Y Pwyllgor Llywodraeth Leol a Thai

Local Government and Housing Committee


Aelodau'r Pwyllgor a oedd yn bresennol

Committee Members in Attendance

Carolyn Thomas
Joel James
John Griffiths Cadeirydd y Pwyllgor
Committee Chair
Mabon ap Gwynfor
Sam Rowlands

Swyddogion y Senedd a oedd yn bresennol

Senedd Officials in Attendance

Catherine Hunt Ail Glerc
Second Clerk
Chloe Davies Dirprwy Glerc
Deputy Clerk
Manon George Clerc
Stephen Davies Cynghorydd Cyfreithiol
Legal Adviser

Cofnodir y trafodion yn yr iaith y llefarwyd hwy ynddi yn y pwyllgor. Yn ogystal, cynhwysir trawsgrifiad o’r cyfieithu ar y pryd. Lle mae cyfranwyr wedi darparu cywiriadau i’w tystiolaeth, nodir y rheini yn y trawsgrifiad.

The proceedings are reported in the language in which they were spoken in the committee. In addition, a transcription of the simultaneous interpretation is included. Where contributors have supplied corrections to their evidence, these are noted in the transcript.

Cyfarfu'r pwyllgor drwy gynhadledd fideo.

Dechreuodd y cyfarfod am 09:15.

The committee met by video-conference.

The meeting began at 09:15. 

1. Cyflwyniad, ymddiheuriadau, dirprwyon a datgan buddiannau
1. Introductions, apologies, substitutions and declarations of interest

Item 1 on our agenda today, then, for this meeting of the Local Government and Housing Committee is introductions, apologies, substitutions and declarations of interest. So, let me welcome Members to the meeting and state that the public items of this meeting are being broadcast live on Senedd.tv, and all participants will be joining by video-conference. The meeting is bilingual and simultaneous translation is available. A Record of Proceedings will be published as usual. Aside from the procedural adaptations relating to conducting proceedings remotely, all other Standing Order requirements for committees remain in place. Are there any declarations of interest? No. 

2. Papurau i'w nodi
2. Papers to note

Then we will move on to item 2, which is papers to note. We have two papers to note this morning. The first is a letter from the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution in relation to a supplementary legislative consent memorandum on the Elections Bill, which, of course, was debated and voted on in the Senedd yesterday. And paper 2 is a report from the Bevan Foundation—'Wales Housing Crisis: making the LHA work for Wales', which is local housing allowance. Mabon ap Gwynfor.

Diolch yn fawr iawn, Gadeirydd. Ar bapur y Bevan Foundation, mae o'n bapur anodd iawn i'w ddarllen. Mae'n ddifyr iawn ac yn ddefnyddiol iawn, ond mae'n un anodd i'w ddarllen yn yr ystyr bod rhywun yn gweld yr heriau sydd yn wynebu pobl, yn enwedig gyda chostau tai. Rŵan, er eu bod nhw'n cyfeirio'n benodol at fater sydd ddim wedi'i ddatganoli, ac nad ydyn ni fel pwyllgor wedi cael amser i'w drafod o, dwi'n teimlo y buasai o'n syniad inni ysgrifennu at Lywodraeth San Steffan yn gofyn beth ydy eu hymateb nhw, a beth ydy eu bwriadau nhw i gynyddu'r gyllideb er mwyn sicrhau bod yna fwy o bres ar gyfer y bobl fwyaf difreintiedig. Ond gan dderbyn nad ydyn ni wedi cael cyfle i'w drafod fel pwyllgor, tybed fedrwn ni wthio ymlaen efo rhywbeth i'r perwyl yna. 

Thank you very much, Chair. On the Bevan Foundation paper, it's a very difficult read. It's very interesting and very useful, but it's a difficult read in the sense that one sees the challenges facing people, particularly with the cost of housing. Now, although they refer specifically to a non-devolved issue—one that we as a committee have not had time to discuss—I do feel that it would be an idea for us to write to the Westminster Government asking what their response is, and what their intentions are in increasing the budget to ensure that there is more funding available for the most disadvantaged people. And given that we haven't had an opportunity to discuss it as a committee, I wonder if we could make progress to that end. 

Diolch yn fawr, Mabon. Is committee content to write, and then, obviously, consider the response? Yes. Okay. Thank you very much, Mabon. Carolyn. 

Yes, I was just going to concur with Mabon on reading this. It would be quite good actually, I think, to have the Bevan Foundation, or somebody from there, to come in and to present to us the findings, and talk us through them. There is quite a lot of information in here—

So, for us to just quickly look at it now doesn't seem to really give it enough attention. But I agree with Mabon about sending this and writing to the UK Government about their local housing allowance—[Inaudible.] It does say, though, that Welsh Government should top it up, but I know that they do from the discretionary housing benefit, don't they—it reaches the top? 

So, it would just be good to have that conversation with the Bevan Foundation as well sometime. Thank you. 

Okay, Carolyn. Well, we'll be considering our forward work programme later, although, really, that's only up to the summer. But there will be opportunities in due course to deal with the forward work programme beyond that point. So, perhaps we'll write, as we've agreed, and maybe consider the response and how we move ahead at that stage, because we can certainly consider work—. I mean, housing is obviously going to be absolutely crucial to the work of this committee in so many different ways, and I'm sure that, beyond the summer, we'll be returning to these housing issues when we look at our forward work programme beyond that point. Okay. Well, thank you very much for that. So, subject to those actions, then, committee is content to note the papers.

3. Cynnig o dan Reol Sefydlog 17.42(ix) i benderfynu gwahardd y cyhoedd o weddill y cyfarfod
3. Motion under Standing Order 17.42(ix) to resolve to exclude the public from the remainder of the meeting


bod y pwyllgor yn penderfynu gwahardd y cyhoedd o weddill y cyfarfod yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 17.42(ix).


that the committee resolves to exclude the public from the remainder of the meeting in accordance with Standing Order 17.42(ix).

Cynigiwyd y cynnig.

Motion moved.

Item 3 on our agenda today is a motion under Standing Order 17.42 to resolve to exclude the public from the remainder of the meeting. Is committee content to do so? I see that Members are. We will, then, move to private session.

Derbyniwyd y cynnig.

Daeth rhan gyhoeddus y cyfarfod i ben am 09:20.

Motion agreed.

The public part of the meeting ended at 09:20.