, developing resources with you, such as information leaflets and training courses, such as the 'meeting in a box', which we're going to talk about later—we know that that's been extremely successful and we really like the layout of that. So, developing something similar in order to support young people across Wales—. I'd just like to say that your enthusiasm and support are very much appreciated, so thank you for that.

Thank you. The next question is from Dawn Bowden.

Thank you, Chair. Good morning, Ffion—good morning, all of you. It's interesting, because I did meet with my Youth Parliament Member, Tommy Church, from Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney, and we discussed this whole issue of mental health and well-being, and I know it's one of the areas that he's championing as well.

You've touched on this a little bit, but what I'd like to know is, really, how you're going to involve more children and young people in your work, because you've talked about awareness, haven't you? Certainly, from the discussions that I've had with young people in my constituency, I don't think that there's enough awareness amongst young people themselves. So, maybe there's awareness among people at our level, but, actually, the people that it's going to impact on the most—. So, how do you think you might address that?

Living in a digital age, we definitely think that using social media to raise awareness of mental health amongst young people and the work of the committee is definitely a good way to move forward, in addition to developing schemes that can be used in schools across Wales.

One of the challenges we've faced as a Youth Parliament is communicating with each other, being across Wales. Of course, then, I can see why it might be a difficulty feeding this information back. But we definitely think, through schemes and social media, we'll be able to reach as many young people as possible so that they are aware of what we're doing and also aware of mental health itself as a topic.

Sure, and then feeding back to you their views.

Yes, definitely. I think we'd also like—. We've talked about—. As we've had these days where we've done a consultation on life skills, we're going to have one on littering and plastic waste. We'd definitely like to have one on mental health too, but with such a sensitive topic, we've had to wait a bit more and do more research on what would be included in that day without being too sensitive.

Sure. Okay, diolch yn fawr.

Okay, thank you. And I've got a question now from Dai Lloyd.

We definitely think there is a lot that we can learn for supporting adults, because, of course, mental health doesn't change—it's the same whether you're three or 36 or 60; it doesn't change. Although the pressures may change, we still see that communication and raising awareness are such big things and, perhaps, being able to involve parents will also help involve young people.

We really think that just being aware that there are places to reach out to and also being aware that everyone has mental health is something that we can definitely learn, and progress, then, to supporting adults. Because I think a lot of people feel difficulty in reaching out, and they feel there's a stigma behind it—that they feel like they might be judged, or different things. But, certainly, I think that's something that we can learn from the research we've done so far on the committee. Thank you.

Okay. Well, thank you, Ffion, and thank you to all of you for updating us on the three priorities. It's been really informative for the committee and we hope that you'll be able to keep us updated. And we look forward to working with you where we can, then, to help you push forward the important and constructive suggestions that you've made.

We're going to move on now to talk about the work that Members of the Welsh Youth Parliament have undertaken to inform this committee's children's rights inquiry. As part of the inquiry, we developed a 'meeting in a box' engagement activity. This is a resource pack to empower children and young people to share their views on children's rights, followed by a short survey in order to share what was learnt and to feed into our wider inquiry. So, before I ask Maisy to speak to us about the work the Welsh Youth Parliament has done with our 'meeting in a box', we're going to watch a short video.

I had no idea we were being filmed in Swansea. I didn't know that there was a camera there.

It's very inspiring, isn't it? It's a lovely video. So, I'm going to hand over now to Maisy to tell us a bit about the Youth Parliament's views on children's rights. 

Thank you very much, Lynne.

Thank you very much, Maisy, and thank you to all your colleagues in the Welsh Youth Parliament for taking the time to share your views on our inquiry on children's rights. And, as you heard, that will be published next year, and we will certainly keep you posted about the inquiry and our findings. 

Just before I bring this morning's discussions to a close, I'd just like to thank the four of you for coming here today, really. It's been incredibly useful for the committee to have the update from you on what is an historic occasion today. And I'd also like to place on record the committee's thanks to the Welsh Youth Parliament staff as well, who I know work incredibly hard. I've seen them in action, and it is busy and hectic. So thank you, too, for all the work that you are doing. It is very much appreciated. 

Hearing from you today, on the thirtieth anniversary, really does demonstrate what upholding children's rights means in practice. You've got a seat at the table and a voice in the important conversations that affect you and also, very importantly, the young people who come after you. And that, for us, is what children's rights are all about and we're really grateful to you for joining us today and for leading this discussion, which has been very, very informative. So thank you to the four of you for coming. Diolch yn fawr. 

We'll move on now, then, to item 3, which is papers to note. Paper to note 1 is a letter to the Minister for Economy and Transport regarding additional learning needs and transport. Paper to note 2 is a letter from the Minister for Education updating us on activity relating to the Welsh baccalaureate, following our report. Paper to note 3 is a letter to the Minister for Education regarding the Plenary debate on our report on school funding. Did I say 3 or 4 then? I've lost—

Three.

Three. Paper to note 4 is a letter to the Deputy Minister for Health and Social Services, regarding children's rights impact assessments, requesting a full list of completed CRIAs. Paper to note 5 is a letter from the children's commissioner to the Public Accounts Committee regarding looked-after children. Paper to note 6 is a letter from the Children's Commissioner for Wales following up on our meeting on 6 November. Paper to note 7 is a joint letter from the Observatory on Human Rights of Children and Children in Wales. And paper to note 8 is a letter from us to Welsh Government Ministers, regarding the joint statement that was issued last week on the proposed review of post-16 learner travel. Are Members happy to note those, please? Thank you very much.

Item 4, then. Can I propose, in accordance with Standing Order 17.42, that the committee resolves to meet in private for the remainder of the meeting, and the whole of the meeting on 4 December? Are Members content? Thank you very much.