Y Pwyllgor Deddfwriaeth, Cyfiawnder a’r Cyfansoddiad

Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee


Aelodau'r Pwyllgor a oedd yn bresennol

Committee Members in Attendance

Alun Davies
Huw Irranca-Davies Cadeirydd y Pwyllgor
Committee Chair
James Evans
Peredur Owen Griffiths

Swyddogion y Senedd a oedd yn bresennol

Senedd Officials in Attendance

Gerallt Roberts Ail Glerc
Second Clerk
Kate Rabaiotti Cynghorydd Cyfreithiol
Legal Adviser
P Gareth Williams Clerc
Sarah Sargent Ail Glerc
Second Clerk

Cofnodir y trafodion yn yr iaith y llefarwyd hwy ynddi yn y pwyllgor. Yn ogystal, cynhwysir trawsgrifiad o’r cyfieithu ar y pryd. Lle mae cyfranwyr wedi darparu cywiriadau i’w tystiolaeth, nodir y rheini yn y trawsgrifiad.

The proceedings are reported in the language in which they were spoken in the committee. In addition, a transcription of the simultaneous interpretation is included. Where contributors have supplied corrections to their evidence, these are noted in the transcript.

Cyfarfu’r pwyllgor drwy gynhadledd fideo.

Dechreuodd y cyfarfod am 13:31.

The committee met by video-conference.

The meeting began at 13:31. 

1. Cyflwyniad, ymddiheuriadau, dirprwyon a datgan buddiannau
1. Introductions, apologies, substitutions and declarations of interest

Good afternoon.

Prynhawn da. Croeso ichi i gyd.

Good afternoon. Welcome to you all.

Welcome to this virtual meeting of the Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee. Just as a reminder, we are broadcasting this live on Senedd.tv, and the Record of Proceedings will be published as normal. Apart from procedural adaptations for conducting Senedd proceedings in a virtual format, all other Standing Order requirements remain in place. So, if Members can make sure that all their mobile devices are switched to silent. We're operating today through the mediums of Welsh and English, so we have interpretation available, and the sound operator is controlling the microphones, so no need to mute and unmute. We are all present and correct here in this virtual setting, so no apologies.

2. Offerynnau sy'n cynnwys materion i gyflwyno adroddiad arnynt i’r Senedd o dan Reol Sefydlog 21.2 neu 21.3
2. Instruments that raise issues to be reported to the Senedd under Standing Order 21.2 or 21.3

So, we move directly to item No. 2. Item No. 2 is instruments that raise issues to be reported to the Senedd under Standing Order 21.2 and 21.3. And we have here, first of all, item 2.1, a made negative resolution instrument, SL(6)313, the Education (School Day and School Year) (Wales) (Amendment) Regulations 2023. These amend the Education (School Day and School Year) (Wales) Regulations 2003 to amend the definition of 'school', and reduce the minimum number of school sessions that must be held during the school year 2022-23 to take account of the additional bank holidays. They provide for an additional in-service training day in school years up to, and including, the 2024-25 school year. The regulations also make requirements for the purpose of the additional INSET day. Now, our Senedd lawyers have identified one merits reporting point. Over to you, Kate.

Thank you. The merits point draws Members' attention to the potential impact of an additional INSET day on children and families, and this is all set out in the regulatory impact assessment.

Thank you very much, Kate. Are we content with the reporting point there? We are. So, we'll move on to item 2.2, which is SL(6)314, the Agricultural Holdings (Units of Production) (Wales) Order 2023. And we have a draft report. This Order sets out figures for agricultural incomes that are associated with various farming activities and are used in determining whether or not the land in question is a commercial unit of agricultural land during two periods—from 12 September 2021 to 11 September 2022, and from 12 September 2022 to 11 September 2023. Again, our lawyers have identified one reporting point—this time a technical reporting point. Over to you, Kate.

Thank you. The technical point notes that, in article 1(2) in the Welsh text, one of the translated definitions is incorrect. It reads 'Regulation 17/2013' rather than 'Regulation 1307/2013'. In response, Welsh Government acknowledges that this is an error, but it says that it is not so sufficiently confusing that it would be worth correcting. Welsh Government's view is that the error is obvious and so there's no possibility that a court or a user of the legislation could interpret the reference in any other way than that which was intended.

Thank you very much, Kate. Any comments from colleagues? No. In which case, I think we're happy to agree the reporting points.

3. Cytundeb cysylltiadau rhyng-sefydliadol
3. Inter-institutional relations agreement

We move on, then, to item No. 3, having disposed of those two instruments. Item No. 3 is notifications and correspondence under the inter-institutional relations agreement, and, in this item, we have the correspondence from the Minister for Finance and Local Government in relation to an upcoming meeting of the Finance: Interministerial Standing Committee, to be held this week on 9 February.

4. Papurau i'w nodi
4. Papers to note

If you're happy to note that, we'll then go on to item 4, which are, indeed, papers to note. So, under this item, we have, first of all, item 4.1, correspondence from the First Minister in response to our letter of 21 December 2022 regarding the second meeting of the UK-EU Parliamentary Partnership Assembly. Colleagues, if you're happy, I'll read these into the record. If there's anything you want to flag in public session, just come in on that. Otherwise, I'll go through them.

Item 4.2, we have correspondence from the Public Accounts and Public Administration Committee in respect of the procurement Bill. So, I invite you to note the correspondence to the Minister for Finance and Local Government regarding the Welsh Government's legislative consent memorandum on the procurement Bill, and the Public Accounts and Public Administration Committee endorsed our letter to the Minister on 26 January, and requested clarification on an additional point.

Item 4.3, we have correspondence from the National Trust Cymru, welcoming the aim of the Historic Environment (Wales) Bill, and noting the report of our initial committee consideration of that Bill.

Item 4.4, we have correspondence from Food Sense Wales regarding the Food (Wales) Bill, bringing to our attention the evidence they provided in respect of Bill, which we thank them for.

Item 4.5, we have correspondence from the Solicitors Regulation Authority to inform our consideration of the Welsh Government's legislative consent memorandum on the Economic Crime and Corporate Transparency Bill.

Item 4.6, we note the written statement by the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution setting out the Welsh Government's position on the UK Government's Strikes (Minimum Service Levels) Bill.

And item 4.7, we note the written statement by the Minister for Rural Affairs and North Wales, and Trefnydd outlining the Government's amendments, which have been agreed with Plaid Cymru's designated Member, Cefin Campbell MS, and noting as well that she intends to bring forward at Stage 2 those amendments, should Members agree the general principles of that Bill.

That's all the items of correspondence to note. Any comments from Members in the public session, or are we happy to note those? We are.

5. Cynnig o dan Reol Sefydlog 17.42 i benderfynu gwahardd y cyhoedd o weddill y cyfarfod
5. Motion under Standing Order 17.42 to resolve to exclude the public from the remainder of the meeting


bod y pwyllgor yn penderfynu gwahardd y cyhoedd o weddill y cyfarfod yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 17.42(vi).


that the committee resolves to exclude the public from the remainder of the meeting in accordance with Standing Order 17.42(vi).

Cynigiwyd y cynnig.

Motion moved.

In which case, we will go into private session to deal with correspondence and other matters we have in front of us this afternoon. So, under Standing Order 17.42, can I ask if Members are happy to exclude the public now for the remainder of the meeting? And we are. We'll go into private, then, if I could ask our clerks to take us into private session.

Derbyniwyd y cynnig.

Daeth rhan gyhoeddus y cyfarfod i ben am 13:38.

Motion agreed.

The public part of the meeting ended at 13:38.